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Mon Sep 18, 2017, 09:40 PM

John Dean just told Don Lemon that experienced federal prosecutors don't

Last edited Tue Sep 19, 2017, 06:05 AM - Edit history (1)

throw the word "indictment" around lightly. He said that if they did mention "indictment" then Manafort has likely already received a target letter and if he doesn't flip he probably will be indicted.



Fixed.

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Arrow 38 replies Author Time Post
Reply John Dean just told Don Lemon that experienced federal prosecutors don't (Original post)
mobeau69 Sep 2017 OP
BigmanPigman Sep 2017 #1
mobeau69 Sep 2017 #2
PoliticAverse Sep 2017 #4
world wide wally Sep 2017 #9
PoliticAverse Sep 2017 #10
tritsofme Sep 2017 #13
Gore1FL Sep 2017 #15
pnwmom Sep 2017 #14
PoliticAverse Sep 2017 #18
sharedvalues Sep 2017 #19
PoliticAverse Sep 2017 #21
sharedvalues Sep 2017 #22
PoliticAverse Sep 2017 #24
bagelsforbreakfast Sep 2017 #28
pnwmom Sep 2017 #20
PoliticAverse Sep 2017 #23
Midnight Writer Sep 2017 #25
PoliticAverse Sep 2017 #34
unc70 Sep 2017 #6
Amaryllis Sep 2017 #8
BigmanPigman Sep 2017 #12
WinkyDink Sep 2017 #36
Hortensis Sep 2017 #35
flamingdem Sep 2017 #3
Corvo Bianco Sep 2017 #5
flamingdem Sep 2017 #7
Jakes Progress Sep 2017 #11
unc70 Sep 2017 #16
Jakes Progress Sep 2017 #38
StevieM Sep 2017 #17
BigmanPigman Sep 2017 #27
StevieM Sep 2017 #30
BigmanPigman Sep 2017 #32
StevieM Sep 2017 #33
WinkyDink Sep 2017 #37
Hekate Sep 2017 #26
bagelsforbreakfast Sep 2017 #29
StevieM Sep 2017 #31

Response to mobeau69 (Original post)

Mon Sep 18, 2017, 09:41 PM

1. Can 45 pardon him?

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Response to BigmanPigman (Reply #1)

Mon Sep 18, 2017, 09:46 PM

2. There's always that.

Normally, you'd think that would be the last straw but there doesn't seem to be any last straws for the orange a-hole.

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Response to BigmanPigman (Reply #1)

Mon Sep 18, 2017, 09:47 PM

4. For federal crimes he may have committed of course he could. n/t

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Response to PoliticAverse (Reply #4)

Mon Sep 18, 2017, 10:26 PM

9. Is treason pardonable?

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Response to world wide wally (Reply #9)

Mon Sep 18, 2017, 10:39 PM

10. A few people have actually received Presidential pardons for treason. n/t

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Response to world wide wally (Reply #9)

Mon Sep 18, 2017, 11:13 PM

13. The only real restriction on the pardon power is that it cannot interfere with impeachment.

Which is a political, not criminal process

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Response to world wide wally (Reply #9)

Mon Sep 18, 2017, 11:19 PM

15. Confederate Soldiers were pardoned. nt

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Response to PoliticAverse (Reply #4)

Mon Sep 18, 2017, 11:14 PM

14. He couldn't pardon him for a conspiracy that he himself was involved in. nt

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Response to pnwmom (Reply #14)

Mon Sep 18, 2017, 11:49 PM

18. Sure he could. n/t

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Response to PoliticAverse (Reply #18)

Mon Sep 18, 2017, 11:58 PM

19. This is legally disputed

Constitution just says "Except in cases of Impeachment".

What does that mean? Likely SCOTUS will have to interpret it.


We are in crazy times

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Response to sharedvalues (Reply #19)

Tue Sep 19, 2017, 12:22 AM

21. That clause means the President can't cancel an impeachment...

If Congress for example were impeaching a Federal Judge the President couldn't cancel the impeachment
process by issuing the judge a pardon.

What some people have a question about is whether a President could pardon themself - the Nixon administration
even got the DOJ to issue an opinion on the matter - the opinion was no he can't, you can read it here: https://www.justice.gov/sites/default/files/olc/opinions/1974/08/31/op-olc-supp-v001-p0370_0.pdf .

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Response to PoliticAverse (Reply #21)

Tue Sep 19, 2017, 12:24 AM

22. That clause means what SCOTUS interprets it to mean

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Response to sharedvalues (Reply #22)

Tue Sep 19, 2017, 12:32 AM

24. I don't think there's any reasonable doubt what that clause means in regards to impeachment. n/t

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Response to sharedvalues (Reply #19)

Tue Sep 19, 2017, 01:00 AM

28. "Likely SCOTUS will have to interpret it." We've seen how that works when...

 

when Gore lost...

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Response to PoliticAverse (Reply #18)

Tue Sep 19, 2017, 12:21 AM

20. If he did, he'd be guilty of obstruction of justice. Also, his Presidential pardon power

doesn't extend to state prosecutions. It's very likely that some of Manafort's crimes could be prosecuted as state crimes in NY, which has strong financial laws.

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Response to pnwmom (Reply #20)

Tue Sep 19, 2017, 12:29 AM

23. "If he did, he'd be guilty of obstruction of justice." - that could very well be true and would

be a reason why a President shouldn't issue a pardon to a co-conspirator. Also a co-conspirator that accepted such a pardon would lose their ability to refuse to testify by invoking their 5th amendment right and could then be forced to testify against the President which would be another good reason for a President not to issue a pardon to co-conspirator.

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Response to pnwmom (Reply #20)

Tue Sep 19, 2017, 12:36 AM

25. I agree. He would open himself to charges. Then we can speculate if Trump can "self-pardon".

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Response to pnwmom (Reply #14)

Tue Sep 19, 2017, 01:42 AM

34. In a Washington Post opinion piece yesterday law professor Lawrence Tribe included the following...

The framers suggested one solution to the prospect of such abuse. During a Virginia debate over whether to ratify the Constitution, George Mason worried that the president might “pardon crimes which were advised by himself.” James Madison replied that a president who did so could be impeached.

From: https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/the-presidential-pardon-power-is-not-absolute/2017/09/18/09d3497c-9ca5-11e7-9083-fbfddf6804c2_story.html?utm_term=.7213caa25945

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Response to BigmanPigman (Reply #1)

Mon Sep 18, 2017, 09:55 PM

6. One of the stories tonight mentioned NY indictment

Can't remember where I heard or saw that. Could have only been through DU or on CNN or MSNBC.

I believe it was in connection to the Ukraine money laundering.

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Response to unc70 (Reply #6)

Mon Sep 18, 2017, 10:23 PM

8. We know Mueller has been working closely with NY AG SChneiderman on Trump state corruption stuff

and that can't be pardoned.

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Response to Amaryllis (Reply #8)

Mon Sep 18, 2017, 10:49 PM

12. That is where I get confused, between the states' and federal government's jurisdiction.

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Response to BigmanPigman (Reply #12)

Tue Sep 19, 2017, 02:31 AM

36. Just depends on the type of crime. E.g., murder is local, but it's Federal if Civil Rights are

 

involved.

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Response to BigmanPigman (Reply #1)

Tue Sep 19, 2017, 02:18 AM

35. This isn't the point. Manafort may answer the question, what did Rump know

and when did he know it? And/or a number of other questions dangerous to Rump and all those associated with him, including potentially Pence.

To keep Rump from being able to by buy silence through pardon, Mueller's and the NY state AG's investigations have teamed up. Remember, Rump cannot pardon state charges.

They have this covered.

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Response to mobeau69 (Original post)

Mon Sep 18, 2017, 09:46 PM

3. Flip baby flip!

You really will not enjoy federal prison. Just play ball Paul!

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Response to flamingdem (Reply #3)

Mon Sep 18, 2017, 09:53 PM

5. Right now I just hope he isn't slipped Russian poison

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Response to Corvo Bianco (Reply #5)

Mon Sep 18, 2017, 10:07 PM

7. Wow, you never know

Perhaps that's why he doesn't want to flip, he's toast if he does.

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Response to mobeau69 (Original post)

Mon Sep 18, 2017, 10:48 PM

11. He won't flip.

He's waiting for his pardon. (Which he will get)

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Response to Jakes Progress (Reply #11)

Mon Sep 18, 2017, 11:21 PM

16. No pardon for State of NY indictments

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Response to unc70 (Reply #16)

Tue Sep 19, 2017, 04:41 PM

38. Then they better get NY charges

on flynn, ivanka, jr., and a dozen others.

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Response to mobeau69 (Original post)


Response to StevieM (Reply #17)

Tue Sep 19, 2017, 12:53 AM

27. Oops, sorry. I was a teacher and should know better but my tablet

auto spellchecker always leaves or creates many errors. I often find that I have to to triple check my writing (even with gmail) yet many errors still get passed over.
I looked at your post and do not see through and throw in it. Did I screw up again? It is late and I have had a very anxiety filled day with the ACA repeal efforts and calling congressmembers.

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Response to BigmanPigman (Reply #27)

Tue Sep 19, 2017, 01:14 AM

30. Actually, I screwed up. I replied to your post rather than the OP.

They are the one who misplaced the homonym.

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Response to StevieM (Reply #30)

Tue Sep 19, 2017, 01:18 AM

32. OK, I feel better. I have been screwing up so much lately.

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Response to BigmanPigman (Reply #32)

Tue Sep 19, 2017, 01:20 AM

33. We are navigating a tough society these days. Don't be too hard on yourself.

Half the country screwed up by voting for Donald Trump.

At least you are doing you part by frequenting the Democratic Underground and contributing to the liberal dialogue.

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Response to BigmanPigman (Reply #32)

Tue Sep 19, 2017, 02:33 AM

37. Not to worry! It's a sign o' the times!

 

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Response to mobeau69 (Original post)

Tue Sep 19, 2017, 12:41 AM

26. Sing like a canary, Manafort

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Response to mobeau69 (Original post)

Tue Sep 19, 2017, 01:01 AM

29. Is it just me or does Manafort dress like Gotti? n/m

 

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Response to mobeau69 (Original post)

Tue Sep 19, 2017, 01:15 AM

31. This is a good post and very informative. Unfortunately, I am not a normal human being.

I cannot help but tell you that you misplaced a homonym. You wrote "through" instead of "throw."

Just giving you a heads up.

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