Sanders Says Democratic Convention Will be Contested

[Hissyspit]

This discussion thread was locked as off-topic by LostOne4Ever (a host of the Latest Breaking News forum).

Source: Associated Press

Sanders says Democratic convention will be contested
BY KEN THOMAS
JUN. 4, 2016 2:50 PM EDT

LOS ANGELES (AP) — Bernie Sanders says that the Democratic National Convention will be contested, predicting that neither he, nor his rival Hillary Clinton, will have enough pledged delegates after the primary season ends.

Speaking to reporters in Los Angeles Saturday, just three days ahead of California's crucial primary, the Vermont senator said that the winner of the Democratic nomination will rely on superdelegates to reach the magic number.

Sanders said it is "not accurate" for the media to lump delegates and superdelegates together, saying that the two play a separate but important role in the Democratic electoral process.

He called the nomination process "deeply flawed," adding that whether he wins the nomination or not, he will do everything he can to change it.

Read more: http://bigstory.ap.org/c64ea5574266427f9fa7b5519a687bee

[merrily]

1. It will or it won't. We'll soon see.

I'm not much for mind reading or crystal ball reading.

[KoKo]

12. Still...I think we Bernie supporter can take heart from this:

I agree with this writer...no matter what happens from now through the convention.

Why Millenials Love Bernie

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=2123323

[merrily]

17. I don't know why, but I have been on a very even keel since I decided to support Bernie.

No ups and downs, just happy that he is running. So, I don't need to take heart. I do want him to stay in, though.

Maybe I have been so calm all along because I always believed his running would make the country better, and, IMO, that happened from the off.


http://www.democraticunderground.com/1280109865

[bvar22]

149. I am estactic that he has gone from a 60 to 1 underdog predicted to win 1 state...

...to have made it a near dead heat with "the inevitable".
It restores my faith in Liberal America.

If the Primaries were to start today with Bernie's current name recognition, Hillary would be an also ran.

The Times ARE changing, and we ARE winning.

I have been posting since 2001 that:
"When the Working/Middle Class and Poor realize that we have more in common with each other than we have in common with the RICH and their employees in Washington, THEN we can have CHANGE."

Pass the WORD.
Viva Democracy!

[David__77]

2. i think his delegates should vote for him.

I intend to vote for him on Tuesday, and I wish him success.

[Skink]

3. Du should run an infomercial between now and the convention

[Skink]

5. Not what I had in mind

[Chicago1980]

6. A bit more civility please...

I know it's hard, but we must try.

Uniting the party also has to do with how we talk to one another.

I have the tendency for snark too, but please let's try be be nicer.

[ciaobaby]

7. yeah - that's the way to win people over.

[libdem4life]

14. True lack of class. Remember, name callers, one finger points toward

the intended, and the other three...well, you get it.

[davidlynch]

15. Can Any Hillary Supporter Please Explain To Me Clearly...

Why is it whenever there is some hopeful news for Bernie that the immediate reaction is go to into ad-homenim mode and start throwing out mean invective like LOSER? Why can't any of you find any joy in the fact that Bernie has some support? He's not making napalm! He's fighting for regular people like you and me. Even if you disagree with him and you favor Hillary can't you find any common ground in the ideals that Bernie promotes?

[jiminvegas]

20. See post number 18

[Beacool]

43. People are getting restless, they want to pivot to the general election.

It's no so much that Sanders is still in the race. After all, so was Hillary in 2008. It's that instead of doing a complete pivot to Trump, he continues to attack Hillary and the party as well. This is not helpful. For example, a couple of days ago Hillary gave what has been called her best campaign speech to date. She skewed Trump in a very effective way. What was Sanders' response? Instead of going after Trump, he went after Hillary. This is the type of thing that makes Hillary's supporters, and the party too, jumping mad. Why? Because she will be the nominee. Her pledged delegate advantage became insurmountable in April. Yes, she won't have enough pledged delegates when the primary race is over to be the nominee outright, but her pledged delegate advantage is almost triple what Obama ended with in 2008. She's also far ahead in the popular vote. There's no criteria by which the super delegates would drop Hillary for Sanders. The match-up polls that are vaunted around by Sanders and his campaign mean very little this early on. There's also the fact that Trump's nomination bump has already receded and in the latest poll Hillary is 9% points ahead of him.

So, Sanders' insistence that he will take it all the way to the convention is angering people. In 2008, Hillary dropped out in June and immediately went to work to help Obama win the election. Ditto for Bill. At the convention she released her delegates so that Obama could be nominated by acclamation. Mind you, Obama's pledged delegate advantage was razor thin (102 delegates), the popular vote was also very close. Totally opposite of this year, where Hillary has the clear advantage. Still, Hillary was gracious and did the right thing for the party. Sanders is threatening to do the opposite, claiming that democracy is "messy".

[billhicks76]

94. They've Been Doing It Since Day 1

They wouldn't even accept there was a challenger. All I heard was blah blah blah the polls show Hillary up by 60%. Guess they didn't understand the mood of the country.

[Beacool]

107. Maybe so, but Hillary has won.

She will be the nominee.

[SCantiGOP]

135. A contested Democratic convention

Would be the only good news Trump has had in weeks.

[AgingAmerican]

101. Hillary supporters have been acting this way for over a year now

Yourself included. Nice try.

[JDPriestly]

125. If the votes of those of us in California who have not yet voted

are so inconsequential to you, then maybe we won't bother to vote for your candidate in November.

You dismiss our candidate. We dismiss yours.

Is that what you are suggesting.

Because we in California, we Bernie supporters, would like to be able to vote without all this harassment from the Hillary supporters who have apparently already voted and think that only their votes should count.

Please let us vote. We like to participate in democracy too.

Hillary was declared the winner long before Bernie even threw his hat in the ring. This is nothing new.

We shall see who is the nominee once the convention is over in July.

Until then, anything can happen. And when I look back at events in past presidential elections, back to the McGovern run, even after the convention, anything can happen.

Stay cool. Be cool.

We want to vote in California.

[Beacool]

139. Oh please, my state (NJ) hasn't voted yet either.

The whole point is that she still will have more pledged delegates than Sanders by the end of the primaries, even if he were to win CA.

That's a fact that many Sanders' supporters appear to want to ignore.

[SouthernDemLinda]

127. Clinton-Trump match-up - loss of Ohio, Florida, and Pennsylvania would lose the Democrats the genera

AN EXCERPT FROM:

HUFFPOST POLOTICS

www.huffingtonpost.com

THE BLOG

Bernie Sanders Could Still Win the Democratic Nomination — No, Seriously

Seth Abramson Attorney; Assistant Professor, UNH; Poet; Editor, Best American Experimental Writing

Updated May 11, 2016

John King of CNN, and others, have made crystal-clear the scenario under which Bernie Sanders could become the Democratic nominee for President: he runs the table on the remaining primaries and caucuses.

If Sanders runs the table in 2016, it will mean the following has (by June 7th) happened:

Sanders has won 19 of the final 25 state primaries and caucuses (not a typo); Sanders is within a few hundred thousand votes of Clinton in the popular vote; Sanders has won 54 percent of the pledged delegates since Super Tuesday; and Sanders is in a dead heat with Clinton in national polling.

The above alone — while absolutely stunning; Sanders running significantly better than Obama for the entire second half of the primary season is a major eye-opener — wouldn't be enough to trigger the second scenario in which super-delegates are suddenly meaningful (as noted above, a front-runner so weak he or she is unlikely to win the general election).

What makes 2016 very different from 2008 is that the following items are presently true:

Sanders has dramatically higher favorable ratings than Clinton, despite months of attacks from his Democratic opponent and Trump and GOP super-PACs generally laying off both Sanders and Clinton; Sanders beats Donald Trump nationally by much more than does Clinton (12 points, as opposed to 6 for Clinton, in an average of all national polls);
Sanders beats Donald Trump in every battleground state by more than does Clinton; and Sanders beats Trump by 22 points among independents, while Clinton loses independents to Trump by 2 points.

As we sit here today, the Clinton-Trump match-up in the three biggest battleground states — Ohio, Florida, and Pennsylvania, the loss of all three of which would lose the Democrats the general election — is a dead heat.

[Beacool]

138. Abramson is as delusional as Goodman.

[LannyDeVaney]

62. Sorry

I'm not really sure what your response has to do with the thread, but I guess my rebuttal would be to see the response from Sanders supporters when DWS announced she had changed her stance on payday lenders. It would seem that the party had been shifted to the left on this issue, but Sanders' supporters responded with snark and bitterness.

I absolutely can find common ground with the ideals that Sanders promotes. But causing derision and looking to disrupt the Democratic Convention is not one of them.

Have a great day.

[panader0]

89. DWS changing her stance on payday lenders hardly shifts the party to the left.

Predatory payday lenders should Never be supported by any Democrat.

[Matt_R]

91. One issue...

Can we move to the left on quite a few more, for instance... healthcare, abortion rights federally, more equality with LGBT, more equality for women, a higher than $15 minimum wage... You know things us peasants need. I know my list is not complete and it doesn't have to be... We need our country to move to the left on ALL issues, We have been moving to the right for more than 40 years and things just keep going to the least common denominator.

It bothered me that Obama looked up to Regan and it bothers me that Clinton is to the right of Nixon.

[brush]

154. Hah! To the right of Nixon? What a laugh. Care to back that up?

[dynamo99]

116. Shift to the left?

Nah, not really, even though it's a good change.

"The party's" view will ultimately be whatever Hillary wants (since I'm resigned to Ms. More-of-the-same being the nominee). And presidential nominees in general don't follow party platforms, they bend the platform to their will. This is a consequence of our political system, which emphasizes individuals who are running rather than the parties they are running under. Hillary's not to blame for that, it's just the way things are.

I hail DWS's shift on payday lending. It's too late to look to her to treat the Dem candidates even-handedly, or even allow them to name union members of their choosing to the platform committee. It would be great if DWS would also stop providing cover for corporate pipelines of money into politics, discrimination in auto lending, allow referenda on medical marijuana, and stop backing the TPP. But that's not going to happen, DWS is of the right wing of the Dem party, same as the DLC was. Snark and bitterness? Sadness is more like it, and there's no point in pretending to be happy.

I don't want to see the Dem convention "disrupted". But neither do I have any particular interest in it being a coronation, a PR event. In fact, I'm not sure why we bother, maybe the money would be better spent hiring field organizers to work the 50 states, not just the swing states.

[magical thyme]

118. so you're saying that the Democratic Party supported payday lenders in the past?

Yikes! The things you learn. No wonder I feel like such a misfit.

[pnwmom]

64. Some of us remember 1968. I was only a child, but I remember how upset

the adults around me were, and it was because of the violence at the convention. The Dems lost a lot of voters that year, even though the cause -- the need to end the Vietnam was -- was right and just.

Trump's going to be managing his convention to be a love-fest. If ours turns into a repeat of the Nevada caucuses, due to Bernie giving his supporters false hopes -- and their believing that the election was "stolen" -- then we might as well hand the keys to the White House to Trump.

In every election since 1984, the AP contacts super delegates to confirm whom they're supporting, and announces the winner when the candidate wins the majority of all delegates -- pledged and super delegates combined.

That will happen on June 7th. But on that same day Hillary will have reached the majority of all pledged delegates -- counting no super delegates on either side of the equation. And she will have won millions more votes than Bernie across the United States.

For Bernie to come charging into the convention, claiming that he has any basis to "contest" the results, will be nothing more than selfish grandstanding. One last chance to be at the center of his universe -- but at the possible cost of leaving our party permanently divided.

[forest444]

80. That might happen - but not because Hillary might become the nominee.

Rather, if the DNC makes the mistake of pulling a Deus ex machina and handing the nomination to Joe Biden.

Don't get me wrong: I like Joe Biden very much, and in fact still feel that he might have made a better nominee than either Hillary or Bernie.

But, of course, he didn't run, and that's the problem - much as it was with the great Hubert Humphrey in 1968.

[AntiBank]

103. "Trump's going to be managing his convention to be a love-fest."

and outside its going to look like a mini civil war.

[OwlinAZ]

155. Grow up, dear.

[SouthernDemLinda]

132. Regular people hm um!

Do you know how to become a paid troll?

A pro-Hillary Clinton PAC is spending over $1m on online trolls in order to 'correct' Bernie Sanders supporters on social media sites.

[rdking647]

8. in 2008 obama needed super delegates to win

no difference now

[totodeinhere]

9. The convention will be contested but yet soon DU posters will only be allowed

to support Hillary on the threat of being banned if we don't.

[Skink]

11. Then DU wil be contested

[Maedhros]

60. The DU will be a graveyard. [n/t]

[MFM008]

76. good luck with that

[Thor_MN]

23. Contested only so far as the false meme that "super delegates don't count"...

The Trump trolls and the delusional cling to the mutually exclusive "super delegates don't count" and that some deus ex machina super delegate manipulation will counter the will of the voters.

It will be effectively over in 80 hours or less. After that there are no more potential landslides to claim will happen. After that, there's only betting that a tossed coin will come up neither head nor tails but will land on its edge.

There are people who won't accept that until votes are counted at the convention. They will have a week after next Tuesday to "get it out of their systems."

They do not have "to support Hillary", but there will be consequences for attacking her, or supporting someone who isn't the Democratic nominee.

[AgingAmerican]

105. Super delegate votes can be changed right up to the time they vote at the convention

So, at this juncture, they do not count YET.

[Thor_MN]

133. Don't pretend that Clinton doesn't have a major lead in super delegates inclinations.

At this juncture, she crushes Sanders in super delegates that have announced they support her. There won't be a deus ex machina. The super delegates will vote more or less as they have indicated and that will be more than enough.

The super delegates have never countered the will of the voters.

[clg311]

59. Orwellian

But not surprising. The democratic establishment has contempt for democracy and free expression.

[TwilightZone]

10. Then, he doesn't know what "contested" means.

[AgingAmerican]

108. It means 'Brokered'

[TwilightZone]

130. Brokered and contested aren't the same thing. The fact that you believe they are interchangeable

terms indicates that you do not have even a basic understanding of the two terms. Seemingly 80% of DU shares this misunderstanding with you.

Further, a contested convention only happens if one candidate is not the clear winner going into the convention.

That will not be the case here.

[TeamPooka]

13. It will show a lack of grace and honor in defeat but if he wants that as part of his legacy then so

be it.

[libdem4life]

18. Oh good grief, it's not like this has never been done. It's not convenient

for many, to be sure, but there have been soo many "irregularities" and now that Sanders is almost a household name, and California looms...I'd say he's doing the right thing. Half of this campaign was getting money and getting his name out there. That's pretty common with a dark horse who wasn't planning to run. There were Invitations Not To Run, but since Bernie was an Independent, he didn't get them.

It's a class war...We, the People vs They, the Wealthy and Connected

Down with the Oligarchy. Either way, the President will be embattled, if not impeached. That's what we got with our two, untrustworthy, scandal-ridden Chosen Wise Ones.

[Maedhros]

61. Lack of grace and honor?

What utter nonsense.

Why do Democrats hate liberals so much?

[Enthusiast]

131. Why do Democrats hate liberals so much? Things. Have. Changed.

[Loki]

151. This is something that we, I hope most of us, taught out children

is how to lose with honor and good sportsmanship. A sore loser is never a winner and always makes the team look bad. I think that some here are not able or willing to understand that. These values that we taught our kids to live by, were not just words. It can't be do as I say, not as I do because they will remember how we handled ourselves when it was time for us to be the loser.

[wisteria]

16. This is the same process we Democrats have used for years to elect our candidates.

If he would have been a Democrat for more than a few months, he would know how things go. And, since Clinton has a majority of both the delegates and popular vote And a majority of Super Delegates backing and pledging their support to her.....She Is Our Nominee. He can contest it all he wants, but he will just look like a poor sportsman, and a sore loser.

[TomCADem]

19. How Ironic. Bernie Relying On Superdelegates to Overturn Popular Vote

Bernie the voice of democracy and openess hoping to relying on backroom deals and power brokers to ignore the voice of the clear majority of Democrats. I guess Bernie is not just the same as any old politician. He is worse in confusing his desires and ambition with the public good.

[Skink]

24. He hired the guy who designed them

So he has always been in the game

[TomCADem]

148. Makes You Wonder, Is It Tad Devine or Bernie Sanders?

I could see Tad Devine driving this, since superdelegates are partly his creation. But, then again, it would need Bernie's consent for the campaign to go all in on using superdelegates to overcome Hillary's lead in pledged delegates and the popular vote.

[RobertEarl]

25. Rules of the game

H campers are so insecure they get upset when Bernie plays by the rules. Can't blame them, I guess, she's not a real winner, in fact they know she will probably lose.

[AgingAmerican]

111. The popular vote is irrelevant in our form of government

Neither in the primaries or the general.

[SusanLarson]

22. The Dem leadership wants a contested convention

They don't want Clinton's baggage hanging over the party in the general election.

IF neither candidate gets the majority of support in the first vote then the delegates are free to support whom they wish. Nominations can be made for any democrat at that point.

Will Sanders be the ultimate nominee who knows, but mark down my prediction that it will not be Clinton.

[Thor_MN]

28. There will be but one vote.

There might not even be a vote if the obvious second place finisher has the class to step aside, as in 2008.

It is delusional at this point to think that the super delegates that have said they are going to vote for Clinton would go against the will of the people (and what they said they would do) to throw their support to someone other than the first place finisher.

Sanders supporters claiming that the leadership doesn't want Clinton and the leadership have fixed primaries for Clinton makes absolutely no sense.

[Beacool]

58. No, they don't.

They want Sanders out. They are trying to hold their water long enough not to offend all the people that he has attracted to his cause.

The leadership doesn't want Sanders, they never did. He was never a Democrat and spent years in Congress criticizing them. They would have had no choice but to nominate him if Sanders went to the convention with more pledged delegates than Hillary. Just as the GOP is going to do with Trump against their will and better judgment.

Sanders will go to the convention far behind in pledged delegates and the popular vote too. He has also continued to anger party leaders. The chances of super delegates subverting the will of the people, and choosing as the party's nominee the candidate that they didn't favor in the first place, is almost nil.

[MisterFred]

99. Apparently the media has flip-flopped

and is playing up Sanders' chances (after having ignored them when they still existed). Though I'm a Sanders supporter (and I disagree with you on why leadership doesn't want Sanders - he's just too liberal for the conservadems that lead the party), I recognize that there's close-to-zero chance he could become the nominee (I don't think Clinton will be indicted by the FBI).

What surprised me the other day is that my extreme-right-wing father (not a fan of Trump, though he'll vote for him) was excited about the possibility of Sanders pulling out an upset against Clinton. It turned into a bizarre occasion where I (a Sanders supporter) had to explain to his skepticism and disappointment (Obama is pretty clearly socialist-meaning-communist in his eyes) that Sanders had no chance, barring something extreme that caused all the super-delegates to switch - and even an indictment probably wouldn't be enough.

It seems he started paying attention when the media did - when Trump won the Rs and the media needed excitement. And, of course, it's all lies and purposefully-missed analysis on radio & tv news.

[Beacool]

109. Your father probably dislikes Hillary more than he dislikes Sanders.

After decades of attacks, many conservatives think that Hillary is close to being the anti-Christ.

[MisterFred]

145. Not my main point...

He fears Hillary more than Sanders (thinks he'd be easier to beat in the general). Another of my disagreements with him. Which he'd dislike more in the White House... dislikes her personally, would be more opposed to Sanders policies.

But my main point was that the media is pretending Sanders still has a shot to win. That's influencing a lot of people who want that to be true, right and left.

[ellennelle]

142. of course they want bernie out!

that is, however, the only substantive truth you offer here.

the leadership wants him out because he was "never a democrat" - ??? excuse me, but he is more a true blue democrat than the entire leadership combined! his positions and policies are a return to FDR principles that the DLC and the clintons - and sadly, now obama - have abandoned and openly worked to reverse since the early 90s, following a republican money trend in place since before reagan. the party that calls itself "democratic" now is frankly further to the right in way too many ways than was reagan, and certainly further right than nixon, most definitely further right than ike. bernie has spent years criticizing them because they deserved it! the party lost its way, abandoned the people, and have been all about padding corporate pockets for decades now.

in short, they want him out because he rains on their money and power parade!

but lets dig a little deeper here, because otherwise this just devolves into a superficial zinger match, and nothing is to be gained from that. see, i have concerns that raise some serious questions. it's just stunning to me that the DNC leadership would invest so much in such a risky candidate as hillary. can anyone here recall any other prez candidate from any party with such serious felony allegations hanging so heavy over his/her head, with their party whistling past the graveyard like this? oh yeah; her hubby in 96. except that was RWN insanity; this is truly and dangerously serious; the FBI is investigating her! there is a nonzero potential for criminal indictment.

and now, these are not just allegations, as the state IQ report exposed. if comey has not exonerated her by convention time, is the party leadership really willing to risk that hammer coming down during the GE? or even if -big IF at that point - she were to get elected, were those allegations to come to fruition while in office, this would mean instant impeachment! again, where have we ever heard of this scenario before? oh yeah; her hubby! but that was for stupid semantics, really (the definition of sex. and 'is'.); what she is facing are potential charges of negligent breach of security, at best.

you pile on top of this explosive time bomb her horrible UNfavorables (as bad as trump's, which are historical), then add to that bernie's consistent favorables and better polling against trump (and all other republicans for months now), and the whole mess puts the lie to any claims of being motivated by the most likely win in november.

then consider the fact that there is so much panicked discussion of shoving biden in with warren if hillary tanks - and down our throats, as they say - and it puts the further lie to any whining about the 'will of the people.' that canard is nonsense squared, as my own super delegate/congressman is not just refusing to vote with the heavily bernie will of his constituents, he's downright nasty, dismissive, and insulting about it. even al franken - and i've loved me some al since SNL days!! - is refusing to reflect the will of his MN constituents who overwhelmingly preferred bernie.

see, none of your arguments hold up under scrutiny.

and again, the thing that really concerns me is how deeply the DNC leadership is invested in this high risk candidate, and how willing they are to ignore the intense enthusiasm and dedication from an enormous influx of young voters - the biggest in history, our next generation!! - being handed to them on a silver platter, ready-made victory and success! yet the DNC is telling them to piss off. WTF??

what that lack of logic and reason further exposes is the fact that this is not about 'the will of the people' or even so much about beating trump; it's all about maintaining their precious status quo. even if it means lying and dirty tricks during the campaign, cheating at the polls, and bulldozing the people. even if it means losing to trump!!??

i'm not at all sure how you claim bernie is not the candidate the pledged delegates "favor," when most of them signed on before any opposition had declared. you don't "favor" something if it is the only option. and i don't know where you learned math, but it is simply not the case that bernie will be "far behind" in pledged delegates, or behind at all. as it stands right now, if they break even on all the states left, neither will have over 50%. that results in a contested convention, by definition.

but i guarantee you, if we get to the convention and hillary has been indicted, or if comey makes that finding public and lynch refuses to indict (worse, imho), all hell will break loose if the DNC leadership tries to pull the biden scenario. (and i like biden, but c'mon; will of the people??)

and all hell should break loose. as noted, that scenario would expose that the party is more concerned with keeping in place its leadership and DLC/repuglilte trends that serve them more than the people; this would expose that this is more important to them than respecting the people. if they try to pull this, and it's starting to smell like some version of this is lurking in the wings, if only as a backup just in case, it won't just be the democratic voters who will notice. that will be the big birthday cake all lit up as a free to gift of the presidency to one donald trump. all because the DNC can't seem to get its head out of its derriere.

as for "holding their water long enough not to offend all the people that he has attracted to his cause," ..... too late. the entire hillary campaign has been a litany of offenses and insults to bernie and his supporters since at least last fall, in addition to the roadblocks and hurdles and flaming hoops they've cast in his path. they can barely hide their disdain, and too often she herself slips. this - it is precisely this glaring character flaw that i found so, yes offensive, about hillary back in 08, her capacity to deliver passive-aggressive cheap shots and low blows to obama was what sealed the deal for me, against her, not just as a candidate, but as a person. sadly, she appears to have only dug herself in deeper. which itself seems to be another character flaw.

so the party leadership can be angry all they want, but to be angry with bernie is absurd. not only did hillary not concede until 4 days after CA (and she was further behind than bernie is), she did not release her delegates until the morning of the roll call vote, the third day of the convention.

so, you know, unwrinkle your nose and relax. don't know how old you are, but this is how it works. plus, 67% of dems actually want bernie to stay in till the convention. how about that, eh? they want to actually witness democracy at work! let's hope the leadership - and the super delegates - have the good sense to show them that, instead of their backsides.

because the only thing the leadership is angry about is that their script is not being followed, somebody moved their cheese; they brought all this on themselves (had they been more true blue FDR democrats, the people might not be so restive, or so burdened with good reason to be). even so, you won't find a single member of congress who will speak ill of bernie. impeccable integrity, that guy. hell, even john boehner of all people recognizes he's "the most honest candidate" running. hence his consistently positive favorability ratings. that, my friend, is what wins elections.

sorry this is so long, but have lost patience with the weak reasoning and shallow priorities swirling around in the guise of pissy smackdowns, and i apologize yours was the comment that set me off.

peace.

[SusanLarson]

146. way too late

People like yourself burned that bridge a long long time ago.

[Matt_R]

92. Contested just means there will be a vote at the convention.

The phrase you are looking for is Brokered Convention.

[redstatebluegirl]

26. Please do something before this happens.

With Trump on the other side this is no time to fight.

[Trust Buster]

27. Sanders and his supporters refuse to respect the will of the voters. They will be forced to accept

the voters decision. They're denial looks very weak.

[EdwardBernays]

31. Don't worry

You'll soon have nominated the least trusted, least liked Democratic candidate of all time... Someone the state Department says lied to you for months and someone who refuses to give press conferences or even release the text of her speeches.

So good job.

And after that, when she loses to Trump, you can celebrate that as well, as that'll be on your head.

[Trust Buster]

33. You're hilarious and hysterical all at the same time. The voters have decided despite your whining.

[EdwardBernays]

34. I'm not whining

I know anyone that challenges Queen Hillary is probably seen as a whiner, but we're not. We just don't want a candidate that the whole country - minus a few cultists like yourself - thinks is dishonest and unlikeable.

I know it's a lot to ask, not nominating someone that's going to hand the country over to Trump, but I think it's worth it.

[Trust Buster]

147. Minus a few cultists like me ? Pal, Hillary has 3 million more votes than your phony candidate.

How laughable.

[billhicks76]

137. Edward Is Quite Correct

Just because you're all in on a bad candidate doesn't change the facts.

[Andy823]

63. Gotta love those right wing talking points

Just keep on spewing them, Trump might even send you a thank you card, who knows.

[EdwardBernays]

70. You're confused

You're still on the "my candidate is the world's biggest victim" talking point.

No one - not progressives, not independents and certainly not the GOP - thinks Hillary's reputation for dishonesty is undeserved. Just her cultists. They all loving thinking they're victims.

Poor little Hillary supporters.

[MisterFred]

100. If you don't think Clinton set up a private server to avoid FOIA requests, then you're

willfully ignorant.

(Possibly some other motivations, I don't care). Support her in spite of that - it's a reasonable position. But don't lie to yourself. It's unbecoming of what SHOULD be the reality-based party.

[cui bono]

37. So you want to refuse to accept the rules? No one is refusing to respect the will of the voters.

The rules are if no one reaches a certain amount of pledged delegates after the voting then no one clinches the nomination. How is that refusing to respect the will of the voters? Maybe you should be directing your anger and vitriol at the rules if you dislike them so much.

.

[AgingAmerican]

114. The voters have NOT decided

She does NOT have enough delegates, sorry.

[felix_numinous]

29. K&R

[Skink]

30. HRC also needs the SD'S

She can't win without them. They will vote in July.

[AntiBank]

104. THIS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[SunSeeker]

32. Bernie is ignoring reality.

Hillary is only 70 delegates away. If she doesn't clinch the nomination this weekend in Puerto Rico and US Virgin Islands, then it will certainly happen by 8 pm EST this Tuesday, when New Jersey is called for Hillary, 3 hours before the polls close in California. That is reality. Given reality, we need to move on and unify against Trump, not turn our convention into a food fight.

[cui bono]

38. Please post the data that shows she is 70 delgates away from clinching the nomination.

Thanks!

.

[pnwmom]

50. Here is the official Associated Press (AP) Delegate Tracker.

They have been calling campaigns when a candidate reaches a majority of all pledged and super delegates -- based on AP's contacting the super delegates -- since super delegates were created in 1984.

https://interactives.ap.org/2016/delegate-tracker/

[cui bono]

52. Superdelegates don't vote until July 25.

You actually are using a tracker that is already counting delegates from CA, a state that hasn't even voted yet? Oh dear. There is a YUGE problem with democracy in this country and so many of you just don't care.

Oh, and you forgot to bring up how I'm a racist again. You also forgot to apologize for trying so hard to make me a racist that other day.

And yes, I will bring it up every time. You attempted character assassination and slander on me and I do not take that lightly, especially when you clearly stand by your actions.

.

[pnwmom]

71. I didn't call you a racist at all. For some reason you have taken that upon yourself.

Something apparently touched a nerve.

[cui bono]

156. Yes, you absolutely did. You know that very well. You had two posts hidden in that thread

for calling multiple people racists.

Good to know you stand by it. It was truly disgusting. If you had any conscience at all you would have apologized, but now, instead, you add snark to it by saying "Something apparently touched a nerve."

No, not at all, I just don't like when people act the way you did that day. It was truly a sight to behold and not something that can be forgotten. True colors were shown that day. Yes they were.
.

[pnwmom]

158. I didn't call ANY Duer a racist but you interpreted my response to your OP that way.

You accused a black Hillary supporter of assault without any trial or conviction. When you apologize for that, I'll apologize for calling you on it in a way that offended you.

[pokerfan]

120. +1000 (nt)

[SunSeeker]

141. SDs are committed to Hillary now, and have not and will not flip.

As far as I am aware, Sanders has managed to "flip" only a few delegates, mostly undeclared SDs. Hence his insurmountable delegate deficit.

Maybe calling CA superdelegate Barbara Boxer a "c*#t" at the Nevada Dem convention might not have been the best strategy for those Bernie supporters.

[cui bono]

157. No, they are not committed at all. They are committed when they vote.

You can pretend all you like but that is weird considering you like to throw out the phrase "ignoring reality".

.

[ybbor]

42. My math shows she is 634 delegates shy

Or are you using New Democratic math.

[cui bono]

46. Gotta love how many people who talk about reality do not know what it is.

[ybbor]

49. They must not have unicorns in their pasture

Mine is lovely with a leprechaun jockey.

[SunSeeker]

88. No, I'm not ignoring delegates like you are. nt

[AntiBank]

110. "Hillary is only 70 delegates away." << NO, thats only with the SD's included. They are up for grabs

HILLARY NEEDS THEM TOO!!!

Sanders can choose to fight fight fight for them. Its allowed, its democracy at its very core. Dont ever try and pull authoritarian shit on a left wing progressive party.

GO GO GO BERNIE.

I love a fighter for the working class, not a puppet/warhawk for the controlling class.

[Laser102]

117. The SDs are not up for grabs. They are Hillarys and always have been. Good luck flipping them.

[cstanleytech]

35. So my questions are how many super delegates would he have to get to win and

is there a realistic chance of him getting the number he would need and if its not realistic then should he bow out gracefully or push on like Ralph Nader?

[ybbor]

41. No one will have enough pledged delegates

The SDs don't vote until the convention and are not committed to anyone until they have cast their votes.

Nader never ran as a Dem so that reference makes no sense at all.

[cstanleytech]

85. I realize that they arent pledged yet but I am asking how many would he have

to win in order to beat Hillary and is there a realistic chance of him winning atleast that many?

The reference to Nader isnt that he ran as a Dem but rather he still ran as a candidate even though he didnt win his parties nomination so should Bernie keep in the race even if he doesnt win the Democratic nomination or bow out?

[antigop]

36. TO THE CONVENTION...AND BEYOND! nt

[yodermon]

39. This will only be a problem if he keeps asserting this *after* the last primary is over IMO.

He is giving his voters in CA and the other final primary states the signal that he is truly fighting to the very end, giving no quarter until the last vote is cast. It is only fair to those voters; they want to vote for their candidate as a *truly engaged candidate* who wants to win. I get that completely.

However, after the voting is over, it will be interesting to see if his rhetoric changes at all. I know Hillary was arguing for *pledged* delegates(!!) to change their votes to her back in 2008 before she was brought to heel. We'll see what Bernie does.

[Feathery Scout]

112. Agreed. After the last Primary...

After the last primary...

All delegates will be allotted. All votes will have been cast. The voters will have spoken.

The Superdelegates will have made their choice known.

And a Presumptive Democratic Presidential Nominee will be clear. That is the person who is on track to win the nomination based on the existing/current numbers.


President Obama and Democrat leaders, such as Elizabeth Warren and VP Biden will be free to endorse the Presumptive nominee and get behind that person.

And anyone who keeps fighting....isn't fighting for uncast votes to go one way or another. They are fighting to tear SD votes from the Presumptive nominee supported by the POTUS and the people.

That's a different scenario...

[LannyDeVaney]

40. How can a vote for one of two different candidates be contested?

Help me out here. After the first vote, isn't one of the candidates guaranteed to have a majority when the choice is between two candidates (assuming there isn't a tie).

[ybbor]

44. It isn't a majority that wins

They must hit the 2383 number to clinch

[pnwmom]

47. 2383 is half of all delegates, pledged and super combined.

And every nominee since 1984, when the system has been created, has used some super delegates to reach that number.

If you want to count only pledged delegates, then the majority she'll need is 2026. And to do that she only needs to win 33% of all the remaining delegates.

Either way, she wins.

[ybbor]

51. Right, right right

I'm sorry I stand corrected. I was thinking back to the GOP idea when they were saying trump wouldn't get first vote then it would open up for other candidates. My bad.

[LannyDeVaney]

48. No comment

[ybbor]

54. I'm sorry, see post 51 above

[LannyDeVaney]

56. Hey, it's a Saturday.

Have a good day.

[ybbor]

67. I'll try

Currently laying on my bedroom floor in horrible back pain, tying to get the strength to shower to see my 8 year old's first dance recital. Two bulging and one herniated discs in my lower back, not very comfortable to say the least. Waiting for the meds to kick in.

Maybe that is the root cause of my mistakes.

Thanks for the well wishes, and I hope your w-end is going better than mine. But can't wait to see my Boo dance, even if it is laying down in the aisle.

[bravenak]

121. I sympathize

My back is killing me too. I'm on the living room floor though. Bigger tv. Hurts so bad.

[Matt_R]

93. You may be looking for the term Brokered Convention

Contested Convention means that more than two candidates make it to the convention.

[pnwmom]

45. She WILL have a majority of pledged delegates. And despite "Bernie math"

you can't add super delegates in on only one side of the equation.

Again, she will have a majority of pledged delegates -- at least 2026.

She will also have a majority of the combined pledged and super delegates -- which will include all her pledged delegates plus as many super delegates as she needs to reach the majority of all delegates.

This has been how the "magic number" has been decided ever since 1984, when the Super delegate system began.

And it's why the AP reports now that she's only 70 pledged delegates away from clinching the nomination.

[SmittynMo]

53. People don't seem to understand us

People - WAKE UP - This is some serious shit here. It affects your future, but more so, your kids and grand kids. This is the difference between the oligarchs and YOUR democracy. And I will stay with Bernie til the day he says "No more".

I suspect that won't happen!!!

With the weekly shit being thrown at Clinton, I would suspect anything can happen now. She really screwed up the Email server issue, and that will cost her trustworthy points. And there may be more to come. It's not over by a long shot.

[Beacool]

66. In a democracy, the person who has more votes wins the race.

In this country, that means the person who ends the race with more pledged delegates. This year that would be Hillary.

You seem more concerned about your side pushing through, despite it being against the will of the majority of Democrats. That is undemocratic and it won't happen.

[SmittynMo]

72. Sorry, but it's you that don't get it

It's pretty simple. July 25. Everything will be much clearer for you on this date. Until then, please make up all the shit you want. I'm not falling for it.

[Beacool]

79. Wow.....

Not only is your response rude, but also in denial of the reality on the ground. Hillary will be the nominee.

[SmittynMo]

81. Yeah OK

Think what you may.

[Angel Martin]

90. if Clinton gets indicted, the Super Delegates

will dump her that day. They are not interested in carrying the Clinton's dirt and risking defeat themselves.

If could be the email server or it could be some additional scandal around the Clinton "Foundation", or Bill's many trips on Epstein's "Lolita Express" to Paedo Island, or... or... That the thing with the Clintons, they are full of surprises - and always unpleasant ones for other Democrats who have to defend them.

Wouldn't it be nice to have a nominee where you can concentrate on the campaign instead of worrying every morning that there will be some new bombshell scandal to deal with ?

[SammyWinstonJack]

83. Go Bernie!

[tinrobot]

87. Sanders: "The American people are "sick and tired of hearing about your d*mn emails!"

Funny how it isn't an issue for Sanders, yet many supporters argue this as the main reason to nominate him.

[Lokijohn]

98. There has been a lot of damning information made public

since he said that. Have you seen any of it?

[brooklynite]

55. In other breaking news: tomorrow will be Sunday.

[Orsino]

57. It just means that there will actually be a vote.

We can all calm down. Isn't it clear how that vote will go?

[imagine2015]

65. It isn't clear at all how the superdelegates will vote. They are free agents.

[SmittynMo]

73. Yeah, no one

seems to get it. Just keep telling them July 25 and end the conversation.

[Orsino]

75. Uh-huh.

Barring big changes/catastrophes, though, it's clear how it will go.

I don't see a good means to make the vote to go the other way--not one we would wish on the party. We've seen an incredible progressive groundswell in this election cycle, but there was never going to be an easy way to dislodge so many, so incredibly many, Establishment figures from the leadership.

I would be okay with slow progress, were the nation and world not facing so many deadly crises. Half-assing for another four or eight years is not a luxury we can really afford again.

[TwilightZone]

84. It's clear how those who have already committed to a candidate will vote.

Most of them aren't going to magically change their minds, especially to switch over to the clear runner-up in the primary contest. That's not how it works, nor is it how it should work.

[baldguy]

68. And Donald Trump smiles.

Normally he'd have to pay good money for this sort of thing - but Bernie is giving it to him for free.

[Matt_R]

95. And Clinton continues to join in the chaos.

[RoccoR5955]

69. As it should be!

Last week on Hartmann's program I heard from Thom, that the winner will need something like 2/3 of the votes to win the nomination. This is nearly impossible for EITHER candidate. This is not a 50% + 1 winner election, from what I understand from him. So the convention shall be contested.
Bernie still could end up our candidate, and Bernie stands a better shot at getting the votes of the independents than does Clinton.

[Angel Martin]

82. Bernie stands a better shot at getting the votes of the independents

he is also very unlikely to be indicted before the campaign ends.

[Mnpaul]

128. 59% of pledged delegates

to clinch on pledged delegates alone

[LonePirate]

74. There will not be a contested convention as Bernie will concede no later than June 17th.

The pressure for Bernie to drop out will be intense once the polls close on Tuesday. He may hold out until after DC votes on the 14th; but his campaign suspension speech is less than two weeks away. This talk of him contesting the convention is all talk and nothing more.

[SammyWinstonJack]

77. Knr.

[Cryptoad]

78. Bwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah!

Oh,,,,there going t be some changes made alright..... it will be a long, long time if ever before a non-Democrat is allowed to run for President as a Democrat!

[ebayfool]

96. Allowed? How so? n/t

[-none]

115. That would be a good thing because the country would begin shifting back to the Left.

No more 3rd Way.

[RoccoR5955]

159. How is Bernie a "non-Democrat?"

He registered as one when he became a Democratic Party candidate.
If you tell me that he is not a lifelong Democrat, well the same holds true for Hilliary.

[liberal N proud]

86. I can't say what I really think of him and his handlers

[Marrah_G]

97. Good

[beachbum bob]

102. wont be contested...hillary wins on first ballot...then all sanders people can be escorted out

sanders lost

and is coming on as the biggest sore losr in US election history...that will be his legacy the biggest whiner of all time


and well deserved

we saved america from sanders

[thereismore]

140. Another one for the bin!

[SwankyXomb]

106. If that's the case

then how about O'Malley jumping back in?

[Demsrule86]

122. How about no

Have a nice day. Virgin Islands about to come in.

[tarheelsunc]

113. And that last drop of respect I had for him is gone.

After all the bitching and moaning about superdelegates and how him and his people kept talking about how the process should be democratic, he has proven himself once again to be the biggest hypocrite in the running. Hillary has a huge advantage in terms of raw votes and she would win the nomination under ANY system, with or without superdelegates.

The people HAVE chosen, Bernie, and they didn't choose you. Deal with it.

[JNelson6563]

119. A true team player with the nation's best interest at heart.Oh, wait...

I must say that my view of the Senator has changed a great deal during this campaign.

[Gothmog]

123. Sanders is lying about a contested convention to keep the small dollar donations flowing

There will be no contested convention

[Fuddnik]

124. It worked!!!!!

I'll send another donation right now!

[Gothmog]

136. Is Sanders making another trip to Rome for himself and ten family members using campaign funds?

[Fuddnik]

143. Maybe he'll take me with him.

I can endorse De Pope!

[beachbum bob]

126. can't be contested when hillary is voted the nominees on first ballot

its not an OPEN convention as the nominee has all the delegates needed to win on Jun7th
showing more character flows in sanders and makes him unqualified to even be considered for president

more whining to con his supporters to pay for the rome vacation.....

[stopbush]

129. Yawn...

[muriel_volestrangler]

134. So though he urged superdelegates to "vote in line with how the people of that state voted"

http://edition.cnn.com/2016/05/16/politics/democratic-superdelegate-math-sanders-clinton/

about 3 weeks ago, he's now changed his mind. Because that would mean "Clinton would have 384 superdelegates, to Sanders' 177", so that would increase Hillary's lead of pledged delegates, and give her the majority.

[SunSeeker]

144. The hypocrisy, it Berns. nt

[brooklynite]

152. Why is this "Breaking News"?

He's been saying this for months.

[onehandle]

153. Welcome to 'Latest Bernie News.'

I'm wondering if Skinner is going to rethink the 30(!?) hosts of this forum that control much of the content of the front page of DU.

[Onlaketime]

160. One thing is certain to me for sure,

the country needs Bernie's policies much more than it needs Hillary's. Judging from all the terrible things that have gone wrong with the USA and all the foreign policy disasters, I would think Bernie is needed now more than ever while Hillary represents the status quo and leaves the country divided. We need a progressive president for a change.

[LostOne4Ever]

161. LOCKING THREAD

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