Create new account | My Profile | My Account | My Bookmarks | My Inbox | Help | Log in

Google search

Advanced search

HomeLatest ThreadsGreatest ThreadsForums & GroupsMy SubscriptionsMy Posts
DU Home » Latest Threads » Forums & Groups » Main » Latest Breaking News (Forum) » New Covid origins data su...

Fri Mar 17, 2023, 12:19 PM

Star Member riversedge (65,402 posts)

New Covid origins data suggests pandemic linked to raccoon dogs at Wuhan market

Source: AP


The samples were collected from surfaces at the Huanan seafood market in Wuhan after the first human cases of Covid-19 were found in late 2019.

March 17, 2023, 8:48 AM CDT


International scientists who examined previously unavailable genetic data from samples collected at a market close to where the first human cases of Covid-19 were detected in China said they found suggestions the pandemic originated from animals, not a lab.

Other experts have not yet verified their analysis, which also has not appeared so far in a peer-reviewed journal. How the coronavirus first started sickening people remains uncertain.

“These data do not provide a definitive answer to how the pandemic began, but every piece of data is important to moving us closer to that answer,” WHO Director-General Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus at a Friday press briefing.

He also criticized China for not sharing the genetic information earlier, adding that “this data could have and should have been shared three years ago.”...................

Read more: https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/covid-origins-data-links-pandemic-raccoon-dogs-wuhan-market-rcna75437




https://media-cldnry.s-nbcnews.com/image/upload/t_fit-1240w,f_auto,q_auto:best/rockcms/2023-03/230317-raccoon-dog-al-0932-769139.jpg

A raccoon dog in Mexico City
A raccoon dog in Mexico City.Alfredo Estrella / AFP via Getty Images file

29 replies, 2022 views

Thread infoBookmark this threadTrash this thread

Reply to this thread

Back to top Alert abuse

Always highlight: 10 newest replies | Replies posted after I mark a forum
Replies to this discussion thread
Arrow 29 replies Author Time Post
Reply New Covid origins data suggests pandemic linked to raccoon dogs at Wuhan market (Original post)
 riversedge Mar 17 OP
LineReply well that took me down a rabbit hole
 jcgoldie Mar 17 #1
LineReply I swear I thought this was satire when I first saw it this morning
 genxlib Mar 17 #2
LineLineNew Reply It might as well be Satire if you read the NYT's article
 womanofthehills Mar 17 #21
LineLineLineNew Reply The Atlantic also published about it
 NickB79 Mar 17 #22
LineReply What did they do to it?
 CountAllVotes Mar 17 #3
LineReply Seems to me they don't want to even mention the MERs /SARS connection to any of the corona
 flying_wahini Mar 17 #4
LineLineReply People like having someone to blame
 IronLionZion Mar 17 #10
LineLineReply Virologists knew coronaviruses were mutating and on the move
 Warpy Mar 17 #11
LineReply Racoon dogs are a suspected conduit for SARS1.
 Eugene Mar 17 #5
LineReply Raccoon dogs are neither raccoons nor dogs, but they are in the family Canidae.
 friend of a friend Mar 17 #6
LineReply Racoon Dog ...
 aggiesal Mar 17 #7
LineReply More on racoon dogs
 IronLionZion Mar 17 #8
LineLineReply +1
 CountAllVotes Mar 17 #9
LineLineReply I've heard people from the north disparage people from the south
 Warpy Mar 17 #13
LineLineLineReply I grew up in Appalachia
 IronLionZion Mar 17 #14
LineLineLineLineReply Squirrel isn't bad if you soak it in milk overnight
 Warpy Mar 17 #16
LineLineNew Reply That's quite an attractive animal
 Bayard Mar 17 #20
LineReply And then there's this:
 Tomconroy Mar 17 #12
LineLineReply LOL gotta love Jon
 intrepidity Mar 17 #17
LineReply So happy to be vegetarian and not part of this atrocity!
 Coventina Mar 17 #15
LineReply Was not familiar with what a Raccoon-Dog was but
 PlutosHeart Mar 17 #18
LineLineReply I'd be interested to know what that disease is
 Bayard Mar 17 #19
LineLineLineNew Reply I almost dread to say the name
 PlutosHeart Sunday #24
LineLineLineLineNew Reply Wow...
 Bayard Sunday #25
LineLineLineLineLineNew Reply Off a thin metal wire fence we think.
 PlutosHeart Wednesday #26
LineLineLineLineLineLineNew Reply Sounds a lot like botulism in herbivores
 Bayard Wednesday #27
LineLineLineLineLineLineLineNew Reply Don't think there is a vaccination for this.
 PlutosHeart 15 hrs ago #29
LineNew Reply OMG! Tom Nook was responsible for COVID...?
 regnaD kciN Mar 17 #23
LineNew Reply This is awful. Raccoon dogs are incredible creatures.
 Kennah Wednesday #28

Response to riversedge (Original post)

Fri Mar 17, 2023, 12:27 PM

Star Member jcgoldie (10,312 posts)

1. well that took me down a rabbit hole

I didn't even know "raccoon dog" was a thing. Banned in the US too, whaddya know?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Response to riversedge (Original post)

Fri Mar 17, 2023, 12:32 PM

Star Member genxlib (5,279 posts)

2. I swear I thought this was satire when I first saw it this morning

I didn't even how there was such a thing.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Response to genxlib (Reply #2)

Fri Mar 17, 2023, 10:22 PM

Star Member womanofthehills (7,266 posts)

21. It might as well be Satire if you read the NYT's article

They took that headline down because none of its true.

They have no animal, there is no research paper and it’s 3 scientists- one who was kicked off the committee looking for the source - for lying.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Response to womanofthehills (Reply #21)

Fri Mar 17, 2023, 11:43 PM

NickB79 (17,826 posts)

22. The Atlantic also published about it

Sounds pretty substantial, given that the samples show a mixture of raccoon dog and COVID genetics (which is as close as we'll get to finding the infected animal itself), and a lot more than 3 scientists have chimed in with support.

https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2023/03/covid-origins-research-raccoon-dogs-wuhan-market-lab-leak/673390/

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Response to riversedge (Original post)

Fri Mar 17, 2023, 12:43 PM

Star Member CountAllVotes (20,473 posts)

3. What did they do to it?

Eat it and hence COVID-19?

Good gawd!



Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Response to riversedge (Original post)

Fri Mar 17, 2023, 12:45 PM

Star Member flying_wahini (4,988 posts)

4. Seems to me they don't want to even mention the MERs /SARS connection to any of the corona

Viruses? The fact that it originated in other places doesn’t really mean anything other than for tracking purposes. Viruses mutate. It’s what they do.

Animal to human transmission has been going on for a couple of decades.
That’s what causes the mutations.
Before there was corona there was the SARS , before that MERs.

Seems to me that by naming the source it looks a good way to blame a group of people
instead of the actual virus. The right newscasters will just take this and run with it on why we should close our borders argument again.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Response to flying_wahini (Reply #4)

Fri Mar 17, 2023, 01:21 PM

Star Member IronLionZion (42,003 posts)

10. People like having someone to blame

it helps them justify their own biases, prejudices, or other bigotry.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Response to flying_wahini (Reply #4)

Fri Mar 17, 2023, 01:28 PM

Star Member Warpy (106,479 posts)

11. Virologists knew coronaviruses were mutating and on the move

which is why that lab in Wuhan was studying them, in the first place. It was only a matter of time before zoonotic tramisission produced a virus capable of jumping from person to person more efficiently.

Raccoon dogs are an interesting critter, they're true dogs but make lousy pets. They occupy the same niche as our own trash pandas, biologists thinking the appearance evolved separately in species not even remotely related because of that.

And yes, they're grown and trapped for their meat. Protein's protein.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Response to riversedge (Original post)

Fri Mar 17, 2023, 12:48 PM

Star Member Eugene (56,529 posts)

5. Racoon dogs are a suspected conduit for SARS1.

This should come as no surprise.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Response to riversedge (Original post)

Fri Mar 17, 2023, 12:54 PM

friend of a friend (251 posts)

6. Raccoon dogs are neither raccoons nor dogs, but they are in the family Canidae.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Response to riversedge (Original post)

Fri Mar 17, 2023, 12:59 PM

Star Member aggiesal (7,975 posts)

7. Racoon Dog ...

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Response to riversedge (Original post)

Fri Mar 17, 2023, 01:08 PM

Star Member IronLionZion (42,003 posts)

8. More on racoon dogs

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_raccoon_dog



I've never heard of them but we probably shouldn't eat them.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Response to IronLionZion (Reply #8)

Fri Mar 17, 2023, 01:13 PM

Star Member CountAllVotes (20,473 posts)

9. +1

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Response to IronLionZion (Reply #8)

Fri Mar 17, 2023, 02:04 PM

Star Member Warpy (106,479 posts)

13. I've heard people from the north disparage people from the south

"They'll eat everything with four legs except the table."

It would be considered an exotic meat, probably destined for fine dining.

I think I'd probably pass, but then again, I grew up eating frogs. And don't look at me like that if you've ever eaten sausage or chicken nuggets.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Response to Warpy (Reply #13)

Fri Mar 17, 2023, 02:07 PM

Star Member IronLionZion (42,003 posts)

14. I grew up in Appalachia

people there eat squirrels, rabbits, wild birds, etc. I don't but I get it if they hunted it themselves. Deer is delicious. Farming exotic animals for wet markets is another issue.

There are viruses connected to eating wild hogs in the American south. Those pigs are dangerous.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Response to IronLionZion (Reply #14)

Fri Mar 17, 2023, 03:04 PM

Star Member Warpy (106,479 posts)

16. Squirrel isn't bad if you soak it in milk overnight

but I drew the line at burgoo. It's right down there with liver.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Response to IronLionZion (Reply #8)

Fri Mar 17, 2023, 09:35 PM

Star Member Bayard (18,159 posts)

20. That's quite an attractive animal

I can see where they got their name. Definitely not edible, in my book.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Response to Tomconroy (Reply #12)

Fri Mar 17, 2023, 03:28 PM

Star Member intrepidity (5,945 posts)

17. LOL gotta love Jon

The Chinese government itself is responsible for the prolonged confusion about this. In their efforts to distance China from *any* culpability wrt C19 origins--even wet market--they have fostered suspicions that are warranted.

Personally, I currently lean toward the zoonotic origin, having been a huge skeptic from the beginning--skepticism born from the behavior of China, mostly. The phylogenetic analyses are, to me, the most compelling evidence.

But China doesn't do itself, or anyone, any favors by continuing to withhold info. It just prolongs the confusion.

Plus, this issue should have *never* had an ideological divide as it does here. One of the most frustrating aspects to me.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Response to riversedge (Original post)

Fri Mar 17, 2023, 02:13 PM

Star Member Coventina (25,294 posts)

15. So happy to be vegetarian and not part of this atrocity!

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Response to riversedge (Original post)

Fri Mar 17, 2023, 04:10 PM

Star Member PlutosHeart (327 posts)

18. Was not familiar with what a Raccoon-Dog was but

there is a highly contagious disease in the US easily transmitted from saliva from raccoons to "dogs" that causes paralysis. Usually temporary but many vets are unable to diagnose it make poor decisions on a pet's fate because of it. I only know this because one of my past dogs had gotten it from sniffing on a fence and it is amazing how fast it happens.Luckily my vet was smart but took him a whole day to figure it out. Pup recovered 90% of his mobility.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Response to PlutosHeart (Reply #18)

Fri Mar 17, 2023, 09:33 PM

Star Member Bayard (18,159 posts)

19. I'd be interested to know what that disease is

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Response to Bayard (Reply #19)

Sun Mar 19, 2023, 01:26 AM

Star Member PlutosHeart (327 posts)

24. I almost dread to say the name

since it sounds racist but it is commonly called Coon-Hound Disease.
The paralysis is very rapid. My dog literally fell over in total paralysis in around 10 minutes. First vet had no clue. Then took him to a very old vet who literally had almost a lab in his house/business. He was well known in our State also but lived near me. He was 100% right on diagnosis.
It took about a month of wheeling him around on a flat cart, rolling him off to pee, etc....hand feeding him. I worked his legs slowly and gave him massages. One day he tried to stand up and it took about two hours and he started to finally get his bearings a bit.
He had residual damage in his left front paw as he would sort of semi-drag it. This is a common side effect from which limb was first affected. He lived a long good life and went on many forest adventures after that with me.
It is now a more commonly seen disease as well.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Response to PlutosHeart (Reply #24)

Sun Mar 19, 2023, 01:07 PM

Star Member Bayard (18,159 posts)

25. Wow...

That's scary. We trap raccoons here because they kill the chickens/ducks/geese.

How was your dog exposed to their saliva?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Response to Bayard (Reply #25)

Wed Mar 22, 2023, 02:52 AM

Star Member PlutosHeart (327 posts)

26. Off a thin metal wire fence we think.

Or the cement used to imbed he fence into. There was an area that it had come and gone through and my dog was sniffing it a lot. It is super easy to get.
I am so grateful my vet identified it otherwise I would have put Andy down. And I dearly loved him.
The symptoms are one limb affected first then the gradual total loss of usage of all fours including holding up the head and all of the body. But like I said, with 10-15 minutes he was floppy.
Just know that recovery rate is fairly good but it takes devotion as well as identification.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Response to PlutosHeart (Reply #26)

Wed Mar 22, 2023, 01:06 PM

Star Member Bayard (18,159 posts)

27. Sounds a lot like botulism in herbivores

We've had 2 baby donkeys die from that, and several goats. Slow paralysis till it finally shuts down vital organs. Its horrible. We finally learned we needed to vaccinate for it here.

Glad your boy recovered.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Response to Bayard (Reply #27)

Fri Mar 24, 2023, 10:34 PM

Star Member PlutosHeart (327 posts)

29. Don't think there is a vaccination for this.

Perhaps because it is most times not fatal. Just misdiagnosed, super scary to see and also takes devotion to help the dog recover. Not sure if other animals can catch it. No idea. Climate crisis has hastened more cases though.

I am sorry about your little creatures. Glad you found out you can vaccinate but so sorry they suffered as well as you did.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Response to riversedge (Original post)

Fri Mar 17, 2023, 11:56 PM

Star Member regnaD kciN (25,614 posts)

23. OMG! Tom Nook was responsible for COVID...?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Response to riversedge (Original post)

Wed Mar 22, 2023, 05:16 PM

Kennah (10,249 posts)

28. This is awful. Raccoon dogs are incredible creatures.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Reply to this thread

Latest Breaking News (Forum)
DU Home | Latest Threads | Greatest Threads | Forums & Groups | My Subscriptions | My Posts

About | Copyright | Privacy | Terms of service | Contact

In Memoriam

© 2001 - 2023 Democratic Underground, LLC. Thank you for visiting.