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Tue Nov 19, 2019, 05:59 PM

Navy Wants to Eject From SEALs a Sailor Cleared by Trump, Officials Say

Source: NYT

The Navy SEAL at the center of a high-profile war crimes case has been ordered to appear before Navy leaders Wednesday morning, and is expected to be notified that the Navy intends to oust him from the elite commando force, two Navy officials said on Tuesday.

The move could put the SEAL commander, Rear Adm. Collin Green, in direct conflict with President Trump, who last week cleared the sailor, Chief Petty Officer Edward Gallagher, of any judicial punishment in the war crimes case. Military leaders opposed that action as well as Mr. Trump’s pardons of two soldiers involved in other murder cases.

Navy officials had planned to begin the process of taking away Chief Gallagher’s Trident pin, the symbol of his membership in the SEALs, earlier this month. But as he waited outside his commander’s office, Navy leaders sought clearance from the White House that never came, and no action was taken.

Admiral Green now has the authorization he needs from the Navy to act against Chief Gallagher, and the formal letter notifying the chief of the action has been drafted and signed by the admiral, the two officials said.

Read more: https://www.nytimes.com/2019/11/19/us/navy-seals-edward-gallagher-trident.html

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Reply Navy Wants to Eject From SEALs a Sailor Cleared by Trump, Officials Say (Original post)
demmiblue Nov 19 OP
Freedomofspeech Nov 19 #1
cstanleytech Nov 19 #2
EX500rider Nov 19 #17
cstanleytech Nov 20 #21
Kurt V. Nov 19 #3
marcpud Nov 19 #4
PatrickforO Nov 19 #10
nykym Nov 20 #29
gopiscrap Nov 20 #30
keithbvadu2 Nov 19 #5
Submariner Nov 19 #6
Evolve Dammit Nov 19 #7
Quackers Nov 19 #8
RainCaster Nov 20 #24
Quackers Nov 20 #27
Haggis for Breakfast Nov 19 #9
Polybius Nov 19 #14
burrowowl Nov 20 #19
riversedge Nov 19 #11
DallasNE Nov 19 #12
jmowreader Nov 20 #22
obamanut2012 Nov 20 #32
JohnnyRingo Nov 19 #13
Progressive Jones Nov 19 #15
rampartc Nov 20 #26
Progressive Jones Nov 20 #28
roamer65 Nov 19 #16
jmowreader Nov 20 #23
Marcuse Nov 19 #18
rabid_decline Nov 20 #20
Name removed Nov 20 #25
OneCrazyDiamond Nov 20 #31
dware Nov 20 #33
dustyscamp Nov 21 #34

Response to demmiblue (Original post)

Tue Nov 19, 2019, 06:02 PM

1. Good news!

Those men should not have been pardoned. He told the world commiting war crimes is just fine.

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Response to demmiblue (Original post)

Tue Nov 19, 2019, 06:06 PM

2. Any chance they could be extradited to the countries where the murders

took place?

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Response to cstanleytech (Reply #2)

Tue Nov 19, 2019, 11:51 PM

17. I'd say about zero, the US usually does not extradite to 3erd World countries with corrupt courts..

..and medieval prisons.

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Response to EX500rider (Reply #17)

Wed Nov 20, 2019, 12:58 AM

21. It usually does not grant pardons to people like this either so maybe the next President and the DOJ

will reconsider.

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Response to demmiblue (Original post)

Tue Nov 19, 2019, 06:12 PM

3. this is a pretty big deal.

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Response to demmiblue (Original post)

Tue Nov 19, 2019, 06:34 PM

4. Just a thought

Isn’t accepting a Presidential pardon an implicit admission of guilt?

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Response to marcpud (Reply #4)

Tue Nov 19, 2019, 08:47 PM

10. I believe so. nt

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Response to PatrickforO (Reply #10)

Wed Nov 20, 2019, 10:30 AM

29. Yes it is

The pardon is offered to the individual.
They cab either accept it or turn it down.
If accepted it is an admission of guilt.

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Response to marcpud (Reply #4)

Wed Nov 20, 2019, 11:23 AM

30. welcome to DU

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Response to demmiblue (Original post)

Tue Nov 19, 2019, 06:38 PM

5. Any actions concerning the other SEAL who admitted actually killing the prisoner?

Any actions concerning the other SEAL who admitted actually killing the prisoner?

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Response to demmiblue (Original post)

Tue Nov 19, 2019, 07:18 PM

6. Taking away his Trident would be a BFD

It would be like being demoted to an everyday run of the mill Chief Petty Officer...period.

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Response to demmiblue (Original post)

Tue Nov 19, 2019, 08:06 PM

7. Good God. All war criminals should be locked up for the rest of their lives.

GWB's administration brought back the war crimes and torture (Yoo and Gonzalez) calling the Geneva Conventions "quaint" and the Constitution a "goddam piece of paper" (GWB). Now we have a further enabling of war criminals by 45. Have we irreparably lost our way? I guess to fuck. And at least 30% of us is fine with that.

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Response to demmiblue (Original post)

Tue Nov 19, 2019, 08:17 PM

8. It will be interesting to see how this plays out.

By all measures, Trump has the final say. I don’t agree with what Trump did, but I don’t think the sailor can be punished now that the pardon has been given.

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Response to Quackers (Reply #8)

Wed Nov 20, 2019, 02:28 AM

24. He's not being punished, just demoted

Accepting a pardon means that you admit to wrongdoing. The Seals are a premier group inside the Navy, and they will not accept such behavior in their ranks.

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Response to RainCaster (Reply #24)

Wed Nov 20, 2019, 08:04 AM

27. Being demoted and kicked out of the Seals is punishment. No way around it. nt

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Response to demmiblue (Original post)

Tue Nov 19, 2019, 08:31 PM

9. trumpie may have pardoned Gallagher,

but he does NOT sit on the NAVY tribunal that decides this man's fate via the UCMJ. They have every right and all the legal authority they need to take his trident. And they absolutely should. This man has disgraced himself, the NAVY and especially the SEALS. I have had the honor of knowing many of these men and their courage, bravery and integrity were never in question. Gallagher leaves a stain that no one can remove, and SEALS deserve better than to be associated with this arrogant, lawless scum. TAKE HIS TRIDENT. He has proven that he is unfit to wear it.

trumpie has NO FUCKING BUSINESS interfering in military justice. His treatment of troops (and vets) is disgraceful and undermines the morale of all in uniform (and out). He is the biggest traitor of all.

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Response to Haggis for Breakfast (Reply #9)

Tue Nov 19, 2019, 09:50 PM

14. From the article:

The president has the authority to stop or reverse any decision concerning the SEALs’ Tridents, according to Eugene R. Fidell, who teaches military justice at Yale Law School. But for generations, he said, presidents have generally refrained from inserting themselves into the military’s personnel decisions.

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Response to Polybius (Reply #14)

Wed Nov 20, 2019, 12:20 AM

19. Dump will insert himself

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Response to demmiblue (Original post)

Tue Nov 19, 2019, 08:55 PM

11. good!!

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Response to demmiblue (Original post)

Tue Nov 19, 2019, 09:00 PM

12. Non-Judical Punishment

Use Article 15 to strip the pin. Shouldn't be double jeopardy. No review process. Simple and clean.

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Response to DallasNE (Reply #12)

Wed Nov 20, 2019, 01:25 AM

22. Revocation of SEAL trident is not an authorized Article 15 punishment

It is, however, an allowable administrative action.

Were I his Team commander, I would kick him out of the Navy, grounds are Best Interest of the Service. This, in addition to revoking his trident.

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Response to DallasNE (Reply #12)

Wed Nov 20, 2019, 02:58 PM

32. He also accepted a pardon ie admitted his guilt

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Response to demmiblue (Original post)

Tue Nov 19, 2019, 09:08 PM

13. The last words in the article...

...about whether Trump will go against the Navy admiral to restore the SEAL's trident badge:

The president has the authority to stop or reverse any decision concerning the SEALs’ Tridents, according to Eugene R. Fidell, who teaches military justice at Yale Law School. But for generations, he said, presidents have generally refrained from inserting themselves into the military’s personnel decisions.

“The president is the commander in chief; he could give orders about how to peel the potatoes in the chow hall if he wanted,” Mr. Fidell said. “The question is, should he?”

Regarding Chief Gallagher’s Trident, he said: “A reasonable observer could say this is a completely inappropriate intrusion into the military. If Trump saves his Trident — and I’d bet on it — I would say he will have driven the wedge ever deeper into an already divided military. And that can’t be helpful.”


Putin's dream come true

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Response to demmiblue (Original post)

Tue Nov 19, 2019, 11:44 PM

15. OK, let's say tRump saves this asshole's position.

Are the SEALS required to let him do the work?
Can't they bust him down to shining shoes, or operating a broom, or whatever?

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Response to Progressive Jones (Reply #15)

Wed Nov 20, 2019, 04:42 AM

26. they can sit him behind a desk

at any of several remote locations with miserable weather and limited recreational opportunities where he can polish his trident and bore the young sailors with war stories.

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Response to rampartc (Reply #26)

Wed Nov 20, 2019, 09:10 AM

28. Yeah, that's what I was getting at. I doubt he'll be involved with any more SEAL stuff.

Others in his unit probably won't trust him. At the least, they won't like the distraction he's become.

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Response to demmiblue (Original post)

Tue Nov 19, 2019, 11:45 PM

16. The Navy should kick him out period.

Dishonorable discharge.

Ignore any antics Dumpy tries.

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Response to roamer65 (Reply #16)

Wed Nov 20, 2019, 01:32 AM

23. A dishonorable discharge isn't available to them

That can only be inflicted as part of a General Court Martial sentence.

An Other Than Honorable discharge IS available to them, it’s an administrative action. However, Trump is probably going to reverse any actions taken against Gallagher...because it certainly seems like Trump is working overtime to turn the whole world against us.

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Response to demmiblue (Original post)

Tue Nov 19, 2019, 11:51 PM

18. "Vindman is not a hero. He's a hero because he wasn't a war criminal. I like war criminals."

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Response to demmiblue (Original post)

Wed Nov 20, 2019, 12:27 AM

20. Did I hear correctly today

That the orange one is the 1st prez to pardon war criminals? I think I heard Hartmann say that.

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Response to demmiblue (Original post)


Response to demmiblue (Original post)

Wed Nov 20, 2019, 02:48 PM

31. Gallagher wasn't pardoned for war crimes.

He was acquitted. The Navy flubbed the case badly and we skated the war crime charges. It is the posing with the body that he was demoted for.

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Response to OneCrazyDiamond (Reply #31)

Wed Nov 20, 2019, 10:21 PM

33. Thank you!!!

People seem to have lost sight of that.

Posing with an enemy combatants body isn't unusual, it happens more times than most people realize, I saw it plenty in VN, not saying it's right, just saying it happens frequently.

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Response to demmiblue (Original post)

Thu Nov 21, 2019, 02:01 AM

34. Ugh, I just checked the comment section of this site to see how people reacted to this news

https://www.military.com/daily-news/2019/11/20/gallagher-faces-loss-trident-lawyers-claim-seal-brass-showed-contempt-trump.html

It's full of magats tossing their shit at Admiral Green and the Left.

President Trump is the Commander in Chief and therefore has all the authority to interject as he deems fit.

Seems to me, the Commander in Chief needs to clean house at the Command levels. A majority of these Commanders have the same problem we are seeing from the NSC Staff, Department of State and other long term Political career Politicians (Republicans and Democrats) who have decided to run their offices as they seem fit rather than actually listen or follow their boss


Pres Trump or the SECDEF should immediately stop this outright insubordination by this admiral and now this review board... Admiral Greene should be disciplined and forced to retire!!!!!

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