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Wed May 16, 2018, 07:17 PM

Giuliani: Mueller's team told Trump's lawyers they can't indict a president

Source: CNN

(CNN)Special counsel Robert Mueller's team has informed President Donald Trump's attorneys that they have concluded that they cannot indict a sitting president, according to the President's lawyer.

"All they get to do is write a report," Trump lawyer Rudy Giuliani told CNN. "They can't indict. At least they acknowledged that to us after some battling, they acknowledged that to us."

That conclusion is likely based on longstanding Justice Department guidelines. It is not about any assessment of the evidence Mueller's team has compiled.

A lack of an indictment would not necessarily mean the President is in the clear. Mueller could issue a report making referrals or recommendations to the House of Representatives.

Read more: https://www.cnn.com/2018/05/16/politics/rudy-giuliani-robert-mueller-indictment/index.html?sr=twCNN051618rudy-giuliani-robert-mueller-indictment0531PMStory

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Reply Giuliani: Mueller's team told Trump's lawyers they can't indict a president (Original post)
CousinIT May 2018 OP
unblock May 2018 #1
elmac May 2018 #32
SergeStorms May 2018 #48
unblock May 2018 #55
SergeStorms May 2018 #56
3Hotdogs May 2018 #2
CousinIT May 2018 #7
truthisfreedom May 2018 #18
3Hotdogs May 2018 #21
Keefer May 2018 #38
MGKrebs May 2018 #3
3Hotdogs May 2018 #11
OhZone May 2018 #13
3Hotdogs May 2018 #17
Calista241 May 2018 #27
LenaBaby61 May 2018 #19
MGKrebs May 2018 #23
Cha May 2018 #49
whathehell May 2018 #52
Arkansas Granny May 2018 #4
Rhiannon12866 May 2018 #47
PoliticAverse May 2018 #5
Eliot Rosewater May 2018 #8
CousinIT May 2018 #9
humbled_opinion May 2018 #22
Lonestarblue May 2018 #36
Eliot Rosewater May 2018 #6
SkatmanRoth May 2018 #10
still_one May 2018 #12
PoliticAverse May 2018 #15
Eyeball_Kid May 2018 #30
OhioLiberal2008 May 2018 #14
byronius May 2018 #28
mac56 May 2018 #44
OhioLiberal2008 May 2018 #57
RockRaven May 2018 #16
tomp May 2018 #50
humbled_opinion May 2018 #20
bluestarone May 2018 #24
Calista241 May 2018 #25
duforsure May 2018 #26
matt819 May 2018 #29
elmac May 2018 #31
Rollo May 2018 #58
RainCaster May 2018 #33
Civic Justice May 2018 #34
bluestarone May 2018 #35
berni_mccoy May 2018 #37
Perseus May 2018 #39
rockfordfile May 2018 #42
TeamPooka May 2018 #40
Marcuse May 2018 #41
flotsam May 2018 #43
EndGOPPropaganda May 2018 #45
moondust May 2018 #46
Achilleaze May 2018 #51
Cicada May 2018 #53
Javaman May 2018 #54

Response to CousinIT (Original post)

Wed May 16, 2018, 07:20 PM

1. Of course, we can't rule out that ghouliani is talking out of his ass. Again.

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Response to unblock (Reply #1)

Wed May 16, 2018, 08:08 PM

32. they had the same problem with Nixon

but threatened to include him as an Unindicted co-conspirator if impeachment didn't happen.

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Response to unblock (Reply #1)

Thu May 17, 2018, 03:34 AM

48. I do believe senility is plaguing Ghouliani now.

Like Trump's "everybody says" and "everybody knows", anything that comes from Ghouliani's mouth is to be taken with an 18 wheeler full of salt. It's mostly wishful thinking, on both Trump's and Ghouliani's parts.

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Response to SergeStorms (Reply #48)

Thu May 17, 2018, 10:10 AM

55. senility may be a factor, but it can't be easy for a normal-thinking person to advocate for donnie

keeping all those lies straight, trying to figure out which lie will meet with donnie's approval given that none of it is facts-based, etc.


not that anyone in donnie's orbit is normal-thinking....

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Response to unblock (Reply #55)

Thu May 17, 2018, 11:24 AM

56. Really!

Try to imagine the city dump that exists in Sarah Sanders' brain right now.

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Response to CousinIT (Original post)

Wed May 16, 2018, 07:20 PM

2. A recommendation to the House? You know where that will go? Straight up our asses.

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Response to 3Hotdogs (Reply #2)

Wed May 16, 2018, 07:24 PM

7. They'll chuck it in the trash bin. ONLY chance is House turns BLUE in November

And Senate too. THEN any recommendation/report Mueller submits CAN be acted upon.

Other than that, Trump has gotten away with all his crimes and his constitutional violations and will continue to do so.

And I'd remind everyone not to turn on NPR these days. It's become a veritable cheerleader for Trump's tax 1.5B in tax cuts for the wealthy, charter schools and elimination of public schools, and unregulated, untaxed capitalism (just tonight they had the founder of Home Depot on to talk about his book "I Love Capitalism!" and he was telling us all how Capitalism works (if you're a billionaire of course -- doesn't work for anyone else)

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Response to 3Hotdogs (Reply #2)

Wed May 16, 2018, 07:38 PM

18. After the mid terms?

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Response to truthisfreedom (Reply #18)

Wed May 16, 2018, 07:41 PM

21. Also, ain't gonna happen.

Remember, 2/3rds vote required.


Maybe, just maybe he gets impeached. Convicted? Never.


He could wack a nun on 5th Avenue.......

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Response to 3Hotdogs (Reply #21)

Wed May 16, 2018, 08:30 PM

38. It only requires a

simple majority in the house.

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Response to CousinIT (Original post)

Wed May 16, 2018, 07:21 PM

3. 2.5 words....

"Unindicted co-conspirator".

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Response to MGKrebs (Reply #3)

Wed May 16, 2018, 07:28 PM

11. just like Christie in Bridgegate. You know where that went.

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Response to 3Hotdogs (Reply #11)

Wed May 16, 2018, 07:34 PM

13. Ruined his career and

got NJ a Democratic Governor.





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Response to OhZone (Reply #13)

Wed May 16, 2018, 07:37 PM

17. Wrong. He was out because of term limits.

His career ended when he brought back the wrong order from McDonalds.

He is now back at his law office, probably making 3x the $$$ he made as governor.

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Response to 3Hotdogs (Reply #17)

Wed May 16, 2018, 07:53 PM

27. He's a former US Attorney.

Former US Attorneys are literally sitting on top of a mint in terms of their ability to make money.

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Response to OhZone (Reply #13)

Wed May 16, 2018, 07:40 PM

19. Was just eating dinner ...

And just saw that picture of Christie sitting there looking like a beached whale, then I got to thinking about that picture he took wearing that huge baseball uniform.

I'm not hungry any longer 🤮 & 😳

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Response to OhZone (Reply #13)

Wed May 16, 2018, 07:46 PM

23. Just another brick in the wall.

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Response to OhZone (Reply #13)

Thu May 17, 2018, 04:44 AM

49. Christie's polls were sooo Low that

it must have helped get a Dem Gov in.

He left a terrible legacy.. if he gives a rats ass.

Good for Dems, though.

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Response to MGKrebs (Reply #3)

Thu May 17, 2018, 06:50 AM

52. Yep, it worked on Nixon.

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Response to CousinIT (Original post)

Wed May 16, 2018, 07:22 PM

4. I'll wait to hear that directly from Mueller before I take Rudy's word for it.

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Response to Arkansas Granny (Reply #4)

Thu May 17, 2018, 02:01 AM

47. On MSNBC tonight they said of course Rudy never got anything from Mueller

They said he talked to someone and attributed it to Mueller - and then walked it back.

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Response to CousinIT (Original post)

Wed May 16, 2018, 07:22 PM

5. The official position of the DOJ is that the President cannot be indicted. Nixon wasn't indicted.

It's unlikely Muller would indict Trump.

From 10-16-2000:

The indictment or cniminal prosecution of a sitting President would unconstitutionally undermine the
capacity of the executive branch to perform its constitutionally assigned function.

https://www.justice.gov/sites/default/files/olc/opinions/2000/10/31/op-olc-v024-p0222_0.pdf

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Response to PoliticAverse (Reply #5)

Wed May 16, 2018, 07:25 PM

8. And even though it will be crystal clear he is guilty of hundreds of crimes and emolument

clause violations and working with our enemy to interfere with an election, his deplorables will say since he was not indicted he is innocent.

But even if he is indicted they will say he is innocent, dumbshits.

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Response to PoliticAverse (Reply #5)

Wed May 16, 2018, 07:25 PM

9. He can't be indicted and won't be impeached then NO. LAW. applies to him. NONE.

I'm sorry but that needs to change.

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Response to CousinIT (Reply #9)

Wed May 16, 2018, 07:43 PM

22. He can be impeached

especially if Democrats win the House, but probably not removed, however the impeachment itself would be important to show that America will not normalize this kind of behavior in a President.

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Response to PoliticAverse (Reply #5)

Wed May 16, 2018, 08:16 PM

36. I hope that interpretation changes because it puts any president above the law.

The Constitution specifically provides for a backup, the vice president, when the president cannot perform his assigned function—as he could not do from jail. So that should be no excuse to avoid indictment for criminal conduct. I’m certainly not a lawyer, but if the president cannot be indicted, then he is free to spend the next two years committing every crime he wants and entering into any number of illegal agreements with other countries that do not require Congressional approval—all to benefit his business. Yes, I know he can be impeached, but we all know that the Senate will not have the majority needed to convict during his term of office. I don’t think the country will survive two more years of this blatantly corrupt person.

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Response to CousinIT (Original post)

Wed May 16, 2018, 07:24 PM

6. Who said this, Rudy? He is a liar, cant trust him at all.

It may be true but it sure as hell isnt anything until someone who doesnt lie all day long says it.

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Response to CousinIT (Original post)

Wed May 16, 2018, 07:26 PM

10. False sense of security to get Trump in front of a Grand Jury

Then when Trump perjures himself, indict the loser.

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Response to CousinIT (Original post)

Wed May 16, 2018, 07:29 PM

12. That is not up that asshole. The SC will decide it

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Response to still_one (Reply #12)

Wed May 16, 2018, 07:36 PM

15. If Mueller never indicts Trump the Supreme Court won't need to decide the matter. n/t

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Response to PoliticAverse (Reply #15)

Wed May 16, 2018, 07:57 PM

30. A subpeona issued to Trumpy does not require a presumed indictment.

indictments occur after an investigation takes place. Mueller is still interviewing.

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Response to CousinIT (Original post)

Wed May 16, 2018, 07:36 PM

14. With This Being The Case Why Did We Hold So Much Hope Mueller Would Take Trump Down?

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Response to OhioLiberal2008 (Reply #14)

Wed May 16, 2018, 07:55 PM

28. Rudy is Lying.

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Response to OhioLiberal2008 (Reply #14)

Wed May 16, 2018, 11:02 PM

44. Dude, you must chill.

Welcome to DU.

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Response to mac56 (Reply #44)

Thu May 17, 2018, 09:12 PM

57. Thanks But I Been Here Since 2003

Just different username I was 14 when I joined

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Response to CousinIT (Original post)

Wed May 16, 2018, 07:37 PM

16. Prediction:

It will come to light that Rudy is lying about the content of that conversation.

Also, Trump will be indicted by somebody (possibly state instead of federal, possibly by a non-Special Counsel US Attorney) prior to leaving office.

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Response to RockRaven (Reply #16)

Thu May 17, 2018, 05:56 AM

50. that rudy is lying is virtually a given.

 

another possibility is that Mueller will issue a sealed indictment to take effect as soon as he leaves office.

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Response to CousinIT (Original post)

Wed May 16, 2018, 07:40 PM

20. All the more reason for

Democrats to win the House, after this news if we do not take the House any report from Mueller will be filed away with no action by corrupt Repubs.

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Response to CousinIT (Original post)

Wed May 16, 2018, 07:46 PM

24. since when do we believe Giuliani?

I'm not sure that Mueller made this statement! Giuliani's track record hasn't been that great if ya know what i mean! Hope it's a trap set for RUMPY!!!!!

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Response to CousinIT (Original post)

Wed May 16, 2018, 07:50 PM

25. It would be Rosenstein's decision. He better be prepared for this question the next time

he has a press conference.

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Response to CousinIT (Original post)

Wed May 16, 2018, 07:52 PM

26. Which means they didn't say

Anything to them. Typical tactic knowing Mueller won't respond, so they just make it up as it goes along, always making it look the opposite of the truth.

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Response to CousinIT (Original post)

Wed May 16, 2018, 07:56 PM

29. Sure, ok

I can’t see Mueller ruling out this approach. And then telling trump’s lawyers that he has.

And even if he did, that may have been the case on the day and time he said it. But new revelations could change that, I would hope. For example, when the president elect received $282 million as a “commission“ and when the Chinese government agrees to pay a $500 million To support of Trump project in Indonesia, Imho this changes the ball game.

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Response to CousinIT (Original post)

Wed May 16, 2018, 08:01 PM

31. Unindicted co-conspirator nt

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Response to elmac (Reply #31)

Thu May 17, 2018, 09:17 PM

58. Yup, just like Tricky Dick

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Response to CousinIT (Original post)

Wed May 16, 2018, 08:09 PM

33. Why does anyone believe this shit?

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Response to CousinIT (Original post)

Wed May 16, 2018, 08:12 PM

34. Indice the daughter !!, the son's !!! and the son in law !!!, and indite every member of his cabinet

 

Indite more of the Russian Oligarchs, and many of the big money people playing in the shadows, and make the indictment clear so that it cast the needed shadow on all the Republican who endorsed this madness, and then Indite the gangster(s) he has been working with for decades, and take their money (guaranteed, the mob gangsters) will then take care of the rest.

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Response to CousinIT (Original post)

Wed May 16, 2018, 08:13 PM

35. I go with what Mueller can do! (because of the Congress REPUBS)

I just worry about RUMP pardons for the next 3 years!

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Response to CousinIT (Original post)

Wed May 16, 2018, 08:22 PM

37. Didn't Rudy say he'd wrap this up in a week? So much for that

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Response to CousinIT (Original post)

Wed May 16, 2018, 08:56 PM

39. Impeachement is not a good idea anyway

Lets vote the whole bunch of gop crooks out of office, that should be the goal, make trump a lame duck while not allowing pence to take office and not allowing gop bad ideas to make it to the floor, then in 2020 lets vote to get a good, intelligent, and as honest as possible president that will in fact, restore USA's credibility and standing around the World.

Even if trump can be indicted, the solution is to vote them out of office, pence is a danger because he is so screwed up but such a good actor that he will make people think that all is well, and maybe even get re-elected.

Solution: VOTE, VOTE...

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Response to Perseus (Reply #39)

Wed May 16, 2018, 10:18 PM

42. Of course you have vote them out, but they're crooks

What do you do with crooks? They should not just be able to go back home. Then the crooks will just keep doing the same thing. Roger stone is still doing all of the typical un-American crap he did in the past.

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Response to CousinIT (Original post)

Wed May 16, 2018, 10:01 PM

40. Law enforcement is allowed to lie to a suspect or target of an investigation.

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Response to CousinIT (Original post)

Wed May 16, 2018, 10:56 PM

43. And tomorrow Sarah Sanders will deny Mueller talked to Rudy

just out of habit...

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Response to CousinIT (Original post)

Wed May 16, 2018, 11:16 PM

45. No! Parse Guiliani's words carefully. Mueller did NOT say he can't indict.

Mueller did not clearly say he "can't indict a president".

Giuliani said that Mueller said instead that he "can't violate the Justice Department rules".

And the rules, enunciated last in a memo in 2000, say that a sitting President can't be put ON TRIAL.

https://www.cnn.com/2018/03/28/politics/walter-dellinger-president-can-be-indicted-don-lemon-cnntv/index.html

Dellinger cited an opinion of the Office of Legal Counsel for the Department of Justice that stated in 2000 a president could not be indicted.
"Although the thoughtful opinion from the Office of Legal Counsel is persuasive in establishing that a president cannot be put on trial, it addresses only briefly the question of whether he could simply be indicted but not tried," he wrote in The New York Times op-ed.


Plus, the Justice Department can CHANGE their rules at any time. The OLC could have issued a new memo. Giuliani is wishcasting.

Here's Giuliani's words:
Giuliani tells CNN the special counsel's team has decided that "they have to follow the Justice Department rules."

"The Justice Department memos going back to before Nixon say that you cannot indict a sitting president, you have to impeach him. Now there was a little time in which there was some dispute about that, but they acknowledged to us orally that they understand that they can't violate the Justice Department rules," Giuliani said.

"We think it's bigger than that. We think it's a constitutional rule, but I don't think you're ever going to confront that because nobody's ever going to indict a sitting president. So, what does that leave them with? That leaves them with writing a report," said Giuliani.

It would then be up to the House of Representatives to decide what to do about with the special counsel's report -- and whether to pursue articles of impeachment.

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Response to CousinIT (Original post)

Thu May 17, 2018, 01:18 AM

46. Ask Anthony Kennedy.

It has never been tested and therefore I'm afraid it could end up being essentially a political decision at SCOTUS much like Bush v. Gore.

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Response to CousinIT (Original post)

Thu May 17, 2018, 06:37 AM

51. Frankly unAmerican

no man is above the law. Lock him up.

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Response to CousinIT (Original post)

Thu May 17, 2018, 07:04 AM

53. 2 former DOJ attorneys said same thing, policy from Clinton

Apparently DOJ did research during Clinton special persecutor. They concluded there was no dispositive authority but that the structure of the constitution leads to conclusion no indictment.

Of course once the president leaves office he can be indicted. And a state or local prosecutor can indict.

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Response to CousinIT (Original post)

Thu May 17, 2018, 08:16 AM

54. and now the right wing nut jobs will run with this as if it's the "truth"

and at the end of the day, that's all these halfwits need to "refute" any actual truth about tRump actually being able to be indicted.

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