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Fri Sep 30, 2022, 09:36 AM

Russia-Ukraine war live: Kyiv applies for Nato membership after Putin annexes Ukrainian regions

Source: The Guardian.

Ukraine has formally submitted its application to join the Nato alliance, its president, Volodymyr Zelenskiy, has announced.

In a video update, Zelenskiy said Ukraine was "taking a decisive step for entire security of free nations".

Read more: https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2022/sep/30/russia-ukraine-war-live-news-biden-and-zelenskiy-reject-expected-annexations-ahead-of-putin-speech



Obviously Ukraine would not have made an application without consulting the United States.

Statement by President Zelensky
https://www.president.gov.ua/en/news/mi-robimo-svij-viznachalnij-krok-pidpisuyuchi-zayavku-ukrayi-78173

32 replies, 2002 views

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Arrow 32 replies Author Time Post
Reply Russia-Ukraine war live: Kyiv applies for Nato membership after Putin annexes Ukrainian regions (Original post)
speak easy Sep 30 OP
FelineOverlord Sep 30 #1
JohnSJ Sep 30 #2
lamp_shade Sep 30 #3
speak easy Sep 30 #4
lamp_shade Sep 30 #6
sarisataka Sep 30 #5
speak easy Sep 30 #8
Lancero Sep 30 #9
sarisataka Sep 30 #13
Pachamama Oct 1 #31
OneCrazyDiamond Sep 30 #26
BeyondGeography Sep 30 #10
Bayard Sep 30 #15
speak easy Sep 30 #7
Beastly Boy Sep 30 #11
Lovie777 Sep 30 #12
AZLD4Candidate Sep 30 #14
Duppers Sep 30 #28
Torchlight Sep 30 #16
blue-wave Sep 30 #17
Sogo Sep 30 #18
sarisataka Sep 30 #19
Sogo Sep 30 #20
sarisataka Sep 30 #21
Beachnutt Sep 30 #23
sarisataka Sep 30 #24
colorado_ufo Sep 30 #22
sarisataka Sep 30 #25
ripcord Sep 30 #27
Duppers Sep 30 #29
ripcord Sep 30 #30
BrightKnight Oct 2 #32


Response to speak easy (Original post)

Fri Sep 30, 2022, 09:39 AM

2. With Russia's annexation move, this makes perfect sense as a counter to that. I wonder if NATO will

agree.

With the new leadership in the UK and Italy it will be interesting if that changes anything



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Response to speak easy (Original post)

Fri Sep 30, 2022, 09:41 AM

3. I thought they had already applied.

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Response to lamp_shade (Reply #3)

Fri Sep 30, 2022, 09:45 AM

4. No.

There were ongoing negotiations about what 'security guarantees' Ukraine could be given after the war.

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Response to speak easy (Reply #4)

Fri Sep 30, 2022, 09:50 AM

6. Thanks. nt

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Response to speak easy (Original post)

Fri Sep 30, 2022, 09:46 AM

5. Acceptance is not happening

Unless NATO want to go to war with Russia

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Response to sarisataka (Reply #5)

Fri Sep 30, 2022, 09:51 AM

8. The question is, does Russia want war with NATO?

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Response to speak easy (Reply #8)

Fri Sep 30, 2022, 09:55 AM

9. Considering that they're lining things up to justify dropping nukes...

They're either gunning for a war, or banking on the West appeasing them. Again.

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Response to speak easy (Reply #8)

Fri Sep 30, 2022, 10:06 AM

13. They probably don't

But Russia is at war with Ukraine, regardless of what Russia calls it. If NATO joins they are choosing to go to war. Russia has not attacked a current NATO member.

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Response to sarisataka (Reply #13)

Sat Oct 1, 2022, 08:00 AM

31. The Sabotage of the Nordstream pipelines?

Could that possibly be considered an attack on NATO members?

Jens Stoltenberg and the various members of NATO realize the significance of this. Putin already has fired the first shot.

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Response to speak easy (Reply #8)

Fri Sep 30, 2022, 02:10 PM

26. The people of Russia, or

The Madmen who sent their troops to die by US made warfare? I don't think the latter cares.

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Response to sarisataka (Reply #5)

Fri Sep 30, 2022, 09:57 AM

10. Acceptance or not

NATO is already part of Ukraine’s future. All of its weaponry and training will come from NATO members and security guarantees from within the alliance will be part of any settlement with Russia.

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Response to sarisataka (Reply #5)

Fri Sep 30, 2022, 10:22 AM

15. Agreed

Nobody wants that. Can't afford it in all kinds of ways.

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Response to speak easy (Original post)


Response to speak easy (Original post)

Fri Sep 30, 2022, 10:03 AM

11. My guess is that Nato will reply with accelerated (or immediate) acceptance of Finland and Sweden

And officially take Ukraine's application under advisement.

Even if Nato doesn't intend to advance Ukraine's application in the near future, a lot may change in a few months. In the mean time, the threat of Ukraine asking for Nato membership may be enough to shut Putin up with his nuclear attack rhetoric.

Putin genuinely fears Nato expanding into Ukraine. All his gloating over his fake annexation of parts of Ukraine pale in comparison with his angst over Nato troops being stationed within 500 miles of Moscow.

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Response to speak easy (Original post)

Fri Sep 30, 2022, 10:06 AM

12. UGH . ..

Hungary Orban is a ass kisser for Putin.

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Response to speak easy (Original post)

Fri Sep 30, 2022, 10:15 AM

14. Putin just started WW3

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Response to AZLD4Candidate (Reply #14)

Fri Sep 30, 2022, 10:42 PM

28. Been thinking about that.

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Response to speak easy (Original post)

Fri Sep 30, 2022, 10:46 AM

16. Fascinating language the western leaders

are using to inform Moscow of potential consequences to their continued invasion. I think this is more a statement of intent, a declaration of what could come should Putin keep his current course.

Interesting to note that a month after Zelenskyy winning the presidency, Ukraine joined NATO's enhanced opportunity partner interoperability program


And bear in mind as well, NATO Secretary General Stoltenberg has publicly stressed more than once that Russia will not be able to veto Ukraine's accession to NATO "as we will not return to the era of spheres of interest, when large countries decide what smaller ones should do."

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Response to speak easy (Original post)

Fri Sep 30, 2022, 11:39 AM

17. Should have been done years ago

long before Pooty's 2nd invasion of Ukraine, better known as his war of terror and genocide. Heck, even before the first invasion in 2014.

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Response to speak easy (Original post)

Fri Sep 30, 2022, 12:11 PM

18. I think this means an abrupt halt to the RU/UKR war.

especially if NATO were to give an accelerated approval to UKR membership....

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Response to Sogo (Reply #18)

Fri Sep 30, 2022, 12:17 PM

19. Or WWIII

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Response to sarisataka (Reply #19)

Fri Sep 30, 2022, 12:18 PM

20. I prefer to see the glass half full.

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Response to Sogo (Reply #20)

Fri Sep 30, 2022, 12:20 PM

21. Risk analysis has taught me

To look at what is the worst possible result and mitigate the chances of it happening.

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Response to sarisataka (Reply #21)

Fri Sep 30, 2022, 12:39 PM

23. Wouldn't the risk be russia taking over Ukraine

and expanding it's reach into Europe and beyond ultimately ?
Adolf Putin has to be stopped asap.

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Response to Beachnutt (Reply #23)

Fri Sep 30, 2022, 12:59 PM

24. That is 'A' risk, not the worst

The worst is an all out strategic nuclear war. Many want to just hand wave that away with wishes. "Putin would never do that" or "the missiles probably don't work" however the same also said he would never invade. Do you want to stand in the city with 6-10 megatons inbound hoping the warheads won't go boom?

It is a moot point if they work because if Russia launches we are not going to wait to see if they explode before we launch. Russia is not going to have a 100% failure to launch rate.

So the solution is how to avoid that while stopping Russian expansion and returning occupied territory to Ukraine.

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Response to sarisataka (Reply #19)

Fri Sep 30, 2022, 12:34 PM

22. Russia does not have the capacity to fight NATO. Period.

Putin will have to do some "fancy dancin'" to back out of this disaster graciously, or else the oligarchs will find a way to send him on a permanent vacation. He has already damaged his own country terribly.

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Response to colorado_ufo (Reply #22)

Fri Sep 30, 2022, 01:07 PM

25. Not a conventional war

Which is why Soviet/ Russian battle plans always include options for NBC use. Even then NATO would be likely to win.

So how many millions of casualties make the fruits of victory taste like ash?

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Response to speak easy (Original post)

Fri Sep 30, 2022, 05:36 PM

27. Maybe the U.S. needs to give NATO a little reminder

When the U.S. enter WW2 in Europe we were under no obligation to do so, in fact since we had been attacked in the Pacific it would have made more sense for us as a nation to concentrate there first. We focused on the war in Europe because helping them was the right thing to do, NATO should remember that.

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Response to ripcord (Reply #27)

Fri Sep 30, 2022, 10:44 PM

29. They're not?

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Response to Duppers (Reply #29)

Fri Sep 30, 2022, 11:17 PM

30. We could have just kept Lend Lease going and not committed troops

Our President and countrymen chose to enter an existing conflict, to sacrifice, bleed and die to save the rest of Europe from Germany, they were under no obligation and could have left them to die but they chose to do the right thing. Before the war there were a groups of Americans opposed to getting into the war, they wanted to leave Europe to settle their own business, they went by the name American First, now we seem to have NATO First.

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Response to speak easy (Original post)

Sun Oct 2, 2022, 12:07 PM

32. NATO might take time but it would take minutes for Ukraine to become Nuclear power again.

Ukraine could easily be provided with tactical and strategic nukes. It would not make sense to just provide them with tactical weapons.

I would make sure they know that Russia knows that Ukraine would be fully armed if the were dumb enough to play that card.

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