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Fri Apr 21, 2017, 12:58 PM

The reason why, if he doesn't kill us all, Trump's presidency could end up good for America

Mark Cuban recently said that Trump is "chemotherapy for America".

This got me thinking.

The problem with the "left" over the past several years (decades?) is that we spent way too much effort and energy fighting each other and "letting the perfect be the enemy of the good" that we ended up allowing our guard down and the barbarians stormed the gate and we couldn't stop them.

In 2010, instead of fighting WITH President Obama on the ACA too many of us fought against him. The ACA wasn't perfect...it had no single-payer option, it didn't cover 100% of people, it still left the insurance companies in charge... so we helped the right fight it. We attacked it and our own politicians and depressed our own midterm turnout and let Republicans take over state governments everywhere during a census year - thus allowing them to gerrymander the districts and lock-in a congressional advantage that we are having a tough time overcoming.

Realizing the threat to the country in 2012, we pulled together enough to keep Obama in office.... but by 2014, we were back to criticizing our own side, depressing our own turnout, and giving the GOP a majority in both houses.

Then in 2016, we fought amongst ourselves just enough to allow a destructive toddler to sneak into the Oval Office.

*THIS* finally was the wake-up call that normal Americans needed.

All of a sudden *NOW* the ACA is super-popular. It hasn't changed, but people - especially on our side - have been forced to admit that hey, maybe some progress is better than none. If we had that attitude in 2010, there never would've been a Speaker Boehner or Speaker Ryan.

All of a sudden *NOW* we are motivated to march for women, march for science, and march against corruption.

All of a sudden *NOW* we are unafraid of taking the fight to Republicans in beet-red districts.

All of a sudden *NOW* America is starting to understand how important it is to have grown-ups in charge in Washington.

Already, you are seeing a shrinkage of support among Trump-voters. Buyer's remorse is setting in, and they're deflated. They will not be turning out in 2018 in anywhere near the number they did in 2016 - as deep-red districts in Kansas and Georgia have already shown.

The Democrats are going to sweep into power in the House of Representatives in 2018. And with the power of subpoena will come the beginning of the end of the Trump presidency.

And our last "chemotherapy treatment" will be his impeachment and removal from office, the ascension of a Democratic Speaker of the House.... and in 2020, a Democratic senate and White House.

Hopefully.. starting January 20, 2021...we'll appreciate our new leadership enough to not repeat the mistakes we made from 2009 to 2016 when we didn't have our President's back. We'll see.

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Reply The reason why, if he doesn't kill us all, Trump's presidency could end up good for America (Original post)
scheming daemons Apr 21 OP
greenman3610 Apr 21 #1
fun n serious Apr 21 #2
DemocraticSocialist8 Apr 21 #5
fun n serious Apr 21 #6
redstatebluegirl Apr 21 #3
Lisa0825 Apr 21 #4
scheming daemons Apr 21 #9
bigbrother05 Apr 21 #7
scheming daemons Apr 21 #8
LiberalLovinLug Apr 21 #20
KittyWampus Apr 21 #14
peggysue2 Apr 21 #10
Kentonio Apr 21 #16
peggysue2 Apr 21 #21
LisaM Apr 21 #26
Kentonio Apr 21 #28
Blue_Tires Apr 21 #11
Chakaconcarne Apr 21 #12
KittyWampus Apr 21 #13
flying-skeleton Apr 21 #15
IronLionZion Apr 21 #17
murielm99 Apr 21 #18
IronLionZion Apr 21 #23
Demsrule86 Apr 21 #19
BumRushDaShow Apr 21 #22
JI7 Apr 21 #24
Initech Apr 21 #25
Pholus Apr 21 #27

Response to scheming daemons (Original post)

Fri Apr 21, 2017, 01:05 PM

1. maybe we'll get it that a democrat, any democrat,

even one that does not immediately blow rainbows out of his ass - is infinitely better than this gang of thieves and traitors.

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Response to scheming daemons (Original post)

Fri Apr 21, 2017, 01:08 PM

2. We will never learn

 

The Bush Years were pretty horrific.. Nadar has his hand in that.. I mean, Cheney was going to intelligence agencies and demanding they fabricate evidence against Iraq. Bush and his people brought us the horrific war in Iraq and the downfall of our economy. People died, MILLIONS of people died and are still dying because of Bush. They were truly war criminals.. Never mind the constant drip drip that was being shown to us of atrocities our soldiers were committing over there like raping men and women in front of their mothers and forcing them to watch. Truly horrifying if you followed the whole ordeal. We saw that happen and still became complacent. We have not learned and probably never will. We have to make people deeply understand that the sheer existence of republicans are a grave threat to our nation.

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Response to fun n serious (Reply #2)

Fri Apr 21, 2017, 01:52 PM

5. Again with the Nader blaming...Nader didn't give us Bush

IDK why some Dems keep repeating that misinformation. More Dems voted for Bush than Dems who voted for Nader...this has been shown several places dispelling the "Nader is why Bush won" argument. Yet no one ever bashes pseudo-progressive Dems who voted for a right-winger in 2000. People instead bash leftists who voted for the Green candidate. People also ignore the black votes that were tossed out in Florida. Both were more impactful in Bush winning than Nader voters in the Dem party.

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Response to DemocraticSocialist8 (Reply #5)

Fri Apr 21, 2017, 02:15 PM

6. I didn't blame it all on Nadar..

 

I said he had his hand in it... There was Jeb Bush also.. and many other things. I also said Dems became complacent.. and we did in the Obama years. We have to fight like out lives depend on it when out of power and in power because Republicans can not govern and are truly atrocious.

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Response to scheming daemons (Original post)

Fri Apr 21, 2017, 01:11 PM

3. I love this....

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Response to scheming daemons (Original post)

Fri Apr 21, 2017, 01:49 PM

4. Great post!

Do you mind if I share this on Facebook?

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Response to Lisa0825 (Reply #4)

Fri Apr 21, 2017, 02:36 PM

9. Sure, go ahead

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Response to scheming daemons (Original post)

Fri Apr 21, 2017, 02:23 PM

7. You do realize this is the Susan Sarandon theory, don't you?

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Response to bigbrother05 (Reply #7)

Fri Apr 21, 2017, 02:30 PM

8. The difference is this.....


Unlike Susan Sarandon, I wasn't part of the group that spent 2009 to 2016 kneecapping our President to put us into this position in the first place.

It is idiots like Sarandon - who spent their time fighting AGAINST Obama and his initiatives that enabled the GOP.


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Response to scheming daemons (Reply #8)

Fri Apr 21, 2017, 04:19 PM

20. Sarandon did not "knee cap" Obama

One hollywood actress, who we hardly even heard much before the election cycle did not knee cap the President. In fact Obama encouraged us to hold his feet to the fire, to be the change we want. So when someone does they are the enemy?

It was the usual suspects, Fox News, hate radio, a false equivalency operating strategy of the MSM news and a just say no congress that were the real and more powerful enemy.

Surely the Democratic party can withstand the criticism from the left as well as the obvious right whether it comes from within and without the party. It all helps move the party in the correct direction knowing there is support out there to change. Things like support of gay marriage, and dropping support of the Dakota access pipeline would not happen without vocalizing concerns from the left.

Suggesting Sarandon went too far in daring to point out the silver lining in a Trump win with an awakening, which is exactly what your OP is about, should not be seen as such a deplorable statement. Its obviously, and thankfully, true.

I always have to add to these posts that I disagreed with her in not voting for Hillary because there was just too much damage a Trumpublican administration could do, but one could at least admit she was right about this one point.

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Response to bigbrother05 (Reply #7)

Fri Apr 21, 2017, 03:49 PM

14. Difference between those who literally WANT to destroy the village to save it...

 

and those who realize there's going to have to be a lot of rebuilding after a destructive regime.

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Response to scheming daemons (Original post)

Fri Apr 21, 2017, 03:12 PM

10. Yes!

The purity tests need to end and we, as members of the Democratic Party, need to admit that Democrats of all stripes are better than the present toxic incarnation of the GOP. I am all for making our party better, more effective but we've seen what happens when we willingly engage in civil war, quickly criticizing progress because it's not fast enough or not perfect enough, applying this measure to capable Democratic candidates as well.

Cuban may have a point. If Trump is a cancer then chemotherapy is the routine treatment. But anyone watching a cancer patient undergo chemo knows that the treatment is harsh, scouring and frequently the patient succumbs before the disease is vanquished. Of course, it depends on many factors, not the least of which is the stage a cancer presents itself.

We've been remiss in early prevention, not firmly and harshly calling out the insanity of right-wing pundits, radio and cable shows that have effectively polluted the Body Politic, cheapening the idea of patriotism, using religion to hide behind, encouraging racial and ethnic bitterness, promoting sexist behavior and flying the flag of victimization, all the while accusing Democrats of identity politics. It's a sly game and the GOP has merrily danced to the tune because between the massive propaganda, district gerrymandering and alleged voter fraud/restrictive voting rules, they have managed to win elections and push their unpopular agenda forward.

This rot has been festering for awhile. In my mind, the Trumpster is an ugly symptom of a deeper pathology, all of which needs cutting out. Branch and root, as they say.

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Response to peggysue2 (Reply #10)

Fri Apr 21, 2017, 03:55 PM

16. The problem is though..

The reason for the infighting is because we have big divisions internally about the direction of the party. The problem with just putting those aside is that the party is still going to have to continue in some direction and half the party are likely to be pretty unhappy unless we can find a medium that keeps everyone content (unlikely). Now there may well be a decent argument for basically saying 'fuck it, we need to get this horrible creature out of the white house NOW, this stuff can wait' and I'd probably agree with that. It feels like we're currently facing a potentially literal existential threat. If we want to take back the country though and start winning a majority of seats at all levels and for the long term, then we need to actually heal those divisions rather than stick on a band aid and hope it goes away.

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Response to Kentonio (Reply #16)

Fri Apr 21, 2017, 04:20 PM

21. Agreed!

There are short and long-term priorities for the party. Right now the country itself is facing an existential threat from within and without. We need to deal with that major threat first and foremost. As I said in an earlier thread, when you've ripped open an artery, the main thing is to staunch the bleeding. Not worry about plastic surgery. And that's not to be glib, diminishing party fault lines. They're real and will need attention and hard work. Plenty of hollering and hooting, too. But first things, first.

Which is to keep the patient alive, viable, able to fight another day.

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Response to Kentonio (Reply #16)

Fri Apr 21, 2017, 04:53 PM

26. I think that is not entirely true.

Hillary and Bernie voted together 93% of the time. 93%!!! Yet there were people who treated them as if they was ideologically polar opposites.

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Response to LisaM (Reply #26)

Fri Apr 21, 2017, 10:22 PM

28. A lot of the things Bernies supporters care passionately about

Aren't exactly up for frequent votes. That's half our problem.

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Response to scheming daemons (Original post)

Fri Apr 21, 2017, 03:16 PM

11. While I'm glad more people are "woke", it's not much consolation

for those of us who knew what was at stake *before* Nov. 8...

I just hope there's enough of a country to rebuild by the time we get to 2020...

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Response to scheming daemons (Original post)

Fri Apr 21, 2017, 03:43 PM

12. Trump and "good for America" should never be used in the same sentence... EVER!

No matter how you want to spin it. It should never be repeated.

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Response to scheming daemons (Original post)

Fri Apr 21, 2017, 03:48 PM

13. There's been outside, foreign help agitating for Left AND Right extremist candidates & positions...

 

I'm just saying.

Pragmatism isn't popular amongst regimes that prefer Authoritarianism.

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Response to scheming daemons (Original post)

Fri Apr 21, 2017, 03:52 PM

15. You're underestimating ....

You're underestimating the power of the stupid juice dispensed by the Republicans !!

Even now, those hooked on the stupid juice believe that the current administration has achieved more in the first 100 days of the Trump Administration than any other President and oh yeah ... that the Trump inauguration was the BIGGEST EVER too !!

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Response to scheming daemons (Original post)

Fri Apr 21, 2017, 03:58 PM

17. Beet red districts!



Being a liberal Democrat in a beet red district has got to be one of the most frustrating places to be.

I certainly hope the Dems from those districts know their voters and issues better than our national party and bring back the 50 state strategy to recruit and run Dems everywhere.

For those DUers who think red districts need a nice liberal choice, now's a great time to run for office.

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Response to IronLionZion (Reply #17)

Fri Apr 21, 2017, 04:04 PM

18. I live in one of those districts.

We have congressional candidates, for a change. We have finally pressured our tea party congressman into holding a town hall.

I am trying to encourage some people to run for state and local offices for this district. I think we have a good chance to elect some of them.

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Response to murielm99 (Reply #18)

Fri Apr 21, 2017, 04:40 PM

23. That is excellent

We need to have candidates everywhere. Our people should be energized and enthusiastic to turn out and vote in midterms and local elections.

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Response to scheming daemons (Original post)

Fri Apr 21, 2017, 04:12 PM

19. I hope so...I was mostly lurking but I well remember the attacks

on Pres. Obama was kept calling him a used car salesmen...disgraceful Good for the mods here that we have a new system.

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Response to scheming daemons (Original post)

Fri Apr 21, 2017, 04:28 PM

22. Good post

although I hate the analogous idea of "chemotherapy treatment" being needed for this to happen... and mainly because although it is used for treatment of a disease, it can have unpredictable results.

One of the other "issues" with liberals/progressives/the left is that we avoid operating from the perspective of "anger" as a motivator, so we can't seem to keep up a consistent electoral turnout because the status quo is often an easier path. And unfortunately "anger" and "pain" ARE motivators when it comes to elections and you hate to have to "out-anger" the perpetually angry GOPers.

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Response to scheming daemons (Original post)

Fri Apr 21, 2017, 04:44 PM

24. NOPE. no matter what there will always be some who claim to be the left that just attacks democrats

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Response to scheming daemons (Original post)

Fri Apr 21, 2017, 04:49 PM

25. I know lots of people who are waking up to what's really going on.

People who before didn't know or care what was happening in politics, but now everything that's happening they are finally starting to pay attention to the evil that the republicans have brought on America. This is definitely a good thing!

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Response to scheming daemons (Original post)

Fri Apr 21, 2017, 05:03 PM

27. Absolutely. Bonus points -- they undid the tools of obstruction in the process...

When we win, don't be the morons who say "Oh for the good of the country, we'll put the filibuster back in."

NOPE

It had better be: "Gosh you guys were dumb to do kill it. It's our turn. Next time you win, maybe you can be the adult for once."

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