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Mon Jan 18, 2016, 05:49 PM

Oregon militants LaVoy Finicum and Ryan Bundy travel to Utah to plot another armed showdown

Source: Rawstory


By Travis Gettys

Two of the Oregon militants have been traveling out of state to meet with other groups who want the federal government to hand over public land to their control.

LaVoy Finicum said he left the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge last week and drove to Utah with one of the other armed militants, reported OPB.

He later identified his travel companion as Ryan Bundy, and he claimed they met with county officials eager to engage in a similar standoff with federal authorities over public land ownership.

Finicum said the occupied visitors center, which the militants have renamed the Harney County Resource Center, was a symbolic victory and inspiration to other anti-government extremists.


Read more: http://www.rawstory.com/2016/01/oregon-militants-lavoy-finicum-and-ryan-bundy-travel-to-utah-to-plot-another-armed-showdown/

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Reply Oregon militants LaVoy Finicum and Ryan Bundy travel to Utah to plot another armed showdown (Original post)
Quixote1818 Jan 2016 OP
hobbit709 Jan 2016 #1
dbackjon Jan 2016 #2
maggies farm Jan 2016 #4
Ned Flanders Jan 2016 #18
Feeling the Bern Jan 2016 #12
blackspade Jan 2016 #21
SDJay Jan 2016 #3
Lucky Luciano Jan 2016 #7
ribrepin Jan 2016 #14
SDJay Jan 2016 #15
KingCharlemagne Jan 2016 #23
FailureToCommunicate Jan 2016 #5
Gregorian Jan 2016 #6
LiberalArkie Jan 2016 #8
Paladin Jan 2016 #9
red dog 1 Jan 2016 #13
metalbot Jan 2016 #19
ohnoyoudidnt Jan 2016 #31
red dog 1 Jan 2016 #10
SoLeftIAmRight Jan 2016 #24
Judi Lynn Jan 2016 #28
maggies farm Jan 2016 #11
blackspade Jan 2016 #25
AllyCat Jan 2016 #16
moreland01 Jan 2016 #17
blackspade Jan 2016 #20
flamingdem Jan 2016 #22
MrWendel Jan 2016 #26
phantom power Jan 2016 #32
MrWendel Jan 2016 #33
Kennah Jan 2016 #27
libodem Jan 2016 #29
StoneCarver Jan 2016 #30

Response to Quixote1818 (Original post)

Mon Jan 18, 2016, 05:59 PM

1. Should have arrested them on the highway.

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Response to Quixote1818 (Original post)

Mon Jan 18, 2016, 06:00 PM

2. Why the FUCK haven't they been arrested?

 

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Response to dbackjon (Reply #2)

Mon Jan 18, 2016, 06:04 PM

4. Honeypot

 

and Malhuer has honey.... and stragglers are still arriving

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Response to maggies farm (Reply #4)

Mon Jan 18, 2016, 07:55 PM

18. Crossing state lines?

 

Seems like crossing state lines during the commission of a crime generally makes things worse for them, yes? We can only hope the good guys are keeping tabs on crimes committed and will do something about it. Although I find it far more likely that the FBI will ignore them, an FBI employee will expose their incompetence, and that whistleblower will then be arrested. Call me a tad bit cynical, good neighbor.

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Response to dbackjon (Reply #2)

Mon Jan 18, 2016, 06:23 PM

12. White. Privilege.

 

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Response to Feeling the Bern (Reply #12)

Mon Jan 18, 2016, 09:22 PM

21. White Supremacy.

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Response to Quixote1818 (Original post)

Mon Jan 18, 2016, 06:02 PM

3. I Get Not Wanting Another Waco or Ruby Ridge

but the longer the feds do nothing, the more emboldened these morons are going to become and the worse it's going to get.

Arrest their asses and throw them in the can.

If these were African-American folks or Muslims, does anyone think they'd even be alive right now?

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Response to SDJay (Reply #3)

Mon Jan 18, 2016, 06:12 PM

7. At this point of see nothing big wrong with s Waco-like outcome.

There are no children or innocents involved.

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Response to Lucky Luciano (Reply #7)

Mon Jan 18, 2016, 07:09 PM

14. There are children at the refuge

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Response to Lucky Luciano (Reply #7)

Mon Jan 18, 2016, 07:31 PM

15. I Do

I think the visual of them being put on a humiliating frog march - hopefully weeping like children - would be much more effective than having them go down in a 'blaze of glory' that would only get their fellow 'patriots' all riled up.

But they need to actually do this. How they let them just come and go and travel from place to place, apparently planning additional insurrections, boggles my mind.

As said elsewhere in the thread: Get off your asses and get this under control. Now.

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Response to SDJay (Reply #3)

Mon Jan 18, 2016, 09:27 PM

23. See Fred Hampton (RIP) for more info - nt

 

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Response to Quixote1818 (Original post)

Mon Jan 18, 2016, 06:08 PM

5. This is crazy! The Feds are either playing 3 dimentional chess here or sucking their

thumbs with their eyes closed.

Seems more the latter than the former.

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Response to Quixote1818 (Original post)

Mon Jan 18, 2016, 06:12 PM

6. I want to know what enforcement is waiting for.

Every time I say Finicum to myself, I say it in a judges' voice, as if from the bench. ...and for crossing state lines, LaVoy Finicum, I hereby...

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Response to Quixote1818 (Original post)


Response to Quixote1818 (Original post)

Mon Jan 18, 2016, 06:17 PM

9. And why wouldn't they make additional efforts?

It's not as if anything punitive is being done to prevent their continuing their land-grab attempts. Anybody else as sick of this as I am?

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Response to Paladin (Reply #9)

Mon Jan 18, 2016, 06:55 PM

13. I am

I just found out about the White House.gov petition to Obama to arrest Bundy & take back the refuge...It's been up for about 10 days, and only 8,000 signatures so far.

They need 92,000 more by February 9 to get a response from the White House.

I'm getting madder & madder every day that Obama sits on his ass & does nothing about this "armed insurrection"

Why do I blame Obama?

Because as Harry Truman said: "The buck stops here.""

Every single DUer should sign the petition!

Every single American, Republican or Democrat, should sign the petition.

These right-wing bastards need to go to jail NOW!.....ALL of them!

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Response to red dog 1 (Reply #13)

Mon Jan 18, 2016, 07:57 PM

19. Your kids are going in first, right?

Or you're signing up to be a federal officer?

When we talk about military activity on this board, there's always someone who at least makes some effort to think about the people we send into harm's way. But I've yet to see any sentiment here to suggest anything remotely like sympathy for the door kickers that many people seem to be calling for.

If your kid was going to be the first one through the door, and didn't make it, would you be saying "It was worth it to get those guys"?

I'm not meaning to single you out here, because a lot of people have expressed the same sentiment. Just food for thought.

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Response to metalbot (Reply #19)

Mon Jan 18, 2016, 11:20 PM

31. We aren't talking about going to war over lies.

There are federal officers who signed up to take care of this sort of thing. That is their job and that is what they are trained to do. They have broken multiple laws and nothing seems to be being done about it. They were too stupid to even bring in enough food when they started this so I doubt they will be much trouble for trained snipers with body armor and armored vehicles. If they cut off the power, it could probably be done quite easily at night with a team using night vision.

The longer the feds wait, the more of these jackasses are likely to arrive and start doing the same thing in other places which will make it more likely for innocents to be harmed. There is also the issue of self proclaimed judges and talk of actions against local officials.

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Response to red dog 1 (Reply #10)

Mon Jan 18, 2016, 09:28 PM

24. just signed

 

...

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Response to red dog 1 (Reply #10)

Mon Jan 18, 2016, 10:00 PM

28. Thank you for your link. n/t

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Response to Quixote1818 (Original post)

Mon Jan 18, 2016, 06:23 PM

11. Prepare yourself for the long haul

 

Even if Malheur vacates soon, the Sagebrush Rebellion is busy in state legislators to achieve the goals of the Wise Use Movement.

You might want to detour and watch this debate regarding the state of Utah request to transfer federal land back to the state.


Becky Lockhart, Utah Speaker of the House and Ken Ivory Utah State Representative spoke in favor of the State of Utah taking over management and title to Utah's Public Lands.

Dr. Bob Keiter, Wallace Stegner Center for Land, Resources and the Environment University of Utah S.J. Quinney College of Law and Dr. Dan McCool, Director, Environmental and Sustainability Studies Program, Environmental and Sustainability Studies, University of Utah spoke against the transfer of public lands back to the states.


In a prior comment I offered that Bundy was just a player in the Sagebrush Rebellion and his history is more than just Bunkerville, NV and Mesquite,NV did not create the man.

If you want hints as to what motivate the Cliven clan you would want to know about Cleon Skousen, the Freemen Institute, and the "National Center for Constitutional Studies."

June 20, 1982
Amid patriotic trappings Freeman Institute preaches born again constitutionalism

..."What the institute does is hold seminars on Skousen's view of the Constitution, and his plan for saving America.

The plan includes abolition of Social Security, the income tax and most federal regulatory agencies, return to election of U.S. Senators by state legislatures instead of popular vote, and a constitutional amendment to curb the powers of the federal judiciary."

..."But the Mormon Church has carefully separated itself from the institute. It issued a warning in 1979 to its local bishops and stake presidents that Freeman meetings and lectures are not to be announced or discussed in church meetings."

..."The Freemen helped instigate the 'Sagebrush Rebellion' -- a move by western states to take control of vast tracts of public lands. Bert Smith, a Nevada rancher who is on the institute board of directors, was one of the founders of the movement.

'Once a state is established, the federal government should have no proprietary right except for military bases, post offices and essential buildings,' said Skousen. State sovereignty

Skousen, however, would go a step further than most of the sagebrush rebels. He also believes the national parks should be run by the states. 'There was no constitutional authority for setting up national parks,' he said.

If Congress wanted to establish a park system, he said, it should have amended the Constitution."

..."Question 100 asks: 'Should the Bureau of Land Management be abolished?'

The correct answer is: 'Yes. This bureau has been rapidly phasing out the traditional grazing rights of ranchers and setting up impossible regulations on land which should have been turned over to the states when they were admitted into the Union.'"

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Response to maggies farm (Reply #11)

Mon Jan 18, 2016, 09:32 PM

25. And here's the thing....

If the Feds turn that land over to anyone it should be Native Americans, the folks who it was stolen from in the first place, not these bloviating assholes.
Talk about wanting shit for free.

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Response to Quixote1818 (Original post)

Mon Jan 18, 2016, 07:38 PM

16. Why are they allowed to leave???

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Response to Quixote1818 (Original post)

Mon Jan 18, 2016, 07:40 PM

17. Whitehouse.gov Petition

I just started a petition on the White House petitions site, We the People.

http://wh.gov/iws6x

"We petition the Obama administration to immediately remove the militants from the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge in Oregon."

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Response to Quixote1818 (Original post)

Mon Jan 18, 2016, 09:21 PM

20. Why were these two assholes not arrested?

What the hell are the cops doing?

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Response to blackspade (Reply #20)

Mon Jan 18, 2016, 09:24 PM

22. And now they can repeat the same thing elsewhere until

they get the confrontation they seek.

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Response to Quixote1818 (Original post)

Mon Jan 18, 2016, 09:36 PM

26. Because...

the current one worked soooooooooo well? Remember to pack extra undies boys.

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Response to MrWendel (Reply #26)

Tue Jan 19, 2016, 11:42 AM

32. Seems like its working just fine

They're still there, and now they're recruiting other ranchers to refuse paying BLM grazing fees.

We can mock them all we want(*), but you know, they're accomplishing their goals. Are we?

(*) and yes, they are stupendously mock-worthy.

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Response to phantom power (Reply #32)

Tue Jan 19, 2016, 11:52 AM

33. Well apparently...

you can live off a bag of dicks.

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Response to Quixote1818 (Original post)

Mon Jan 18, 2016, 09:59 PM

27. We need a law!

One armed showdown a month.

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Response to Quixote1818 (Original post)

Mon Jan 18, 2016, 10:44 PM

29. Maybe the FBI

And Homeland Security would like to help them? How many other agencies do we pay for to sit on their asses?

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Response to Quixote1818 (Original post)

Mon Jan 18, 2016, 10:44 PM

30. Wait

 

The trap is set. Every fly will come. Then you don't have to find them. Just wait another week. Then it's all over. Yes, it's 3-d chess. I'd do the same thing.
Stone carver

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