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Thu Jan 13, 2022, 01:35 PM

Joe Manchin praises Kyrsten Sinema's refusal to tweak filibuster as voting rights bill stymied

Source: The Independent

Sen Joe Manchin praised fellow conservative Democrat Sen Kyrsten Sinema’s speech in which she indicated she would not vote to eliminate the filibuster to advance voting rights legislation.

Mr Manchin spoke with The Independent on the way to a meeting between President Joe Biden and Democratic senators as the White House seeks to enact legislation ahead of the 2022 midterms and the next presidential election.

“Very good,” Mr Manchin said of his colleague’s remarks. “Excellent speech.”

Other Democrats were less complimentary. “I’d say the speech kind of speaks for itself,” Sen Sheldon Whitehouse of Rhode Island said.

Read more: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/manchine-sinema-filibuster-voting-rights-b1992627.html

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Reply Joe Manchin praises Kyrsten Sinema's refusal to tweak filibuster as voting rights bill stymied (Original post)
Polybius Thursday OP
Irish_Dem Thursday #1
Cha Friday #51
Irish_Dem Friday #53
Cha Friday #54
True Blue American Thursday #2
Polybius Thursday #3
onecaliberal Thursday #4
Rebl2 Thursday #22
onecaliberal Thursday #25
BeckyDem Friday #52
AZSkiffyGeek Thursday #8
Joinfortmill Thursday #35
EndlessWire Thursday #41
Javaman Friday #48
PortTack Thursday #11
Bev54 Thursday #14
elleng Thursday #5
PatrickforB Thursday #20
rpannier Thursday #29
BradAllison Thursday #36
gab13by13 Thursday #6
brooklynite Thursday #7
AZSkiffyGeek Thursday #9
PortTack Thursday #12
brooklynite Thursday #13
Joinfortmill Thursday #34
Bev54 Thursday #15
Rebl2 Thursday #23
brooklynite Thursday #37
ForgoTheConsequence Thursday #43
brooklynite Thursday #44
oasis Friday #50
True Blue American Friday #46
ShazamIam Thursday #10
Post removed Thursday #16
MontanaMama Thursday #17
2naSalit Thursday #18
Joinfortmill Thursday #33
PatrickforB Thursday #19
Joinfortmill Thursday #32
Rob H. Thursday #21
Cobalt Violet Thursday #24
BlueIdaho Thursday #26
Moebym Thursday #27
kansasobama Thursday #28
Joinfortmill Thursday #31
Calista241 Thursday #39
BlueIdaho Friday #49
True Blue American Friday #47
Joinfortmill Thursday #30
jcmaine72 Thursday #38
pfitz59 Thursday #40
Marthe48 Thursday #42
monkeyman1 Thursday #45

Response to Polybius (Original post)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 01:41 PM

1. I wonder why I keep thinking about a special place in hell

reserved for certain people.

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Response to Irish_Dem (Reply #1)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 03:34 PM

51. That's a very

nice way to put it.

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Response to Cha (Reply #51)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 05:00 PM

53. Yes I cleaned it up quite a bit for public consumption.

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Response to Irish_Dem (Reply #53)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 05:03 PM

54. lol.. I know very well how

that goes. 😊

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Response to Polybius (Original post)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 01:46 PM

2. Joe Manchin is lying about Sinema's speech today, the same as the media. Everyone needs to listen to

To Her speech. She laid the blame right at the feet of those who are refusing to vote for a voting rights bills are now refusing to. She said she was for both bills!

Anyone get a video please post it. I have not been able to find it but the media is rushing right out, lying like the Devil! It was about the disease of division.

Andra Mitchell cut her off. I listened to it on CSPAN!

DOJ just charged 11 with seditious conduct!

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Response to True Blue American (Reply #2)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 01:47 PM

3. I agree that she's for passing the bill

But didn't she say that she opposes ending the filibuster to do it?

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Response to Polybius (Reply #3)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 01:48 PM

4. Yes

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Response to onecaliberal (Reply #4)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 04:26 PM

22. So she doesn't

understand we can’t get the vote without doing away with the filibuster at least momentarily to get voting rights act passed? I really don’t think she is for it, even though she said she is for it.

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Response to Rebl2 (Reply #22)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 04:29 PM

25. She understands perfectly. She just thinks her constituents are stupid.

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Response to onecaliberal (Reply #25)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:38 PM

52. Exactly right.

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Response to Polybius (Reply #3)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 01:54 PM

8. She's speaking idealistically

And on that level I agree with her. We SHOULD be able to sit down and debate and get 10 Republicans to agree that protecting voting rights is important.

And I don't think McConnell will nuke it as soon as possible if the Dems don't do anything.
But if the Dems do kill it, there's nothing stopping the next Republican congress from outlawing abortion nationally, for example.

I'd like to see it changed, and I disagree with Sinema's position right now, but I completely understand the point she is trying to make - that the other side needs to step up and do their jobs and that trying to govern without them will only further the divisions in the country.

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Response to AZSkiffyGeek (Reply #8)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 08:41 PM

35. In the real world the GOP is never going to step up.

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Response to AZSkiffyGeek (Reply #8)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 10:16 PM

41. It's hard to give a damn

about "divisions in the country" when the entire country is under threat of being taken over by a Hitler-like Trump Party, who don't support Democracy, but autocratic rule by a guy who idolizes the worst dregs of humanity world wide. He's a mafia guy who is in it for himself. Do we have the time to wait for ALL these effers to fricking DIE before we secure the country? Because, that's what it will take to get the other side to STEP UP. She was making a speech to HER side, not them. And, her side is questionable at this point. I'm now going to search for the tape...I'm tired of this crap.

It seems to me that Joe started his Presidency urging us ALL to bipartisanship, forgiveness, and wholeness for the country. A year in, and both he and the VP have declared us to be in an internal war. Well, they should know. I personally don't care whether some Republican agrees with Joe or not. He's doing a good job. He fixes problems, or tries, while THEY create them. Neither one of those two Dems are helping at all. We are in danger of losing our Democracy. When Trump lowers the American Flag and raises a flag with a big T on it, what will their excuse be? They are neither dealing with a full deck. Slap them in the face and wake them up! Assholes both!

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Response to AZSkiffyGeek (Reply #8)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 10:14 AM

48. the world were repukes are actually responsible doesn't exist.

that's what makes simema's "speech" completely disingenuous.

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Response to Polybius (Reply #3)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 02:00 PM

11. They aren't going to end the filibuster just do a "carve out."

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Response to Polybius (Reply #3)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 02:16 PM

14. They are not looking to end the filibuster just do a carve out and then go back to the

old rules of having to be on the floor to filibuster.

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Response to True Blue American (Reply #2)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 01:51 PM

5. *'Pre-empting a presidential visit to the Capitol to meet privately with Democrats,

Ms. Sinema took to the floor to say that while she backed two new voting rights measures and was alarmed about new voting restrictions in some states, she believed that a unilateral Democratic move to weaken the filibuster would only foster growing political division.

“These bills help treat the symptoms of the disease, but they do not fully address the disease itself,” Ms. Sinema said. “And while I continue to support these bills, I will not support separate actions that worsen the underlying disease of division infecting our country.”'>

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/01/13/us/politics/house-voting-rights-bill.html

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Response to elleng (Reply #5)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 03:07 PM

20. Foster growing division, is it? It is too late - I'd say the division is already irreparable.

The other side has already proven they are at war with democracy, and the GOP no longer supports the republic.

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Response to True Blue American (Reply #2)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 07:55 PM

29. She favors passing it, but will not make necessary changes to the rules

She is the very example of the white moderate described by MLK Jr 60 years ago in his letter from a Birmingham jail of 16 April 1963

I must make two honest confessions to you, my Christian and Jewish brothers. First, I must confess that over the past few years I have been gravely disappointed with the white moderate. I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's great stumbling block in his stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Counciler or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate, who is more devoted to "order" than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says: "I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I cannot agree with your methods of direct action"; who paternalistically believes he can set the timetable for another man's freedom; who lives by a mythical concept of time and who constantly advises the Negro to wait for a "more convenient season." Shallow understanding from people of good will is more frustrating than absolute misunderstanding from people of ill will. Lukewarm acceptance is much more bewildering than outright rejection.

I had hoped that the white moderate would understand that law and order exist for the purpose of establishing justice and that when they fail in this purpose they become the dangerously structured dams that block the flow of social progress. I had hoped that the white moderate would understand that the present tension in the South is a necessary phase of the transition from an obnoxious negative peace, in which the Negro passively accepted his unjust plight, to a substantive and positive peace, in which all men will respect the dignity and worth of human personality. Actually, we who engage in nonviolent direct action are not the creators of tension. We merely bring to the surface the hidden tension that is already alive. We bring it out in the open, where it can be seen and dealt with. Like a boil that can never be cured so long as it is covered up but must be opened with all its ugliness to the natural medicines of air and light, injustice must be exposed, with all the tension its exposure creates, to the light of human conscience and the air of national opinion before it can be cured.

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Response to True Blue American (Reply #2)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 08:44 PM

36. She's using the coward's way out

Stop it.

"I'll vote for it because I know it won't pass."

Her "oh well" tone was clear.

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Response to Polybius (Original post)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 01:52 PM

6. Why does this remind me of Joe Lieberman?

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Response to Polybius (Original post)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 01:54 PM

7. Why did Schumer talk this strategy up if there had been no progress with Manchin and Sinema?

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Response to brooklynite (Reply #7)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 01:58 PM

9. Can there be one of those weird late-night maneuvers that Schumer uses

When the chamber is mostly empty, to get approval by voice vote? I remember him doing that a few times last year.

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Response to brooklynite (Reply #7)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 02:03 PM

12. JMHO he holding te vote because it's one thing for a senator to stomp their feet and say no

Quite another to vote no and be the only one in your party to do so

If sinema votes no, it will seal her fate, if not already. AZ Dems are FED UP!!

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Response to PortTack (Reply #12)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 02:14 PM

13. I keep reading about how she's doomed.....

She's not up until 2024. Long time for people to stay angry.

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Response to brooklynite (Reply #13)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 08:38 PM

34. I don't think the Dems in Ariz will ever forget her.

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Response to PortTack (Reply #12)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 02:18 PM

15. I hope they have a really good dem to primary her.

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Response to Bev54 (Reply #15)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 04:27 PM

23. Me too

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Response to Bev54 (Reply #15)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 08:52 PM

37. I'm sure Justice Democrats will find a challenger...

...that the Republican challenger will love running against.

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Response to brooklynite (Reply #37)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 10:29 PM

43. Let me know when there are laws making it harder for wealthy white New Yorkers to vote.

Until then...

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Response to ForgoTheConsequence (Reply #43)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 10:36 PM

44. Well, Arizona has a longer early voting period than New York...

...which only introduced early voting two years ago.

...And Arizona has a provision for a County to mail a ballot to every voter (not allowed in NY)

...and they have a legal right for a no excuse absentee ballot (NYers voted down a Constitutional Amendment last year) including a permanent absentee ballot mailing list.

As much as activists are angry with her, I'm not convinced that ordinary voters will be focusing on voting rights.

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Response to Bev54 (Reply #15)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 02:35 PM

50. Nina Turner sez "It's time for Biden to gas up his jet" go to WV and AZ

and get work on primaring "their behinds".

I'm with Nina on that.

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Response to brooklynite (Reply #7)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:17 AM

46. I may be wrong but watching what is taking place

Seems like a pretty well structured plan.

Sinema came out, shamed Republicans for refusing to vote for a voting rights bill when they always did before.. Then she and Manchin went to the WH to meet with Biden.

Meanwhile the House passed the bill. Now Schumer is beginning a process of passing the bill back and forth. After so many passes the Filibuster can no longer be used. This came out last night.

The press is actually helping with all their doomsday projections.

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Response to Polybius (Original post)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 01:58 PM

10. This seems to place Sinema and Manchin in opposition to democracy and Democratic?

Sinema ended her career early and Manchin has chosen infamy.

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Response to Polybius (Original post)


Response to Polybius (Original post)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 02:30 PM

17. This is a game for them. n/t

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Response to Polybius (Original post)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 02:33 PM

18. *%#% them both...

I hope karma pays them both a visit real soon.

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Response to 2naSalit (Reply #18)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 08:37 PM

33. Me too.

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Response to Polybius (Original post)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 03:04 PM

19. I have to confess a degree of personal disgust with both Manchin and Sinema.

Their actions seem to me to be both un-Democratic, and undemocratic. I cannot see how it would be possible for any Democrat, no matter how conservative, or any sane Republican, if any of those exist these days, could fail to support the voting rights act.

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Response to PatrickforB (Reply #19)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 08:37 PM

32. Totally agree.

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Response to Polybius (Original post)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 03:40 PM

21. But...

wE'rE sO LuCKy tO hAve HiM!!1! He VoTEs FoR tHe PReSiDeNT's aGeNdA 100% oF tHe TImE!!1!!

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Response to Polybius (Original post)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 04:28 PM

24. White Supremacy.

They want a right-wing dictatorship. Both are extremists.

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Response to Polybius (Original post)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 04:33 PM

26. Make them vote against the Voting Rights Act. Period.

Don’t let them hide behind the Filibuster fig leaf, put them on record - hating our Democracy’s fundamental right to vote. Then everyone can see exactly what they are.

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Response to BlueIdaho (Reply #26)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 05:15 PM

27. I doubt that will work.

Even if Manchin and Sinema go on record with their nay votes, the bill's failure will be framed as a failure of the entire party even though 96% of the Democratic caucus will have voted yea.

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Response to Moebym (Reply #27)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 05:32 PM

28. Not if they really vote on Voting Rights

Problem is there may never be a vote if the filibuster is not broken. So, Sinema will never have to vote. She can just say she will.
Can Arizona recall her?

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Response to Moebym (Reply #27)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 08:35 PM

31. Do it anyway. They must stand by their miserable words.

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Response to Moebym (Reply #27)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 10:06 PM

39. You're assuming the rest of the Dems will line up for a lost cause vote.

And i'm not sure they will given the rule change is doomed to failure without Manchin and Sinema.

I can see a number of them voting to not change the rules, mainly so the Repubs can't point at them and say they're removing the filibuster because they supported it when there was a Dem President. But then again, maybe that's what they really feel. I'm not sure Schumer will even bring it to the floor given its ultimate fate, and how those votes could be used against Dems in the future.

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Response to Calista241 (Reply #39)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 11:50 AM

49. No, I'm assuming doing something is better than doing nothing

Shrugging our collective shoulders and saying “Oh well…” is not going to get us re-elected.

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Response to BlueIdaho (Reply #26)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:19 AM

47. That is what I have been saying,

Sinema put it right at Republicans feet in her speech. Do not forget she said she supported both bills!

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Response to Polybius (Original post)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 08:34 PM

30. These two are on the wrong side of history.

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Response to Polybius (Original post)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 09:54 PM

38. Two peas in the same oily pod.

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Response to Polybius (Original post)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 10:08 PM

40. Minority rule is a crime!

Death of the nation.

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Response to Polybius (Original post)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 10:20 PM

42. senators are the only ones who have a right to vote

After the debate is over the voting starts, just think how it will look when 52 elected senators vote NO on voting rights for American citizens.

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Response to Polybius (Original post)

Thu Jan 13, 2022, 11:40 PM

45. modern day -" BONNEY & CLYDE " !!

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