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Mon Jul 17, 2017, 12:17 PM

Do you think Mueller has his tax returns?

I think if he did someone would have heard tRump's howling and leaked it.

But I do hope so.

11 replies, 1311 views

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Arrow 11 replies Author Time Post
Reply Do you think Mueller has his tax returns? (Original post)
SHRED Jul 17 OP
Shell_Seas Jul 17 #1
SHRED Jul 17 #2
Shell_Seas Jul 17 #4
Johnny2X2X Jul 17 #3
SHRED Jul 17 #5
Shell_Seas Jul 17 #6
TEB Jul 17 #7
Princess Turandot Jul 17 #8
MineralMan Jul 17 #9
pnwmom Jul 17 #10
Raven Jul 17 #11

Response to SHRED (Original post)

Mon Jul 17, 2017, 12:19 PM

1. As a special investigator can he legally obtain those from IRS w/out permission?

I would think so.

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Response to Shell_Seas (Reply #1)

Mon Jul 17, 2017, 12:21 PM

2. I didn't think of that

In other words Mueller could have them and tRump may not even know?

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Response to SHRED (Reply #2)

Mon Jul 17, 2017, 12:26 PM

4. Which may be why

he's added attorneys to his team that specialize in RICO and money laundering.

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Response to SHRED (Original post)

Mon Jul 17, 2017, 12:25 PM

3. Yes, he has them

But there are no leaks coming from Mueller's team and I don't expect that to change.

Mueller is smart, what they do have is a drop dead plan in place. Meaning that if they get fired by Trump and the investigation closed by the next guy, they probably have a dead man's switch employed. The info they have gathered will not be erased or buried.

By having no leaks, Mueller has protected himself from Trump firing him. If there were leaks it could be used as an excuse to get rid of him. It wouldn't surprise me though that if there are leaks in the near future they are Red Herrings, Mueller could leak that they are exonerating Trump so Trump allows the investigation to continue.

It doesn't take a partisan to see that the Russia story is the most weighty story for our Democracy since the Civil War. It's going to be beyond explosive, it's going to shake the foundation of our country.

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Response to Johnny2X2X (Reply #3)

Mon Jul 17, 2017, 12:27 PM

5. I realize Mueller won't leak

I was thinking more of the tRump administration leaking since that's what they like to do. Rats off the ship.

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Response to Johnny2X2X (Reply #3)

Mon Jul 17, 2017, 12:28 PM

6. Remember that there were reports of

the Obama administration leaving a heavy paper trail when they left in regards to Trump Russia?

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/03/01/us/politics/obama-trump-russia-election-hacking.html?mtrref=www.bing.com&gwh=76980D87F08E9D4EC43F6FB5331A1950&gwt=pay

I would imagine Mueller is doing much of the same.

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Response to SHRED (Original post)

Mon Jul 17, 2017, 12:32 PM

7. Yes

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Response to SHRED (Original post)

Mon Jul 17, 2017, 02:19 PM

8. The US Code allows for the release of tax returns in a Federal criminal investigation unrelated to..

tax matters, to certain 'Federal officers or employees'. They must submit an application to a judge consistent with the rules (shown below).

In the Justice Department's guidelines in this area, the example format for the application includes a request that the application and order be maintained under seal, so if Mueller has made a request, Trump likely would not know about it. Also, once a special prosecutor, Assistant US Attorney, etc. receives tax return information from the IRS, they are still bound by law as to whom they can reveal the information during the investigation efforts. The DOJ's application requires the names of each person who will need access to the information. So, if Mueller does request/receive the tax returns, his team of star attorneys are not going to commit a felony that could jeopardize the investigation and hurt - if not destroy - their careers by leaking anything about them.

Here's part of the related US Code:

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Section 6103(i): Disclosure to Federal officers or employees for administration of Federal laws not relating to tax administration
.......................

(B) Application for order:

The Attorney General, the Deputy Attorney General, the Associate Attorney General, any Assistant Attorney General, any United States attorney, any special prosecutor appointed under section 593 of title 28, United States Code, or any attorney in charge of a criminal division organized crime strike force established pursuant to section 510 of title 28, United States Code, may authorize an application to a Federal district court judge or magistrate judge for the order referred to in subparagraph (A). Upon such application, such judge or magistrate judge may grant such order if he determines on the basis of the facts submitted by the applicant tható

(i) there is reasonable cause to believe, based upon information believed to be reliable, that a specific criminal act has been committed,
(ii) there is reasonable cause to believe that the return or return information is or may be relevant to a matter relating to the commission of such act, and
(iii) the return or return information is sought exclusively for use in a Federal criminal investigation or proceeding concerning such act (or any criminal investigation or proceeding, in the case of a matter relating to a missing or exploited child), and the information sought to be disclosed cannot reasonably be obtained, under the circumstances, from another source.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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Response to SHRED (Original post)

Mon Jul 17, 2017, 02:43 PM

9. He could have. He'd have to get a federal judge to order it,

but that shouldn't be difficult, really. However, it wouldn't get leaked, I'm sure, if he has them or gets them. They might eventually be made public, but that's a far more complicated process. They could be subpoenaed by a congressional investigation, I believe, but they'd also have to be kept private.

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Response to SHRED (Original post)

Mon Jul 17, 2017, 02:49 PM

10. Yes with a judge's approval. Here's a longer answer:

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Response to SHRED (Original post)

Mon Jul 17, 2017, 02:50 PM

11. I would be amazed if he didn't. He is

keeping everything every close to his chest and it is a tribute to the professionals he has hired that there have been no leaks. If the tax returns are as bad as we think they are, Mueller may also be concerned about a constitutional crisis when the information eventually comes out. You know, any of us who lived through Watergate have to admit that as much as we deplored Richard Nixon, he left the Republic intact. I'm not so sure Trump will do the same. We are perilous waters and we have a madman at the helm.

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