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Fri Jul 7, 2017, 07:14 PM

You are Trump. You have just colluded with a hostile foreign power in the run-up to the election.

Your co-conspirators are Russian. They are the masters of propaganda, of disinformation, of deflection.

There are 3 institutions which will expose you and bring you down: 1) The intelligence community; 2) The Press; 3) The Judiciary.

You pre-emptively attack all of these pillars of American society, incessantly, for inexplicable reasons.

You already know that 35-40% of Americans are brainwashed by right wing media outlets. You can count on them to believe your assertions if those assertions are propounded and regurgitated by the great right wing propaganda machine.

That's how we got here. Trump has hand-picked the institutions to demonize in order to protect his ass from criminal and political prosecution. He has muddied the waters in order to induce everyone to question reality.

The question now is: are those pillars of American society sturdy enough to withstand a formidable attack by the Republican Party, its embedded media, the executive branch and hordes of zombified true believers?

If not, I'm afraid it's goodbye USA. Once these fascists gain a toehold, their malignancy will know no boundaries.

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Response to Mr. Ected (Original post)

Fri Jul 7, 2017, 07:37 PM

1. It isn't treason. We are not at war with Russia.

There may have been felonies involved, and certainly a case for impeachment is very plausible, but working with a foreign government to influence an election is not treason.

"Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort. No Person shall be convicted of Treason unless on the Testimony of two Witnesses to the same overt Act, or on Confession in open Court."

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Response to Voltaire2 (Reply #1)

Fri Jul 7, 2017, 07:43 PM

2. There's treason in a legal sense. There's treason in a colloquial sense.

I was referring to treason as a dictionary would define it, not the Constitution. But your point is absolutely correct. Trump will not be prosecuted for treason.

For violation of the Espionage Act of 1917...well, that's a different story.

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Response to Mr. Ected (Reply #2)

Fri Jul 7, 2017, 08:00 PM

3. It isn't clear that the president can violate any espionage acts.

Not at least while he is president. There is also the complicating factor that Trump holds the get out of jail card as long as he is president and can use it for any federal crime for any person. As Ford established, blanket pardons for crimes not yet revealed are just fine.

It is actually unlikely that anyone on the campaign team knowingly handed classified information over to Russian agents. There was no reason to do that. Each side had a shared interest in seeing Clinton defeated. Most of them had no access to classified information prior to Nov. 8 anyway.

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Response to Voltaire2 (Reply #3)

Sat Jul 8, 2017, 05:32 AM

9. He aided and abetted our adversary before the election -- that's how he got to be President. nt

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Response to pnwmom (Reply #9)

Sat Jul 8, 2017, 08:23 AM

11. Adversary has no legal meaning with respect to

treason or espionage. Or anything else for that matter. Besides you have it backwards. Russia aided the Trump campaign. As I said there was a mutual interest in defeating Clinton.

It is entirely possible that Russia acted on its own with no coordination or cooperation with the Trump campaign. It is also entirely possible that they did collude. In either case treason or espionage are far fetched

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Response to Voltaire2 (Reply #1)

Sat Jul 8, 2017, 04:04 AM

7. Modern warfare is just as likely to involve computers as fighter jets. Computers can inflict

massive amounts of damage.

If Russia's state-sponsored hackers shut down our power plants in the dead of winter, wouldn't you call that an act of war? They've already attacked our hospitals, where lives were literally at stake. Wasn't that an act of war.?

Welcome to the modern era, Voltaire.

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Response to pnwmom (Reply #7)

Sat Jul 8, 2017, 04:50 PM

13. Sure if they shutdown our power plants that would be

serious shit. But they didn't. We actually don't know if they did anything other than perhaps get some email off a server. They almost certainly conducted a social media campaign supporting Trump's election- but that isn't even a crime.

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Response to Mr. Ected (Original post)

Fri Jul 7, 2017, 10:55 PM

4. *45 can be indicted, as sitting POTUS for unlawful acts committed both prior to taking office AND

for unlawful acts committed, while serving as POTUS, which involve actions/activities outside of the scope of POTUS duties.

If all federal options fail, it will be incumbent upon NY AG to play the Little RICO card... (since NY Gov. is only one who can pardon state convictions)

Time, unfortunately, is of the essence simply because *45 has now officially agreed to partner with Russia on a review and possible revision of the entire US Gov cyber infrastructure and related security components.

Once this partnership provides access to Vlad, it will be impossible to remove *45 & KGOP from office because of the risk that Vlad will be able to crash any given cyber realm he chooses in response to any attempt to take *45 /KGOP into custody or hold accountable legally in any way.

Many remedies exist ....
very few are realistically executable at this point in time and that number only decreases as time passes.
IMO/FWIW

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Response to Mr. Ected (Original post)

Fri Jul 7, 2017, 11:02 PM

5. Brilliant synopsis Mr Ected ! You have managed to boil it all down perfectly ! Hard to

imagine it will be the press though. They covered the visit today like it was an actual bona fide leader while we were thinking WTF this guy gave secrets to the Russian diplomats not just a month or two ago and both Trump and Putin covered their asses by having no media during their talks.

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Response to Mr. Ected (Original post)

Fri Jul 7, 2017, 11:27 PM

6. Very well-articulated, Mr. Ected.

As true and concise as it could be.

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Response to Mr. Ected (Original post)

Sat Jul 8, 2017, 04:39 AM

8. re: right wing media-if some of us can sacrifice 15min. each and take note of sponsors and then post

here, then we can compile a boycott list.

It is so painful to listen for even 5 min. -- intense bully radio full of lies that are so twisted in logic, they fold back on themselves...and mixed with putrid bile.

I know I've heard ads for Home Depot and Geico on wingnut radio...but I can't remember the name of the show-- something like red-eye radio -- really nasty.

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Response to Mr. Ected (Original post)

Sat Jul 8, 2017, 07:05 AM

10. Our Founders did not write protections against a Mobster Administration.

This is why Washington spoke so forcefully against Political Parties.

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Response to Mr. Ected (Original post)

Sat Jul 8, 2017, 08:30 AM

12. Kick.

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