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Miguelito Loveless

(4,559 posts)
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 05:21 PM Mar 2023

A Clandestine Trip and a Four-Decade Secret: An Untold Story Behind Jimmy Carter's Defeat

This discussion thread was locked as off-topic by Lasher (a host of the Latest Breaking News forum).

Source: NYT

His longtime political mentor invited him on a mission to the Middle East. What Mr. Barnes said he did not realize until later was the real purpose of the mission: to sabotage the re-election campaign of the president of the United States.

It was 1980 and Jimmy Carter was in the White House, bedeviled by a hostage crisis in Iran that had paralyzed his presidency and hampered his effort to win a second term. Mr. Carter’s best chance for victory was to free the 52 Americans held captive before Election Day. That was something that Mr. Barnes said his mentor was determined to prevent.

His mentor was John B. Connally Jr., a titan of American politics and former Texas governor who had served three presidents and just lost his own bid for the White House. A former Democrat, Mr. Connally had sought the Republican nomination in 1980 only to be swamped by former Gov. Ronald Reagan of California. Now Mr. Connally resolved to help Mr. Reagan beat Mr. Carter and in the process, Mr. Barnes said, make his own case for becoming secretary of state or defense in a new administration.

What happened next Mr. Barnes has largely kept secret for nearly 43 years. Mr. Connally, he said, took him to one Middle Eastern capital after another that summer, meeting with a host of regional leaders to deliver a blunt message to be passed to Iran: Don’t release the hostages before the election. Mr. Reagan will win and give you a better deal.

Read more: https://www.nytimes.com/2023/03/18/us/politics/jimmy-carter-october-surprise-iran-hostages.html



This has been stated and restated many times since 1980. Barnes had the sheer gall to say this about his betrayal and silence:

Mr. Barnes said he did not reveal the real story at the time to avoid blowback from his own party. “I don’t want to look like Benedict Arnold to the Democratic Party by participating in this,” he recalled explaining to a friend. The headlines at the time, he imagined, would have been scandalous. “I did not want that to be on my obituary at all.”

But as the years have passed, he said, he has often thought an injustice had been done to Mr. Carter. Discussing the trip now, he indicated, was his way of making amends. “I just want history to reflect that Carter got a little bit of a bad deal about the hostages,” he said. “He didn’t have a fighting chance with those hostages still in the embassy in Iran.”
37 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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A Clandestine Trip and a Four-Decade Secret: An Untold Story Behind Jimmy Carter's Defeat (Original Post) Miguelito Loveless Mar 2023 OP
Bookmarking! for reading in full later liberalla Mar 2023 #1
This old story snowybirdie Mar 2023 #2
It is an old story, but this is the first time I recall any Republican verifying the truth DemocraticPatriot Mar 2023 #36
This is also quite similar to what the Nixon campaign did to LBJ during the Vietnam War. keep_left Mar 2023 #3
LBJ Miguelito Loveless Mar 2023 #4
Two Texans with Big Oil support? bucolic_frolic Mar 2023 #7
Yes, most definitely. By the way, I think it was Everett Dirksen who broke the news to LBJ about... keep_left Mar 2023 #19
IIRC it showed up in Ken Burns's "The Vietnam War," soldierant Mar 2023 #32
I also heard that Reagan promised arms to Iran if they kept the hostages until after the 1980 electi UCmeNdc Mar 2023 #5
He did DENVERPOPS Mar 2023 #17
A closely-related scandal, "Iraq-gate", implicated a lot of the same people... keep_left Mar 2023 #25
I think you're thinking of the Stark incident? EX500rider Mar 2023 #29
This excerpt is incendiary... Hekate Mar 2023 #6
Thanks Miguelito Loveless Mar 2023 #9
Just makes me want to throw up! hamsterjill Mar 2023 #8
Pretty much DownriverDem Mar 2023 #10
Remember this well. Pas-de-Calais Mar 2023 #11
Republicans cheating in presidential elections has been going on a loooong time. nt SunSeeker Mar 2023 #12
The last legitimately-elected republican president was Eisenhower. PSPS Mar 2023 #34
"...Carter got a little bit of a bad deal about the hostages." markodochartaigh Mar 2023 #13
There's a quote stage left Mar 2023 #24
Another Republican cheating to interfere in a presidential election which we hear about decades later Rhiannon12866 Mar 2023 #14
20th century Republicans and treason like day follows the dawn. jaxexpat Mar 2023 #31
Kick dalton99a Mar 2023 #15
Make amends? Losing a reelection bid is small potatoes Raven123 Mar 2023 #16
Your a little late are you not Mr. Barnes..... turbinetree Mar 2023 #18
History will right this, I hope. As for Reagan, history will take care of him, too. Joinfortmill Mar 2023 #20
Another conservative POS! Grumpy Old Guy Mar 2023 #21
So evil Blues Heron Mar 2023 #22
I was alive in the era Marthe48 Mar 2023 #23
remember that morning in america TV ad - the voice is just as you say Blues Heron Mar 2023 #28
Treason, is what it is, and helping usher in the radical right too LymphocyteLover Mar 2023 #26
He should be prosecuted as if he had taken those hostages himself Blues Heron Mar 2023 #27
. . . and there is this from the NYT article AverageOldGuy Mar 2023 #30
A DU post from November 1st, 2003: ex-President Carter's Operation Desert Claw sabotaged? NBachers Mar 2023 #33
He should know there is no statute of limitations for kidnapping Blues Heron Mar 2023 #35
Locking after a discussion with forum hosts. Lasher Mar 2023 #37

liberalla

(9,507 posts)
1. Bookmarking! for reading in full later
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 05:23 PM
Mar 2023

snowybirdie

(5,373 posts)
2. This old story
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 05:29 PM
Mar 2023

has been bantered around for 40 years. Finally the NYT has gotten around to verifying it. About time!

 

DemocraticPatriot

(5,410 posts)
36. It is an old story, but this is the first time I recall any Republican verifying the truth
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 08:38 PM
Mar 2023

of it!


Previous versions may have had the details wrong, they supposed that Casey was the person doing the dirt--
those stories never seemed to consider that lower-level people did all the talking to Iran.


In any case, now we have a confession out of their own Republican treasonous mouths...


At least this lower functionary tried to do the right thing at the last moment,
with President Carter on his deathbed.

That does not excuse what he did back then,
but it confirms the fact that this conspiracy did exist, from a Republican who participated at the time.

No longer can they call it "a conspiracy theory".


keep_left

(1,933 posts)
3. This is also quite similar to what the Nixon campaign did to LBJ during the Vietnam War.
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 05:38 PM
Mar 2023

The Nixon campaign tried to undermine the ongoing Paris peace talks. They were apparently overconfident in their ability to keep things secret, and the NSA was listening in. I've forgotten who broke the news to LBJ, but I recall it being described as "treasonous" on the part of the Nixon officials. The story was kind of an open secret for many years, and I remember it being officially confirmed on Amy Goodman's Democracy Now! show.

Miguelito Loveless

(4,559 posts)
4. LBJ
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 05:45 PM
Mar 2023

would have done the country a great service if he had blown the whistle on Nixon in ‘68.

bucolic_frolic

(44,642 posts)
7. Two Texans with Big Oil support?
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 05:56 PM
Mar 2023

keep_left

(1,933 posts)
19. Yes, most definitely. By the way, I think it was Everett Dirksen who broke the news to LBJ about...
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 07:11 PM
Mar 2023

...what the NSA had discovered. I would have to listen to that episode of Democracy Now! again, or read up on my history, but what I clearly recall is that whoever the individual was, they were very upset about the actions of the Nixon campaign, calling it "treason" in no uncertain terms. There is a recording of this meeting with LBJ in the Oval Office; it was played on the show, and it was damning.

soldierant

(7,416 posts)
32. IIRC it showed up in Ken Burns's "The Vietnam War,"
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 08:23 PM
Mar 2023

including the word "treasonous.

UCmeNdc

(9,618 posts)
5. I also heard that Reagan promised arms to Iran if they kept the hostages until after the 1980 electi
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 05:47 PM
Mar 2023

It is a history that is not well understood or reported on.

DENVERPOPS

(9,293 posts)
17. He did
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 06:56 PM
Mar 2023

but truly, Reagan was just a pawn, like W and Trump. It was HW and his CABAL that did every thing during the Reagan "years"......

HWBush also gave the Ayatolla the promise of weapon sales to cinch the deal.........

As I recall later, Iran shot one of the missiles HW had sold them at a U.S. Navy Ship in the gulf, killing 27? sailors. I remember the Republicans having to go into overdrive for weeks to cover up the fact that it was one of our missles and everyone wondering how Iran was able to get a hold of OUR missles.......

THAT was a slam dunk for Treason, if there ever was one..............

keep_left

(1,933 posts)
25. A closely-related scandal, "Iraq-gate", implicated a lot of the same people...
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 07:39 PM
Mar 2023

...that were involved in the Iran-Contra scandal. There was a really good and largely forgotten book about it, Spider's Web: The Secret History of How the White House Illegally Armed Iraq by Alan Friedman.

https://www.democracynow.org/2003/12/17/spiders_web_the_secret_history_of

https://www.amazon.com/Spiders-Web-Secret-History-Illegally/dp/0553096508

EX500rider

(11,008 posts)
29. I think you're thinking of the Stark incident?
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 07:54 PM
Mar 2023

Hekate

(92,460 posts)
6. This excerpt is incendiary...
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 05:53 PM
Mar 2023

Stuff we did not know, stuff we did know, confirmation of what we intuited a long time ago.

Barnes thinks this will “make amends,” because “Carter got a little bit of a bad deal” ? Oh, I don’t think this goes anywhere near making amends.

By the way, Nevilledog has the non paywall link
https://www.democraticunderground.com/100217738499


Miguelito Loveless

(4,559 posts)
9. Thanks
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 06:01 PM
Mar 2023

hamsterjill

(15,394 posts)
8. Just makes me want to throw up!
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 05:56 PM
Mar 2023

I lived through that time frame and I cannot imagine anyone allowing those hostages to suffer one minute longer than necessary. Despicable!

DownriverDem

(6,356 posts)
10. Pretty much
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 06:28 PM
Mar 2023

figured out at the time.

Pas-de-Calais

(9,944 posts)
11. Remember this well.
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 06:38 PM
Mar 2023

There was a book if I recall correctly

SunSeeker

(52,476 posts)
12. Republicans cheating in presidential elections has been going on a loooong time. nt
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 06:42 PM
Mar 2023

PSPS

(13,786 posts)
34. The last legitimately-elected republican president was Eisenhower.
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 08:34 PM
Mar 2023

markodochartaigh

(1,477 posts)
13. "...Carter got a little bit of a bad deal about the hostages."
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 06:45 PM
Mar 2023

And sure he did. But I'm pretty sure that President Carter himself would say that it was really democracy in the US that took the real hit from the Republicans' self-serving and vicious coercion.

stage left

(2,996 posts)
24. There's a quote
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 07:38 PM
Mar 2023

that will make you see red. "A little bit of a bad deal." It was an enormous bad deal for the hostages and for us, the American people, the beginning of our downward slide.

Rhiannon12866

(212,222 posts)
14. Another Republican cheating to interfere in a presidential election which we hear about decades later
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 06:48 PM
Mar 2023

It took 50 years for it to be revealed that Nixon was secretly conspiring with the Vietnamese to win in 1968 which shut down promising peace talks - and prolonged the war for seven more years resulting in thousands more war deaths on both sides. And now we learn what we always suspected, Reagan was guilty of the same foreign power collusion to defeat President Carter.

jaxexpat

(7,220 posts)
31. 20th century Republicans and treason like day follows the dawn.
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 08:20 PM
Mar 2023

And night the dusk.

Raven123

(5,472 posts)
16. Make amends? Losing a reelection bid is small potatoes
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 06:53 PM
Mar 2023

Think of the lives of the hostages and their families. What the he** is he thinking? His moral compass is as broken now as it was when he executed the plan

turbinetree

(24,845 posts)
18. Your a little late are you not Mr. Barnes.....
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 07:08 PM
Mar 2023

have you gone and spoken to Mr. Carter yet .....

Joinfortmill

(15,215 posts)
20. History will right this, I hope. As for Reagan, history will take care of him, too.
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 07:12 PM
Mar 2023

Grumpy Old Guy

(3,336 posts)
21. Another conservative POS!
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 07:15 PM
Mar 2023

Too little, too late.

Blues Heron

(6,013 posts)
22. So evil
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 07:19 PM
Mar 2023

“I just want history to reflect that Carter got a little bit of a bad deal about the hostages,” he said. “He didn’t have a fighting chance with those hostages still in the embassy in Iran.”

Any message for the hostages, sicko?

Marthe48

(17,884 posts)
23. I was alive in the era
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 07:32 PM
Mar 2023

The r line at the time was so freakin' smooth, seamless, subtle. I'll never, even fall for it again, ever.

Blues Heron

(6,013 posts)
28. remember that morning in america TV ad - the voice is just as you say
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 07:52 PM
Mar 2023

so smooth, deep, ultimately creepy in retrospect

LymphocyteLover

(5,961 posts)
26. Treason, is what it is, and helping usher in the radical right too
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 07:42 PM
Mar 2023

Blues Heron

(6,013 posts)
27. He should be prosecuted as if he had taken those hostages himself
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 07:45 PM
Mar 2023

He thinks he got away with it scot-free. Someone needs to disabuse this little punk of that notion.

AverageOldGuy

(1,673 posts)
30. . . . and there is this from the NYT article
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 07:58 PM
Mar 2023

He (Barnes) was such an influential figure that he helped a young George W. Bush get into the Texas Air National Guard rather than be exposed to the draft and sent to Vietnam.

NBachers

(17,473 posts)
33. A DU post from November 1st, 2003: ex-President Carter's Operation Desert Claw sabotaged?
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 08:34 PM
Mar 2023

Ollie North and the whole stinking band of republican traitors & spooks in their still-ongoing RICO Crimewave Against America:

https://democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x629531

Blues Heron

(6,013 posts)
35. He should know there is no statute of limitations for kidnapping
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 08:36 PM
Mar 2023

If he caused those people to be held even a minute longer than they would have been, he is guilty of kidnapping.

Lasher

(27,865 posts)
37. Locking after a discussion with forum hosts.
Sat Mar 18, 2023, 08:42 PM
Mar 2023

We see this as more of a feature than breaking news. After all, this same story has been around in one form or another for years.

Latest Discussions»Latest Breaking News»A Clandestine Trip and a ...