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Sat Jul 29, 2017, 02:28 PM

Hackers Crack Voting Machines Within Minutes At DEF CON In Vegas

Source: Huffington Post

07/29/2017 12:29 pm ET
Hackers Crack Voting Machines Within Minutes At DEF CON In Vegas
Confirming what we already knew — our voting systems are awfully vulnerable.

By Andy Campbell

We already knew U.S. voting systems had security flaws ― the federal government put that nail in the coffin when it repeatedly confirmed that Russian hackers breached systems in at least 21 states during the election last year.

But on Friday, hackers stateside showed us just how easily some of the electronic voting machines can be cracked.

Those who attended DEF CON, a 25-year-old hacking convention held in Las Vegas, were given physical and remote access to voting machines procured from eBay and government auctions.

Within about 90 minutes, they’d exploited weak and outdated security measures to gain full access, The Register first reported. Some physically broke down the machines to reveal their vulnerabilities, while others gained remote access or showed that external ports found on some could be used to upload malicious software.



Read more: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/hackers-crack-voting-machines-within-minutes-at-def-con-in-vegas_us_597ca139e4b02a4ebb75c134

60 replies, 7188 views

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Reply Hackers Crack Voting Machines Within Minutes At DEF CON In Vegas (Original post)
.99center Jul 2017 OP
flibbitygiblets Jul 2017 #1
Frustratedlady Jul 2017 #2
stevepal Jul 2017 #8
diva77 Jul 2017 #31
TheFrenchRazor Jul 2017 #12
WinstonSmith4740 Jul 2017 #18
Best_man23 Jul 2017 #3
WinstonSmith4740 Jul 2017 #19
JoeOtterbein Jul 2017 #4
TheFrenchRazor Jul 2017 #10
diva77 Jul 2017 #24
benld74 Jul 2017 #5
dembotoz Jul 2017 #30
Leith Jul 2017 #49
bora13 Jul 2017 #6
Amaryllis Jul 2017 #14
RussBLib Jul 2017 #7
Amaryllis Jul 2017 #16
tomp Jul 2017 #42
TheFrenchRazor Jul 2017 #9
turbinetree Jul 2017 #11
broadcaster90210 Jul 2017 #13
LittleGirl Jul 2017 #15
SHRED Jul 2017 #17
judesedit Jul 2017 #20
TheFrenchRazor Jul 2017 #37
BadgerMom Jul 2017 #21
yallerdawg Jul 2017 #22
diva77 Jul 2017 #23
yallerdawg Jul 2017 #26
diva77 Jul 2017 #27
yallerdawg Jul 2017 #29
Squinch Jul 2017 #32
Bernardo de La Paz Jul 2017 #43
politicat Jul 2017 #36
TheFrenchRazor Jul 2017 #38
diva77 Jul 2017 #41
TheFrenchRazor Jul 2017 #39
diva77 Jul 2017 #25
L. Coyote Jul 2017 #34
diva77 Jul 2017 #35
TheFrenchRazor Jul 2017 #40
ElementaryPenguin Jul 2017 #52
Blue Idaho Jul 2017 #28
L. Coyote Jul 2017 #33
TheBlackAdder Jul 2017 #44
Squinch Jul 2017 #45
TheFrenchRazor Jul 2017 #55
diva77 Jul 2017 #60
Hugin Jul 2017 #46
jimlup Jul 2017 #47
TheFrenchRazor Jul 2017 #56
jimlup Jul 2017 #57
TheFrenchRazor Jul 2017 #58
diva77 Jul 2017 #59
dlk Jul 2017 #48
Dark n Stormy Knight Jul 2017 #50
FakeNoose Jul 2017 #53
Dark n Stormy Knight Jul 2017 #54
Nitram Jul 2017 #51

Response to .99center (Original post)

Sat Jul 29, 2017, 02:31 PM

1. Jesus H. Christ. Time to call those Senators again!

Got those fuckers on speed dial unfortunately

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Response to .99center (Original post)

Sat Jul 29, 2017, 03:02 PM

2. It would be great to return to paper ballots and black pens.

I'm not in such a hurry that I can't wait a day or two for the results. We've had nothing but trouble since we switched to machines, so why continue that route? So some manufacturer who donated a pile of money can make a pile of money with no-bid contracts? We gave it a chance and they blew it.

Sometimes progress isn't.



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Response to Frustratedlady (Reply #2)

Sat Jul 29, 2017, 03:35 PM

8. It would also be a helluva lot cheaper.

The only reason we ever started using the voting machines was so that the owners of the companies making them, Repubs in general, cd game them and win elections so they cd achieve what they've now achieved: the complete hijacking of American democracy, or what used to be "American democracy."

Without the voting machines counting votes for well over a decade, the US would be an entirely different place politically and socially.

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Response to stevepal (Reply #8)

Sat Jul 29, 2017, 09:24 PM

31. the budgets for the machines are enormous -- it's another example of taxpayer money being

sucked up by private corporations. The machines get used once in a blue moon, and then get replaced every few years and there is no way to guarantee that our votes are being counted as cast...what a setup for the perfect crime on so many levels

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Response to Frustratedlady (Reply #2)

Sat Jul 29, 2017, 03:39 PM

12. yep; TWO repug POTUSs who LOST the popular vote in 16 years? really?? not coincidence. nt

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Response to Frustratedlady (Reply #2)

Sat Jul 29, 2017, 04:15 PM

18. Been on a tear on this since 2000.

It's totally doable. We don't need the results with-in two minutes of the polls closing. The methodology is already in place...ever see a "counting room" in Las Vegas? Those folks are never so much as a dime off. Their methods can be duplicated easily...UN oversight, as well as representatives of each party, as room supervisors. We need to stop wringing our hands and bemoaning the Republicans dirty tricks. Dirty tricks are all the Republican power structure has...they have almost no ideas, and the ones they do have are just plain ugly and hurt everyone but the wealthy. So we have to stop being surprised by their ability to go ever lower.

Because you're right. The problems started with the use of computers for voting, so let's eliminate that and see what happens.

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Response to .99center (Original post)

Sat Jul 29, 2017, 03:02 PM

3. Here's some more information from SC Magazine (Cybersecurity)

by Bradley Barth, Senior Reporter SC Magazine

Within mere hours of opening, members of the hacker community were apparently not only compromising machines with known bugs, but also finding previously undiscovered issues.

Corroborating Blaze's account, the "DEFCON Voting Village" twitter account posted this tweet: “90 min after doors open: Complete remote control on the operating system level of the Winvote voting terminal (including election data).” <Note: Bold was added by me for emphasis>

In addition to the Winvote, the Voting Village also featured the Edge, ES7S iVotonic, Diebold TSX, and Diebold Expresspoll 4000 machines. Dlin said that as of approximately 1:30 PST, three-and-a-half hours after the Village had officially opened, “three or four” machines had already been compromised.

Read More: https://www.scmagazine.com/election-tech-hacked-within-hours-at-def-con-voting-village/article/678454/

I'm calling my Senators on Monday and sending them this information. I'm also going to call my Supervisor of Elections and ask them what they are planning to do to strengthen cybersecurity of their voting machines and networks.

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Response to Best_man23 (Reply #3)

Sat Jul 29, 2017, 04:17 PM

19. Good idea.

I'm calling my Senators on Monday and sending them this information. I'm also going to call my Supervisor of Elections and ask them what they are planning to do to strengthen cybersecurity of their voting machines and networks.


We all need to do this. Thanks for the idea.

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Response to .99center (Original post)

Sat Jul 29, 2017, 03:08 PM

4. We need to repeat, over and over: "ALL elections must be with paper ballots and MUST be audited"

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Response to JoeOtterbein (Reply #4)

Sat Jul 29, 2017, 03:37 PM

10. all counted by hand, the first time, IMO. most audits could be defeated. nt

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Response to TheFrenchRazor (Reply #10)

Sat Jul 29, 2017, 06:46 PM

24. This +1000. Plus, the handcounted paper ballot method has a built in "audit" -

each vote counted is observed by more than one person; and actually, results come out pretty quickly.

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Response to .99center (Original post)

Sat Jul 29, 2017, 03:25 PM

5. The Vegas gaming machines go through

A more rigorous procedure before being placed in casino floor than those voting machines.
That's been true since their inception

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Response to benld74 (Reply #5)

Sat Jul 29, 2017, 08:01 PM

30. I would love to hack me some slot machines

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Response to benld74 (Reply #5)

Sun Jul 30, 2017, 11:03 AM

49. Absolutely True

I was involved in that with my old job. Every gambling machine - even every piece of furniture - has the nonsense tested out of every bit of it: math, inner workings, outer dimensions, everything. Who tests them? The manufacturers, private testing corporations, governmental agencies, and finally on the casino floor. And they all talk to each other.

I also used to work as a computer programmer contracted to 2 different states. We never forgot that we were working for the state government and the people. Every word of code we wrote or updated belonged to the state we wrote it for. So... how does Diebold get away with claiming "proprietary software?!" The company owner is a big rethug donor.

Ben, we probably have friends and LinkedIn contacts in common.


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Response to .99center (Original post)

Sat Jul 29, 2017, 03:25 PM

6. anyone who can follow detailed instructions

could

hack

certainly no one in WH would order such a thing...

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Response to bora13 (Reply #6)

Sat Jul 29, 2017, 03:55 PM

14. And certainly no repub SOS such as Kris Kobach would stoop so low.

And certainly no Russians would think of that.

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Response to .99center (Original post)

Sat Jul 29, 2017, 03:32 PM

7. would somebody show this to Congress?

Congresscritters either seem to believe our machines are unhackable or they know better and they are protecting special interests.

Gee, I wonder which one it could be?

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Response to RussBLib (Reply #7)

Sat Jul 29, 2017, 04:03 PM

16. I've wondered for years why Dem leadership has never taken this seriously. They can't all be

ignorant of just how vulnerable our election infrastructure is and has been for years.

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Response to Amaryllis (Reply #16)

Sun Jul 30, 2017, 05:31 AM

42. me too. makes one go "hmmm...." nt

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Response to .99center (Original post)

Sat Jul 29, 2017, 03:36 PM

9. nooo... i'm shocked... NOT. throw in russian resources and POTUS at stake, and it's guaranteed. nt

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Response to .99center (Original post)

Sat Jul 29, 2017, 03:39 PM

11. Again it's time to call my Sec. Of State Elections and ask what are they going to do about this

See how your state does it


https://www.eac.gov/assets/1/1/State%20Requirements%20and%20the%20Federal%20Voting%20System%20Testing%20and%20Certification%20Program.pdf


I really think we need what they are doing in Oregon on a national level


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Response to .99center (Original post)

Sat Jul 29, 2017, 03:44 PM

13. Yep. Last election was hacked.

nt

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Response to .99center (Original post)

Sat Jul 29, 2017, 03:56 PM

15. Yep, I truly believe this

I believe that #45 is not my President because of this. I do not believe that the GOP has full control of Congress, WH or SC.
Our election was stolen from us. I don't care what any politician says, I used to work IT so I know what the hell I'm talking about.

I want paper ballots hand counted. Every. Single. Election.

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Response to .99center (Original post)

Sat Jul 29, 2017, 04:08 PM

17. Does America value democracy?


Doesn't appear that way.

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Response to .99center (Original post)

Sat Jul 29, 2017, 04:18 PM

20. We ignored it in 2000 when Clint Curtis admitted to altering software so the GOP would win in Ohio

I believe it was. And we were shown on national television by Howard Dean how in less than 5 minutes the votes could be flipped on Diebold and Sequoia machines. Owned by rethugs btw. Blackboxvoting and bradblog have been trying to get people to listen for years. It's about freaking time someone paid attention. But look what it took. We have a fucking lunatic in the White House with his fucking robot followers who eat out of his tiny hands. Now to stop them. You tell me

Bush should have been ousted immediately and definitely should NEVER have gotten a 2nd term.

Thank you hackers. America is grateful you've exposed it again....Now help us fix it. Where were you while all of this was happening? Seems to me it could have been stopped.

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Response to judesedit (Reply #20)

Sun Jul 30, 2017, 03:24 AM

37. sadly, if nothing was done after 2000, nothing will probably be done now. nt

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Response to .99center (Original post)

Sat Jul 29, 2017, 04:24 PM

21. K & R

I'm calling on Monday, too. Anymore, whenever I go to "recent calls" Kamala Harris and Dianne Feinstein are always among the last 5 calls or so.

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Response to .99center (Original post)

Sat Jul 29, 2017, 05:15 PM

22. I'm sorry, but 'cracking a machine' is meaningless.

I've never used a machine to vote in my life! Always paper ballots. And I've been voting since Jimmy Carter!

45 states have paper ballots, and while they count ballots election night, it takes weeks to certify the election, while they sample ballot counts by hand against the more reliable and exact tallying machines.

If the goal is to discredit our elections, to make US question them - I guess it worked - and it rolls on!

If, if, if, but, but, but - "Our election was hacked!" is the new "Grassy knoll and magic bullet!"

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Response to yallerdawg (Reply #22)

Sat Jul 29, 2017, 06:37 PM

23. if you voted on a paper ballot, most likely the tabulation was done with optical scanners which

contain easily hackable software.

check out what happened in Racine County, WI 2016 election:



The goal is not to discredit elections and drive people away from voting. The goal it to ensure that our votes are counted as cast -- and there needs to be transparency to achieve this -- you cannot observe what is taking place inside a computer, therefore you cannot guarantee that your vote is counted as cast. The software and hardware are owned by private corporations that do not make the code available for inspection. And the machines are vulnerable to outside hacking as well.

To ensure transparent elections, you have to be able to observe what's going on. That's why the Germans rejected computerized voting & tabulating machines.

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Response to diva77 (Reply #23)

Sat Jul 29, 2017, 06:52 PM

26. Of course! It's the "optical scanners" now!

Which are so reliable when tested against hand counts there is no justification for the time and money.

And these are sampled everywhere in the USA in the process of certifying the state election numbers.

But 6 months later - we've still got THIS VIDEO!

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Response to yallerdawg (Reply #26)

Sat Jul 29, 2017, 07:11 PM

27. sorry yallerdawg - am not understanding where you stand

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Response to diva77 (Reply #27)

Sat Jul 29, 2017, 07:29 PM

29. If the goal of the Russians is to discredit American elections...

and this goal includes making us question the validity of our own elections, then the 'usual suspects' - including Donald Trump, Jill Stein, and the 'international hackers - have all managed to achieve their goal.

If we all went to paper ballots and hand count tallies, 'someone' would be asking for polling worker birth certificates!

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Response to yallerdawg (Reply #29)

Sat Jul 29, 2017, 11:44 PM

32. Regardless of what the Russians' goal was, why should we risk it? We know how to avoid this.

What reason is there for the rest of the states not to go to a plan like Oregon's, which works great by the way?

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Response to yallerdawg (Reply #26)

Sun Jul 30, 2017, 05:55 AM

43. You don't seem to understand that optically scanned ballots can be audited and verified.


If need be, they can even be all hand counted.

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Response to diva77 (Reply #23)

Sun Jul 30, 2017, 02:41 AM

36. If you're going to doubt optical scanners...

You need to doubt 50 years of academic testing, everything from the Iowa Test of Basic Skills through the SAT to the GRE and bar exams, CPA exams, actuary exams. Academia has been using -- and securing -- optical scanners since Scantron.

Scanners are airgapped -- they don't have network connections -- and they're secured when not in use. Sure, a scanner can be hacked, the same way a Roomba or an electronic sewing machine can be hacked -- if the hacker is in the same room with it, with a screwdriver. Assuming that hundreds of the county clerks and recorders have all been turned in exactly the same way is multiverse possible, but highly unlikely.

Humans are far less accurate than machines. We make errors between 1 in 10,000 and 1 in 100,000 times. And we make more mistakes when we're tired and under pressure. Machine accuracy (optical scanner) starts at 1 in 100 million.

Certification takes weeks, during which time we count those ballots multiple times, running spot checks for accuracy. There's a reason this takes so long. Get rid of the touch screens, IoT versions, and non-tracking systems - absolutely. They're expensive, failure prone, not secure and they don't do what they promised. But paper ballots and scanners are not the problem here.

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Response to politicat (Reply #36)

Sun Jul 30, 2017, 03:28 AM

38. wow, that's very trusting of you, but not very informed on this subject, IMO. nt

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Response to politicat (Reply #36)

Sun Jul 30, 2017, 03:43 AM

41. Check out computer expert J. Alex Halderman's testimony in this clip

he clearly includes optical scanners in his testimony...

https://www.c-span.org/video/?c4674512/j-alex-halderman-voting-structure-vulnerable-sabotage-even-attacks-can-change-votes

June 21, 2017 | Clip Of Russian Interference in U.S. Elections

J. Alex Halderman: Our voting structure is vulnerable to sabotage, even to attacks that can change votes Computer science professor whose research focuses on computer security and privacy has (with colleagues) studied voting machines and tested and verified that they can be hacked by foreign actors.

and check out Amaryllis's post on DU
https://www.democraticunderground.com/10029295571

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Response to yallerdawg (Reply #22)

Sun Jul 30, 2017, 03:30 AM

39. the goal is not to discredit our elections; it is to secure them and make them verifiable. who would

possibly be opposed to that?

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Response to .99center (Original post)

Sat Jul 29, 2017, 06:48 PM

25. Here's how to frame the public "debate" -

The machines do NOT meet the burden of proof that they cannot be hacked.

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Response to diva77 (Reply #25)

Sun Jul 30, 2017, 01:16 AM

34. The 2016 election cannot be shown to have been accurately tallied.

Because there is no way to show that hackable voting machines counted the votes accurately.

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Response to L. Coyote (Reply #34)

Sun Jul 30, 2017, 01:48 AM

35. I like your version too. Now we need to put heat on Secretaries of State to respond to the DefCon

hacks...media needs to expose the hypocrisy of the people certifying "voting" machines

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Response to L. Coyote (Reply #34)

Sun Jul 30, 2017, 03:34 AM

40. that's why i call it "faith-based voting." needless to say, i'm an atheist, and i need to see proof.

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Response to L. Coyote (Reply #34)

Sun Jul 30, 2017, 01:09 PM

52. DING! DING! DING! Exactly right, Coyote!!

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Response to .99center (Original post)

Sat Jul 29, 2017, 07:24 PM

28. Paper Ballots...

Who cares if it takes a few days for the count to come in? We could guaranty accuracy and get rid of all the breathless prognostion from the news hounds on election night.

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Response to .99center (Original post)

Sun Jul 30, 2017, 01:13 AM

33. K & R. 40,000 switched votes flipped the Electoral College.

The great thing about a switched vote, IT COUNTS TWICE, add one to one column AND subtract one from the other column.

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Response to .99center (Original post)

Sun Jul 30, 2017, 06:19 AM

44. It blows my mind that those things are actually resold on the open market and not destroyed.

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Response to .99center (Original post)

Sun Jul 30, 2017, 07:11 AM

45. This thread is full of people smugly telling us that hacking is unlikely. Right after an election

that was hacked to make Trump(R) president.

Why are we arguing this? The machines CAN be hacked, Oregon has come up with a very functional system of paper ballots, one that incidentally increases voting rights. Why in the hell is there resistance to this from Democrats? What do we have to lose by fighting to go from a system that can be hacked to one that can't?

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Response to Squinch (Reply #45)

Mon Jul 31, 2017, 03:40 AM

55. i ask myself the same thing; why would anyone be opposed to a paper-based system? nt

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Response to Squinch (Reply #45)

Mon Jul 31, 2017, 06:04 PM

60. there are problems with all-mail voting, sorry to say

the votes are tabulated in one central location -- it's much better to have tabulation done at precinct level to avoid easy manipulation of results on mass scale

the ballots have to follow a chain of custody via US mail -- therefore, cannot guarantee an unbroken chain

the ballots are tabulated with optical scanners -- easily hackable

It would be far better to hand count paper ballots at the precinct level with public oversight and post results at precinct level.

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Response to .99center (Original post)

Sun Jul 30, 2017, 07:16 AM

46. As they have every year for the past umpteen years.

One can only conclude that TPTB don't want hack proof voting.

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Response to .99center (Original post)

Sun Jul 30, 2017, 08:17 AM

47. I know we are not suppose to question the vote

but damn it! I think there likely was Russian interference at a local voting precinct level. I've been arguing for awhile now that all it would take to get the result of 11/9 was to hack some machines in Wisconsin, PA and MI. Knowing Detroit because I live in the suburbs, to say that Detroit's vote wasn't hacked or botched or both is extremely naive.

I am openly wondering if Computer scientists have looked at the results of 11/9 to see if there are statistical anomalies that would indicate the hack. Comparisons between widely separate precincts with very similar demographics would be interesting for example. All you need is to flip one vote per precinct in these 3 states ...

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Response to jimlup (Reply #47)

Mon Jul 31, 2017, 03:47 AM

56. don't know about this election, but extensive statistical analysis of 2000 election

showed every "anomaly" in the book; bottom line is that it is hard to prove anything that way, however it should be enough to convince people that we need a more secure system.

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Response to TheFrenchRazor (Reply #56)

Mon Jul 31, 2017, 07:58 AM

57. I've been looking for a reference

as a scientist I like to look at data. Do you know a reference that would help me?

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Response to jimlup (Reply #57)

Mon Jul 31, 2017, 04:19 PM

58. you could check the DU archives for poster named Truth-is-all, or something similar (TIA)?;

i've been here since the beginning and i remember this guy, claimed to be some kind of statistician i think, and he either did or posted many, many statistical analyses of 2000 era elections. don't know whatever happened to him or whether his studies were debunked or anything. they sounded convincing to me.

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Response to jimlup (Reply #57)

Mon Jul 31, 2017, 05:51 PM

59. here are a couple of links to articles with data

one is a study of the 2014 election; the other for 2016 primaries

E2014: A Basic Forensic Analysis
Jonathan D. Simon
http://electiondefensealliance.org/files/E2014--A%20Basic%20(Chilling)%20Forensic%20Analysis.pdf

(am having trouble getting link to work via click, so be sure to copy link above and paste in browser)

An Electoral System in Crisis
lulu Fries’dat & Anselmo Sampietro
in collaboration with Fritz Scheuren
July 18, 2016
https://static1.squarespace.com/static/571db55ee707ebff30822be1/t/578d64fe6b8f5bebe7f37292/1468884229114/An+Electoral+System+in+Crisis+-+Friesdat-Sampietro-Scheuren+_20160718A+FINAL.pdf

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Response to .99center (Original post)

Sun Jul 30, 2017, 10:17 AM

48. Republicans Have Been Stealing Elections for Quite Some Time & The Watchdogs Have Been Put to Sleep

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Response to .99center (Original post)

Sun Jul 30, 2017, 11:24 AM

50. No big surprise. 2006 Documentary, Hacking Democracy should have

been enough to cause a massive uprising, but I guess everyone was too busy wathcing the Apprentice and cheering on the thuggish vulgarian yelling, "You're fired!!!"

The film the voting machine corporations don't want you to see. HACKING DEMOCRACY follows investigator/grandmother, Bev Harris, and her citizen-activists as they set out to uncover how America counts its votes. Proving the votes can be stolen without a trace culminates in a duel between the Diebold corporation's voting machines and a computer hacker - with America's democracy at stake.

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Response to Dark n Stormy Knight (Reply #50)

Sun Jul 30, 2017, 02:44 PM

53. Yes these issues have been known for at least 10 years

But Russians hacking individual states through the internet is relatively new - only for the last couple of elections.
The GOP has known these things and done nothing, because it benefits them.

Democrats are guilty of being lazy and looking the other way while this happened. We must be vigilant all the time because they will never stop trying to cheat. The GOP can't win unless the cheat.


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Response to FakeNoose (Reply #53)

Sun Jul 30, 2017, 08:15 PM

54. "The GOP can't win unless they cheat." I just said those exact words to my mom this morning!

And she agreed, by the way.

I know the Ruskie hacking is newish, but it seems if we'd dealt with the earlier known hacking, we'd have been in a better position to derail the new hacking. Not to mention, we'd have dealt with the earlier problems, regardless of what came later.

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Response to .99center (Original post)

Sun Jul 30, 2017, 12:07 PM

51. Wake up, Federal and State voting authorities! You are placing our democracy into clear

and present danger by failing to take strong action on the issue of the vulnerability voting machines. We want a paper trail with every vote in this country!

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