Physicians have lost their minds

[Drahthaardogs]

I dislocated a shoulder today. The pain is excruciating. Dr. sent me home with Tylenol and celebrex because " We just don't prescribe opiates any more".

WTF?

[Eliot Rosewater]

1. This is the future and if we have a future, which is doubtful, this is frightening.

Pain is debilitating and can kill.


Because we treat drugs stupidly in the first place with a puritanical attitude, this is inevitable when we have issues, we dont respond like adults.

[TheBlackAdder]

71. Unfortunately, overprescription caused an opioid epidemic--those intentionally injure themselves.

.

.

[okieinpain]

80. +1 n/t

[okieinpain]

81. i just finished this video and john oliver needs to

be a weekly psa. great video, what happened to the journalist in this country.

[triron]

2. Get a new doctor.

[Drahthaardogs]

4. It was ER.

Have you ever dislocated a joint? The pain is breathtaking. I have no words.

[triron]

10. no but I believe it! I have injured ribs falling while jogging on a trail--

does not feel very good!
Can you get in to see your regular doc soon?

[Drahthaardogs]

17. Hopefully tomorrow

Gonna be a long night.

[woodsprite]

19. OMG! I can't imagine. I just recovered from a broken and dislocated shoulder

So I know exactly what you're going through. Actually, I recovered 3x from it over the past 1.5 yrs. First was the initial injury, then a manipulation under anesthetic because it wasn't healing properly (sent me back to square 1 PT/use-wise). They finally did an MRI because my strength wasn't coming back and ROM wasn't there. They found that I had a major tear in my rotator cuff, so they had to go in to fix that and put a few pins in.

I was on some form of pain meds (mainly varying doses of Oxycontin and Tramadol) for almost a full year. Not full doses after the first 3 weeks or so, but before bed I'd take 1/2 pill (2.5mg) and before PT 3x wk I'd take 1/2 to one full pill depending on where I was in the therapy protocol. When I first came home from the ER, I had a note that I could take 2-3 oxy, plus some kind of booster (an antihistamine - which made me feel awful), plus Tramadol for breakthrough pain.

I'm so sorry. I'd definitely get to a dr. that took your pain seriously. There is no way that OTC pills can handle that pain. A year before my shoulder injury, I had fallen and cracked a few ribs. Being stoic and not hurting too bad right after the accident, I turned down the pain meds thinking I'd feel better the next day. The ER doc told me to take a couple times the regular Motrin at a time, alternating doses with the same amount of Tylenol. I got through it, but I swore then that I would take the pain meds if they ever offered them again - even if I didn't actually take them, at least I'd have them if needed.

Love my dog, but she was the cause of both of those ER visits

[csziggy]

33. After every surgery the doctors prescribed opiods to me

And when my husband had surgery, they gave him some, too. Both of us are pretty stoic about pain so we always have left overs. Those pills live in the freezer.

They came in handy the second time I folded over a torn meniscus and let me get the pain under control until I could get to my doctor. He gave me a new prescription to use until the knee surgeon could get me into his office, so the two pills I had used were augmented. They also let me stay out of the emergency room the night my husband left the seat up on the toilet and I wrenched my back when I fell into the bowl -

Oh, and I feel for you about your shoulder - been there, done that, have the scar to prove it!

[unblock]

22. yes, emergency room physicians are very paranoid about people chasing opiates

whether by faking an injury, milking a minor injury, or actually deliberately injuring yourself, people apparently do such things and then go to the e.r. hoping for a few opiates.

i guess the idea is that they don't know your history like your regular doc might so they might.

so out of paranoia they just assume everyone's an addict.


when i was got my emt training i did 10 hours in the e.r. among other things, i watched them set a teenager's broken arm. they game him absolutely nothing for the pain, only versed, which blocks transfer of short-term memories to long-term.

i.e., they made him scream his poor little head off while they repeatedly manipulated his broken arm, but he didn't remember anything 10 minutes later, so, hey, no problem, right?

[itcfish]

67. That Sounds

like a horror movie. Geez, that is inhumane

[Mariana]

68. I wonder what they would do with me.

I can't have Versed, I'm allergic.

[unblock]

77. probably give you a rolled-up towel to bite down on....

[RedWedge]

3. Some have, some haven't. It depends on a lot of things.

The ER you present at, whether it's your usual doc or not, their internal biases, your gender, your race, your class, etc.

[Cattledog]

5. That's crazy...you prescribe based on the injury.

Pain is a real symptom and opiates are often necessary. If you have no history of abuse you should get the proper pain meds to
help you. Was this your Doc?

[Drahthaardogs]

8. No, ER.

I am white and have no drug history. I don't even drink. The extent of my drug use was testosterone and dbol in the eighties when it was legal.

[Cattledog]

16. If the pain is unbearable I would go to your Doc

or see a specialist. My spine doc gave me hydrocodone for sciatica. I only use it as a last resort.

[former9thward]

6. They haven't lost their minds.

They don't want to be sued by a lawyer for over prescribing drugs and turning a patient into an addict. There is a price to be paid for allowing personal injury lawyers to run wild.

[Warpy]

24. No, this is Pete Sessions using the DEA to crack down on people he doesn't like

It has nothing to do with lawsuits.

The risk of addiction from short term opiate use for acute pain is tiny.

This is the DEA leaning on doctors to leave their patients in pain because drug hysteria.

[former9thward]

35. The cheer leading for the personal injury crowd goes on.

I read article after article in the media about opiate abuse and addiction. Those articles don't come from the DEA.

[kcr]

38. Not all of us can be born in the invincible crowd like you n/t

[sharedvalues]

52. GOP talking point. Personal injury lawyers defend against corporate overreach

A big share of our opiate problems are due to Purdue Pharma who developed Oxycontin.
Purdue saw the marketing opportunity in an opiate that lasts 12 hours since morphine and others last only 6-8. So they marketed it as a 12 hour drug even though Oxycontin really lasts 6-8 too. Purdue persuaded docs to prescribe larger doses, not more frequent doses, which leads patients to swing from stupor to pain and back.

THAT helps get people addicted.


LA Times investigative piece: http://www.latimes.com/projects/oxycontin-part1/

And guess what-- the owners of Purdue, the Sacklers, recently shot up to become one of the top 20 richest families in America, net worth $14B.

Lawyers act as a check on corporate bad behavior like this.

[LanternWaste]

58. I pretend mere disagreement with my opinions is simple "cheer-leading" as well...

I pretend mere disagreement with my opinions is simple "cheer-leading" as well, hopefully getting others to forget I've failed to support my original allegation with any objective evidence.

[unblock]

25. that's quite unlikely in the case of e.r. treatment. you'd only prescribe a day or two's worth.

and tell them to see their regular doc or a specialist. hard to get addicted on such a little supply.

now, accident while under the influence, or overdose (especially if combined with alcohol and/or other drugs), that's another story.

[kcr]

37. Right wing talking-point hogwash

And any doctor who does think this is true is just prioritizing their right wing beliefs in myths over the pain of their patients, and has no business being a doctor. It's far more likely they're buying another brand of bullshit based on hysteria caused by the war on drugs.

[jberryhill]

56. Can you identify a suit of this type?

I've never heard of a doctor being sued for that. Could you provide some examples?

[former9thward]

65. Sure, but not to your satisfaction.

Patients take legal action after being damaged by over-prescription of drugs

http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-families/health-news/doctors-sued-for-creating-valium-addicts-6282542.html

West Virginia allows painkiller addicts to sue prescribing doctors

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/west-virginia-allows-painkiller-addicts-to-sue-doctors-who-got-them-hooked/

Parkinson's Patient Wins Lawsuit Over Gay Sex Addiction


http://abcnews.go.com/Health/parkinsons-disease-patient-wins-lawsuit-gay-sex-addiction/story?id=17839255

If a doctor overprescribed addictive pain killers, can the patient sue for addiction? A doctor may be liable in a malpractice lawsuit, if negligence can be proven.

http://www.alllaw.com/articles/nolo/medical-malpractice/doctors-liability-pain-medication-addiction.html

Narcotic addicts can sue doctors and pharmacies for "enabling" them


http://skepticalscalpel.blogspot.com/2015/06/narcotic-addicts-can-sue-doctors-and.html

I know. They are all made up stories and right wing sites. I will save you the trouble.

[Cicada]

92. Price of letting lawyers run wild? Very low.

A lot of states have changed their laws limiting medical malpractice awards. The cost of health care has not fallen by a detectable amount. On the other hand an 8 day prescription has something like a twenty percent chance of the patient becoming addicted, with all its problems. Pain is a pain. But so is the alleviation of pain. Maybe the doctor did what he rationally thinks is the best thing for his patient.

[Whiskeytide]

99. That is a shameless right wing talking point.

The "Stella Awards" and other such absurd "outrageous lawsuit" memes are fake. http://www.snopes.com/legal/lawsuits.asp. And note that even the list of real outrageous lawsuits collected by Snopes in it's article all resulted in dismissals of the silly claims. That is overwhelmingly the rule.

While you can always find anecdotal examples of abuse of the legal system, it has and hopefully will remain one of the most valuable tools of a free society. There is a very good reason the republicans support draconian tort reform measures - because corporate interests loathe lawyers and the ability of lawsuits (and damage awards) to restrict corporate conduct. It's also no mystery why authoritarian regimes often act to cripple or abolish the legal profession as one of the first items of business after assuming power.

And the citations you provide in your post below only reaffirm what I'm saying. All of those legislative Acts and precedents - in one way or another - require the plaintiff to prove that the physician acted negligently and outside the scope of reasonable medical practice. In other words, you don't just recover a bag of money because you become addicted to opiates under your doctor's care. You have to PROVE the doctor prescribed the medicine to you improperly. That's a pretty tough - and fair - standard.

Frankly, what I'm seeing in my practice is that pharmaceutical companies are paying physicians truckloads of money and other benefits to Rx their drugs. So what would you prefer? Laws against negligently prescribing pain meds that may sometimes result in an occasional bullshit lawsuit, or the absence of such laws enabling your physician to Rx you a highly addictive Fentanyl nasal spray 100 times more potent than heroine because the mfr pays him/her $20,000 a month in "speaking" fees.

[TheFrenchRazor]

105. or for allowing the "war on drugs" to run wild. nt

[superpatriotman]

7. Get some red vein Kratom

That's good for pain, allegedly.

[BigDemVoter]

9. Interesting point.

I've been an RN for many years. Back around 2000 or so, we (nursing) were informed that "Pain is what the patient experiences and describes." In other words, "Pain is what the patient says it is." It was treated as the "5th vital sign."

After all these years of vastly increasing numbers of addicted patients, physicians are looking at this differently. Physicians are looking at "multi-modal analgesia" which means using different types of medication to obtain pain relief. For instance, they don't want to rely ONLY on opiates. They usually mix in tylenol (IV tylenol sometimes) or non-steroidal anti-inflammatory meds.

In any case, your physician sounds like a total dick. One shouldn't hold the heavier drugs just because of fear patient may get addicted. With some oversight in a case like this, it would be appropriate to give you something stronger!

[Drahthaardogs]

12. Have you seen the studies on knee arthritis and tylenol?

Bottom line, it basically does nothing yet Dr.s still push it. Hell, bring back Tylenol with codeine. It works.

[csziggy]

34. Before I got my knees replaced opiods did nothing for the bone on bone pain

Piroxicam, the generic name for Feldene, reduced the inflammation and made me able to function much better than anything else. My husband uses a similar drug, meloxicam (brand name Mobic), to handle his joint pain.

Neither of us like the effects of opiods and don't find that they do much to control our pain. For me, they just make me so dopey I don't care about pain or anything.

[pnwmom]

47. That is exactly the reason I avoid opioids.

They make me feel dopey and disconnected but I'm still aware of the pain. What good is that?

[k8conant]

51. I had that reaction to Demerol years ago...

and don't even get me started about Versed and scopolamine.

Codeine always made me hyper. Novocaine would fry my brain if I ever consented to it any more.

[csziggy]

63. I call them my "stupid pills" since they make me so dopey

They really don't do me any good and the side effects are seriously unpleasant.

[Mariana]

89. People have different reactions.

Some people don't get that dopey feeling and function very well on them.

[anneboleyn]

95. Good for you guys but other people need them for chronic pain. I can't stand the indifference to

chronic severe pain and the people who need opioids(see right wing new war on drugs). You guys didn't need them and/or other things worked for you. Other people absolutely need them and if their pain is left untreated or undertreated which is often the case nowadays it is a death sentence -- an absolute living hell.

[csziggy]

97. I do understand the need for pain treatment

But some people can be helped by alternatives to opioids. While in rehab for my knee replacements I had to argue with the doctors and nurses to give me the piroxicam instead of the opioids. Even the medical professionals at that time were pushing them rather than what I knew worked for me.

My husband and I are lucky in that we don't need opioids to control pain for most of our problems but we both believe that each person should get the treatment that they need.

[Sgent]

78. Codeine is an outmoded drug

it has a huge variability of effect, based on how the individual processes it in their system. Some people its very effective, some people it does nothing, and there is no way to tell which is which.

Low dose hydrocodone (Vicodin, Lortab) is more effective and no more likely to cause addiction -- especially in a case like this where they would only give 2-3 days and say see your dr or specialist for followup.

[Crunchy Frog]

96. I sure was grateful for it when I had a series of tooth abcesses

As a teenager.

[get the red out]

87. I have never had it work for a simple headache

I have no idea why they push it so hard.

[walkingman]

11. America's healthcare system

is not only the most expensive in the world but also with worse outcomes but is is simply a greedy screwed up mess. I think that since we need to booast GDP it is simply about revenue and profit and very little to do with patient care. We should all be ashamed that we continue to elect these legislators knowing that they care only about business and not people.

[malaise]

13. I dislocated a shoulder as a teenager

There were no opiates - shit there was no Tylenol then either. I don't even remember if it hurt.

[kerry-is-my-prez]

14. I broke my shoulder and had to take opioids for a short while but was allergic and broke into hives.

My feet were so swollen I could barely walk. A Dr. refused to give me anything (usually you will get steroids) for the hives because he claimed I was addicted and if he gave me something to cure my hives I would keep on taking the opioids. I still had my sling on and had just broken it. What a nutcase he was. I did get a call from the office later to ask if my visit was satisfactory and my mother let them have it. Someone must have picked up on what happened with this doctor and his mistreatment.

Luckily, I went to urgent care and found a decent Doctor.

It seems that some doctors will give it out like candy and then there are others who are paranoid and overly concerned/controlling about it.

And, no I was not addicted and haven't touched them since.

[Warpy]

15. I'm now on a contract with pee tests for a drug I've been on for 10 years

and have never requested a dosage change. The press is hyping THE OPIATE CRISIS and the DEA, having nothing better to do, is cracking down on people in real pain.

What they should be doing is leaning on the drug companies and finding out where fentanyl, sufentanil, and oxycontin are being diverted. That might involve taking on people with real power (like the various mobs) so they lean on us, instead.

I can't take the alternatives. Regular SSRIs give me Stevens-Johnson like reactions and the Cox2 inhibitors like Celebrex shut my kidneys down.

If I need surgery, I'm fucked.

If they reduced the dislocation, Celebrex might do a decent enough job to get you through it, it's a pretty amazing drug if your kidneys don't shut down.

[grossproffit]

20. I've seen it hyped on here as well. Many people need these meds for pain. NOT everyone is an addict.

[Warpy]

21. Dependence and addiction are different phenomena

People with dependence try to stop the drugs, don't feel well at all, and start to panic, making the whole thing worse. They're actually pretty easy to wean down slowly and no follow up care is usually needed.

Addicted people get sick when the drug is withdrawn and have intense cravings along with the panic. Weaning them down is much more difficult since the cravings will cause them to supplement the tapered dose to quiet the intense cravings. If they do manage to get off the drugs, they need intensive follow up care, many of them for life.

[Shrike47]

91. Me, too, on the pain meds contract.

I've never abused them but the drs. are so worried I might go crazy...

[sarcasmo]

18. Booze and Weed

[democratisphere]

23. Be thankful the redumbliCONs are not in charge. You probably would

have been sent over to the death panel to receive your last rights.

[Coventina]

26. Don't even get me started on this "Reefer Madness" retread.

It's inhuman.

I was cut from sternum to groin for an abdominal surgery last summer and had to BEG for opiates.

It's out of hand and needs to stop.

[Freethinker65]

27. My husband fractured some ribs a few weeks back and got an Rx for Tramadol at immediate care

He did not ask for it but filled the Rx anyway. Said the ibuprofen 800s worked better for the pain, but I noticed he got better sleep taking the Tramadol. I think he got about 20 tablets with no refills.

[Blue Meany]

28. You might see about getting medical marijuana, which mostly does not

involve physicians--here in Maine, anyway. If you do, you want to get products (edibles, oil, weed) that are high in CBD rather than THC. CBD is both a pain killer and an anti-inflamatory agent. My daughter had found that a particular type, called Northern Lights, is effective for her acute pain. She cannot take most pain killers because of other health problems.

I, too, have seen the senseless refusal to prescribe pain killers for people with acute pain. I don't really understand it.

[eShirl]

31. In my personal experience, THC is quite effective for pain.

Northern Lights is good, one of my favorites.

https://www.wikileaf.com/strain/northern-lights/

[Ilsa]

29. I requested a 2-3 day Rx after oral surgery a few months ago.

I used the opiate for about one and a half days. But I was glad I had it.

If doctors would just be judicious about how many pills they write for, it might work out so that the drug is still available for real needs.

Also, I think states need to establish double-check rules on the scripts: require a written script that becomes invalid after three days. The written script has to match up with an electronic script to make certain the quantity matches. No refills without a new script.

I think the ER doc was too conservative with your situation, especially since he could see your physical injury. Good luck and I hope you feel better soon.

[bhikkhu]

30. That's about the only thing I ever used them for

and about the same. Last time was a root canal and I took one after the surgery, then one before bed to let me sleep, then it wasn't too bad in the morning so the bottle went to the back of the medicine cabinet. I never cared for them, didn't like the feeling.

Which is easy to say when pain isn't too bad. Years ago I had no insurance or money and suffered through 2 months of a broken and infected tooth, and being in pain really does drag the mind down. Back then I dealt with it by drinking too much, and I ended up just having it pulled. If I ever had some kind of chronic pain issue now I would definitely research alternatives to opioids.

[Sgent]

79. My dentist (specialist) wouldn't give me any after a root canal surgery

he f'ed it up and left root still in the tooth, and had to inject a s'load of novicaine because I'm resistant. Fortunately my regular dentist was willing to give me 3 days worth of pain killer, but I will never go back to that idiot. I'm almost as pissed about the lack of pain control as I am about the root canal that has to be redone.

[clementine613]

32. That's what you get when you have Rethugs in charge.

I'm sorry about your pain and hope it goes away soon.

[Crunchy Frog]

46. Unfortunately, this situation predates the most recent election.

The current opioid hysteria seems to be bipartisan in nature.

I basically couldn't get pain management two years ago when I got a kidney stone.

[clementine613]

53. Granted, it does...

But Trump has only made things worse. Since he took office, thousands of people have died. Has he done a single thing about it? No.

[Meowmee]

36. That's horrific

I would make a complaint. There was no doubt you were injured and you needed something stronger. Controlling pain is very important for the healing process. They shouldn't get away with failing a patient that way. I hope you get some relief.

[Crunchy Frog]

39. Yes. I learned about that 2 years ago, when I got a kidney stone.

I've since taken steps to ensure that I have the means to take care of my own pain, should the need arise.

Sorry about your shoulder and your pain. It really sucks.

[kcr]

41. Jesus, a kidney stone?

My family and I have been lucky in that we haven't needed to use the ER or have any major injuries or surgeries in a long time. I knew that hysteria over pain meds had been bad but I had no idea just how bad it was. This thread is eye opening. This is horrifying.

[Crunchy Frog]

48. 3 hours screaming in an ER cubicle, being treated worse than an animal.

People telling me to STFU, and being told that my call bell was being ignored. Being treated with snide nastiness, until I was finally able to get my mother there to advocate for me, then it was CYA time. Finally given 10 mg hydrocodone after the stone had shifted position, and the pain (that particular episode) largely resolved on its own.

Can you tell that I still have anger issues over it?

I'll never go to an ER for kidney stone pain again. Won't need to.

I'll never go to one without a recording device on me either. I won't go period, unless I think I might be dying, or in danger of losing a limb or major organ, and even then, it will be with extreme reluctance.

Yes. "Horrifying" is a good word for it.

[aikoaiko]

40. I've been taking opiods 3-5x daily since Jan. They always underprescribe.

But I thank for allowing the excruciating pain to be lessened to tolerable pain levels where I can get to work.

I don't understand how anyone gets high off of them. Even when I double dose its not a high feeling.

[linuxman]

42. Go find one who'll give you opiates then.

Not like there's some reason they're not wanting to prescribe them or anything...

[Egnever]

43. The ER really is not the place to get a decent script anymore

Too much liability there.

[pnwmom]

44. Is that the same as having an arm come out of a socket? That used to happen to my father

fairly often, till he had so much scar tissue it finally stopped happening.

Hope you feel better!

[sarah FAILIN]

45. my son was puking from the pain of his spleen

It was out of position down below his belly button. They gave him toreadol and Phenergan there to get him to stop puking the the script to go home with was..... Reglan lol. A laxative.

[Hamlette]

49. My Dr. retired and sent me to another, new doc said no opiates at all anymore.

I switched docs, we'll see what he says. I have lots of pain and my doctors have given me 100 lortabs per year for 40 years. Didn't matter to the new doc.

They are freaked out by all the addiction and deaths caused by accidental overdoses.

[loyalsister]

50. OMG!

I have done that several times and I know it's horribly painful.
I have heard these stories from a lot of people. The response to opioid addiction has been to punish patients who experience severe pain. Indeed doctors have lost their minds. A blanket policy for pain relief is ridiculous.

[exboyfil]

54. I lost my doctor over this

He was sanctioned for opiate prescriptions. This prompted my insurance company to pull his provider status. I can still go to him, but it will no longer be covered.

Of course I don't know the details of what he actually did, but I do know him. I have found him to be easily the best doctor that I have ever had. My wife know him and his family, and they are wonderful people. It is going to be hard for him. I don't see how he will be able to practice given the number of individuals in the community under my insurance (even if they are the only company).

I strongly doubt he was taking kick backs or drumming up business by being Dr. Feelgood. He might be too nice and compliant. I just don't know. He has written opiates for me in the past (when I sliced the end of my finger off).

[jberryhill]

57. "I strongly doubt he was taking kick backs"

Look up your doctor here:

https://openpaymentsdata.cms.gov/

My doctor gets $5k a year in free lunches.

[exboyfil]

62. In the three years listed

Data for only one year. He took a whooping $37.70 (probably two lunches?) from ASTRAZENECA PHARMACEUTICALS.

[Vinca]

55. The addicts have ruined it for the people with bona fide pain. Tylenol is worthless IMO.

Try Aleve, although it will probably barely touch your pain from a dislocated shoulder.

[Mariana]

70. The addicts didn't ruin it.

It's the people who decided it's more important to punish addicts than to treat pain. Let's not forget that many of the addicts are also in real physical pain. That's often how they became addicts in the first place. I don't think it's fair to blame them for the idiotic policies that result in doctors refusing to treat pain.

I say let the addicts have what they want, let them buy clean drugs in standard dosages, and treat pain appropriately. I don't know why people freak out so about opiates anyway. There are a lot of alcoholics, straight up physically addicted to the booze who risk their lives if they stop drinking without medical supervision, but no one is calling that a crisis. Alcoholism is a socially acceptable addiction and the addicts can buy their drug off the shelf. Let's have some consistency.

[Coventina]

72. I was standing in line at CVS at about 6:30pm last night.

And every single person ahead of me in line was buying one of those big-bottom shelf liquor bottles.

A few of them had mixers, but every one had those behemoths of booze.

It was a bit shocking. I'd never seen so many all at once like that before.

I guess CVS truly is a drug store.

I was there buying valerian for my insomnia.

But, hey, if you are in pain, just practice yoga and meditation. Pain drugs are EVIL!!!!

[Mariana]

74. Funny how they never tell us

how many of the overdose deaths from pain pills are due to mixing them with alcohol, which a lot of people do, and which is a particularly deadly combination. That little detail just isn't relevant, I suppose.

[Coventina]

75. Exactly. Why not call it alcohol overdose? n/t

[Lee-Lee]

76. You think the abusers will just use at regular dosages. That's cute

But your way, way out of touch with how bad it is.

That isn't what happens.

They get some, then more, then more.

People not as badly hooked jump from ER to ER and doctor to doctor getting as many prescriptions as possible to sell them. Some who won't even take the stuff do that.

Alcohol is bad. It's nowhere near as bad as the opiate problem.

Ask anyone who has spent time working on an ambulance or in an ER how bad it is with the drug seekers abusing anything and everything and everyone, often not even for a fix but to get the pills to sell for a profit.

It totally is the abusers who have ruined it for everyone. And just telling doctors to give them whatever they want, when it's enabling a harmful habit, is not encouraging responsible medical care.

[Mariana]

84. I don't think abusers will just use at regular dosages.

Please don't misrepresent my post. I did not say that. I think it's a good idea for them to know how much they're taking, which they can't do with street drugs. Some will die, some will get sick of it and quit, some will manage to live a long time as addicts. You know, exactly like what is happening now. I think it would be the lesser evil. Forcing people to suffer in agony because some other people get high or get addicted is an atrocity.

Isn't it funny how alcoholics aren't bothering much with ER's and doctors and ambulances and all that. I suspect if they required a prescription to get their particular drug they would do so.

[Lee-Lee]

90. Most prescription abusers know exactly what dose they are getting

They know what they want and how much. They buy and sell the pills on the street and know the value of every dosage level of every type.

Most opioid overdoses are not from an unknown quality drug, but the person continually taking more and more of pharmaceuticals that are clearly marked and knowing what they are taking.

There is a huge a wide difference between alcohol abuse and misuse and what is happening with opioids today. I suspect you are probably somewhat sheltered from how deep the problem is, as are most Americans, based on your statements here. They are not in the same ballpark at all as far as how addictive they are, how destructive they are, how fast they destroy people and how hard it is to beat the addiction.

You admit people will die from this, and more so if things become even more easily obtained, and then go to say that people shouldn't be forced to "suffer in agony" (for only as long as it takes to see a regular doctor instead of the ER) because others will abuse it. So literally your placing easing your discomfort a few hours faster as a higher priority than saving lives from either death or life destroying addiction and reducing all the harm that comes to society from all that.

[Luciferous]

59. I was prescribed hydrocodone for kidney stones last year through the local urgent

care. I would see another doctor if you can.

[Bettie]

60. They've been this way for a while

I had a terrible sinus infection. The doctor told me that she was surprised I was even functional. I asked for two (yes two) mild painkillers to allow me to sleep that night before the antibiotics kicked in.

Asking for two pills was "drug seeking behavior".

So, I got really drunk because I hadn't slept in four days while waiting to get an appointment, due to the pain. I'm sure that was way better for me than taking two Tylenol 3's or whatever they're called these days.

[AngryAmish]

69. First kidney stone I went to the ER, eventually got morphine.

The one last year I just got drunk...Lol I was going to get drunk anyway!

Woke up fine. My stones pass easy I guess.

[usedtobedemgurl]

61. I have been in chronic pain for over twenty years....

I went to the doctor when I first got in my car accident and they prescribed Vicodin. I took a whole one and have not done so since. I had to crawl to the bathroom because I could not stand up!

I was thankful for the Vicodin because even though I was kept awake with the pain, it was more manageable.

Luckily I had insurance back then. It is only through ACA that I can now afford health care and have started going back to the doctors to see why my pain persists so many years later. By the way, when the accident happened I saw a physical therapist, a chiropractor, and a neurologist.

Before I got insurance I was gifted 58 Vicodin from a friend whose mom died. That was in December of 2015. I am down to my last five pills. I have seen several GP's, a couple of ortho's, and been to the ER. No one has offered anything stronger than a muscle relaxer. This is after x-rays, an MRI, and two epidurals done on my back due to pain.

I saw my GP last week and she said the next time I apply for a handicap placard she will make it permanent! She said that half the time I am in her office I am in tears. Of course I am. I have been diagnosed with arthritis in my hips, sciatica, facet joint disease and degenerative disc disorder. Yes, there are times when I a in tears as I even try to wipe myself after I have used the bathroom. There have been times when I have used my walk in shower, versus lifting my legs up to get into the bath, because of pain. She asked if I had thought about surgery and I told her my current ortho has said I am not at that stage. She suggested I get my MRI and seek one out. But you know what? I still am not prescribed pain meds. How crazy is that?

As of late I have taken to drinking because I need to have some relief and I want to save those last few Vicodin for when I am in deeper need than I am at the moment. What our doctors are doing to our people is crazy. My quality of life has gone way downhill. I take aquatic fitness classes and on a weekly basis I leave early and in tears. How can our doctors do this to us? There has to be a better way.

I feel for you. I hope you get relief soon.

[MoonRiver]

64. When I had necrosis of my upper femurs, before 2 total hip replacements,

the only way I got out of bed was with Oxycontin. Now I never take the drug and am pain free. I'm just saying that sometimes opiates are necessary. I had no problem stopping them, because I wasn't an addict. I just needed some major pain relief for awhile. Our medical system is getting more stupid by the day.

[Lil Missy]

66. Even if you have a history of substance addiction, you should get something adequate

for pain based upon the injury or condition.

I had rotator cuff repair 10 months ago. (I've been sober since 2009, and I make sure all my medical providers know that.) I was given more oxy's to begin with, and hydro's than I could possibly need.

Go see a different Dr. Your usual GP is good place to go.

[workinclasszero]

73. And in most states medical MJ

is still illegal.

I blame hillbilly heroin junkies like Rush Limpballs for these draconian rules.

[MFM008]

82. I've had 13 surgeries

Couldn't have made it through without oxycodone.
Needed it again for back issues.
People want to kill themselves with it.
It's your choice like alcohol and cigarettes.

[MindPilot]

83. If you have a medical cannabis recommendation in CA, Drs aren't allowed to prescribe opiates for you

These days you have to be careful what you say...even to your doctor.

[Dem2]

85. I can't handle opioids

I find them instantly addicting and they make me feel nauseous and depressed.

I feel handing them out like candy is a very dangerous practice.

On the other hand, if you can handle them and you do not have an addictive personality, you should be given the choice to use them.

[HockeyMom]

86. Too many people are getting addicted to them

including the elderly after surgeries. My husband's former, emphasis on former, boss got addicted after back surgery. "Are you still in pain?" Here's another script for Oxycodone and on and on. This former executive is now living on the streets. He is in his early 60's.

My husband had a hip replacement surgery and was given same Oxycodone for 10 day script. Doctor asked, "Are you still in pain?" Another 10 day script. Was my husband still or was it because as he said, "This feels wonderful". "High as a kite". THAT worried me, not his "pain". He kept nodding out. When he did get up, was incoherent. Dangerous part? He was DRIVING to work. I told him that he was becoming addicted. Remember what happened to your former boss????? He stopped taking them and went through withdrawal after only about 15 days being on them: sweats, chills, and shaking. "Worse than my surgery", he said. When he needed another hip replacement, he told the (different) doctor not to give him any more of that "Oxycrap".

One major dental surgery, I was given some kind of "pain pill". I took only half a pill and was out cold for 4 hours. My husband could not wake me up. Felt absolutely horrible when I did wake up. Not from PAIN either. I've had other dental procedures, and have only taken a Tylenol which worked fine. Last root canal, dentist wanted to given me pain script. Told him I didn't need it. He actually argued with me telling me I would be in pain without it. Excuse me? I have had root canals before and I know what my pain level is, and what works for pain. His receptionist actually followed to me to my car with that script. Unbelievable. ONE Tylenol is all I need, or want. Thank you. Why PUSH pain medication on a patient who doesn't want it? Give me my antibiotic script. End of story.

Disagree?

[Coventina]

88. I think you need a new dentist.

Nobody should be encouraging you to take drugs you don't want.

However, different people have different needs in regards to pain meds. It's not a one-size fits all approach.

Opiates are cheap and effective for the vast majority of people, and their effects have been studied for several centuries now.
Yes, there is a danger of addiction, but for acute, short-term use they are extremely effective, both medically and economically.

In my case: Tylenol does NOTHING to relieve pain for me. I'm deathly allergic to naproxen (the drug in Alleve). I am at the medically allowed maximum daily dose of ibuprofen for my arthritis. So if I have surgery, or get an injury, where does that leave me?

[anneboleyn]

93. The rabid reefer madness re:opioids (the new "war on drugs") hurts legitimate patients. People who

say extremely lame and insensitive and clueless comments about how they didn't need pain killers for x or y -- wait until you experience real pain. The OP's post broke my heart. Severe untreated pain is the worst thing one can imagine, and it makes life unbearable. I also have heard the insulting comments that a patient should just take more ibuprofen as that "worked for me"or that a prescription painkiller made them sleepy or whatever. This make me so angry I can't even breathe. I have posted long threads about this issue before as we dealt with this issue with an extremely ill relative with horrific bone pain from cancer, and the opioids were the only thing that gave her any relief and any quality of life. What I witnessed changed my life -- my entire outlook -- forever. Before I didn't truly understand how bad things can get and that pain, and suffering, like that existed. Yes of course I knew that people suffered, and I had suffered myself, but I had never seen it up close. I had never seen what severe chronic pain does to a human being -- untreated chronic pain is absolutely a DEATH SENTENCE. The indifference to this suffering requires a level of cruelty that I don't understand, and it terrifies me that we see more of this callous indifference everyday.

The idea that some asshole politician could strip her of a right to proper care and proper pain treatment is APPALLING. I simply don't understand why anyone on the left, especially people who support legalizing marijuana for example, would play into right wing rhetoric. People who use these drugs inappropriately (ADDICTION as dependence is a different issue in medical treatment) should be treated as they are treated in Europe. It is a MEDICAL PROBLEM. Locking them in jail or punishing people with real pain because of people who abuse the system and abuse the drugs is frankly evil. It is the kind of thinking republicans promote all the time: certain "bad" people exploit/use illegally Medicare/welfare/food stamps/prescription medications therefore we should cut off these programs entirely and/or limit food or medical to three days ma see Chris Christie's "solution" to the issue in New Jersey).

I will never understand why people first of all think that their medical experience is the same as every else's or that they won't find themselves in need of pain treatment in the future (it didn't hurt that bad...or I've never had severe pain so I don't really get it). I even see that right wing memes creep into it (war on drugs rhetoric, who cares if legitimate patients like the OP suffer because some people use drugs illegally and it's far more important that we focus on them and fuck the people who are screaming in pain, they don't really NEED these drugs -- they can ruin their livers with mountains of Tylenol or kidneys with mountains of ibuprofen or their stomach linings with buckets of aspirin that won't work, etc etc). Our relative was treated like a drug addict even though the pain was very real and from a terrible disease. She had to go in every single month, of course, and deal with the always unfriendly pharmacy and deal with all of the hoops and disapproving looks every month, because asshole politicians have taken this on themselves as the new war on drugs. It's a lot easier to terrify doctors and terrorize sick patients than to track down drug lords isn't it?! And people wonder why the suicide rate skyrockets for people with chronic pain.

Jesus this is depressing. It is making me cry with rage.

[Coventina]

94. Thank you! Would you consider making this an OP?

Maybe it would open a few eyes....and hearts.

[Crunchy Frog]

102. Wish I could rec your post.

[CountAllVotes]

104. suicide rate skyrockets for people with chronic pain

Yes yes yes yes!

That is where I will find myself.

I do not care to end up in a wheelchair living in severe pain. No thanks!

Suicide becomes a viable option sadly.

[Blue_Tires]

98. There's been a huge crackdown due to widespread abuse...

It's happened to me and my mother, too

[ellie]

100. I had shingles a couple of years ago

And my doctor told me to take ibuprofen. Nope, that wasn't going to do it. I had to go to the emergency room and was given a script for Oxy. It worked wonderfully and I didn't even finish the prescription. I am sorry that you are in pain.

[YOHABLO]

101. Find another physician.

[CountAllVotes]

103. Horrible!

I had a similar experience recently.

I went to the ER as I was urinating blood.

I have MS.

I went to get some antibiotics and they ran the urine through the drug check crap. Of course it showed up!

I was treated like a criminal!

I left there in tears with my RX for sulfa for this infection that I could have died from during the night!

I too have the pain contract crap and the drug testing going on as I am a chronic pain patient.

FUCK ALL OF THESE LOSERS DOING THIS TO SICK PEOPLE THAT ARE IN PAIN AND REQUIRE MEDICATION FOR IT TO STAY ALIVE OR AS IN MY CASE, NOT REQUIRING A WHEELCHAIR!!

FUCK YOU TRUMP!!!