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Wed Dec 8, 2021, 07:50 AM

Pfizer says blood samples showed a third dose of its vaccine provides significant protection against

Source: New York Times

Pfizer and BioNTech said Wednesday that laboratory tests suggest that three doses of their coronavirus vaccine offers significant protection against the fast-spreading Omicron variant of the virus. The companies said that tests of blood from individuals who received only two doses found more than a 25-fold reduction in antibody levels against the Omicron variant compared to an earlier version of the virus.

That finding indicates that two doses alone “may not be sufficient to protect against infection” by the new variant, the companies said. But the blood samples obtained from people one month after they had received a booster shot showed neutralizing antibodies against the Omicron variant comparable to the levels of antibodies against a previous version of the virus after two doses, the companies said in a statement. At the same time, the tests suggested that the mutations in Omicron do not appear to significantly affect T cells — another critical part of the immune system’s response.

That suggests “vaccinated individuals may still be protected against severe forms of the disease” after only two doses, the companies said. The results seem to underscore the importance of booster shots in combating the new variant. “Our preliminary, first data set indicate that a third dose could still offer a sufficient level of protection from disease of any severity caused by the Omicron variant,” said Dr. Ugur Sahin, the chief executive officer of BioNTech, Pfizer’s German partner.

The results come one day after a preliminary report on laboratory experiments in South Africa found Omicron seemed to dull the power of the Pfizer’s vaccine. Those experiments also hinted that people who have received a booster shot might be better protected. The Omicron variant has now spread to dozens of countries, and while the Delta variant is still overwhelming dominant here, the Biden administration is bracing for Omicron’s impact.

Read more: https://www.nytimes.com/live/2021/12/08/world/omicron-variant-covid/pfizer-says-blood-samples-showed-a-third-dose-of-its-vaccine-provides-significant-protection-against-omicron

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Response to BumRushDaShow (Original post)

Wed Dec 8, 2021, 08:40 AM

1. I wonder

I wonder if people who got J&J first will become eligible for a third shot?

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Response to imaginary girl (Reply #1)

Wed Dec 8, 2021, 09:15 AM

2. They became eligible in October 2021

https://www.cnet.com/health/johnson-and-johnson-covid-booster-omicron-variant/

You could also get Pfizer or Moderna as a booster, says the article. Might be best to get one of the mRNA boosters instead, says the article.

Safest: check w/ your doctor.

While the CDC gave the go-ahead earlier this month for all adults to get boosters, people who received the one-dose Johnson & Johnson COVID-19 vaccine have been eligible for another shot since October. The reason for their earlier eligibility is because a single dose of Johnson & Johnson has lower effectiveness compared to two doses of a COVID-19 vaccine, according to the CDC.

. . .

Does the booster have to be another shot of J&J?

No. You can get any of the three COVID-19 vaccines available, depending on your personal circumstances or preference. This leeway isn't specific to people who got Johnson & Johnson -- all fully vaccinated adults can opt for a different booster after the FDA and CDC signed off on heterologous boosters or a "mix and match" approach to boosting for COVID-19. Johnson & Johnson's booster is the same dose as its original vaccine.

In fact, some people may opt for an mRNA booster because of their increased risk of a rare but serious complication of Johnson & Johnson's vaccine. Women under age 50 are at a higher risk for the blood-clotting disorder associated with Johnson & Johnson's vaccine and should "know about other available COVID-19 vaccine options for which this risk has not been seen," the CDC says. (These clots are extremely rare but considered serious because they typically require different treatment than the clots that occur from things such as taking birth control pills or riding on an airplane.)

Importantly, this risk isn't associated with the Pfizer or Moderna vaccines. There is also the rare risk of a neurological disorder linked to Johnson & Johnson, occurring mostly in older men. In clinical guidance issued this week, meant to help walk eligible adults through choosing a booster dose, the CDC said that patients with a history of Guillain-Barré syndrome should "discuss the availability of mRNA COVID-19 vaccines" for protection against the coronavirus.

At an October meeting with the CDC's advisory panel, committee Dr. Pablo Sanchez, said that while he agrees people who received Johnson & Johnson should get a second dose or booster, "I would prefer that those individuals get an mRNA vaccine."

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Response to CousinIT (Reply #2)

Wed Dec 8, 2021, 09:57 AM

3. Good information, but...

My question was about a third shot. The information you provided relates to a second shot. I got a Moderna booster when eligible, but the article I initially replied to talked about the importance of three -- not two -- shots. Seems like that issue may need to be addressed for anyone who started their series with J&J.

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Response to imaginary girl (Reply #3)

Wed Dec 8, 2021, 10:31 AM

4. Agree. I did the same as you, imaginary girl.

Again, J&J people left without answers.

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Response to bamagal62 (Reply #4)

Wed Dec 8, 2021, 11:16 AM

6. The J&J provides a superior CD8 cell response

The J&J with an mRNA booster provides excellent protection. The study that measures neutralizing antibodies by vaccine and booster is online if you want to see for yourself. The WSJ did a nice synopsis though here.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.wsj.com/amp/articles/covid-19-vaccine-boosters-mix-and-match-efficacy-11635955315

J&J with a Moderna booster is the best

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Response to DenaliDemocrat (Reply #6)

Wed Dec 8, 2021, 01:51 PM

12. Thanks!

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Response to imaginary girl (Reply #3)

Wed Dec 8, 2021, 11:03 AM

5. Since the mix/match was only approved in late October

we are still only a couple months out from when you could have gotten that booster so there should be time to evaluate how that goes (particularly for those who are still in the mix/match trials who had Janssen's (J&J) vaccine).



Those who got Pfizer or Moderna in a "2-dose series", generally started those much earlier, and only started getting a "3rd dose" 6 months (or later) after their 2nd dose once that was approved in August.



So at this point, the "importance of 3 shots" is only for the mRNA vaccines. From what I gathered, a mRNA "booster" to Janssen's vaccine provided a very robust response and you are probably good to go for the time being (unless you are very immuno-compromised and in that case, I think they are still trying to get data from what happens after an initial booster - whether using another Janssen or one of the mRNAs).

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Response to BumRushDaShow (Original post)

Wed Dec 8, 2021, 12:17 PM

7. My first Pfizer shot required a booster after 2 weeks. Does that count as ONE shot or TWO?

I've already had a 6-month "booster" shot... does that mean I've had two or three?

When Pfizer says I need a third shot, have I already received it? (after all, I've had three injections...)

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Response to NurseJackie (Reply #7)

Wed Dec 8, 2021, 12:31 PM

8. There was discussion of some immuno-compromised possibly needing a 4th shot



Which for Pfizer would mean a "3-dose primary series" plus a "4th dose" (that they are calling a "booster" although it is the same concentration as the previous doses).

This is actually reflected on the top row of that chart.

The first column shows a "2-dose primary series" as the initial dosing (with a default timing between dose 1 and dose 2 of 21 days, although in your case, the 2nd dose was a week earlier), and then in the second column, they list what they are calling "an additional dose for the immuno-compromised" at least 28 days after the first 2, and finally in the third column they show what they are calling a "booster dose" at least 6 months after the initial doses.

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Response to BumRushDaShow (Reply #8)

Wed Dec 8, 2021, 01:07 PM

9. Thanks! That's helpful...

... mostly. Still very confusing though.

Just tell me where I need to be and what I need to do and I'll be there to get my shot/s.

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Response to NurseJackie (Reply #9)

Wed Dec 8, 2021, 01:39 PM

11. Since you have had 3 shots (regardless of the internal timing of those)

then you should probably wait another 6 months after that last shot to get a 4th.

So if you got it (the "booster" or 3rd shot) right after the official "booster approval" that happened in August, then you would wait to get another shot in February. I don't know when you had your initial 2 shots or that last one, so that is also something to keep in mind for timing.

Most of the chain pharmacies do offer 1st dose, 2nd dose, 3rd dose, and 4th dose or "booster". For me, since I had Moderna and wanted to stay with Moderna, I let my pharmacy know that I only needed the "1/2 dose 'booster'" version of Moderna for my 3rd dose and not another "full dose" Moderna for my 3rd dose, since I am not immuno-compromised. Moderna was the only one doing 1/2 doses as their "booster".

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Response to BumRushDaShow (Reply #11)

Wed Dec 8, 2021, 02:34 PM

13. I had the Pfizer (part-A and B) then the over-65 booster...

... so I'm probably looking at February before I get my 2nd booster or 3rd round or 4th jab.

So far no adverse reactions (other than tenderness in the injection site)

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Response to NurseJackie (Reply #13)

Wed Dec 8, 2021, 02:49 PM

14. Okay

Yes - there appears to be that 6-month interval between the first 3 and a 4th one. At that point, we would be into a new year since the initial large group of vaccines were done, so we'll have to see at what point people are told to "start over" for a new year's worth of protection (I know they don't want to think about that ).

Since I wanted to stay with Moderna for a booster and that wasn't approved for "regular" booster doses until the 3rd week of October, I waited until a couple weeks after that approval week so that I could also get the flu shot with it too.

The timing was pretty good since I reached the 6 months post-1st/2nd doses that same week Moderna was approved for the non-immuno-compromised booster, so I could plan for it at a closer location to where I live, making sure that where I got the vaccine also carried Moderna (some sites only carried Pfizer).

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Response to BumRushDaShow (Reply #11)

Wed Dec 8, 2021, 03:06 PM

15. 4th shot has not been approved for anybody yet.

NT

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Response to LisaL (Reply #15)

Wed Dec 8, 2021, 03:20 PM

17. I just included that slide from their October meeting (twice above)

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Response to NurseJackie (Reply #7)

Wed Dec 8, 2021, 03:07 PM

16. Pfizer was originally a 2 dose vaccine (I presume you mean your second dose

was 3 weeks after your first dose, not 2). Then you got a booster 6 months later. You had 3 shots.

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Response to LisaL (Reply #16)

Wed Dec 8, 2021, 03:54 PM

18. Thanks... it's all starting to make sense now.

Stay safe!

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Response to BumRushDaShow (Original post)

Wed Dec 8, 2021, 01:26 PM

10. My original vaxes were Moderna and I got a Pfizer booster on 11/12. I feel well protected

and will go on living my life as normal. I'll wear a mask where it is required, which is most places here in L.A.

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