Tue Dec 20, 2016, 01:10 PM
Ohioblue22 (1,430 posts)
Thom Hartman just nullified Godwin's law for the next 4 yearsLast edited Tue Dec 20, 2016, 01:57 PM - Edit history (2)
Sorry people he said that on his show today just before either posted it. He wanted to refer to trump as being Hitler-like. Comparing his rallies to the
Nuremberg rallies etc.
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28 replies, 4216 views
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Author | Time | Post |
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Ohioblue22 | Dec 2016 | OP |
unblock | Dec 2016 | #1 | |
forgotmylogin | Dec 2016 | #4 | |
unblock | Dec 2016 | #7 | |
oberliner | Dec 2016 | #8 | |
unblock | Dec 2016 | #9 | |
oberliner | Dec 2016 | #14 | |
unblock | Dec 2016 | #17 | |
oberliner | Dec 2016 | #21 | |
unblock | Dec 2016 | #23 | |
oberliner | Dec 2016 | #28 | |
sarcasmo | Dec 2016 | #12 | |
Wounded Bear | Dec 2016 | #2 | |
Achilleaze | Dec 2016 | #5 | |
Ohioblue22 | Dec 2016 | #19 | |
baldguy | Dec 2016 | #3 | |
Mika | Dec 2016 | #6 | |
Ohioblue22 | Dec 2016 | #16 | |
MineralMan | Dec 2016 | #10 | |
Ohioblue22 | Dec 2016 | #18 | |
MineralMan | Dec 2016 | #20 | |
Ohioblue22 | Dec 2016 | #22 | |
Ohioblue22 | Dec 2016 | #26 | |
cwydro | Dec 2016 | #11 | |
Ohioblue22 | Dec 2016 | #15 | |
Achilleaze | Dec 2016 | #24 | |
LanternWaste | Dec 2016 | #13 | |
haele | Dec 2016 | #25 | |
stevenleser | Dec 2016 | #27 |
Response to Ohioblue22 (Original post)
Tue Dec 20, 2016, 01:14 PM
unblock (50,438 posts)
1. godwin's law is very misunderstood.
it only says that eventually, in an online discussion, someone will mention hitler/nazis.
it's commonly misunderstood to mean things like, whoever mentions hitler/nazis first loses the argument. |
Response to unblock (Reply #1)
Tue Dec 20, 2016, 01:21 PM
forgotmylogin (7,028 posts)
4. I've heard it as
basically the point where an online argument jumps the shark. If the original subject was not about Hitler/Nazis to begin with, it's the point the discussion has descended into reductio ad absurdum and all further continuation is pointless. That's been shortened to "the argument is over/someone loses" but it's like "Oh, the alien babies are real people have contributed, I'm out."
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Response to forgotmylogin (Reply #4)
Tue Dec 20, 2016, 01:27 PM
unblock (50,438 posts)
7. as an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving hitler approaches 1
that's the original.
the idea that the discussion is then over, as you describe, and/or lost by whoever brought up hitler/nazis, is common, and listed in wiki as a "corollary", but it's very dangerous as it can easily lead to shutting down discussion when the the analogy actually makes sense. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law |
Response to unblock (Reply #1)
Tue Dec 20, 2016, 01:28 PM
oberliner (58,724 posts)
8. It's not a real law
It's just an experiment Mike Godwin made up.
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Response to oberliner (Reply #8)
Tue Dec 20, 2016, 01:31 PM
unblock (50,438 posts)
9. hmm. not an experiment really. perhaps "godwin's saw"?
Response to unblock (Reply #9)
Tue Dec 20, 2016, 01:46 PM
oberliner (58,724 posts)
14. He says it was an experiment
So, I set out to conduct an experiment – to build a counter-meme designed to make discussion participants see how they are acting as vectors to a particularly silly and offensive meme…and perhaps to curtail the glib Nazi comparisons.
https://www.wired.com/1994/10/godwin-if-2/ |
Response to oberliner (Reply #14)
Tue Dec 20, 2016, 01:55 PM
unblock (50,438 posts)
17. interesting article. subtle distinction perhaps, but i think the experiment wasn't the law itself
rather the experiment was promulgating the law and observing the effects, to see if it actually curtailed gratuitous nazi/hitler references.
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Response to unblock (Reply #17)
Tue Dec 20, 2016, 02:02 PM
oberliner (58,724 posts)
21. Fair enough
But I think it has essentially morphed into a more expansive idea (i.e. that making a knee-jerk Hitler comparison without fully thinking it through is foolish).
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Response to oberliner (Reply #21)
Tue Dec 20, 2016, 02:05 PM
unblock (50,438 posts)
23. my concern is that it has morphed into the idea that *any* hitler comparison is foolish.
Response to unblock (Reply #23)
Tue Dec 20, 2016, 04:43 PM
oberliner (58,724 posts)
28. The term "nazi" is often used flippantly to describe any mean or strict person
That is sort of a pet peeve of mine, to be honest.
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Response to unblock (Reply #1)
Tue Dec 20, 2016, 01:38 PM
sarcasmo (21,958 posts)
12. I will use Orange Julius.
Response to Ohioblue22 (Original post)
Tue Dec 20, 2016, 01:15 PM
Wounded Bear (51,032 posts)
2. A little context would be helpful....nt
Response to Wounded Bear (Reply #2)
Tue Dec 20, 2016, 01:22 PM
Achilleaze (15,460 posts)
5. Yah, what did Harmann do? Or say?
Or are we just "supposed to know" somehow?
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Response to Achilleaze (Reply #5)
Tue Dec 20, 2016, 01:59 PM
Ohioblue22 (1,430 posts)
19. Sorry he said it out the radio
Response to Ohioblue22 (Original post)
Tue Dec 20, 2016, 01:21 PM
baldguy (36,649 posts)
3. Gee, that's for that Breaking News Thom, Mr. Russia Today.
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Response to Ohioblue22 (Original post)
Tue Dec 20, 2016, 01:26 PM
Mika (17,751 posts)
6. Love posts like this. WTF are you talking about? Do have ANYTHING to inform us?
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Response to Mika (Reply #6)
Tue Dec 20, 2016, 01:53 PM
Ohioblue22 (1,430 posts)
16. Sorry he said that on his show.
Response to Ohioblue22 (Original post)
Tue Dec 20, 2016, 01:33 PM
MineralMan (143,928 posts)
10. Link, please.
We are not looking at the same thing you are. If you want to alert us to something, post a link to it. We cannot see through your eyes.
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Response to MineralMan (Reply #10)
Tue Dec 20, 2016, 01:58 PM
Ohioblue22 (1,430 posts)
18. He is talking about it now on the radio he's comparing trump to hitler
For example he's comparing trump's rallies to the Nuremberg rallies |
Response to Ohioblue22 (Reply #18)
Tue Dec 20, 2016, 02:01 PM
MineralMan (143,928 posts)
20. Ah, I see. But, I'm not listening to whatever radio station
you are listening to. Probably very few people on DU are. So, we had no idea what you were talking about. Providing information in thread-starting posts is the polite thing to do, so people won't be confused or wonder what your source might be.
I still don't know what Hartmann said, you see, that led to your original post. Oh, well, never mind... |
Response to MineralMan (Reply #20)
Tue Dec 20, 2016, 02:02 PM
Ohioblue22 (1,430 posts)
22. It's OK. It's not a big deal
Response to MineralMan (Reply #10)
Tue Dec 20, 2016, 04:06 PM
Ohioblue22 (1,430 posts)
26. http://www.democraticunderground.com/1017415804
Response to Ohioblue22 (Original post)
Tue Dec 20, 2016, 01:33 PM
cwydro (46,411 posts)
11. Wtf is this about?
These kinds of OPs are so ridiculous.
No link, no hint, nothing. |
Response to cwydro (Reply #11)
Tue Dec 20, 2016, 01:52 PM
Ohioblue22 (1,430 posts)
15. I can't link to one sentence he spoke on his show
Response to Ohioblue22 (Reply #15)
Tue Dec 20, 2016, 02:35 PM
Achilleaze (15,460 posts)
24. But you could paraphrase
That would qualify as a clue for those who are not tuned into his radio channel...most of us.
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Response to Ohioblue22 (Original post)
Tue Dec 20, 2016, 01:39 PM
LanternWaste (37,748 posts)
13. Invoking Godwin's Law has been as valid as calling Dibs or Shotgun in any formal discussion.
Invoking Godwin's Law has been as valid as calling Dibs or Shotgun in any formal discussion.
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Response to Ohioblue22 (Original post)
Tue Dec 20, 2016, 02:44 PM
haele (11,173 posts)
25. No, Godwin's law only applies to discussions that don't start out about Nazis or Nazi activities.
With Steve Bannon and other nativists/supremicists, KKK'ers hanging around and supporting the administration, with the use of Nazi propaganda tactics and potential adoption of Nazi government policies (forced birth, isolation of religious/ethnic minorities amongst the citizenry, approval of extra-judicial activities against perceived social deviance.) in the current administration, Godwin's law does not apply.
Haele |
Response to Ohioblue22 (Original post)
Tue Dec 20, 2016, 04:11 PM
stevenleser (32,886 posts)
27. Godwin himself said it's probably valid to discuss analogies between Trump, the alt right and Nazism
https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2015/12/14/sure-call-trump-a-nazi-just-make-sure-you-know-what-youre-talking-about/?utm_term=.63636b6cc2ce
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