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Sun May 28, 2017, 02:31 PM

Lawrence O'Donnell: Difference Between Liberals and Conservatives


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Reply Lawrence O'Donnell: Difference Between Liberals and Conservatives (Original post)
iluvtennis May 2017 OP
emulatorloo May 2017 #1
FM123 May 2017 #2
Different Drummer May 2017 #3
Alice11111 May 2017 #59
jodymarie aimee May 2017 #4
athena May 2017 #17
SCantiGOP May 2017 #28
trueblue2007 May 2017 #49
jodymarie aimee May 2017 #55
J_William_Ryan May 2017 #5
Hortensis May 2017 #60
certainot May 2017 #64
Different Drummer May 2017 #6
loyalsister May 2017 #7
progressoid May 2017 #8
Iggo May 2017 #9
world wide wally May 2017 #13
Crunchy Frog May 2017 #20
progressoid May 2017 #27
paleotn May 2017 #34
argyl May 2017 #42
klook May 2017 #57
progressoid May 2017 #26
paleotn May 2017 #32
TheFrenchRazor May 2017 #35
Proud liberal 80 May 2017 #10
pangaia May 2017 #19
TheFrenchRazor May 2017 #36
irisblue May 2017 #11
ProudProgressiveNow May 2017 #12
elleng May 2017 #14
Johnny Noshoes May 2017 #39
elleng May 2017 #41
Stonepounder May 2017 #50
H2O Man May 2017 #15
mnmoderatedem May 2017 #16
Towlie May 2017 #18
eleny May 2017 #21
lastlib May 2017 #37
geretogo May 2017 #22
oberliner May 2017 #23
bhikkhu May 2017 #47
mcar May 2017 #24
William769 May 2017 #25
grantcart May 2017 #29
LostinRed May 2017 #31
grantcart May 2017 #38
LostinRed May 2017 #30
PufPuf23 May 2017 #33
Towlie May 2017 #43
PufPuf23 May 2017 #46
bhikkhu May 2017 #48
PufPuf23 May 2017 #54
Initech May 2017 #40
IronLionZion May 2017 #44
Dawson Leery May 2017 #45
Awsi Dooger May 2017 #51
mazzarro May 2017 #56
klook May 2017 #62
cstanleytech May 2017 #52
Lyricalinklines May 2017 #53
Cha May 2017 #58
Soxfan58 May 2017 #61
onlyadream May 2017 #63
Morrakiu May 2017 #65
DuaneBidoux May 2017 #66
Gidney N Cloyd May 2017 #67
Dorn May 2017 #69
DuaneBidoux May 2017 #70
Dorn May 2017 #68

Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Sun May 28, 2017, 02:37 PM

1. Rec for the Greatest page and bookmarking.

Thank you for posting.

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Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Sun May 28, 2017, 02:38 PM

2. I am praying he gets to stay!

I sure hope they renew his contract by next Sunday when it expires.

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Response to FM123 (Reply #2)

Sun May 28, 2017, 02:40 PM

3. You and me both! n/t

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Response to FM123 (Reply #2)

Mon May 29, 2017, 04:45 AM

59. Fire him,good ratings and knows his stuff...geez,if they took OReilly...drips w pretentious hate

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Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Sun May 28, 2017, 02:43 PM

4. I adore this man

 

simply adore.

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Response to jodymarie aimee (Reply #4)

Sun May 28, 2017, 04:16 PM

17. I do, too.

I have, ever since I saw him on the McLaughlin Show over a decade ago. He has always been a true liberal with a clear and consistent message.

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Response to jodymarie aimee (Reply #4)

Sun May 28, 2017, 05:02 PM

28. I like him too

But this is close to plagiarism from a statement by FDR.

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Response to jodymarie aimee (Reply #4)

Sun May 28, 2017, 09:19 PM

49. I love him too and he is sooooooooooooooooo good looking !!!!

He has a "strong jaw"

lol, sigh.

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Response to trueblue2007 (Reply #49)

Mon May 29, 2017, 03:35 AM

55. he is 67 years young

 

google his ex Kathryn Harrold...gorgeous movie star.

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Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Sun May 28, 2017, 02:44 PM

5. And liberals continue to defend

the right to privacy, the right to vote, clean water, clean air, Social Security, and Medicare from reckless, irresponsible, and unwarranted attacks by conservatives.

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Response to J_William_Ryan (Reply #5)

Mon May 29, 2017, 04:54 AM

60. Right. Liberal founding fathers enshrined the concept of equality

in our government -- against the opposition of most conservatives.

Liberals created government of, by and for the people -- against the opposition of most conservatives.

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Response to J_William_Ryan (Reply #5)

Mon May 29, 2017, 07:34 AM

64. but liberals have been losing the last 30 years because they have been

ignoring the right's best weapon.

reagan killed the fairness doctrine in 87, they bought up 1000 of the loudest radio stations on the planet, put limbaugh on most of them for free and since then they have all been selling the same lies - free market trickle down, deregulating media (or anything) lowers cost, environmental regulation increases cost, brown people are voting illegally so we need voter ID/suppression, electronic voting makes it safer, single payer doesnt work, corporations are people, unions put as much money in politics as corporations, liberal media, and liberals/dems are whores, liars and their ideas are treasonous.

and a 95% monopoly means americans much prefer limbaugh/hannity/savage ignorance lies and hate to liberal radio.....

to 50 mil a week for 30 years

and liberals just walked by listening to music

talk radio is the only major medium with NO political counterpart that's easy and free in 40 states with 80 senators, and the rcons are now one state legislature away from being able to call for a constitutional convention

democrats have been getting their ass kicked for no reason except they ignore talk radio

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Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Sun May 28, 2017, 02:44 PM

6. K&R for greatest exposure! n/t

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Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Sun May 28, 2017, 02:45 PM

7. The first on the list is a testament to how far the GOP has fallen

Liberal republican women led the charge in the suffrage movement.

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Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Sun May 28, 2017, 03:01 PM

8. Ya but...Lincoln freed the slaves and he was a Republican!!111!!

Nya nya nya, ya liberal snowflakes.

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Response to progressoid (Reply #8)

Sun May 28, 2017, 03:16 PM

9. That's 'cause Lincoln was a liberal.

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Response to progressoid (Reply #8)

Sun May 28, 2017, 04:03 PM

13. That was the last good thing Republicans did

It was only 150 years ago

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Response to world wide wally (Reply #13)

Sun May 28, 2017, 04:23 PM

20. Teddy Roosevelt did alot of good things,

and Nixon established the EPA.

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Response to Crunchy Frog (Reply #20)

Sun May 28, 2017, 04:58 PM

27. Those guys wouldn't make it in today's GOP.

Hell, they think Ike is a boarder-line Socialist.

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Response to Crunchy Frog (Reply #20)

Sun May 28, 2017, 05:32 PM

34. Nixon also saddled white anger in the south...

over civil rights and rode that pony to victory in '68 and '72. Maybe not the epitome of evil like Elf Sessions, but I wouldn't call tricky progressive by any definition of the word. He did propose the EPA, but vetoed the Clean Water Act. Thankfully, the House and Senate voted to override Nixon's veto.

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Response to Crunchy Frog (Reply #20)

Sun May 28, 2017, 06:17 PM

42. Nixon hardly established the EPA.

The Clean Air Act was established in 1963 and strengthened in 1965 by the first pollution limits on automobiles, the Solid Waste Disposal Act was passed in 1965 and the Clean Water Restoration Act was passed in 1966.
And in 1967 the Secretary of Health Education and Welfare, John Gardner, commissioned a Task Force on Environmental Health and Related Problems. It went to Congress with 34 recommendations, the last ten calling for NEPA.
In 1969 when Nixon assumed office the nation would be shocked by two environmental catastrophes, the oil well blowouts off the coast of Santa Barbara and the Cuyahoga River catching fire off Cleveland. The people were demanding laws protecting the environment.
The bill was hashed out in Congress and Nixon signed it Jan.1st, 1970.
The Johnson administration also signed into law the Wilderness Act and the Wild and Scenic Rivers Act.

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Response to argyl (Reply #42)

Mon May 29, 2017, 03:46 AM

57. Thank you for the reminder. (nt)

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Response to world wide wally (Reply #13)

Sun May 28, 2017, 04:56 PM

26. I find it hilarious that they have to go back that far to find someone compassionate in their party.

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Response to progressoid (Reply #8)

Sun May 28, 2017, 05:19 PM

32. that would be the Radical Republicans

....They eliminated their liberal wing by the time Hayes became president. There wasn't another significant reformer from the Republican ranks until TR. And after that.....virtually none. Now northern Republicans did help end the filibuster over the '65 civil rights act. But then there was that whole southern strategy bit in '68 and '72. It seems every time you the Republicans try to do something decent, they immediately lapse back into reactionary asshole mode. It's written in their DNA.

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Response to progressoid (Reply #8)

Sun May 28, 2017, 05:47 PM

35. republicans were the socially liberal party at that time, so O'Donnel is correct here. nt

 

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Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Sun May 28, 2017, 03:36 PM

10. Some conservative idiot

Will chime in to that tweet and say that democrats were the party of slavery, Jim Crow, and the KKK while Republicans freed the slaves and voting rights and blah blah blah, deliberately confusing political ideology with political party.

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Response to Proud liberal 80 (Reply #10)

Sun May 28, 2017, 04:18 PM

19. So we tell them it is not about parties. parties switch..... It is about liberal vs right wingers...

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Response to pangaia (Reply #19)

Sun May 28, 2017, 05:48 PM

36. precisely; the important thing is about lib vs. consrv ideology, not party labels. nt

 

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Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Sun May 28, 2017, 03:50 PM

11. Got that right.props @ Lawrence

I forgot.
MFer

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Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Sun May 28, 2017, 03:59 PM

12. K&R nt

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Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Sun May 28, 2017, 04:12 PM

14. Great one!

Did he write this for The West Wing, dialogue/speech by President Josiah Bartlett or Candidate Matt Santos?

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Response to elleng (Reply #14)

Sun May 28, 2017, 05:57 PM

39. Matt Santos

It was Santos' reply to something GOP candidate Arnie Vinick said during their free form debate.

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Response to Johnny Noshoes (Reply #39)

Sun May 28, 2017, 06:01 PM

41. Right. That was a GREAT debate.

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Response to Johnny Noshoes (Reply #39)

Sun May 28, 2017, 10:52 PM

50. I knew that I had heard that quote before.

I Googled it and sure enough it was from the West Wing. And then I looked up the episode and found out that it was written by O'Donnell. He is a national treasure and wherever he lands I will find him and listen to him!

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Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Sun May 28, 2017, 04:14 PM

15. Way recommended.

Way, way, way recommended, in fact.

He's my favorite journalist.

Thank you for this.

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Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Sun May 28, 2017, 04:14 PM

16. I've often measured the difference as to what pisses the party members off, respectively

I mean what get the respective bases downright infuriated.

Liberals get pissed off over thing like unnecessary wars being started and innocents being killed and soldiers coming home in coffins to the benefit of the oil elite.

Conservatives get pissed off over the prospect of their taxes going up. They could care lees over the war thing, as long as they don't have to fight it.

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Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Sun May 28, 2017, 04:17 PM

18. He forgot one: Liberals founded America.

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Response to Towlie (Reply #18)

Sun May 28, 2017, 04:27 PM

21. Now there's a button I'd wear on my jacket!

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Response to Towlie (Reply #18)

Sun May 28, 2017, 05:50 PM

37. The Declaration of Independence is the "birth certificate" of liberalism.

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security."

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Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Sun May 28, 2017, 04:35 PM

22. The GOP is nothing but a death cult masquerading as Christian patriots and defenders of freedom .

These are the hypocrites Jesus spoke of 2000 years ago . They make me sick .

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Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Sun May 28, 2017, 04:42 PM

23. Liberals got women the right to vote?

 

I don't know about that.

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Response to oberliner (Reply #23)

Sun May 28, 2017, 07:45 PM

47. The National American Woman Suffrage Movement got women the right to vote

...or at least deserves the majority of the credit. It was not by any stretch a conservative organization, though, as a single-issue campaign they didn't promote a broader liberal agenda. Even so, it was a fundamentally liberal goal, and the writing and work they did went on to directly inspire the civil rights movement and liberal feminism.

Its fair to say that liberals got women the right to vote.

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Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Sun May 28, 2017, 04:50 PM

24. Amen!

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Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Sun May 28, 2017, 04:52 PM

25. kick & recommended.

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Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Sun May 28, 2017, 05:04 PM

29. Love O'Donnell but he is incorrect about the civil rights bill of 1964

It was passed by a higher percentage of Republican Congressman and Senators than Democratic ones.

The filibuster in the Senate was broken by Dirksen.

Obviously things changed after 1968.

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Response to grantcart (Reply #29)

Sun May 28, 2017, 05:18 PM

31. He said liberal not dem

Agree Democratic Party switched in the sixties

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Response to LostinRed (Reply #31)

Sun May 28, 2017, 05:56 PM

38. it's misleading and still not accurate.

This wasn't an ideological vote but a geographic one. Conservatives and liberals in the north supported it at roughly the same rate (85-95%). Only 1 Southerner (Yarborough) did. Liberals like Fulbright voted against it. A lot of Northern conservatives voted for it.

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Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Sun May 28, 2017, 05:17 PM

30. Memorizing this

Excellent rebuttal

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Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Sun May 28, 2017, 05:24 PM

33. Liberals are egalitarian and conservatives are not egalitarian is

the basis of a useful rule.


egalitarian

[iˌɡaləˈterēən]

ADJECTIVE

of, relating to, or believing in the principle that all people are equal and deserve equal rights and opportunities:
"a fairer, more egalitarian society"

NOUN

a person who advocates or supports egalitarian principles.

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Response to PufPuf23 (Reply #33)

Sun May 28, 2017, 06:55 PM

43. Ironically, that's pretty-much the intro to the Gettysburg Address.

"Four score and seven years ago our fathers brought forth on this continent, a new nation, conceived in Liberty, and dedicated to ... egalitarianism!"

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Response to Towlie (Reply #43)

Sun May 28, 2017, 07:43 PM

46. Cool. I did not know that or perhaps

long ago the Gettysburg Address oozed into my brain in school.

Egalitarianism as a rule to categorize is a simple and relatively straightforward judgement, albeit black and white.

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Response to PufPuf23 (Reply #33)

Sun May 28, 2017, 07:52 PM

48. Liberals believe that people are basically good

and that personal freedom, equality and opportunity lead naturally to a healthy and prosperous nation.

Conservatives believe that people are basically bad, dishonest and lazy, and all sorts of measures of control, coercion and hierarchies of power (essentially structural inequality of limited rights) are necessary to prevent a disordered societal collapse.

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Response to bhikkhu (Reply #48)

Sun May 28, 2017, 11:49 PM

54. I agree your take on basic differences between liberals and conservatives.

Best to you.

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Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Sun May 28, 2017, 06:01 PM

40. Amen!!!!!!

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Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Sun May 28, 2017, 06:57 PM

44. I don't know that we've ever had as big a difference between the parties

as we do now. Anyone who claims both parties are the same, no point voting, etc. is definitely trying to discourage us to help the Republicans.

Our worst Democrats are usually better than their best Republicans.

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Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Sun May 28, 2017, 07:15 PM

45. Conservatives supported slavery

Conservatives supported apartheid
Conservatives supported overthrowing democratically elected governments
Conservatives opposed dealing with Nazi Germany
Conservatives opposed seat belts
Conservatives opposed civil rights

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Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Sun May 28, 2017, 11:06 PM

51. Yeah, but you have to attack the word conservative instead of defending the word liberal

Otherwise we're constantly on the defensive. It's been that way for decades and it's incomparably pathetic. That's what the right savors and more often than not they succeed. Even a basic dig like saying Democrat instead of Democratic gets under our skin.

I take the offensive on political sites of sports forums. Those forums are overwhelmingly far right and flooded with Trump supporters. I call them SAM or Simplistic Angry Males. They can't stand it. Really can't stand it. But the one they react to most is when I write that the new first rule of politics is...Never Prevent a Conservative from Sounding Like a Conservative. Whenever there's a moronic post from a righty I'll drop in those 9 words. They react as a block. I'm not saying it's great but apparently they are so unfamiliar with conservatism being mocked that they become unhinged and don't know how to react, other than slobbering words that normally prompt me to paste the 9 words again.

Wonderful fun.

I have no idea why we've never run a major campaign defining conservatism for what it really is, and how it has performed over the decades. That's supposed to be the idea...attack the perceived strength and when that crumbles the remainder is cupcakes.

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Response to Awsi Dooger (Reply #51)

Mon May 29, 2017, 03:37 AM

56. Ditto! +100% n/t

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Response to Awsi Dooger (Reply #51)

Mon May 29, 2017, 07:08 AM

62. Good post - call out conservatism

for the hodgepodge of simplistic, selfish, cruel hypocrisies that it is.

Would make a good OP.

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Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Sun May 28, 2017, 11:35 PM

52. Also liberals like to think for themselves.

Conservatives would rather be told what to think because the thought of trying to do it on their own scares the shit out of them.

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Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Sun May 28, 2017, 11:46 PM

53. EVERY. F*CKING. DAY!!! YES! eom

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Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Mon May 29, 2017, 03:51 AM

58. Mahalo, iluvtennis, for LO'D's the Difference between Liberals and Cons

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Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Mon May 29, 2017, 06:12 AM

61. I believe

Part of that was in the season 7 debate ep. of The West Wing. Which I believe Mr O'Donnell was a writer on.

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Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Mon May 29, 2017, 07:30 AM

63. Saving image so I can dump it on every poster on FB who calls me a libtard. Nt

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Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Mon May 29, 2017, 09:25 AM

65. Yes

 

Love

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Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Mon May 29, 2017, 10:11 AM

66. The principle is much simpler:

I once heard a sermon at my Unitarian church where the pastor said that "the fundamental difference between a conservative and a liberal is that conservatives always try to make the circle bigger and liberals always try to make it smaller."

Everything else is nothing but an inevitable manifestation of these philosophies on the part of both groups.

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Response to DuaneBidoux (Reply #66)

Mon May 29, 2017, 11:04 AM

67. I don't get it. What's the "circle?"

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Response to DuaneBidoux (Reply #66)

Mon May 29, 2017, 12:18 PM

69. Did you get that backward? I think liberals want to include more people, conservatives the reverse

So if the circle is a happy fulfilled lived conservative don't / didn't want women or minorities to vote, they don't want gays to marry, they don't want the poor to have health care, they don't want teachers to have unions. I see myself wanting more people inside the circle and fewer outside, my conservative relatives want the reverse.

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Response to DuaneBidoux (Reply #66)

Wed May 31, 2017, 11:32 AM

70. Actually gothe that backwards...

Conservatives make the circle smaller liberals make it bigger

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Response to iluvtennis (Original post)

Mon May 29, 2017, 12:13 PM

68. One of the many horrid things Reagon did was to 1984 the word liberal

Thank you Lawrence, your message is well written.

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