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Tue Sep 27, 2016, 04:09 PM

U.S. owes black people reparations for a history of ‘racial terrorism,’ says U.N. panel

Source: Washington Post

The history of slavery in the United States justifies reparations for African Americans, argues a recent report by a U.N.-affiliated group based in Geneva.

This conclusion was part of a study by the United Nations' Working Group of Experts on People of African Descent, a body that reports to the international organization's High Commissioner on Human Rights. The group of experts, which includes leading human rights lawyers from around the world, presented its findings to the United Nations Human Rights Council on Monday, pointing to the continuing link between present injustices and the dark chapters of American history.

"In particular, the legacy of colonial history, enslavement, racial subordination and segregation, racial terrorism and racial inequality in the United States remains a serious challenge, as there has been no real commitment to reparations and to truth and reconciliation for people of African descent," the report stated. "Contemporary police killings and the trauma that they create are reminiscent of the past racial terror of lynching."

The panel drew its recommendations, which are nonbinding and unlikely to influence Washington, after a fact-finding mission in the United States in January. At the time, it hailed the strides taken to make the American criminal justice system more equitable but pointed to the corrosive legacy of the past.

Read more: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2016/09/27/u-s-owes-black-people-reparations-for-a-history-of-racial-terrorism-says-u-n-panel/

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Reply U.S. owes black people reparations for a history of ‘racial terrorism,’ says U.N. panel (Original post)
NWCorona Sep 2016 OP
LiberalFighter Sep 2016 #1
xocet Sep 2016 #4
Missn-Hitch Sep 2016 #24
DustyJoe Sep 2016 #103
xocet Sep 2016 #2
Taitertots Sep 2016 #7
xocet Sep 2016 #12
Taitertots Sep 2016 #18
xocet Sep 2016 #22
Taitertots Sep 2016 #27
xocet Sep 2016 #47
Taitertots Sep 2016 #79
Missn-Hitch Sep 2016 #25
Taitertots Sep 2016 #36
brush Sep 2016 #28
Taitertots Sep 2016 #35
brush Sep 2016 #38
Sand Rat Expat Sep 2016 #39
brush Sep 2016 #40
Sand Rat Expat Sep 2016 #41
brush Sep 2016 #42
Name removed Sep 2016 #51
Name removed Sep 2016 #52
Name removed Sep 2016 #53
anniebelle Sep 2016 #63
narnian60 Sep 2016 #64
Name removed Sep 2016 #65
Lochloosa Sep 2016 #66
anniebelle Sep 2016 #67
Name removed Sep 2016 #69
sarae Sep 2016 #77
Taitertots Sep 2016 #78
anniebelle Sep 2016 #80
Taitertots Sep 2016 #83
anniebelle Sep 2016 #102
Taitertots Sep 2016 #104
brush Sep 2016 #85
Name removed Sep 2016 #55
TCJ70 Sep 2016 #3
Dreamer Tatum Sep 2016 #6
brush Sep 2016 #84
Name removed Sep 2016 #88
Taitertots Sep 2016 #5
Wednesdays Sep 2016 #14
Taitertots Sep 2016 #15
Missn-Hitch Sep 2016 #26
Taitertots Sep 2016 #33
xocet Sep 2016 #45
Missn-Hitch Sep 2016 #101
Taitertots Sep 2016 #106
Missn-Hitch Sep 2016 #108
awoke_in_2003 Sep 2016 #32
Taitertots Sep 2016 #34
GummyBearz Sep 2016 #37
awoke_in_2003 Sep 2016 #43
melman Sep 2016 #46
GummyBearz Sep 2016 #95
awoke_in_2003 Sep 2016 #99
Xithras Sep 2016 #100
NobodyHere Sep 2016 #8
Coolest Ranger Sep 2016 #9
JustAnotherGen Sep 2016 #30
Name removed Sep 2016 #54
Archae Sep 2016 #10
xocet Sep 2016 #13
ronnie624 Sep 2016 #19
christx30 Sep 2016 #81
brush Sep 2016 #29
AngryAmish Sep 2016 #73
awoke_in_2003 Sep 2016 #11
EX500rider Sep 2016 #20
awoke_in_2003 Sep 2016 #21
EX500rider Sep 2016 #23
melman Sep 2016 #31
Starry Messenger Sep 2016 #61
Coolest Ranger Sep 2016 #71
ronnie624 Sep 2016 #16
BumRushDaShow Sep 2016 #17
Buckeye_Democrat Sep 2016 #44
Name removed Sep 2016 #48
CincyDem Sep 2016 #58
Name removed Sep 2016 #59
Post removed Sep 2016 #49
Post removed Sep 2016 #50
CincyDem Sep 2016 #56
Name removed Sep 2016 #57
malaise Sep 2016 #60
Spitfire of ATJ Sep 2016 #62
Coolest Ranger Sep 2016 #74
RaymondLuxuryYacht Sep 2016 #68
Lochloosa Sep 2016 #70
polynomial Sep 2016 #90
retrowire Sep 2016 #72
brush Sep 2016 #89
retrowire Sep 2016 #91
Name removed Sep 2016 #92
LWolf Sep 2016 #75
LWolf Sep 2016 #76
ronnie624 Sep 2016 #82
Name removed Sep 2016 #87
LWolf Sep 2016 #107
Name removed Sep 2016 #86
oberliner Sep 2016 #93
ronnie624 Sep 2016 #94
KittyWampus Sep 2016 #96
ronnie624 Sep 2016 #97
Quantess Sep 2016 #98
jtuck004 Sep 2016 #105
Row_the_boat Sep 2016 #109
Liberal_Stalwart71 Sep 2016 #110

Response to NWCorona (Original post)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 04:20 PM

1. Disagree.

There needs to be major changes that equalizes for everyone. Maybe require more serious penalties or other remedies for those that continue to discriminate. I couldn't include my primary suggestion as it involves bodily harm.

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Response to LiberalFighter (Reply #1)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 04:46 PM

4. Significant harm through past discrimination cannot be cured merely by the elimination of the...

discrimination of the present as the elimination of present discrimination only prevents future harm from occurring.

Yes, equality and social justice need to be achieved.

It is unclear, however, that the use of violence as a primary means of implementing social change has ever worked even partially without exacting terrible costs.

Perchance your "primary suggestion" should be reconsidered.

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Response to LiberalFighter (Reply #1)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 07:30 PM

24. It's certainly not my primary but it's an option. I am hearing a lot of

"chatter" from the other side. Cheers LF!

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Response to LiberalFighter (Reply #1)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 02:43 PM

103. supervised by the UN

A lot of the UN member nations are hosts and enablers of the worlds greatest terrorist and murdering groups. They are going to be really busy trying to hold their logic in this edict across all member nations.
The UN is a toothless political organization not even a shadow of what it was built on and holds no sway with the world governments that ignore its edicts every day.

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Response to NWCorona (Original post)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 04:31 PM

2. That is obvious. Native Americans should also be given significant reparations. n/t

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Response to xocet (Reply #2)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 04:54 PM

7. If you honestly believed that, then you'd be paying them

 

Oh right...
You're one of those people who think other people should have to pay.

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Response to Taitertots (Reply #7)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 05:14 PM

12. I just read your other post.

It seems that the view that you describe is very narrowly defined.

First of all, it seems that (to you) reparations equate purely to payments to individuals. IF you were to reread the article, you would find:

"The reparations could come in a variety of forms, according to the panel, including "a formal apology, health initiatives, educational opportunities ... psychological rehabilitation, technology transfer and financial support, and debt cancellation." "

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2016/09/27/u-s-owes-black-people-reparations-for-a-history-of-racial-terrorism-says-u-n-panel/


Also, you seem to have been around some sort of RW propaganda source a little too long - it might be influencing your thinking. "Racial collective guilt" has nothing to do with reparations. A desire for social justice and equality in the USA (you know: e pluribus unum et cetera) are the reasons (beyond the obvious moral reasons) that such a program is desired - it is in everyone's self-interest (all citizens) to have a better present-day society.



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Response to xocet (Reply #12)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 06:07 PM

18. None of those are free. Are you going to give up your prosperity?

 

Of course not. Because you don't believe the cause justifies your sacrifice.

Tell me again why I should be forced to pay for your collective racial guilt.

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Response to Taitertots (Reply #18)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 07:09 PM

22. "None of those are free." What is the price of a "formal apology" these days?

You must live in an extraordinary world if you think that what amounts to striving to perfect the union is going to cost you "your prosperity."

Beyond that, one must ask: What cause? What sacrifice? What guilt? (You assume a lot in your posts.)

Since you seemingly focus primarily on the financial aspects of a moral issue, one thing that you might consider is what the fiscal cost of maintaining the status quo is. What is the cost to society of mass incarceration? What is the cost to society of lack of educational opportunities? What is the cost to society of lack of universal access to healthcare? etc.

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Response to xocet (Reply #22)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 07:46 PM

27. What is the apology for? Racial collective guilt is racism

 

"You must live in an extraordinary world if you think that what amounts to striving to perfect the union is going to cost you "your prosperity." "
You want to unilaterally declare that your opinions "perfect the union" despite valid counter opinions. Should my reply be sticking my fingers in my ears and shouting "My policies perfect the union more than your's!"?

Reparations are institutional racism. It is a moral issue. It's immoral to use race as a basis for forced asset seizure. Even when you have high minded goals.

All the problems you listed have simple progressive solutions that don't require egregious policies.

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Response to Taitertots (Reply #27)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 01:50 AM

47. As noted before, you assume a lot in your reading (or casual perusal) of articles and replies.

It would seems that the word reparation has a very narrow meaning in your mind. Here is a definition for you:

reparation

  1. the making of amends for wrong or injury done: reparation for an injustice.
  2. Usually, reparations. compensation in money, material, labor, etc., payable by a defeated country to another country or to an individual for loss suffered during or as a result of war.
  3. restoration to good condition.
  4. repair1 (def 7).


http://www.dictionary.com/browse/reparation?s=t


Definition 2 seems to be all that you can see before you launch into tirades regarding "forced asset seizure", "collective guilt" and "racism". The "egregious policies" that you mention are your own straw men clouding your vision.

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Response to xocet (Reply #47)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 09:38 AM

79. This is professional level disingenuous behavior

 

You want forced asset seizure and transfer. You can try to hide behind pedantic and disingenuous attempts to avoid the inevitable forced asset seizures from reparations, but no one is buying it.

Every policy suggested has a cost and you want the assets of whites seized to pay that cost. It's only a strawman if you didn't support reparations. Where does the money required to pay reparations (cash or in kind) come from?

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Response to Taitertots (Reply #18)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 07:40 PM

25. What do you mean by prosperity?

Are you saying we can spend $100M on one F-35 fighter jet and we can't spend a little on healthcare facilities, infrastructure, and it goes on. It's all about priorities. I know, we could spend more money on prisons and then let private companies operate them - at a profit. Nice.

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Response to Missn-Hitch (Reply #25)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 10:52 PM

36. Let's do that and not have it racially exclusionary (reparations)

 

I agree. We should spend less on the military.

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Response to Taitertots (Reply #7)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 07:54 PM

28. How about a slice of the hughly bloated military budget go to college education . . .

funds, small business grants to qualified applicants, job training, community facilities, etc.

Notice I didn't include checks cut to individuals, and no provision for individuals to help pay for the much deserved reparations to African Americans and others.

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Response to brush (Reply #28)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 10:49 PM

35. Why would any of those policies need to be racially exclusionary

 

You're not making the case for reparations, you're making the cases for progressive policies. We should do those things for everyone.

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Response to Taitertots (Reply #35)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 11:12 PM

38. Sure, do progressive things for everyone but we've swept hundreds of years . . .

of unpaid, stolen labor of enslaved African Americans under the rug, hundreds of year of racial discrimination because of skin pigment, several decades of lynchings and Jim Crow, and now modern day lynchings with the killings of unarmed black men, it's time to deal with our historical cruelty towards people of color, especially black people.

Do you realize that if the hundreds of year of labor by enslaved African Americans had been paid to them, they would have had something to pass down to their families. Maybe family wealth of African Americans would not be lagging behind that of white families so severly.

Do you not also realize that if the principle of compounding were employed, if those hundreds of years of stolen labor came due, the US Treasure would not be able to pay it so it would be a bargain to set up a college education fund, small business grants, job training programs and community facilities — you know some goodwill effort to make up, in a small way for all the racism that we are still to this day experiencing (see Charlotte and Tulsa for just the latest, glaring examples)

I just don't get the resistance to this (nothing from individuals but a small slice from the bloated military budget). There is no denying the racist history of the country. We know horrible cruelty was done. Why not try, in this small and relatively inexpensive way, considering the horrible damage done to a people, this good faith way to make amends?

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Response to brush (Reply #38)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 11:57 PM

39. Perhaps this is the cynic in me talking, but...

I doubt there'd be much "goodwill" as a result of the kind of reparations you're talking about.

On the one hand, there would be a great number of people who would be pissed off about reparations being paid. They'd view it as theft of their resources for a crime they took no part in, especially if reparations involved payments to individuals. So rather than unify people, this would only create discontent among people who would feel that they're being punished for something they didn't do. Children of immigrants would particularly have this reaction.

On the other hand, the people in the African-American community who are most vociferously calling for reparations would not, in my opinion, feel much "goodwill" here either. Does your bank feel "goodwill" towards you when you pay them what you owe them? Similarly, the most outspoken people calling for reparations would likely have a reaction more along the lines of "About damn time!" than "Thanks!" Or they'd say that it wasn't enough, will never be enough, etc. etc. I've read articles by African-Americans saying that the only "fair" payment would be the transfer of all wealth held by white Americans to African-Americans. So I rather doubt they'd consider what you're proposing to be sufficient.

Rather than bring people together, these reactions would only drive people further apart. You'd have a significant chunk of those who are supporting these reparations with their tax monies feeling cheated and embittered, and you'd have a portion of those receiving these reparations feeling cheated and embittered because they feel it's not enough.

Again, maybe it's just my inner cynic talking after going through a very rough week. I dunno. People being people, though, I don't think I'm far off the mark here.

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Response to Sand Rat Expat (Reply #39)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 12:14 AM

40. I said early on there should be no payments to individuals

Why the resistance. There is no denying the racist cruelty done, not to mention the STOLEN, UNPAID LABOR FOR CENTURIES.

Doing something shows good will. All the excuses not to do something that you mention can be worked out.

Google the Dawes Rolls to see a precedent of who would be included.

It can and should be done as the horrible injustices were definitely done.

We all know this, and they are continuing — as I said, see Charleston and Tulsa.

It's telling that an international body understands that reparations resources should be made available to descendants of those whose labor and freedom was stolen for hundreds of years but people here who have benefited directly or indirectly from discrimination against African Americans can't, or don't want to see it.

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Response to brush (Reply #40)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 12:23 AM

41. Just pointing out that, people being people, I doubt everyone will hug it out afterward. NT

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Response to Sand Rat Expat (Reply #41)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 12:25 AM

42. Hugs are overrated. Amends for historical racism and cruelty rate much higher.

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Response to Taitertots (Reply #35)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 06:27 AM

63. I guess it's because it was black people (not white people) kept as slaves, DUH!

I know a whole lot of people who have no qualms about using/miss-using other humans ( I've lived in the confederacy all my 71 years), so I hear it every where I go ~ I see Nazi flags hanging in my neighbors' yards ~ all white people, just like me. They have no problem with a Mexican mowing their yard for $5.00, but by gawd he better get his ass back to Mexico when he's done. They have no problem with having every privilege available to them (just because they were born white) ~ the best schools, go any where they want without fear of being shot for walking with skittles and iced tea, and yet, the majority of them are dumb as a box of rocks and know more about NASCAR and porn than what this country has achieved on the backs of slaves and yet, they're so blinded by their hate, they don't even know they're slaves too ~ they just make a FEW more dollars ~ just enough to keep them in their shacks and their pickemup trucks and have enough to go buy a lottery ticket every week. But, it gets them to vote against their best interest every time and keep the trillions going to the military and the banksters. I never thought I would live to see the day this country ~ humpin' their bibles, wavin' their flags, turn into such a ship of fools.

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Response to anniebelle (Reply #63)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 06:34 AM

64. Wow.

Well said.

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Response to anniebelle (Reply #63)


Response to Name removed (Reply #65)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 06:55 AM

66. Welcome to DU for your short miserable stay.

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Response to Lochloosa (Reply #66)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 07:00 AM

67. Well, sorry they removed that typical racist's remark so soon. I had some facts for him.

Last edited Wed Sep 28, 2016, 07:44 AM - Edit history (2)

But I could tell he is not interested in facts ~ he lives over there in that other universe reserved for total idiots. Anyway, for any others that might be thinking he had some 'points' to consider.
Many people who consider themselves “white” would be surprised to discover they have African ancestry — especially those in the South.

In an ironic twist, a new study has found that some of the states with the most racial tension are also the ones where the most white people have black ancestors. The findings published this month in the American Journal of Human Genetics found that whites in the South were far more likely to have black ancestry than any other part of the country.

Researchers examined 145,000 DNA samples provided to genetic testing company 23andme for ancestry analysis. They have now determined that at least six million Americans who called themselves white had at least 1 percent African ancestry.

Oh, I almost forgot to mention, most of this is because White slave owners enjoyed as part of their 'ownership', sex with the black females in their 'stables' ~ Thomas Jefferson, just to name one of many. Probably with the black 'studs' too, but of course, they could not reproduce.

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Response to anniebelle (Reply #67)


Response to anniebelle (Reply #63)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 09:04 AM

77. +100

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Response to anniebelle (Reply #63)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 09:12 AM

78. Sounds like you're filled with racial animus

 

Empty the hate that's in your heart.

The sins of 150 years ago don't justify racist policies today.

But please explain why you're ignoring the hundreds of thousands on non-African slaves. Why are you spreading misinformation about the racial composition of slavery in America? Slavery was never an exclusively race based system of oppression.

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Response to Taitertots (Reply #78)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 09:43 AM

80. You need a history lesson about slavery, obviously.

Over the period of the Atlantic Slave Trade, from approximately 1526 to 1867, some 12.5 million slaves had been shipped from Africa, and 10.7 million had arrived in the Americas. The Atlantic Slave Trade was likely the most costly in human life of all of long-distance global migrations.

The first Africans forced to work in the New World left from Europe at the beginning of the sixteenth century, not from Africa. The first slave voyage direct from Africa to the Americas probably sailed in 1526.

The volume of slaves carried off from Africa reached thirty thousand per year in the 1690s and eighty-five thousand per year a century later. More than eight out of ten Africans forced into the slave trade made their journeys in the century and a half after 1700.

By 1820, nearly four Africans for every one European had crossed the Atlantic. About four out of every five females that traversed the Atlantic were from Africa.

The majority of enslaved Africans were brought to British North America between 1720 and 1780. The decade 1821 to 1830 still saw over 80,000 people a year leaving Africa in slave ships. Well over a million more – one tenth of the volume carried off in the slave trade era – followed within the next twenty years.

In your next lesson, you might want to study up on Chinese enslavement and Latino enslavement which is prevalent in today's America.

But, I guess more importantly, you need to learn to stick to the topic at hand. The topic read:

U.S. owes black people reparations for a history of ‘racial terrorism,’ says U.N. panel

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Response to anniebelle (Reply #80)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 10:57 AM

83. Already knew that. Still doesn't justify institutional racism (reparations)

 

The sins of the past don't justify the sins of the present. It's not acceptable for you to be racist because other people in the past used to be racist.

It's not acceptable to be racist because people in the present are racist either.

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Response to Taitertots (Reply #78)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 02:28 PM

102. You obviously did not read the title of the post I was responding to.

Pay attention taitertots ~ try to keep up with the rest of the class. The OP was titled:

U.S. owes black people reparations for a history of ‘racial terrorism,’ says U.N. panel

I have no 'hate' in my heart. How 'bout your putting a brain in your head before you make an ass of yourself. Maybe the next OP will be on the 'hundreds of thousands of non-African slaves."

And by the way, I don't owe you any kind of explanation about my responses to OPs.

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Response to anniebelle (Reply #102)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 03:54 PM

104. I read it. Your heart is filled with hatred.

 

You claimed that no white people were slaves.
"I guess it's because it was black people (not white people) kept as slaves, DUH!"
That is a demonstrablely false. I'm not going to let you lie about history and spread misinformation without calling you out.

The OP is about race based forced asset seizure (reparations). The truth about history is contextual to the subject. Otherwise your supporting taking money from the children of slaves to give to the children of slave owners based solely on your racist attitudes about stuff that happened 150 years ago.

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Response to anniebelle (Reply #63)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 11:01 AM

85. I love this post.

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Response to xocet (Reply #2)


Response to NWCorona (Original post)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 04:33 PM

3. Well, then let's find all the former slaves still living...

...and make those reparations.

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Response to TCJ70 (Reply #3)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 04:54 PM

6. Yes, we'll just take it out of our individual inheritances. nt

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Response to TCJ70 (Reply #3)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 11:00 AM

84. Formerly enslaved people of course are not still living (but you knew that). Their descendants . . .

are however. Google the Dawes Rolls for a precedent if you want to know how those descendants could be found and their authenticity determined.

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Response to brush (Reply #84)


Response to NWCorona (Original post)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 04:52 PM

5. Racial collective guilt is racism

 

If you support it, you're a racist.

Its trying to remedy injustice in the past with present day injustice. Two wrongs don't make a right.

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Response to Taitertots (Reply #5)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 05:52 PM

14. You are on the wrong side of history

Things are going get very uncomfortable for you in the next several years.

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Response to Wednesdays (Reply #14)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 05:58 PM

15. Your defense of racism puts you on the wrong side of history

 

The defense of racial collective guilt puts you in the same camp as the KKK, Aryan Nation, David Duke....

I don't have to worry because your brand of racism (collective racial guilt via reparations) has no wider support. Probably because it's disgusting bigotry.

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Response to Taitertots (Reply #15)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 07:46 PM

26. Let's race. 1 mile. I get 1/2 mile head start.

Hell, it was illegal for "freed" slaves to read until the latter half of our country's existence.

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Response to Missn-Hitch (Reply #26)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 10:42 PM

33. When our great grand kids race, will your's need that same advantage?

 

To compensate for having their great grand parent lose an unequal race?

Would you call that equality?

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Response to Taitertots (Reply #33)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 01:22 AM

45. FYI: "...will your's (sic) need...?" n/t

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Response to Taitertots (Reply #33)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 02:15 PM

101. Respectfully. So you do admit that inequality exists present day?

I believe the goal would be to PREVENT future inequality.

Again, respectfully, do you envision "reparations" as a way for black folk to take over and enslave the white folk?

Cheers.

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Response to Missn-Hitch (Reply #101)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 07:34 PM

106. I'm worried about inequity.

 

Your goal creates inequity as a way to reduce inequality. Having laudable goals is nothing when the attempts to meet those goals is inherently racist, unreasonable, and rejected by the vast majority.

My ideological goals reduce inequity. The result reduces inequality. The ends and the means are both desirable.

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Response to Taitertots (Reply #106)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 08:10 PM

108. I guess it's too bad Abe didn't nip this in the bud. He was way too nice. Cheers.

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Response to Taitertots (Reply #5)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 10:22 PM

32. That is

 

the whitest thing I have ever read on DU.

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Response to awoke_in_2003 (Reply #32)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 10:43 PM

34. You're saying that like it's a bad thing

 

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Response to Taitertots (Reply #34)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 11:08 PM

37. Oh snap

 

Someone just got their privilege checked!!!

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Response to GummyBearz (Reply #37)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 12:57 AM

43. How did my privilege get checked?

 

I was pointing out that the person I was responding to was using their white privilege to explain racism.

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Response to awoke_in_2003 (Reply #43)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 01:32 AM

46. By that logic

 

you are doing the same thing.

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Response to awoke_in_2003 (Reply #43)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 12:24 PM

95. Don't worry about it

 

I replied to the other guy. Congrats on checking his privilege yesterday and keep up the good work

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Response to GummyBearz (Reply #95)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 01:07 PM

99. Thanks for the reply

 

I thought maybe I was missing something

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Response to Taitertots (Reply #5)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 01:29 PM

100. The entire concept of collective guilt is horrific.

Those who believe in it are no better than the Nazi's or the KKK. It's the same ideology those organizations were built upon, and it's an ideology that regularly leads to acts of horrific violence and genocide.

"Some members of 'INSERT ETHNIC/SOCIAL GROUP HERE' committed the crime of 'INSERT CRIME HERE'. All members of 'INSERT ETHNIC/SOCIAL GROUP HERE' share some blame. All members of 'INSERT ETHNIC/SOCIAL GROUP HERE' share guilt."

Once you start with that premise that someone is guilty simply because of who they are, escalating things is simply a matter of bringing "justice" to the "guilty".

Everything from the Nazi's killing the Jews, to the killing fields of Cambodia and the Rwandan Genocide can be traced to the same underlying concept of collectivized guilt. Hell, slavery itself was justified using the concept, because it was long believed by Christians that blacks were descended from Ham and therefore shared his curse and the guilt of his crime.

Collective guilt is racism and bigotry in one of its purest forms.

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Response to NWCorona (Original post)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 04:55 PM

8. Maybe the UN should be more concerned with its "rape for food" programs

 

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Response to NWCorona (Original post)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 05:02 PM

9. This is a huge issue within our community

I do want my 40 acres and a mule

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Response to Coolest Ranger (Reply #9)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 08:05 PM

30. I'd be happy with the 40 acres

Weed will be a black industry - it's the new funeral home. I think mules bite. Hmmm - I will send mine to Trump. He's a jackass so they will get along.

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Response to Coolest Ranger (Reply #9)


Response to NWCorona (Original post)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 05:02 PM

10. Reparations is a stupid concept.

First, who would collect it?
And from whom?

All of my ancestors came to the US after 1900, decades after slavery ended.

Who hands it out? Yet another red-tape factory of a bureaucracy?

And who would get it?

Most blacks in the US aren't entirely black.

Should Obama get half "his share" of the money, since he's half black?

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Response to Archae (Reply #10)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 05:18 PM

13. You might want to reread the article. It does not say what you seem to think that it says. n/t

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Response to xocet (Reply #13)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 06:36 PM

19. A visceral reaction to the word, 'reparations'.

It can get some people worked up in a hurry.

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Response to ronnie624 (Reply #19)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 10:01 AM

81. Because people don't want to shell out a bunch of money

to pay for crimes that they had nothing to do with.
But it's really a dead letter anyway. The majority of the American people would never agree to it. Any politician that brings it up as a serious issue is going to find himself on the streets very quickly. And even if it were to become law, the IRS would receive a lot of photos of middle fingers instead of payments.

And I say this as a Hispanic.

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Response to Archae (Reply #10)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 07:57 PM

29. If you had a little more knowledge you'd know it isn't stupid and there is a precedent

Google the Dawes Rolls.

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Response to Archae (Reply #10)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 08:19 AM

73. Obama would get nothing, because his ancestors were never enslaved.

 

The concept is not hard, if one is willing to learn.

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Response to NWCorona (Original post)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 05:05 PM

11. It is so easy...

 

to tell which of the people in this thread are white

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Response to awoke_in_2003 (Reply #11)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 06:40 PM

20. I bet if I wrote:

"it is so easy to tell which people in the thread are ( )" Fill in blank with any other race then white and it would be alerted and locked.

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Response to EX500rider (Reply #20)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 06:51 PM

21. I am white, BTW

 

48 year old white male.

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Response to awoke_in_2003 (Reply #21)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 07:14 PM

23. Point still stands.

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Response to EX500rider (Reply #20)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 09:07 PM

31. Of course

 

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Response to awoke_in_2003 (Reply #11)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 05:31 AM

61. And right wing.

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Response to awoke_in_2003 (Reply #11)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 07:59 AM

71. it really is

the responses don't shock me either

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Response to NWCorona (Original post)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 06:02 PM

16. "The dangerous ideology of white supremacy

inhibits social cohesion amongst the US population."

You can see it in the widespread support for Donald Trump.

Shameful.

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Response to NWCorona (Original post)

Tue Sep 27, 2016, 06:02 PM

17. The OP is the final report from that committee

As added info - the preliminary report had been released this past January and had been due for final release this month (the OP) - http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/USA-Update/2016/0131/UN-group-recommends-reparatory-justice-for-African-Americans

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Response to NWCorona (Original post)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 01:07 AM

44. What about reparations for women?

Women have been exploited and mistreated since the dawn of humanity.

Pay up, fellas!

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Response to NWCorona (Original post)


Response to Name removed (Reply #48)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 05:10 AM

58. ^---- warning. Trigger alert on above post. n/t

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Response to CincyDem (Reply #58)


Response to NWCorona (Original post)


Response to NWCorona (Original post)


Response to Post removed (Reply #50)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 05:08 AM

56. this won't take long. lol

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Response to CincyDem (Reply #56)


Response to NWCorona (Original post)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 05:19 AM

60. K & R

for truth

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Response to NWCorona (Original post)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 06:25 AM

62. America loves to blame their black population for it's suffering as if it's deserved.

 

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Response to Spitfire of ATJ (Reply #62)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 08:22 AM

74. Don't you know

we get blamed for everything these days

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Response to NWCorona (Original post)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 07:04 AM

68. Perhaps those reparations could be paid by the current slaveholders in saudi arabia

and sudan. Have the brazilians already paid reparations for their history of slavery? How about the belgians and dutch who profited from the slave trade?

Yes, the system is far from ideal, but if punishment and reparations need to take place, other transgressions might take priority. I'm looking at you, king leopold and every german and spaniard. Perhaps every nanogram of gold in europe could be liquidated to pay every victim of "white man's burden."

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Response to RaymondLuxuryYacht (Reply #68)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 07:33 AM

70. One flaw in your argument...we are the "Greatest County on Earth" remember.

We are supposed to lead not follow.

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Response to RaymondLuxuryYacht (Reply #68)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 11:28 AM

90. The indigenous population too

Slave trade goes back before Christ. Any Jew Knows, or any Nazi. It is a very passionate idea to just blame the Americas for slavery.

When in human events it is needed to be protracted back to the Old World Royals, demarked by the old world east of the twentieth meridian and west of the one hundredth and sixtieth meridian should also participate in reparations.

Yet better America needs to appreciate the indigenous population, the American Indian that is slandered in today’s political rhetoric.

The Mexican American is peddled into fear and anguish of deportation. That relates to incredible hatred in gangs and crime.

That gives rise to bitter frustration from the long history of bias hatred in culture of the old world style Republican reaching back to before the medieval Roman Republic Latin language in legal Tort laws abused today, now whites against whites…in open in your face lies political commercials supported by mainstream media.

Here the media is muzzled or complicit to this period that is possible to become a Republican Trump Tragedy with misery extending the ghettos across America.

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Response to NWCorona (Original post)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 08:08 AM

72. reparations!

I learned about this extensively a while ago. It's a tricky subject.

Not only because it would cause unnecessary tension between black and white people but it would also cause tension amongst black people.

The debate is, would reparations only be given to black folk who had ancestors in enslavement? Or all disadvantaged black folk that can prove their circumstances are because of slavery in the past? Should successful black people, regardless of ancestry get reparations even though they clearly weren't disadvantaged like others? And if they did, would the affected AA's think it unfair that their wealthy black neighbor also gets a windfall? What about Irish descendants who had ancestors in enslavement? They're white, would that pose a problem?

Reparations. It's a lot more complex than just giving money out.

But to make it clear, if we could find a way, I would support it.

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Response to retrowire (Reply #72)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 11:16 AM

89. Reparations, IMO to avoid many of the things you mention, should not be in the form of . . .

checks cut to individuals but in perhaps college education funds, job training programs, small business grants for legitimate applicants, community facilities, etc.

A Dawes Rolls type validation program could be established to determine eligibility.

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Response to brush (Reply #89)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 11:29 AM

91. hmm that does sound more feasible. nt

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Response to brush (Reply #89)


Response to NWCorona (Original post)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 08:31 AM

75. This is a great topic for discussion.

Predictably, looking down the thread, some have already gone off the rails because they couldn't debate it with civility. They could take some debate pointers from Clinton.

I'm going to read on down and see if I have anything to add.

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Response to NWCorona (Original post)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 08:45 AM

76. So

while reading down the thread was certainly illuminating, I'm not going to step into that mess. I'll focus on the article:

This conclusion was part of a study by the United Nations' Working Group of Experts on People of African Descent, a body that reports to the international organization's High Commissioner on Human Rights. The group of experts, which includes leading human rights lawyers from around the world, presented its findings to the United Nations Human Rights Council on Monday, pointing to the continuing link between present injustices and the dark chapters of American history.

"In particular, the legacy of colonial history, enslavement, racial subordination and segregation, racial terrorism and racial inequality in the United States remains a serious challenge, as there has been no real commitment to reparations and to truth and reconciliation for people of African descent," the report stated. "Contemporary police killings and the trauma that they create are reminiscent of the past racial terror of lynching."

Citing the past year's spate of police officers killing unarmed African American men, the panel warned against "impunity for state violence," which has created, in its words, a "human rights crisis" that "must be addressed as a matter of urgency."


I don't care if you call it reparations or something else. The point is to break that link with the past that continues to allow, to encourage even, African Americans to be treated like second class citizens, and like criminals deserving of public and private physical and economic violence.

I'm sorry that it takes an outside agency to point all of this out, but I'm grateful for this report.

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Response to LWolf (Reply #76)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 10:28 AM

82. According to a lot of people,

all the injusice of slavery was wiped clean as if it never happened, at the moment the Emancipation Proclamation was issued.

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Response to ronnie624 (Reply #82)


Response to ronnie624 (Reply #82)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 07:51 PM

107. According to a lot of

ignorant, mis-informed, and/or disingenuous people, anyway.

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Response to NWCorona (Original post)


Response to NWCorona (Original post)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 11:36 AM

93. A lot of messages deleted and names removed on this thread

 

Apparently, this is a tough subject to have a reasonable conversation about here.

What's your perspective on it?

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Response to NWCorona (Original post)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 12:11 PM

94. Practically the entire continent of Africa is owed reparations.

Western capitalists have been brutally exploiting the people and resources for centuries, and it continues to this day. Those who believe the injustice ended with slavery, are delusional, and have little interest in learning the truth.

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Response to NWCorona (Original post)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 12:31 PM

96. I can appreciate the concept of reparations. IMO, if they were to happen

 

It should be by community or organizations, not individual.

Perhaps a multi-stream infusion of money.

Some going into community-building (clinics, schools, housing)
Some going into house-ownership subsidies
Some going to educational grants

In other words, not a direct payout to individuals.

But Governmental Organizations that can disperse funds to help groups and families move forward.

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Response to KittyWampus (Reply #96)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 12:39 PM

97. +1

The knee-jerk reaction is to the thought of the government shelling out cash to individuals.

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Response to NWCorona (Original post)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 12:41 PM

98. How would it work? I mean, which "black people" would qualify?

Would there be DNA testing to determine who gets the biggest share? Many Americans are part black but look white.
Do the dark skinned black people get more money than the lighter skinned people?

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Response to NWCorona (Original post)

Wed Sep 28, 2016, 04:09 PM

105. How much equals respect? n/t

 

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Response to NWCorona (Original post)

Thu Sep 29, 2016, 06:56 AM

109. When reports like this come out...

 

... I always wonder if they ever think they'll be implemented.

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Response to NWCorona (Original post)

Thu Sep 29, 2016, 07:19 AM

110. The racists run in here to keep us Negroes in our place. Typical.

 

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