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Mon Sep 25, 2017, 09:52 PM

Bernie is Beating the Demonic Duo Punch by Punch! Edit: Added Video

Last edited Mon Sep 25, 2017, 11:36 PM - Edit history (1)

The reason is because Bernie is correct about Medicare for ALL.

We need to support it because it makes sense.

Otherwise, the GOP will paint us as mushy for "not having a plan.

Edit:

"http://heavy.com/news/2017/09/bernie-debate-health-care-video-graham-cassidy-full-replay-cnn-obamacare/



83 replies, 5845 views

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Reply Bernie is Beating the Demonic Duo Punch by Punch! Edit: Added Video (Original post)
JoeOtterbein Sep 25 OP
Arazi Sep 25 #1
kstewart33 Sep 25 #2
Cuthbert Allgood Sep 25 #15
Not Ruth Sep 25 #3
Warpy Sep 25 #4
malaise Sep 25 #5
JoeOtterbein Sep 25 #6
InAbLuEsTaTe Sep 26 #53
lovemydogs Sep 25 #7
InAbLuEsTaTe Sep 26 #54
SHRED Sep 25 #8
haveahart Sep 25 #10
SHRED Sep 25 #11
Cuthbert Allgood Sep 25 #18
InAbLuEsTaTe Sep 26 #55
brooklynite Sep 26 #47
aikoaiko Sep 25 #9
womanofthehills Sep 25 #13
JoeOtterbein Sep 25 #14
aikoaiko Sep 25 #16
LongTomH Sep 25 #19
JoeOtterbein Sep 25 #17
George II Sep 25 #12
Cuthbert Allgood Sep 25 #20
sheshe2 Sep 25 #27
ehrnst Sep 26 #62
JoeOtterbein Sep 25 #21
George II Sep 25 #22
JoeOtterbein Sep 25 #23
dae Sep 25 #30
JoeOtterbein Sep 25 #31
pangaia Sep 26 #42
lapucelle Sep 26 #57
Jakes Progress Sep 26 #58
shanny Sep 26 #37
George II Sep 26 #38
shanny Sep 26 #39
George II Sep 26 #40
shanny Sep 26 #41
pangaia Sep 26 #43
shanny Sep 26 #44
pangaia Sep 26 #46
shanny Sep 26 #48
melman Sep 26 #49
Lordquinton Sep 26 #50
KPN Sep 26 #52
KPN Sep 26 #51
Voltaire2 Sep 26 #69
Jakes Progress Sep 25 #24
SHRED Sep 25 #25
JoeOtterbein Sep 25 #34
Jakes Progress Sep 26 #59
Hassin Bin Sober Sep 26 #80
Jakes Progress Sep 27 #82
karynnj Sep 25 #32
pangaia Sep 26 #45
Jakes Progress Sep 26 #60
CrispyQ Sep 26 #65
Jakes Progress Sep 26 #68
Voltaire2 Sep 26 #70
Jakes Progress Sep 26 #72
Voltaire2 Sep 26 #74
Jakes Progress Sep 27 #81
mvd Sep 25 #26
UCmeNdc Sep 25 #28
JoeOtterbein Sep 25 #29
UCmeNdc Sep 26 #36
George II Sep 25 #33
Nevernose Sep 25 #35
obamanut2012 Sep 26 #56
MrsCoffee Sep 26 #61
Voltaire2 Sep 26 #71
George II Sep 26 #73
Voltaire2 Sep 26 #75
George II Sep 26 #77
Voltaire2 Sep 26 #78
disillusioned73 Sep 26 #63
JoeOtterbein Sep 26 #66
disillusioned73 Sep 26 #67
Autumn Sep 26 #64
Demsrule86 Sep 26 #76
tecelote Sep 26 #79
Demsrule86 Oct 5 #83

Response to JoeOtterbein (Original post)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 09:55 PM

1. +1000 Eom

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Response to JoeOtterbein (Original post)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 09:55 PM

2. I thought Graham-Cassidy was the debate's topic.

Very unfortunate.

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Response to kstewart33 (Reply #2)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 10:40 PM

15. And he's making it look like a steaming turd

that they dropped on the senate floor. Or do you think Graham-Cassidy are winning this with their buffoonery?

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Response to JoeOtterbein (Original post)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 09:56 PM

3. It's happening!

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Response to JoeOtterbein (Original post)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 10:00 PM

4. He always does. He knows his stuff backwards and forwards

and no republican can ever really trip him up. All they have is bluster, bigotry, and a great deal of whining as they try to pretend this isn't all about getting donations from the Kochs and the Mercers and they don't give a flying fuck about the country and the people in it.

They will be doing a lot of heavy drinking tonight, if no alcohol, then Maalox.

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Response to Warpy (Reply #4)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 10:01 PM

5. Yep

Proof that knowledge is power

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Response to malaise (Reply #5)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 10:15 PM

6. Thanks you Malaise. From you that is truly a rec!

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Response to Warpy (Reply #4)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 03:25 AM

53. Bernie is a beast!!

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Response to JoeOtterbein (Original post)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 10:19 PM

7. Bernie is rockin' it tonight!

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Response to lovemydogs (Reply #7)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 03:26 AM

54. Like he usually does... no surprise there.

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Response to JoeOtterbein (Original post)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 10:20 PM

8. But...but...but...

What about what David Gergen said?

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Response to SHRED (Reply #8)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 10:22 PM

10. It still holds. Wait for tomorrow. Bernie is good tonight but we are dealing with not only a

 

deplorable voter base but a dumb one.

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Response to haveahart (Reply #10)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 10:27 PM

11. ??

I don't understand what you are saying.

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Response to haveahart (Reply #10)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 10:40 PM

18. NO DEM WOULD CHANGE THEIR MIND

You know that, right?

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #18)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 03:28 AM

55. Chances are zero any of them would.

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Response to SHRED (Reply #8)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 12:24 AM

47. I wager that NOBODY had their mind changed by this debate...

...because nobody who didn't already have a firm opinion bothered to watch.

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Response to JoeOtterbein (Original post)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 10:22 PM

9. Amy and Bernie are doing great!!!

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Response to aikoaiko (Reply #9)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 10:37 PM

13. Amy and Bernie are doing super great !!!!!!!!!

God, Graham is such an a**hole and a horrible speaker.

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Response to womanofthehills (Reply #13)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 10:39 PM

14. Yep! But Amy should have had more time. The D-Duo stole much time.

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Response to womanofthehills (Reply #13)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 10:40 PM

16. Cassidy made me want to slap his face through the tv.


Just vile and smarmy.

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Response to womanofthehills (Reply #13)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 10:41 PM

19. Graham keeps talking about 'the deficit,' while his party is ready to vote for a $700 billion....

..........defense bill and a big tax cut for billionaires like the Koch brothers.

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Response to aikoaiko (Reply #9)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 10:40 PM

17. Yep!

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Response to JoeOtterbein (Original post)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 10:36 PM

12. I thought the debate was about the ACA vs. the now dead trumpcare?

We had to sweat out 3 no votes to save the ACA, under today's conditions, realistically "MFA" is deader than trumpcare.

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Response to George II (Reply #12)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 10:42 PM

20. Yup. Let's give up.

Let's never try. Most people support MFA in this country, but fuck that. We're done. Turn the lights out. Nobody gives a shit anymore.

So much for the "Underground" portion of Democratic Underground. Just roll over and take it.

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #20)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 11:30 PM

27. I do not see where George said any of that.

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #20)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 08:52 AM

62. Strawman.

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Response to George II (Reply #12)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 10:44 PM

21. Now is not the time to waver. We need to make OUR demands clear now!

We have to sharpen our differences with the GOP. MFA is the perfect knife to make the point while also doing the smart/correct thing for ALL.

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Response to JoeOtterbein (Reply #21)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 10:53 PM

22. We have the ACA now, MFA won't pass until we control both houses and the presidency.

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Response to George II (Reply #22)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 10:57 PM

23. We will win control when we make it clear what we want. Healthcare for ALL.

Ring it out loud! Clear as a bell. Because it is the only morally correct position.

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Response to JoeOtterbein (Reply #23)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 11:42 PM

30. I like the way you think Joe!

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Response to dae (Reply #30)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 11:45 PM

31. I like that you like that you also think we should should think morally dae!

Thanks dae!

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Response to JoeOtterbein (Reply #31)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 12:13 AM

42. Me too. Me too!!!





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Response to JoeOtterbein (Reply #23)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 06:21 AM

57. Healthcare for all? That's universal coverage.

That's been a core Democratic party value for decades. It's in our 2016 platform.

Securing Universal Health Care
Democrats believe that health care is a right, not a privilege, and our health care system should put people before profits. Thanks to the hard work of President Obama and Democrats in Congress, we took a critically important step toward the goal of universal health care by passing the Affordable Care Act, which has covered 20 million more Americans and ensured millions more will never be denied coverage because of a pre-existing condition.

Democrats will never falter in our generations-long fight to guarantee health care as a fundamental right for every American.

http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/papers_pdf/117717.pdf

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Response to lapucelle (Reply #57)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 08:02 AM

58. But, but. I thought the Dems were all corporate stooges.

They don't go for really cool slogans and stuff. Gee. Sure they get stuff done, but it ain't fun. You know?

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Response to George II (Reply #22)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 12:05 AM

37. We have to aspire and inspire

not just play defense. That's how we win both houses and the WH and state leges and governorships

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Response to shanny (Reply #37)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 12:07 AM

38. Huh?

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Response to George II (Reply #38)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 12:08 AM

39. Duh

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Response to shanny (Reply #39)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 12:08 AM

40. Wha?

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Response to George II (Reply #40)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 12:09 AM

41. obvious innit

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Response to shanny (Reply #41)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 12:14 AM

43. obvious to me, that's for sure..

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Response to pangaia (Reply #43)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 12:18 AM

44. same here, bucko

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Response to shanny (Reply #44)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 12:20 AM

46. bucko? did you call me BUCKO?



Why you whippersnapper, you.

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Response to shanny (Reply #44)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 12:26 AM

48. oops.

thought I was responding to Somebody Else. blame old eyes and a really small screen.

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Response to shanny (Reply #41)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 12:27 AM

49. Of course

At least it should be.

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Response to shanny (Reply #41)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 12:41 AM

50. It's obvious to almost everyone

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Response to shanny (Reply #39)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 12:59 AM

52. + 11111

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Response to George II (Reply #22)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 12:57 AM

51. Oh poo.

And hush.

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Response to George II (Reply #12)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 05:02 PM

69. But I thought Sanders was going to sabotage the ACA and that this debate was going to be a disaster.

I'm starting to lose confidence in the prognostications here. They don't seem to pan out so well.

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Response to JoeOtterbein (Original post)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 11:07 PM

24. I like the idea of Medicare for over 55.

Medicare for all sounds really great, but it ain't happening. If all you want is to feel good about yourself, then MFA is the way to play it. If you want to do the work and help a couple of million people, we could use the rush of protests over ending Obamacare to push this forward. That would be a "plan". MFA is a slogan.

Before I get piled on, I would love universal health care. I think this country needs to join civilized society and get there. But with our gerrymandered districts and our donor class and our spineless republican majority in government, we aren't going to help anyone with slogans. I would push for 55 and accept 60. Give it to people like Barney Frank and All Franken and Elizabeth Warren to push through.

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Response to Jakes Progress (Reply #24)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 11:15 PM

25. I think this is way forward

Takes many costly older patients off the insurance pools.
Prices drop.

How it's financed is the tricky part.

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Response to SHRED (Reply #25)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 11:50 PM

34. If you consider that we are now paying much more than the world market pays; gives us Leverage for a

GREAT deal. No, really! It can be done. WE can make Trump, the GOP et all, a deal they cannot refuse because we have the only plan that makes sense for ALL!

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Response to JoeOtterbein (Reply #34)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 08:03 AM

59. Golly. You remind me of

me. About forty years ago.

I didn't know how things worked, but I had a lot of enthusiasm.

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Response to Jakes Progress (Reply #59)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 08:26 PM

80. not a bad idea but...

How do you propose to bring in 55 or 60 year olds?

The main strength of the proposed MFA is bringing in younger premium payers who don't utilize much health care.

Younger payers don't ( statistically) use much healthcare while for-profit private insurance siphons off all the profit during the healthy years.

Nice racket they have. Thanks for 30 years of profit now go see Medicare when you get old and sick.

Bringing in slightly younger people could be expensive and not be offset by healthy young premium payers.

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Response to Hassin Bin Sober (Reply #80)

Wed Sep 27, 2017, 03:40 PM

82. Well,

just like millennials are beginning to resent medicare for all the old dudes, the cost of insuring 55 and up would put more pressure to expand to everyone.

You don't explain how to pay for the younger people though. They may have lower costs, but not zero.

Another way to do this would be to leave the current old age limit at 65, but add under 18 as another medicare bracket. So you would have Medicare from birth to 18 and from 65 till death. Think of the benefit to parents in their peak earning years.

Hey. I'm all for universal healthcare (I am a Democrat after all), but for now MFA is just a slogan, something to shout and feel good about shouting. It is not about to happen. Some expansion of Medicare might.

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Response to Jakes Progress (Reply #24)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 11:46 PM

32. The option of allowing people over 55 to choose Medicare was floated in 2009

It was rejected because Joe Lieberman said he would not vote for a bill with that in it. It would have led to an easier more successful program -- but we needed all 60 votes.

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Response to Jakes Progress (Reply #24)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 12:18 AM

45. Somehow I don't think ER would have taken that tack. The, "it ain't happenin' one.

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Response to pangaia (Reply #45)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 08:19 AM

60. Studying history is a good thing.

Did we get universal health care in the forties? Did Jim Crow become illegal and the Civil Rights Act brought about? And didn't you like the way she rammed through laws protecting LBGT citizens? How about marriage equality?

Or don't you think she wanted all those things?

She did what could be done when it could be done. She was smart. Slogans and feel-good posters weren't good enough for her. She did the hard work and paved the way for all the progressive changes that came after - changes that she wanted then but know weren't happening at that time. Like I said; she was smart.

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Response to Jakes Progress (Reply #24)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 10:55 AM

65. I know several 55+ year olds, who are working just for health coverage. -nt

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Response to CrispyQ (Reply #65)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 02:13 PM

68. Yep.

Medicare over 55 would be a boon that would grow like the original Medicare and Social Security. It could help this country catch up to the rest of the civilized world.

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Response to Jakes Progress (Reply #24)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 05:06 PM

70. The funding for that would be a bit of a nightmare.

Unless it is a fairly rapid phase in - say five years to full coverage, this just bails out the insurance companies and saddles the tax payers with the most expensive segment of the population. It is the equivalent of letting charter schools take all the good students. The payroll tax would go up for everyone working in order to cover the new medicare population, but most of those paying would get nothing in return.

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Response to Voltaire2 (Reply #70)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 05:07 PM

72. Are you saying

that Medicare for all would be less expensive?

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Response to Jakes Progress (Reply #72)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 05:16 PM

74. In total? absolutely.

Our national expenditures on health care would go down significantly. Individual costs for average earners would go way down.

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Response to Voltaire2 (Reply #74)

Wed Sep 27, 2017, 03:24 PM

81. Got numbers?

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Response to JoeOtterbein (Original post)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 11:19 PM

26. Sure, Trump wont sign it so we do have to protect the ACA

But Medicare For All is the best way and it is gaining momentum. Democrats should support the idea for when we gain back the Presidency. It also has a solid base of support among the public despite the lies.

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Response to JoeOtterbein (Original post)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 11:32 PM

28. Is there a link to the debate?

I missed it.

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Response to UCmeNdc (Reply #28)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 11:37 PM

29. Video added on edit above. Thanks for the reminder!

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Response to JoeOtterbein (Reply #29)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 12:02 AM

36. Thanks!

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Response to JoeOtterbein (Original post)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 11:47 PM

33. Sorry, Amy carried the day.

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Response to George II (Reply #33)

Mon Sep 25, 2017, 11:54 PM

35. She was the perfect complement & vice versa

She hammered in defense of ACA and added to the aspirational MFA; Bernie hammered home the aspirational while defending the ACA.

Perfect, as far as I'm concerned. We want to keep what we've got, but to win elections we've got to push for more. This particular duo, I thought, did a masterful job balancing those needs. I'd like to see more stuff like this from them.

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Response to George II (Reply #33)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 06:08 AM

56. Yes, I am getting a bit annoyed that the woman is again being ignored

Especially the woman who is on fire and is the actual Democrat.

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Response to George II (Reply #33)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 08:39 AM

61. Yes she did.

She steered the debate and passionately defended ACA while Bernie's gamble threatens to backfire.

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Response to George II (Reply #33)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 05:07 PM

71. and the other person on our team, what's his name, how did he do?

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Response to Voltaire2 (Reply #71)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 05:13 PM

73. Look at the subject line, do you have a similar comment about that?

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Response to George II (Reply #73)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 05:17 PM

75. I'm just curious how you think what's his name did.

You know, that person who was the other half of our team?

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Response to Voltaire2 (Reply #75)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 06:17 PM

77. First, how do you think "what's her name did. you know the person that was the other half....

...of our team?"

Incidentally, why have you decided to follow me around and respond to day-old posts of mine?

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Response to George II (Reply #77)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 06:34 PM

78. She did great!

Now how about He Who Must Not Be Named?

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Response to JoeOtterbein (Original post)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 10:54 AM

63. My favorite part..

both GOP goobers said that Bernie was "the most honest man in the Senate".. and they kinda implied like that was a bad thing.. lol

Bernie took these guys to school last night.. if u didn't watch it live, u really should - just to see Grahams face every time Bernie destoyed their horrible plan w/ facts..

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Response to disillusioned73 (Reply #63)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 11:37 AM

66. And they said it like they did not know it made Bernie more honest than them! LOL!

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Response to JoeOtterbein (Reply #66)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 01:27 PM

67. Nuance is definetely not their strong suit..

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Response to JoeOtterbein (Original post)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 10:55 AM

64. K&R

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Response to JoeOtterbein (Original post)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 05:19 PM

76. Nonsense...we need to save the ACA and strengthen it. Single Payer can't pass for years.

Get the ACA up and running better, add a public option...now do one of two things...strong price controls on insurance and medical costs and we end up with a system much like Germany. I think this is what will happen...or lower the age of medicare gradually starting with 55 years olds...and we end up with Medicare for all in the end. A stand alone bill will not pass until those who have insurance at work are not the majority...years away.

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Response to Demsrule86 (Reply #76)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 07:31 PM

79. If you want $50, then ask for $75.

If you want Medicare for 55 year olds, fight for single payer and be willing to compromise.

A great start.

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Response to tecelote (Reply #79)

Thu Oct 5, 2017, 02:22 PM

83. Wrong... You ask for pieces...demanding the entire thing will get you exactly nothing.

You point out that a PO would help in those areas that don't have good coverage...if that works ...you point out that older folks taken out of the markets would strengthen the markets...the GOP will use single payer against us in the coming elections...let's be smart about this.

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