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Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:03 PM

A word about the ongoing Democratic presidential primaries

After last night's primary results I think it's safe to say that the shape of the 2016 general election is starting to come into focus. On the Republican side, Donald Trump holds a commanding lead and will likely secure his party's nomination. On the Democratic side, Hillary Clinton continues to maintain a significant delegate advantage. She has not yet collected the 2,383 delegates necessary to claim the nomination, so technically it is still possible for Sanders to win. But the chances of that happening are exceedingly small, barring some sort of unexpected event that completely changes the fundamentals of the race.

So what does this mean for Democratic Underground?

Given that neither Democratic candidate has collected the necessary delegates to win, and neither candidate has suspended their campaign, it is still primary season on Democratic Underground. Members are free to support the Democratic primary candidate of their choice here on DU while the candidates themselves are still actively campaigning for the nomination.

But we also understand that many DUers -- even as they continue to support their preferred primary candidate -- are starting to turn some of their attention to the general election that is starting to take shape. I know it is something of a cliché to say that this year's election is the most important in a generation, so I'm not going to say that. But I think it goes without saying that this year is unique in that our likely opponent espouses a toxic mixture of unvarnished racism and incitement to violence that many of us had believed (wrongly) was beyond-the-pale for a major party candidate. Given such a repellent choice on the other side -- a candidate that displays outright contempt for many of the core values of this country and this website -- I have no doubt that every DU member will, in time, get past the divisiveness of the Democratic primary and vote for the Democratic nominee no matter who it is. To do otherwise is unthinkable.

I understand that many of you are not ready to think about the general election yet, and that's fine. But to those of you who are starting to think about the need to get past the division and start to think about healing, I think it is important that we begin to tone down the most divisive and over-the-top rhetoric about our primary candidates and their supporters. And in case it's not clear, that goes for both candidates.

For the last four years we've allowed you all, via the Jury system, to set the standards for where you think the line should be drawn at DU, without interference from Admins. The system worked pretty well for a long time, but I think most people would agree that it has been stretched beyond the breaking point during the last few weeks of primary season. I knew there was a risk in sticking with this system in a highly-charged partisan environment, but we decided to place our faith in the members of DU -- believing that most DU members would be able to take off their candidate-supporter hats when serving on juries and make a good-faith effort to be fair to everyone regardless of candidate. I do not believe my faith was misplaced, but in hindsight I think that it was very difficult for individual jurors to hold the line against the worst-of-the-worst when it felt like standards everywhere on the site were in freefall. And let's be honest: Some of you have been serving on juries in a nakedly partisan fashion.

With this in mind we have been working on some significant changes to the Jury System which we think you will approve of -- I'm not going to go into the details because we're still working on it. Let's just say the focus is on reducing drama, providing better guidance for jurors, and setting clearer standards that better lay out our expectations for what Democratic Underground should be. Unfortunately these changes are still a couple of weeks to a couple of months away from being ready -- at which point the primary race should be pretty much over. Until then, we are going to implement some short-term changes to get us through primary season.

The short-term changes

We still believe that the vast majority of DU members are perfectly capable of participating in a productive way, and serving on juries in a non-partisan way. But given the pervasively negative tone of discussions here, we think it would be wise to provide a greater incentive for people to do so. Going forward if we see anyone voting to leave the worst-of-the-worst posts, or voting in a nakedly partisan fashion to hide posts which are clearly legitimate, then we will remove that person's ability to serve on juries. (We are not going to provide any notification to members who lose their jury privileges, because under the messed-up values of primary season we think many of you would see it as some kind of badge of honor.)

So, please, do the right thing when serving and let's clean this place up a bit.

We've also decided to try removing the current "five hides and you're out" restriction, mainly because we suspect that members would be more likely to vote to hide bad behavior if they didn't feel like one of their friends might get canned over it. So while members can still be flagged for review for getting posts hidden too quickly, there's no more five-hide suspension. And anyone who is currently suspended for getting five hides is able to post again as of now. We reserve the right to change this decision if it seems like it's having the opposite effect to what was intended.

And also we are not going to feature discussion threads on the DU homepage if they are posted in the General Discussion: Primaries forum, or in either of the two primary candidate supporters' groups. We are no longer interested in featuring the most divisive content on the front page of this website.

And so on to the part I'm sure you're all really interested in...

Who are we purging?

Nobody. However, if we see anyone puffing up Trump they will have to go do it someplace else.

tl;dr

General election season is on the horizon but the race is not over. Primary season continues. Nobody is getting purged unless they're Trump-humping. In an effort to improve the level of discourse we're going to remove Jurors who make terrible decisions (either voting to leave the worst-of-the-worst posts, or voting to hide clearly innocuous posts).

We'll be back with more news when we have some. In the meantime, let's all enjoy the fact that 2016 is shaping up to be a big year for progressives and a car wreck for conservatives.

PS. Fuck Donald Trump.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:06 PM

1. Ew. You said Trump-humping. My brain needs purging now.

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Response to Solly Mack (Reply #1)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:41 PM

124. Heh

Puffy trump-humpin fluffers! That's the code name for trumps army.



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Response to Solly Mack (Reply #1)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:18 PM

213. He also said, "Fuck Trump."

 

As a heterosexual female (albeit absurdly elderly and ridiculously unattractive), all I can say is

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Response to Solly Mack (Reply #1)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 05:18 PM

369. Trump Humping. I need to hurl.

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Response to 47of74 (Reply #369)


Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:07 PM

2. 5th Rec .....

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Response to Hekate (Reply #2)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 03:17 AM

524. 522nd Rec ....

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:07 PM

3. I can't vote I'm English.

I want the Democrat to win, and I'm still fairly neutral about who that is. In a way I'm glad it's a decision I don't have to make.

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Response to Bad Dog (Reply #3)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:09 PM

12. I could tell from your accent

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Response to Orrex (Reply #12)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:11 PM

202. Is it so bleeding obvious?

I can vote, just not in your elections. I'll be voting in the Council elections in May, (Labour of course,) and to stay in the EU in the referendum in June. In the presidential elections in November the only things I'll be crossing are my fingers, and maybe my eyes.

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Response to Bad Dog (Reply #202)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 04:04 PM

290. Poor you...I see what Cameron is doing over there.

I am an Anglophile, so I do keep eyes on Merry Olde.....and whinge about Cameron's behavior.

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Response to dixiegrrrrl (Reply #290)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 04:48 PM

340. He's just been defeated in the Lords

For trying to pass Trade Union legislation that would effectively cut off a huge amount of Labour funding. Even his own party think it's out of order.

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Response to Bad Dog (Reply #340)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 12:15 PM

642. Yes, he hasn't really been having a great couple of weeks

Partly it's his habit of leaving practically all domestic policy to George Osborne, who's been getting more and more ridiculous lately. Osborne tried - unsuccessfully in the end -to drastically cut benefits for disabled people, to an extent that pissed off even some hardened right-wingers in his own Cabinet.

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Response to LeftishBrit (Reply #642)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 01:15 PM

643. I don't think Osborne will be the next leader.

He's not at all likeable.

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Response to Bad Dog (Reply #643)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 01:40 PM

645. Bloody hope not; but the alternatives aren't great either

Theresa May, who is thick as two short planks and seems to think everyone is an illegal immigrant. Boris Johnson, superficially likeable but even lazier and more inclined to leave everything to others than Cameron is, and a blatant opportunist on the EU issue. Who else is on the horizon?

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Response to LeftishBrit (Reply #645)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 02:44 PM

646. Nobody springs to mind.

I'm sure there's some as yet unknown wannabees though.

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Response to Bad Dog (Reply #202)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 04:57 PM

350. "Labour" ...

... not "bleeding" obvious, but obvious ... ;->

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Response to Jopin Klobe (Reply #350)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 05:15 PM

366. That's what it's called.

It's not an Australian political party.

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Response to Bad Dog (Reply #3)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 05:31 PM

377. off-topic but I watched a few hours of the House of Commons debate on the "Snooper's charter" bill..

otherwise known as the Investigatory Powers Bill. I was very impressed at the quality of the debate, as always, and wondered what your thoughts were on it. Thanks.

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Response to steve2470 (Reply #377)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 06:25 PM

417. All today's news is about the budget and the new sugar tax.

As always the devil's in the detail. I have no trouble with suspected terrorists and criminals being spied on, provided they get clearance from a judge. I am against mass data trawling not just because it's an abuse of privacy but because it doesn't work. Wading through heaps of data has not resulted in one successful prosecution, unlike targeted intelligence led surveillance. This bill has been knocked back to the committee stage so we'll have to see what they come up with, but we don't want to give the government extra powers than can be abused. And they will abuse them given the chance, they always do. There must be adequate safeguards put in place.

Incidentally when a Labour government tried this the Tories were up in arms against it. Guess they didn't fancy being spied on by MI5 either.

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Response to Bad Dog (Reply #417)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 06:43 PM

426. thank you, I think you, Labour and the SNP are on the right track with this! :) nt

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Response to steve2470 (Reply #426)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 03:38 AM

528. So do I but the road ahead isn't exactly smooth.

The success of the SNP in Scotland has helped the Tories in England. There was a bit of anti English rhetoric during the referendum. That's all it was, but some people took it seriously and voted Tory because they did not want a Labour government backed by the SNP.

Corbyn is a risk too. He may unite the young, the non voter and those who abandoned us for the Greens and get us back it, or it could be a repeat of the 1980s and long opposition. I honestly don't know which. I hope it's the former, but Corbyn needs to be a bit more dynamic, take a leading role in the stay campaign, and disgruntled MPs need to get behind him. He needs to be given a fair crack of the whip.

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Response to Bad Dog (Reply #3)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 10:37 PM

489. my Brit mum thought Trump was "bloody ridiculous"

we value your opinion even if you cannot vote against him!

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Response to Skittles (Reply #489)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 03:30 AM

527. Thank you.

I can post videos like this though.



He's going to take on IS, but he's scared of a man with a tuba.



This is the website mentioned in the above video. Click on it to pledge a brick and get a moose to grunt in Trump's face. So far 152,664,494 have. It's only been up two weeks. I think Trump is more hated than Dubya was, and he's not even been elected.

http://brickingitforcanada.com/

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Response to Bad Dog (Reply #3)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 11:40 AM

594. In lieu of voting, you can support Arsenal along with me

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Response to Blue_Tires (Reply #594)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 12:01 PM

599. That's fighting talk.

I'm Saints 'til I die. Arsenal took a lot of our best players, Walcott, Oxlade Chamberlain, Chambers. We train 'em up and the big clubs snap 'em up.

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Response to Bad Dog (Reply #3)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 12:13 PM

641. Same here. I do prefer Sanders, but the MOST important thing is no INSANE Republicans!

I don't know anyone British who likes Trump, even people who vote Tory here.

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Response to LeftishBrit (Reply #641)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 01:16 PM

644. Even Farage said he thought Trump was too extreme.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:07 PM

4. Thank you Skinner.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:07 PM

5. Well -- does this mean jury decisions are getting "juried?"

 

Or, I suppose, reviewed, a la our own court system?

Who will have time to keep Watching the Watchmen in such a busy, charged political season, though?

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Response to villager (Reply #5)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:43 PM

128. more like they need appeals

we do have appeals in our system don't we. Heck appeals on certain adult sites get more traction than they do here. like zero they don't get a response. adult message groups at least you get a response. It might not be very nice but I prefer that over the silent treatment. I prefer because I have ADD , one points out this is what I did wrong this is why it's wrong and how to avoid it in the future. However if you remove certain Discussions off the main page that goes a long way to removing alot of the anger and banning one gets for inadvertently saying something stupid in a room full of people of the other candidate. I remember saying something pro faith in a room full of Atheists when DU3 was just forming. Banned before I knew it. It was posted to the main page by mistake however

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Response to PatrynXX (Reply #128)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:47 PM

137. Well, I was just curious as to what the mechanism was. How will decisions deemed clearly "egregious"

 

...be brought to the attention of those charged with revoking folks' juror privileges?

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Response to villager (Reply #5)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 06:09 PM

412. that was my question

It sounds as if all jury votes will be monitored for intent and motive. And that sounds impossible.

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Response to grasswire (Reply #412)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 06:13 PM

414. It really does. How do you discern "intent?"

 

How are you alerted to which jury decisions should be overridden, and which jurors banned?

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Response to villager (Reply #414)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 06:18 PM

416. yeah, wasn't the jury system automated, unless someone complained? nt

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:08 PM

6. Thanks - and I agree with your ps!

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:08 PM

7. I was ready to rage, but it all sounds pretty reasonable.

Undies unbunched.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:08 PM

8. Question

Will folks till be locked out if they don't support Bernie? I still don't get that.

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Response to DownriverDem (Reply #8)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:04 PM

185. If I were a newcomer to this site,

I'd probably think the same thing. I mean when you go to the main page and see discussions comparing Hillary to Hitler followed by 3 or 4 others that just hit the next rung below that level of offensiveness, one would probably think only Bernie supporters are allowed here. Moreover, I never thought I'd see the day when there were more negative posts about a democratic candidate on DU than on Free Republic, but we finally managed to reach that point! These changes are way overdue. Thank you, Skinner.

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Response to Native (Reply #185)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:53 PM

274. Supporting all Democrats!

What a wonderful concept!

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Response to Native (Reply #185)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 03:20 AM

525. This. ^^^^^

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Response to Native (Reply #185)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 09:15 AM

564. YES!

I've pointed this out before AND got jumped on by several posters. No one took the time to support me then. I'd prefer Bernie, but I've never seen a Democratic candidate get "hated on" as much as Hillary on D.U. in the past months.

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Response to Native (Reply #185)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 10:46 PM

622. maybe it was this way last election and I didn't notice it.

Agree.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:08 PM

9. Fuck Trump

 

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:09 PM

10. Good stuff, thanks. I agree with the changes to the jury system, especially the time outs.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:09 PM

11. Sounds good.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:09 PM

13. Thanks, Skinner. I hope this helps.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:09 PM

14. Times like this prompt memories of my cat, a noble veteran candidate...

 

In Texas, where Republicans bow East for routine prayer to the Gran Phant, my selection of a candidate means little. So Katy, residing comfortably below the Afghan pine, gets my nod once again. Oh, she was a Democat, btw.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:09 PM

15. So does this mean that

1STRONGBLKMAN, BEAVENACK and many others who had been suspended are now back among us? If so huge K AND R

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Response to Coolest Ranger (Reply #15)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:11 PM

22. Test

 

I got my 5th again last night.....

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Response to giftedgirl77 (Reply #22)


Response to Post removed (Reply #87)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:44 PM

130. Oh what utter bullshit.

 

Take that nonsense elsewhere.

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Response to giftedgirl77 (Reply #130)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:41 PM

262. Something about who you are must upset them. I wonder what it is.

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Response to Coolest Ranger (Reply #15)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:11 PM

26. So yes we can!!!

 

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Response to giftedgirl77 (Reply #26)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:16 PM

43. Welcome back! This is one I really like.

Also welcome back sheshe2, Magggie, KMOD, a couple of others!

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Response to ucrdem (Reply #43)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:17 PM

47. B & 1SBM!!!

 

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Response to giftedgirl77 (Reply #47)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:21 PM

59. oh absolutely

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Response to ucrdem (Reply #59)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:23 PM

65. I feel like a lil kid that just got ungrounded early.

 

It's like an early birthday present.

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Response to giftedgirl77 (Reply #65)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:27 PM

233. seabeyond and JoePhily too

It's like Bastille day!

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Response to ucrdem (Reply #233)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:30 PM

240. oops, wrong spot. nt.

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Response to giftedgirl77 (Reply #26)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:26 PM

79. Yay!

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Response to Coolest Ranger (Reply #15)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:40 PM

119. And LexVegas

Who doesn't post a lot, bit who is a strong liberal, and a man who supports his daughters' rights for equal rights.

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Response to obamanut2012 (Reply #119)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:44 PM

133. Most certainly.

 

I didn't even know he was gone until he just posted.

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Response to obamanut2012 (Reply #119)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 04:16 PM

303. Here I am.

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Response to LexVegas (Reply #303)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 08:14 PM

456. Welcome back

:

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Response to LexVegas (Reply #303)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 09:36 PM

473. Welcome home

my wayward son

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Response to Coolest Ranger (Reply #15)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:31 PM

241. Yep

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Response to JustAnotherGen (Reply #241)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:40 PM

258. I know someone whose name is an unmemorable tangle of letters and numbers who's going to be

incredibly disappointed by this.

Bravenak's biggest fan will soon have something -- anything -- to talk about again.

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Response to Number23 (Reply #258)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 10:34 PM

487. LOL

 

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Response to bravenak (Reply #487)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 11:09 PM

491. There you are!!!!!



You know you need to be in AA right now.

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Response to Number23 (Reply #491)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 11:14 PM

492. I'm on my way!!

 

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:10 PM

16. Lame. You should have given us another month at least.

 

Wait until the election result is 100% clear.

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Response to Cheese Sandwich (Reply #16)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:21 PM

61. Exactly what do you disagree with on what is in Skinner's OP?

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Response to William769 (Reply #61)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:33 PM

94. "I think it is important that we begin to tone down"

 

He saying ok guys we are moving into a new phase now so let's tone it down.

I think it is important that we begin to tone down the most divisive and over-the-top rhetoric about our primary candidates and their supporters. And in case it's not clear, that goes for both candidates.



"divisive" and "over-the-top" are in the eye of the beholder.

Reading between the lines the tl;dr of this OP is: Stop attacking Clinton. That's what it means to say stop being divisive at this point. He's presuming that the election result is known, and he's mostly right, but why not wait another month to be much more sure just out of respect for the people who are hoping for that unlikely comeback. Out of respect for democracy.





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Response to Cheese Sandwich (Reply #94)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:38 PM

113. Attack away. I just trash all of those threads without reading them anyway.

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Response to Cheese Sandwich (Reply #94)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:20 PM

217. You're still fairly new

There was a time when the vicious backbiting wasn't allowed here.

I'm glad to see an effort to move back in that direction.

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Response to Bobbie Jo (Reply #217)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 04:42 PM

335. +1

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Response to Bobbie Jo (Reply #217)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 08:14 PM

458. Me 2

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Response to Nitram (Reply #458)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 09:37 PM

474. Make it 3

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Response to SCantiGOP (Reply #474)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 03:24 AM

526. Four.

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Response to William769 (Reply #61)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:47 PM

144. Wants another month to slur the nominee of our party

 

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Response to CorkySt.Clair (Reply #144)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:55 PM

167. We have a nominee? Who is that?

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Response to SammyWinstonJack (Reply #167)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:56 PM

170. Ok, likely nominee

 

Feel better?

I bet not.

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Response to CorkySt.Clair (Reply #144)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:41 PM

261. I'd like to remind you, Hillary lost 2008 with 1639.5 delegates and 257 superdelegates.

So, jumping the gun there a bit, AND dissent != slur.

There are no 'slurs' allowed that would be disallowed when the nomination is finally clinched, and you know it.

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Response to CorkySt.Clair (Reply #144)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 12:03 AM

503. Classy. Real classy.

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Response to Cheese Sandwich (Reply #16)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:59 PM

174. totally lame. they are acting like M$NBC and all the others who are all in for Hillary.

 

Its just a wake up call for all us Bernie supporters and I for one am going nowhere. I wont give up and none of us should.

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Response to litlbilly (Reply #174)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:08 PM

194. There's a reason we have primaries.

 

To be realistic, it's very unlikely Sanders can come back at this point.

Why not let the election play out, and THEN crack down on tone?

Just out of respect for the democratic process.

It's kind of funny that website owners like Daily Kos and DU have decided for us that March 15 is the day we have to fall in line.

After all the primaries continue all the way through June. Why shouldn't California see the same vigorous debate as Iowa and NH?

The truth is the March 15 tone crackdown is the owners way of putting their thumb on the scales.

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Response to Cheese Sandwich (Reply #194)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:17 PM

210. its actually very disrespectful to the residents

of the THIRTY places that haven't voted yet. i wonder how many are paying members and how many might wonder how well their money is being spent.

just a thought.

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Response to restorefreedom (Reply #210)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:26 PM

225. I am going to be mostly a lurker now, which is what they want. Wont do much IMO. The Bernie

 

momentum is just starting as I see it. He was supposed to lose by as much as 40 points in some of those states so, we have to be proud of where we are. DU has nothing to do with it much anyway so it's no big deal. If they want to be Hillary 24/7, that's fine with me. Just proves our point doesn't it, and that we were mostly correct in our push backs against the Hillary record. They took that as going negative, but, the record is what it is and it proves otherwise.

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Response to litlbilly (Reply #225)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 04:15 PM

302. yes, i am starting to back off a bit

i even started my own hashtag, #berniegrouporbust to reflect my recent trashing (yay) of gdp. i have had some nice exchanges with some very respectful hillary supporters but at this point, i don't need the stress when things get ugly with others.

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Response to restorefreedom (Reply #302)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 05:44 PM

392. How fun is DU gonna be now, it'll just be Hillaryites drooling all over themselves. Will be as fun

 

as watching M$NBC. I have better things to do anyway like working for Bernie

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Response to litlbilly (Reply #392)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 06:11 PM

413. yes.. dont forget jpr too! nt

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Response to litlbilly (Reply #225)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 04:25 PM

314. Why on earth would TALKING ABOUT BERNIE be bad for HIM?

And Hillary has been insulted probably at least 10,000 times this year alone with the same insults over and over and over. Hillhaters are the only ones who read them so how is continuing that dreary business supposed to help Bernie? Instead of talking about him and his policies?

Frankly, even the slightest imposition of restraints on behavior can only be good for Bernie.

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Response to Hortensis (Reply #314)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 05:18 PM

370. The truth isn't an insult. Or at least it shouldn't be framed as one.

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Response to BillZBubb (Reply #370)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 07:19 PM

439. When it's not really the truth, It is.

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Response to restorefreedom (Reply #210)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:52 PM

272. I'm certainly tired of being told I have no say whatsoever in our party's nomination.

Coming from the state with the most delegates in the country, it would be nice to have some influence. I'm not just talking about this primary, I feel this way every 4 to 8 years.
Our current primary system sucks...

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Response to MoonchildCA (Reply #272)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 04:12 PM

300. yes, its almost as though the west coast is an afterthought

i think and hope that one of the things that happen as a result of this election is major election reform.

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Response to MoonchildCA (Reply #272)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 04:36 PM

326. One person one vote and get money out

 

If we could just get money out of politics and remove the delegates from the primary - it would be more democratic and fair.

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Response to restorefreedom (Reply #210)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 05:22 PM

374. I live in CA

And I don't feel the least bit disrespected. Skinner hasn't taken my vote away.

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Response to wryter2000 (Reply #374)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 05:32 PM

378. thats true. nt

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Response to restorefreedom (Reply #210)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 06:37 PM

421. What is disrespectful about....

Asking people supporting both candidates to not be assholes to supporters of the other?

You can still support your candidate, even very strongly.

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Response to Adrahil (Reply #421)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 06:56 PM

433. nothing. but truthful facts about a candidate that are not flattering are not attacks.

personal stuff is always bad, i agree. especially towards other posters as opposed to the candidates. but bad policy should always be called out. and any suggestion that we should reign in the debate before all states vote is not cool.

if that is not what the op meant, then no problem.

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Response to restorefreedom (Reply #210)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 06:07 AM

536. Well I regret it now

There's not much chance that I'll pay for this again next year.

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Response to kdmorris (Reply #536)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 07:09 AM

547. i imagine you are in good company on that. nt

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Response to Cheese Sandwich (Reply #194)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:22 PM

220. I see it as them putting their thumbs on the scale like DWS and the DNC. Just trying to dampen

 

the Bernie people. It wont work.

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Response to Cheese Sandwich (Reply #194)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 04:37 PM

328. The March 15th is intentional

They (meaning establishment-supporting sites like this one and Kos) know that Hillary is only ahead at this point because of the map/calendar and that after today it shifts to states that are naturally more Bernie friendly. The hope is to take advantage of this calendar luck and paint this as a done deal to tamp down on enthusiasm and turnout in those states.

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Response to a2liberal (Reply #328)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 04:40 PM

331. That's probably right.

 

The map gets a little bit better for Bernie as we move forward. I don't want to exaggerate it though. It's going to be difficult to come back. But out of respect for a democratic process, it's way too soon to call this election over.

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Response to Cheese Sandwich (Reply #194)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 07:42 PM

449. "come back" from where?

The thinking was always that March 15th was the high-water mark for Clinton. Sounds like you have accepted teh Ides of March "best by" date too.

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Response to Cheese Sandwich (Reply #194)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 07:44 PM

451. Ironically, that's the same date where the map gets easier for Bernie. eom

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Response to Cheese Sandwich (Reply #16)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 04:23 PM

311. This post does not surprise me.

Skinner's post, however, is a good change to DU.

This isn't all about the election result, it is also about DU.

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Response to Raine1967 (Reply #311)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 04:52 PM

635. exactly.

Hillary took Obama to the bitter end but she was a gracious loser. The tone at DU has been off putting with fault on both sides. Hillary supporters need to look toward the general. Hillary may hire Bernie or vica versa.

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Response to Cheese Sandwich (Reply #16)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 06:49 AM

541. +1, Hillary will not be the nominee.

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Response to harun (Reply #541)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 10:26 AM

572. From your mouth to God's ear.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:10 PM

17. Thank you

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:10 PM

18. Completely agree with you Skinner. Thanks for doing this.

and fuck trump - he's a loser

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:10 PM

19. Thank you for lifting the 5 and you're out rule.

It will be nice to have some of our AA posters back.

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Response to Starry Messenger (Reply #19)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 09:36 PM

472. Explain 5 and you're out

 

Is it 5 jury hides in a short period of time and you're out? Because if you were here three years, and got 5, that's not really a lot.

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Response to Reter (Reply #472)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 11:53 PM

497. 5 in 90 days.

After 90 days they disappear from your record.

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Response to Starry Messenger (Reply #19)

Fri Mar 18, 2016, 05:03 PM

630. Yes, because all the posters that had 5 hides were

 

as innocent as babes.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:10 PM

20. Glad to see this

That NanceGreggs ban really upset me

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Response to malaise (Reply #20)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:15 PM

41. Nance Greggs was banned?

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Response to Pathwalker (Reply #41)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:17 PM

48. 5-hide ban I think

so glad to see this change

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Response to malaise (Reply #51)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:27 PM

82. Her profile says her account is still active,

so she was NOT banned. Thanks.

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Response to Pathwalker (Reply #82)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:35 PM

102. I think the Active re-designation was real recent

I noticed for example, Bravenak's status is Active, but it wasn't a couple of days ago (and her time out was not due to expire until about May 11). So I think everyone who isn't flagged for review got their statuses set to Active.

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Response to progree (Reply #102)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:40 PM

121. You are correct and Skinner explained it

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Response to malaise (Reply #121)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 07:11 PM

435. I don't think she was banned; it was just that her post was unjustly hidden

For instance, she was able to post in Omaha Steve's thread to thank him: http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=7681683
and she was able to post a few hours before Skinner announced this amnesty: http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=1503406
so unless there were other intervening hides which came within a day of other hides from 90 days ago expiring, I don't think she was blocked.

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Response to muriel_volestrangler (Reply #435)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 07:12 PM

436. Thanks

Still I was really upset re that verdict

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Response to progree (Reply #102)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:49 PM

150. There's a difference between 5-hide suspension and being banned.

"Banned" means that the poster has been kicked off DU permanently. The previous 5-hide suspension was just that, a temporary suspension of posting rights. Those posters were not banned. NanceGreggs was not banned.

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Response to yardwork (Reply #150)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:56 PM

277. That was a really bad hide though

There was absolutely nothing offensive or ToS-violating in the post that got juried. A perfect example of what Skinner meant when he wrote about juries being used for nakedly partisan purposes.

That 5-hide suspension should never have happened.

And I say that as a lurking Sanders supporter who has frequently found Hillary supporters highly condescending and who misses the NanceGreggs we had when certain shrubs were overgrowing the White House.

I'm probably a hypocrite for disabling the jury service option on my account, lol. (I deal with enough crap at work and don't want to deal with more of it here.)

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Response to strategery blunder (Reply #277)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 06:37 PM

422. +1,000

It was the first time I wondered whether I'd be renewing my subscription at year end.

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Response to malaise (Reply #20)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 04:31 PM

319. Yeah me too

There were some ugly hides there.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:11 PM

21. I will support any candidate who is faithful to Democratic Party

Last edited Wed Mar 16, 2016, 06:12 PM - Edit history (1)

traditions and causes. I will never vote for or say one positive thing about Trump. That said, I don't think DUers should have to pledge loyalty to any candidate with a D after his or her name who is a DINO. Just my 2 cents.

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Response to LibDemAlways (Reply #21)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:32 PM

93. I agree with LibDemAlways

I will happily vote for anyone who has Democratic principles, and only those people.

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Response to greymouse (Reply #93)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 09:23 AM

565. Exactly, if Senator Sanders wins the nomination, he has my vote

I would never vote for a Republican.

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Response to LibDemAlways (Reply #21)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:58 PM

173. Agree.

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Response to LibDemAlways (Reply #21)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 12:29 AM

513. Same.

I will not support Third Way, corporatist DINO types.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:11 PM

23. Sound changes. Thanks.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:11 PM

24. Like it halfway

I like that the home page will no longer include posts made "in either of the two primary candidate supporters' groups." (I even actually made that suggestion at http://www.democraticunderground.com/12599720 ) - but I think removing all GD from the front page takes it a bit too far, at least at this point. There's still lots of good conversation to have about the primaries, and I think taking out the "group" posts would naturally tend to greatly diminish the most partisan by itself.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:11 PM

25. I denounced Trump in a comment of a Trump video

 

Jury voted to hide...


On Sat Mar 12, 2016, 01:04 PM an alert was sent on the following post:

Someone needs to see that for what it is
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1017&pid=338205

REASON FOR ALERT

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.

ALERTER'S COMMENTS

This is part of an orchestrated attempt to discredit Sanders.

JURY RESULTS

A randomly-selected Jury of DU members completed their review of this alert at Sat Mar 12, 2016, 01:11 PM, and voted 4-3 to HIDE IT.

Juror #1 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: What??? I do not see how this discredits Sanders.
Juror #2 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: Inappropriate post
Juror #3 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: Hide it because it looks as though the poster is claiming Bernie Sanders is insane. Which he is actually the sanest of them all.
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: OFFS. fun n serious is talking about TRUMP!!!! Whoever alerted on this is being disingenuous or is misreading this, and whoever votes to hide is too.
Juror #5 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: There are so many trolls on DU. Calling Senator Sanders a "thing" is beyond the pale. How did this one get past MIRT?
Juror #6 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: I kind of want to give the benefit of the doubt that the post it talking about Trump but it just doesn't read like that.
Juror #7 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Frivolous alert.

CONSEQUENCES OF THIS DECISION

You will no longer be able to participate in this discussion thread, and you will not be able to start a new discussion thread in this forum until 2:11 PM. This hidden post has been added to your <a href="/?com=profile&uid=182288&sub=trans">Transparency page</a>.

IMPORTANT: Hidden posts remain on your Transparency Page for 90 days. If at any time your Transparency Page contains five or more hidden posts there are additional consequences: 1) your Transparency Page will be displayed and can be read by any logged-in member 2) you will be unable to post until there are fewer than five hidden posts remaining on your Transparency Page 3) if you are a forum or group Host and/or serving on the Malicious Intruder Removal Team (MIRT), you will lose those privileges



It was a Trump hate video. I said I could not imagine 1 vote for Trump let alone many but Sanders supporters hate me and used it to silence my voice. Please look into this and reverse it.

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Response to fun n serious (Reply #25)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:26 PM

78. What would be the point of reversing it now?

It was a bogus hide - how jurors could mistake who you were talking about, I can't think - but those are the breaks. Since the 5 hide limit is cancelled, there's no point in changing it (which admin don't do anyway).

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Response to fun n serious (Reply #25)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:30 PM

89. It's because you said "he" and not "Trump"

People have been very sensitive around here. It is silly season after all.

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Response to dorkzilla (Reply #89)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:32 PM

91. I guess that makes it a valid hide....

 

HOW?

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Response to fun n serious (Reply #91)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:33 PM

97. I don't agree with the hide

Just pointing out it was hidden for the want of a proper noun is all. Relax.

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Response to dorkzilla (Reply #97)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:36 PM

107. OK. I'm not here to fight.

 

I want us together. My perfect candidate would be one a little more right than Sanders and a little more left than Hillary. I want to figure out a way Sanders can make that argument and get a position in a Clinton administration where his ideas would be hard to ignore.

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Response to fun n serious (Reply #107)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:39 PM

118. Me neither - I'm a lover, not a fighter :)

But the fact still remains that she hasn't gotten the nomination yet, so we'll have to see who ends up in whose cabinet.

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Response to dorkzilla (Reply #118)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:44 PM

129. Hear hear

 

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Response to fun n serious (Reply #129)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 09:47 PM

476. No consolation, but

I had the same thing a month ago. I put up a snarky line about how the GOP would trash whomever ended up as the Dem candidate,and had the post hidden 4-3 because I was "calling people Republicans" and it hurt their feelings.

Actually,it was the only time I have ever literally(in the literal sense of the word) laughed out loud at a post.

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Response to SCantiGOP (Reply #476)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 10:32 PM

486. There was a strategic effort to silence us

 

It's why we all left and you see us back today.... It turns people OFF of why they support their candidate.

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Response to fun n serious (Reply #107)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 04:00 PM

284. The last place I want Sanders is in a Clinton administration.

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Response to merrily (Reply #284)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 04:13 PM

301. If she is the nominee

 

His ideas would be better heard in a higher place of office. It would be good for the people.

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Response to fun n serious (Reply #301)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 04:17 PM

306. Again, the last place I would want Sanders is in a Clinton Adminstration.

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Response to merrily (Reply #306)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 05:44 PM

391. Agreed

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Response to merrily (Reply #306)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 01:14 AM

518. I'm certain Hillary Clinton shares that same sentiment with you. eom

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Response to BlueCaliDem (Reply #518)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 03:45 AM

529. She's adopted so many positions of his that one must assume she admires him greatly--

as she should.

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Response to fun n serious (Reply #91)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:33 PM

245. Because people thought you meant Sanders. nt

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Response to redgreenandblue (Reply #245)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 04:41 PM

333. Insane, diagnosed and committed..

 

On a video of Trump. The 3 words above do not describe Sanders not even to a Clinton supporter. It was a " Target hide"

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:12 PM

27. Hey, Donald Trump is great. He said so himself. Many, many times.

He also said he's smart. Said that many, many times. And you know if someone repeats something many, many times, that makes it true. That's called logic.







( Really it is. Please don't purge me.)

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Response to tclambert (Reply #27)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:06 PM

189. ...

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:12 PM

28. K&R (Skinner)

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:12 PM

29. I have more questions than answers now

This answered a few but the intended nature of this forum is still very vague to me.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:12 PM

30. Thank You So Much

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:12 PM

31. Personal attacks should always be

removed, they should never be allowed to remain be it now or in the future....... just my two cents.

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Response to UglyGreed (Reply #31)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:57 PM

172. + 1

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Response to UglyGreed (Reply #31)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:02 PM

179. "Personal attack" is overused by alerters.

Someone saying you're thinking simplistically is not a personal attack ( the gist of a recent alert where I was a juror.) Calling a troll a troll isn't either, but that one is harder for n00bs to judge and I've seen such get hidden. With no suspension penalty the latter type of hide is less of an issue.

What I find boggling is how many jurors think "difference of opinion indemnifies RW views that are CLEARLY against the TOS.

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Response to Gormy Cuss (Reply #179)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:04 PM

184. A personal attack is a personal

attack...... plain and simple. It's really not hard to determine

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Response to UglyGreed (Reply #184)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:56 PM

276. Actually, based on some alerts that I've seen it seems to be a handy excuse

for some who dislike disagreement.

It's also evident that jurors feel comfortable hiding "you're a poopy head" but uncomfortable establishing a community standard in line with the TOS.

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Response to Gormy Cuss (Reply #276)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:58 PM

280. Before this primary

I've seen many personal attacks remain, name calling without any doubt and that is what I meant by my original post in this thread.

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Response to UglyGreed (Reply #280)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 04:05 PM

291. Lots of posts stand that should've been nuked.

Racist, sexist, otherwise bigoted posts and RW nonsense have stood so long as the comment wasn't in the obvious form of a personal attack. That's what I'm talking about.

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Response to Gormy Cuss (Reply #291)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 04:09 PM

296. I believe we

are in some sort of agreement.

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Response to Gormy Cuss (Reply #179)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 07:19 PM

438. Yeah, calling someone a troll is a personal attack

Someone else may agree with it, but it's a subjective judgement about the person, not about one opinion of theirs, and it's designed to denigrate them.

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Response to muriel_volestrangler (Reply #438)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 10:35 PM

488. Calling you or me a troll is a personal attack.

Calling a n00b poster who's racking up hides disparaging DUers or Democratic pols a troll, there should be no penalty for that.

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Response to Gormy Cuss (Reply #488)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 05:24 AM

535. Yeah, that's still a personal attack

They're a person, and you're attacking them. If you think they're anti-Democrat, report them to MIRT. Your idea of who counts as a 'n00b', and who is too disparaging of DUers or Democrats in general isn't enough.

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Response to muriel_volestrangler (Reply #535)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 09:26 AM

566. Where is that 'report them to MIRT" button?

That's part of the problem. Until there's a direct way to send that signal, some posters are going to do it directly in a thread and AFAIK many such callouts either aren't challenged or left to stand by juries. IOW, jury fail under the "you take your chances" theory.

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Response to Gormy Cuss (Reply #566)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 09:43 AM

567. There's a list of MIRT in the Announcement forums

Which you surely know and have used to report suspected trolls, haven't you? I do.

Yes, some people may not be bothered to report them, but that doesn't make it OK for them just to start calling them trolls in replies. And calling them trolls doesn't get any trolls banned, either.

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Response to muriel_volestrangler (Reply #567)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 10:18 AM

570. No, I've never reported a suspected troll to a MIRT member

but to expect posters to go find out who is on MIRT and then send one of them an email is clunky and clearly ineffective, else posters wouldn't be calling out trolls in threads or asking why MIRT hasn't offed them yet.

I've never contacted a MIRT member via email. I have checked TOS violation on an alert but my understanding is that MIRT only sees that if a jury hides the post. There is nothing in the description of how MIRT works that encourages users to circumvent that process and contact a MIRTer directly (not that it's a bad thing, just that it isn't how the system is described.)

For reference:

How the MIR Team Works

If any logged-in member believes they have spotted a post by a malicious intruder, they may alert on the post as a Terms of Service violation. The post is first sent to a DU Jury who will determine if it is a violation of DU's Community Standards. If the Jury votes to hide the post, an email alert is sent to every member of the Malicious Intruder Removal Team (MIR Team), as well as the DU Administrators. (If the Jury votes to leave the post alone, an email alert is sent to the Administrators only.) If any member of the MIR Team or any Administrator then determines that the person who posted the message is indeed a malicious intruder, they may revoke the intruder's posting privileges.


The longer description of the process doesn't include contacting a MIRTer directly either.

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Response to Gormy Cuss (Reply #570)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 11:20 AM

588. If there's a specific post that breaks the rules, you can alert on it

You wanted a way to get MIRT involved not because of a post, but because of a general feeling that someone is a troll, didn't you? As an alternative to just posting to call them 'a troll'.

I have, for instance, alerted MIRT via mail when a banned person has returned (and, I think, received mail like that when on MIRT). Trying to explain why it's the same person to random jury members is hard in a short alert, and they're unlikely to know much about matching up people (and quite possibly not care).

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Response to muriel_volestrangler (Reply #588)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 11:56 AM

598. Great example of my point.

The system is not set up for this. Some posters use the work-around of directly contacting an individual MIRTer but I suspect most posters a) are unaware that this is acceptable, b) are uncomfortable reaching out to a MIRTer directly for whatever reason.

Reading the site guidelines one would never guess that direct contact was an acceptable approach. That's a defect in the system.

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Response to Gormy Cuss (Reply #598)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 12:40 PM

601. I think Skinner has said he feels a direct 'report to MIRT' button on each post would get abused

I agree with that. It would just be used by certain people as an easy form of "I want people I disagree with banned" relief. It might be worth adding something in Skinner's stuff about MIRT saying people can email them if they have specific reasons to think someone is a 'malicious intruder', yes.

But I think you've seen that your original point - that it's OK to call DUers trolls in posts if you you think they are - was wrong, yes?

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Response to muriel_volestrangler (Reply #601)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 12:54 PM

605. Actually, my original point on calling people trolls was that it's not a personal attack

worthy of a hide under the current system because of the other limitations in reporting tools.
As for not having a MIRT button, it can't be worse than the abuse of alerting already happening.


BTW, I hope that you understand that I'm arguing this point in the context of this thread, where admin has announced that they're fine tuning guidance.

I hope they do add text about notifying a MIRTer directly when there seems to be a trollish poster about. It seems more practical to make the case with links to several posts rather than hitting the TOS button and hoping the jurors see it based on one post.

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Response to UglyGreed (Reply #31)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 11:52 PM

496. Strict enforcement of that rule was one of the things that made DU2 better than DU3

IMHO.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:12 PM

32. Thanks

Some of the alerts have been so weak, it seemed like any negative thing someone said about one candidate was being alerted on.

PS. Barack Obama knows exactly what he's doing.


Peace

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:12 PM

33. Thanks for the constructive moves, Skinner. Greatly appreciated.

Especially the clean-up of the Home page.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:13 PM

34. I get the sense that I am in the minority here

in that I like both our candidates and look forward to working for either one to defeat Trump.

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Response to edhopper (Reply #34)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:49 PM

149. A Bernie supporter here who also thinks the Hillary venom is getting overwrought...

 

I simply agree with much more of what he has to say, so he has my primary vote.

That said, the entire notion of who will "get" to be President will shortly be rendered moot, unless the issues of climate change and eco-collapse are actually dealt with.

Something our political system... isn't actually equipped to deal with.

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Response to villager (Reply #149)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:52 PM

160. Very good points.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:13 PM

35. Bravo!

I especially like that you're removing GDP and candidate group threads from the home page. I had those forums/groups hidden and was often distressed to see the vitriol break through to the home page.

I appreciate your patience and fairness....and yes, fuck Trump!

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Response to Laurian (Reply #35)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:19 PM

55. ^^^This!^^^

 

"I especially like that you're removing GDP and candidate group threads from the home page."

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Response to Laurian (Reply #35)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:33 PM

95. Should have been a feature from the get go

If you're got those forums trashed/hidden, they should not show up on the main for logged in viewers.

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Response to Laurian (Reply #35)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:06 PM

191. +about a million!

It was like looking in on Free Republic! For that alone I thank the Admins.

But I am most happy to see that several of my favorite posters can no longer be alert-stalked in order to be deliberately silenced when they try to discuss issues that are important.

Those posters and their ideas are worth heeding, whichever candidate one supports. If anyone is offended, all they have to do is to put the poster on "Ignore" so that others who appreciate them can enjoy their participation.

Fingers crossed that the tone generally improves!

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Response to Laurian (Reply #35)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 06:05 PM

409. Same here. The first thing you saw on the home page were really nasty posts from

people you had on ignore and generally the same people every day. It would almost make you want to leave the site right then and there. This is much better. Ditto on Trump!

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:13 PM

36. Can you clarify "puffing up Trump", please?

I think that Donald Trump is the best thing to happen to the Democratic party in a long time - for the first time, I'm cautiously optimistic about holding the presidency - and in the past I've actively advocated that Democrats should "hold fire" on him until we're sure he has the nomination in the bag (although now that Rubio has dropped out, that's probably no longer necessary).

Can I confirm that arguing that Trump winning the Republican nomination would, in the long run, be a good thing is legitimate, and that it's only actual support for him as a presidential candidate that's beyond the pale, please?

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Response to Donald Ian Rankin (Reply #36)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:57 PM

278. We are hoping that Trump being the nominee will help speed up the process of turning Texas blue

Trump is an idiot but so was Pete Wilson when he helped turn California blue

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Response to Gothmog (Reply #278)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 04:28 PM

316. As much as I hate to say it

I think trump would win the south, including Texas.

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Response to mountain grammy (Reply #316)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 10:00 PM

479. Nobody here in my little corner of Houston can stand him.

They are all solid Cruz if they aren't supporting Bernie.

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Response to mountain grammy (Reply #316)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 10:13 PM

483. All my in laws in Texas

My ex husband, his wife, all for Trump. Houston is a bit saner. I lived there 1978 to 1984.

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Response to Donald Ian Rankin (Reply #36)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 04:56 PM

349. Was wondering the same thing.

 

If I think Clinton would lose the GE to him, will saying so get me tombstoned?

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Response to Donald Ian Rankin (Reply #36)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 10:30 AM

573. If the admins are convinced that someone is a supporter of Donald Trump...

...and wants him to be president of the United States, then we would ban that person.

The stuff you describe is not what we had in mind.

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Response to Skinner (Reply #573)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 12:46 PM

603. Great, thanks for the clarification. N.T.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:13 PM

37. Thank you

Fuck Trump.

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Response to ProudToBeBlueInRhody (Reply #37)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 09:51 PM

477. Aren't you afraid

Trump will sue you for using the F word?

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:14 PM

38. No objections to any of that.

FUCK DONALD TRUMP VERY MUCH

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:14 PM

39. Thank you!!!!!

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:15 PM

40. Sounds all good but don't mess with the jury system too much please.

The jury system is what makes this such a great democracy of a website. Don't restrict it too much.

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Response to liberalnarb (Reply #40)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:44 PM

132. the current system is the tyranny of the majority

It has made du so suck.

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Response to obamanut2012 (Reply #132)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:48 PM

146. I totally understand what you mean.

I think the short term monitoring of the jury system is a great idea. But I don't want to see any permanent changes made.

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Response to liberalnarb (Reply #146)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:34 PM

248. People really broke it

it has been so disappointing to see it abused the way it has been abused.

It is hard to have any faith in it in the future, having seen one group targeted and hunted with the jury system as the weapon. Speech was chilled - speech that totally complies with the guidelines of the site - and that is really messed up.

I never thought I'd see my fellow democrats behave that way.

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Response to jsmirman (Reply #248)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 04:46 PM

339. Self discipline is in short supply among some of us

at certain times. It seems likely that some of the worst offenders will over time no longer be serving on juries, especially the noxious game players.

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Response to obamanut2012 (Reply #132)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 05:29 PM

376. I do think that it should be harder to qualify for privileges here.

Basically, a troll with a busy keyboard can, within the space of a few days, have pretty much the same voice as a person who has been here for fifteen years. I think that's the problem, really. Jury duty, particularly, should be a thing that is earned over time. How can you judge your fellow DUers if you don't even know how to link an article, or post a pic, or if you don't even know what the culture is, here?

I've always thought that jury duty ought to kick in at six months or several hundred (at least) posts--whichever comes LAST. That way, you know that the person serving on that jury knows a little bit about the culture and the way people interact, here.

I'm not a prude, I can swear with the best of 'em on occasion, but I have NEVER in all my years here seen some of the crudeness, rudeness and really vulgar vitriol that I've seen in this current election season. It's really disgusting--and so much of it is allowed to stand.

I am hopeful these changes will help get the place correct. People who don't get the idea right now, will, soon enough, I suspect.

I go out of my way to NOT get personal, but I enjoy HIDES because I don't favor a particular candidate. That kind of reasoning is just wrong.

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Response to liberalnarb (Reply #40)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 06:50 AM

542. Agree, jury system is working.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:16 PM

42. Free at last, Free at last...

 

Hey alert stalkers...go F yourselves!

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Response to trumad (Reply #42)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:36 PM

108. ^^

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Response to trumad (Reply #42)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:39 PM

115. I don't doubt someone will alert on Skinner.

"over the top, rude and insensitive to those who disagree with toned down rhetoric".

Hahaha

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Response to trumad (Reply #42)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:43 PM

127. Way to jump back in trumad! :-)

I thought you were back anyway? If I missed your most recent exit then welcome back.

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Response to MuseRider (Reply #127)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:45 PM

134. I was..

 

And of course walking on egg shells because of alert trolls.

Glad Skinner killed them.

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Response to trumad (Reply #42)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:10 PM

199. Agree with that!

I was out so many times because of every post I made being alerted on - it never failed.

It was really silly - people pm'd me asking, wtf??. Some people desperately need to get a life.

But, no more! Woot!!!!

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Response to polly7 (Reply #199)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:29 PM

239. Totally. Thinking of cali & many other good ones and also my compadres

 

who too often have posted in fear of a 5th alert, like bmus, Segami, you, Fawke Em, pine box, et. al. (please forgive my inability to easily call up names -- I love ALL good Bernie supporters )

So glad for this!

Plus, we can always put the intolerables on ignore.

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Response to senz (Reply #239)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:32 PM

244. Right on, senz. Sooooo many alert stalkers.

I guess they can still do it, but it won't be quite as satisfying.

Glad to see cali and others will be back!!

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Response to polly7 (Reply #199)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 01:06 AM

515. Ahhh, but you're wrong Polly. You've gotta get your mind right.

It's only H supporters and people of color who are alert-stalked. They are just so victimized. And it's all due to those evil BernieBros. They claim it over and over again, so it must be true.

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Response to kath (Reply #515)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 01:31 AM

520. I saw those sad, sad claims. Nearly broke my heart.



'We're being silenced!, bring out another cross'

* me.



Cali and others are back too now though, not sure if she cares anymore - certainly the Admins did nothing to stop what we all knew was happening to her. (To have a mole inside their 'Grumble', now that since all those screenshots they've hidden all their little plans up. lol. God ....... talk about needing lives).

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Response to polly7 (Reply #520)

Fri Mar 18, 2016, 06:43 PM

631. Those poor, "set upon" children of reason...

 

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:16 PM

44. This is a step in the right direction thank you.

With that said, I want to add that people who say they are voting third party or writing a candidate name in should also be banned because the fact of the matter is that would be helping Trump. And yes, FUCK DONALD TRUMP!

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Response to William769 (Reply #44)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:17 PM

49. And I believe it goes against the current TOS, does it not? nt.

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Response to William769 (Reply #44)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:47 PM

138. I second this, Skinner

It's also against TOS, and people have been prred for it before. that needs to stop ASAP.

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Response to William769 (Reply #44)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:47 PM

268. Saying you are going to write in a candidate name is not against TOS.

Saying you are going to write in a candidate name who is not the Democratic nominee is a violation of TOS.

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Response to JonLeibowitz (Reply #268)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 04:03 PM

289. Your play on semantics is noted.

I still stand by my original statement.

No loop holes for you.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:17 PM

45. Hallelujah! Praise be! A judicious and wise decision. And, none too early, either!

 

to you Skinner, and the rest of the gang.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:17 PM

46. Fuck Trump.

Interested in seeing how the five hides aspect works. Seems possible that it will work with some of the jury changes. Could be a disaster. lol. Open mind as it's clear you always think these things through extremely well before implementing.

This is the most fun and addicting site on the web in my opinion. Thanks Skinner and crew.

Fuck Paul.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:18 PM

50. More evidence that DU is swinging to the right

 

already trying to dismiss Bernie's chance of winning.

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Response to Jenny_92808 (Reply #50)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:20 PM

58. LOL. nt

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Response to Jenny_92808 (Reply #50)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:26 PM

77. I truly cannot imagine how you got that from Skinner's OP.

Amazing.

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Response to Jenny_92808 (Reply #50)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:33 PM

96. He needs 76%

Of course, that's better than winning the lotto.

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Response to Renew Deal (Reply #96)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 04:40 PM

332. Bullsh*t

You must be counting superdelegates, ignoring the fact that if they choose to override the popular consensus the party will be torn apart. The number is more like 58% if you only look at pledged delegates, which is eminently doable in the upcoming states unless people start believing the media narrative that it's all over (which of course is why the media and Clinton supporters feel a need to push that narrative).

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Response to a2liberal (Reply #332)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 04:50 PM

343. Super Delegates count

And it doesn't matter if you don't like it.

Currently they do not need to override the popular consensus of the party.

I have a challenge for you. Tell me which states Bernie will lose and how Bernie will make up those losses?

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Response to Jenny_92808 (Reply #50)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:48 PM

148. lolz

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Response to Jenny_92808 (Reply #50)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:22 PM

221. What chance?

 

nt

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Response to Jenny_92808 (Reply #50)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 05:57 PM

402. Seriously?

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:19 PM

52. Thank you, Skinner. About time

There is still the problem, and I don't know how you can handle it, when an identical post with only the names of the candidates changed gets hidden by one jury but not by the other.

And when a DUer is targeted on one thread so that each post is hidden by the supporting of the opposing candidate, leading to a suspension of the account, at least for a few days.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:19 PM

53. Thanks.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:19 PM

54. Good. This should solve the problem for now.

Glad to get rid of the 5 hides your out.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:20 PM

56. Sounds reasonable

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:20 PM

57. You had me at PS.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:21 PM

60. Vigorous debate and hard-fought primary: good. Circular firing squad: bad. NT

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:22 PM

62. Good call to keep GDP and candidate group threads off the homepage.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:23 PM

63. it's about time

asnd do not be afraid to go further if you need to. I know you cannot outright say "the jury system was a bad idea because it allowed cranks and dirty tircktsers to game it" but the steps you have taken have helped fic that anyway.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:23 PM

64. All fine and needed, except lifting the 5 hide ban doesn't follow from encouraging hiding the worst.

 

There are disruptors here who cannot post without being total asses and the 5 hide ban is the only thing that keeps their toxic posting off the board. Hiding their post doesn't stop them, blocking them from a thread doesn't stop them, only a forced time out stops them. And that only stops them until they come back.

Otherwise, the changes look good and would make the place more civil but for giving the worst offenders freedom to offend without a time-out risk. I look forward to changes in the jury system.

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Response to morningfog (Reply #64)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:33 PM

99. I agree with you wholeheartedly about the 5 hide ban.

We'll see what happens.

Otherwise, it looks good.

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Response to morningfog (Reply #64)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:48 PM

145. Yup, I think getting rid of the 5 hides suspension swings us too far back the other way

Last edited Wed Mar 16, 2016, 05:39 PM - Edit history (1)

There are some ridiculous 5-hide-suspensions. For example I looked at Bravenak's last 3 hidden posts in full context, and they were ridiculous and nakedly partisan hides, and I say this from the perspective of a white BernieBro.

but there are some very very well justified ones too (think V...) calling everyone who doesn't agree with her a Republican troll or a misogynist, or sock puppet, and I forget what else now, but just gratuitous nastiness. I'm real sorry someone like that still hasn't been PPR'd after an endless series of well-deserved timeouts.

Edited to change the word "ban" to "suspension" for clarity

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Response to morningfog (Reply #64)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:03 PM

181. THIS - about the 5-hide timeout being lifted.

Bad idea, to give the worst offenders free rein - see my post below.

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Response to morningfog (Reply #64)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:20 PM

215. I was five hides banned because one of them came from commenting in a safe-haven group accidentally.


A second because, okay, I cussed at a guy who I believed was a true idiot ( IMO) and a third because I quoted a member with their moniker as if it's criminal to quote and 'call out' a member.. I love D.U. and have been here for many years, but I think that's weak. Oh yeah, two others were just a little too insulting to HRC followers.

Does that make me deserving 90 days no commenting? I've read far, far more insulting things since then that never got hidden..


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Response to vkkv (Reply #215)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:28 PM

234. Well, it is only 90 days time out if you run up your 5 hides within a day or two.

 

I am not familiar with your hides or posting history. There are others though who stay on time out.

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Response to morningfog (Reply #64)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 04:02 PM

288. Even a time out doesn't stop them. They just switch from toxic posts to toxic pms.

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Response to merrily (Reply #288)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 01:38 AM

521. Yes, unhinged toxic PMs.

And it gets ridiculous how some of them - even one who has openly admitted (in a PM, IIRC) that she is just *pretending* to support Hillary because she was offended by something a Bernie supporter said somewhere sometime so now she likes to stir the shit - keep getting allowed back here over and over again after multiple timeouts, dozens of taunting shit-stirring posts that barely skirt the line, and after really hateful PMs have been reported to the Admins multiple times.

some are definitely more equal than others (and then there's the one who was exposed as having multiple socks yet is still here.)

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Response to kath (Reply #521)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 03:47 AM

530. And then there's a sane poster whose threads got hundreds of recs and replies.

Go figure.

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Response to morningfog (Reply #64)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 10:55 AM

577. With regard to removing the 5-hides-and-you're-out feature...

Obviously, getting rid of the threat of suspension takes away a big incentive against bad behavior. So yes, there are going to be some anti-social people who take this as an opportunity to be even more anti-social. We know that, and that is why we qualified this change by explicitly stating we reserve the right to reverse it.

I would point out that DU3 had the jury system for a full two years before we created the five-hides-and-your-out feature, so running the jury system without the 5-hides function is not without precedent. And I would also point out that on DU2 we never had any automatic suspension function, and people thought that was ok at the time.

The reason we have decided to try this is pretty straightforward. As I said in my OP, I think that there are times when jurors are evaluating behavior and they know it is disruptive, but they cannot bring themselves to hide it because they don't want to see someone they like getting suspended from the site. There is no doubt in my mind that this effect exists, and is exacerbated by the partisanship that infects this place during primary season. Our hope -- and I admit it is only a hope -- is that getting rid of the five hides feature will tip the scales somewhat so jurors are more likely to hold THEIR FRIENDS and THEIR FELLOW PARTISANS accountable for their bad behavior.

If people are more likely to hide bad behavior, and if bad behavior gets hidden more reliably and consistently by juries, then our hope is that overall the tone of the site will seem to improve. And if people perceive that the tone is better they will improve their own tone. Now that the admins are removing jurors who vote to allow the worst behavior, in theory the juries should become less tolerant of bad behavior over time.

The bottom line is that we make no guarantees on this. If letting people back makes the site worse then we can easily put the 5-hides feature back.

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Response to Skinner (Reply #577)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 11:10 AM

583. Fair enough. I hope it works. I'll do my best to do my part.

 

WHich started by putting the most toxic returnees on Ignore.

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Response to Skinner (Reply #577)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 10:38 PM

621. With no fear of suspension, GD:P has turned into a raging crime scene. In only a matter of hours.

Posters openly bragging that they no longer have to hold back for fear of suspension, and plowing through the forum like a out-of-control driver on a busy sidewalk.

My gawd - there has to be a better way than this! Dunno what, but something!

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:23 PM

66. Thank you so much! And + eleventy billion on your P.S.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:23 PM

67. "Let's all enjoy..."

From your lips to God's ear.

Yes, yes. Trump is the enemy. Anyone who can't understand that simple fact, well, you know.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:23 PM

68. This is a solid step forward. Thanks! eom

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:24 PM

69. I suppose this means no more visible transparency pages?

 

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Response to morningfog (Reply #69)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:26 PM

227. So far, transparency pages are still visible

at least judging by one example -- Bravenak's.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=profile&uid=300456&sub=trans

and 1StrongBlackMan's

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=profile&uid=273034&sub=trans

both have their account status as Active.

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Response to morningfog (Reply #69)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 10:56 AM

578. Transparency pages will still become visible when someone has five hides. (nt)

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:24 PM

70. I will vote for whoever the Dem nominee is.

Period.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:24 PM

71. You shortened my sentence by 2 days!!!!!!

Thanks for the pardon!!!!!



Well done!!!

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:24 PM

72. Thank you, hoping beyond all hope this works. I do have one major objection ....

Under absolutely NO circumstance will I fuck Trump; I have standards.

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Response to etherealtruth (Reply #72)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:35 PM

104. .

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Response to etherealtruth (Reply #72)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:36 PM

109. LOL...

and

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:25 PM

73. Thank you. nt

 

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:25 PM

74. Fuck Donald Trump! nt

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:26 PM

75. Thanks Skinner....and what you said.........

Fuck Donald Trump.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:26 PM

76. Big thumbs up to removing GD-P and candidate groups from the home page.

Long past due. Should be removed from Greatest, as well.

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Response to onehandle (Reply #76)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 06:47 PM

428. ^^^ THIS. Of course, to remove them from Greatest, just trash them.

(I did that long ago. The Greatest page is MUCH nicer since I did that. Far more informative, also.)

The problem was that even if you trashed them, they would still appear on the home page.

I guess there was a technical reason for that. Sounds like it is technically easier to take them off the home page for everyone rather than go by the trash setting. Or maybe just what he said, they (finally) decided not to have our ugliest threads messing up the home page, period.

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Response to onehandle (Reply #76)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 10:58 AM

579. we considered doing this.

And we might still do it. Until then, my advice is to use the "trash forum/group" function to remove them from the latest and greatest pages.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:27 PM

80. Thanks for this.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:27 PM

81. Thank you, Skinner!



And you never would have been banned from the Hillary Group!

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:28 PM

83. re: Fuck Donald Trump, patience. That is what the general election campaign is for.

 

For the moment, Go, Donald, Go !!! Win this thing !!! Be the face of the real GOP.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:29 PM

84. No "Trump-humpers".

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:29 PM

85. Excellent ideas. Thanks Skinner.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:29 PM

86. I wish people could say what they need to say in a concise form.

I majored in math, reading is torture for me. I can't read through all of this but I am sure you had some points you thought were important, but I couldn't make it through. Sorry.

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Response to pdsimdars (Reply #86)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:50 PM

152. Just go down to the tl:dr part.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:30 PM

88. Thank you so much. I'm glad you are allowing the 5 hide people to post. Nt

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:31 PM

90. Thank you Skinner!

I agree with Don Coquixote as well. You do what you need to, to get this board in order. It is YOUR board, and we are your guests.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:32 PM

92. Concur. Thanks.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:33 PM

98. I can live with that

Because if Trump doesn't get the nomination then we all know he is going to go scorched earth and run as a third party.
If that happens we could have a Ficus Plant as a candidate and beat the Repukes.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:33 PM

100. Thanks Skinner...


...it's always such a delight to see such even handed common sense from the admins. 14 years I've been watching you guys herd these cats and keep us from scratching each others eyes out, and I marvel at times like this that you haven't blown the whole place up.


PS. Fuck Trump

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:34 PM

101. Looking forward to a new and improved 2016.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:35 PM

103. I appreciate your efforts. I hope that your improved jury system includes limiting how often

 

can alert both for the SoP and CS. Some posters here use the alert system to harass others.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:36 PM

105. domald Trump has to be degeated -- period

Whether it's Hillary -- probably -- or Bernie, in the event of something weird happening.

good post -- k 7 r!

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:36 PM

106. Question for Skinner - If I say Trump is to the left of Hillary on trade and regime change

do you consider that to be puffing up Trump? Because I am not puffing him up.

It's just fact.

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Response to jillan (Reply #106)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:38 PM

111. So you believe anything Trump says?

 

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Response to trumad (Reply #111)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:40 PM

122. There are other candidates that I do not trust in addition to Trump -btw my question was for Skinner

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Response to jillan (Reply #106)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:51 PM

156. It is insulting HRC by puffing up Trump

It is a textbook example of it.

And, Trump isn't to the left of hillary on a bloody thing.

NOT

ONE

THING

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Response to jillan (Reply #106)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:51 PM

158. If you say "people should vote for Trump because he's to the left of Hillary on trade",

then yes.

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Response to jillan (Reply #106)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:55 PM

168. Sounds like you are promoting Trump over HRC

 

which may just be your ill informed opinion but it still is a TOS violation regardless.

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Response to giftedgirl77 (Reply #168)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:20 PM

216. pointing out thst trump is vehemently against the tpp

while hillary sold it all over the world is factual data. it is not telling anyone how to vote, whom to vote for, or what issues to vote on. so it is not a tos violation.

when we get to the point where facts are banned, many of us will gladly be out of here.

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Response to restorefreedom (Reply #216)


Response to Post removed (Reply #224)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:27 PM

232. have a good one! my ignore list just grew by one, thanks! nt

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Response to restorefreedom (Reply #232)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:28 PM

235. Awww please no.

 

I mean it no, please whatever will I do without your wisdom.

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Response to giftedgirl77 (Reply #235)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:29 PM

237. i am sure you will be just fine. nt

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Response to giftedgirl77 (Reply #235)

Thu Mar 17, 2016, 12:15 AM

510. .

 

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Response to jillan (Reply #106)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 03:00 PM

176. Trump is not to the left of HRC on anything.

It's just fact.

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Response to jillan (Reply #106)


Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:37 PM

110. Donny Jingles is going to get so wrecked.

This is going to be a double digit landslide.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:38 PM

112. Good direction to go in. YUUUUUGELY fuck Trump!

Thanks Skinner. The only other thing that really bothers me are posters who out and out say they will vote for Trump or a third party candidate or won't vote at all if their candidate is not the nominee. Their position run counter intuitive to both the DU Mission Statement and Terms of Service. Mods should be encouraged to ban posters who espouse such a position.

In your Mission Statement it is stated:

Democratic Underground is an online community where politically liberal people can do their part to effect political and social change by:

Interacting with friendly, like-minded people;
Sharing news and information, free from the corporate media filter;
Participating in lively, thought-provoking discussions;
Helping elect more Democrats to political office at all levels of American government; and
Having fun!


In the DU Terms of Service it is stated:

Vote for Democrats.
Winning elections is important — therefore, advocating in favor of Republican nominees or in favor of third-party spoiler candidates that could split the vote and throw an election to our conservative opponents is never permitted on Democratic Underground. But that does not mean that DU members are required to always be completely supportive of Democrats. During the ups-and-downs of politics and policy-making, it is perfectly normal to have mixed feelings about the Democratic officials we worked hard to help elect. When we are not in the heat of election season, members are permitted to post strong criticism or disappointment with our Democratic elected officials, or to express ambivalence about voting for them. In Democratic primaries, members may support whomever they choose. But when general election season begins, DU members must support Democratic nominees


Thanks very much

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:38 PM

114. Thanks, Skinner. This is a breath of fresh air.

I, for one, appreciate the hard work and dedication that you and others do who provide this place.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:39 PM

116. puffing up trump? only comparing buttrying to refrain from that

however I know Donald will use that and likely point out so and so connections so if it's not said, and he comes up with the BS and we don't know about it so we can counter it. he could end up winning and I sure as f**k don't want that. He crossed said line long ago. I've only stated who I won't vote for. and thats just one person. I will continue to vote for all the others with D or Left leaning people Congress on down. and what Bernie wants is for us to change bottom up. I don't think he even imagined he'd be in the race but I think when say in DU the Hillary people started banning people they didn't agree with. That struck a nerve and Hillary had already been doing that. So healing? First think I'd think would go is for the Hillary supporters here to unban people for awhile and set up some system of having warnings before ultimately banning someone. However this brings me to something you said Skinner " And also we are not going to feature discussion threads on the DU homepage if they are posted in the General Discussion: Primaries forum, or in either of the two primary candidate supporters' groups. We are no longer interested in featuring the most divisive content on the front page of this website. " that would help behind words. Fairly sure I've been banned outright because I responded to so and so's group thinking it was general discussion. Like all the cliche'd old jokes about walking into a gay bar and not knowing it X_X although if I walked into a room of Republicans I sure wouldn't prove them right. I'd get right in for a chat. I'm trying to stave off a clinical depression brought on by not being employed since Oct 20 2008 (yeah before Obama was elected and partially brought on by a dad who said mom and i were going to hell for voting for. thus 2009 was pure hell. name calling every day of every week of every month of every year all because some marriage couselor decided he wanted to try Psychiatry and almost got legally in trouble for operating w/o a license. Summer 2009... the Psychs, my Psychs have yet to fix that problem. 7 yrs later something akin to I use people for my own needs and drop them dead when I don't need them anymore thus to dad I'm the most selfish person alive except I've got to hell and back thinking he desperately needs a dog for his health. I still think this because 2 years ago he osconded a dog wandering around (lost dog) had him for about 6 hours till neighbors went calling for him. Pip? oh LOTR Pippens okay Mary. (sp) But I say this so that people understand why I can get irate sometimes.

These are my views. You can't change them however you can prove me wrong. That may or may not make sense. ie I have views... it's up to whoever to prove me wrong.. Yes I have panic attacks. I also come from a rather conservative faith background. So somewhere between Lutheran and George Carlin , rare to get offended unless it's something faith based.

I wish Liberals the best of luck. Using any other word just won't work this year. Maybe another year but again my opinion.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:39 PM

117. But...I WANT to puff up Trump!

 

With helium. A lot of it.

And watch him float far, far away.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:40 PM

120. And not -just Trump! Don't forget Cruz!

He may be even -worse- than Trump!

It's kind of like the difference between crap and poop. Let's heave'em both to the curb!

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Response to Saviolo (Reply #120)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 02:52 PM

159. The difference between a healthy horse poo, and a sick elephant poo.

 

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Response to Saviolo (Reply #120)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 04:02 PM

287. Kaisch is also horrible on voting rights and women rights

Kaisch may be a stronger general election candidate than Trump and he is just as nasty in many ways as trump. Kaisch is just sneakier

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Response to Gothmog (Reply #287)

Wed Mar 16, 2016, 04:06 PM

293. I agree 100% on Kasich

I just don't feel like he has any chance whatsoever at the nomination at this point, with only one state under his belt.

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