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Galraedia

(5,015 posts)
Tue Dec 27, 2011, 10:28 PM Dec 2011

The Muslim Test: How To Expose The Hypocrisy Of The Religious Right

One of the more ridiculous talking points of the Right is that America was founded by devout Christians. Christians that, despite living centuries ago, believe and hate all the same things that today’s conservatives believe and hate. Poppycock, says I! And so does any reputable historian. But people behind this fable are not interested in historical accuracy. The real intent behind this “belief” is to erode the separation of Church and State to the detriment of both and to the benefit of those who would use religion as a means of control. To this end, the Right has spun a truly fantastic yarn where they are an oppressed minority and Christianity is beset on all sides by those with evil intent. But there is a way to pierce this fabrication. I call it “The Muslim Test.”

So what is the Muslim Test? Simple! It is the fool proof method of revealing this Right Wing hypocrisy. As the last three years have made blindingly obvious, the average conservative has lost all sense of reality. They are so consumed by hatred of Muslims, they’ve jettisoned every shred of rationality. But how do you get through to people this crazed? Well, you really can’t. But what you can do is force them to confront their lunacy and watch them howl at the moon in outrage. This provides a glimpse for neutral or undecided bystanders into the depths of Right Wing fanaticism while providing liberals with an amusing game to play with mentally unhinged people.

Here’s how the Muslim Test works: Take any conservative claim that they are being oppressed by evil secularists or rival religions, replace Christianity with “Islam” and see if the offended party is still quite as gung-ho. Conversely, take any demand for special privileges, insist that they be granted to Islam as well and watch the odd conservative head explode.

Let’s try it out!!

Angry conservative: “I’m offended that those darn liberals have taken prayer out of school! I demand that we allow our children to worship in the classroom!”

The Muslim Test: “Well, OK, we’ll allow the principal, Mr. Siddiq, to lead a morning prayer to Allah.”

Angry conservative: “WHAT?! I don’t want my children worshiping another faith!”

The Muslim Test: “Well, then they can stand out in the hallway while the class prays.”

Angry conservative: “ABSOLUTELY NOT! Why should MY children be treated like outcasts?!”


Read more: http://www.addictinginfo.org/2011/12/27/the-muslim-test-how-to-expose-the-hypocrisy-of-the-religious-right/

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The Muslim Test: How To Expose The Hypocrisy Of The Religious Right (Original Post) Galraedia Dec 2011 OP
It's a perfect reversal -- somehow doesn't seem to penetrate most of the time. DirkGently Dec 2011 #1
Post removed Post removed Dec 2011 #2
Who is this "we" that you speak of? Hugabear Dec 2011 #3
Students are allowed to pray in schools and otherwise discuss their religion JDPriestly Dec 2011 #4
Welcome to DU.. Fumesucker Dec 2011 #6
I use Satanism, but same general idea cthulu2016 Dec 2011 #5

DirkGently

(12,151 posts)
1. It's a perfect reversal -- somehow doesn't seem to penetrate most of the time.
Tue Dec 27, 2011, 10:41 PM
Dec 2011

Same for the Ten Commandments in the (courtroom, schoolhouse, etc. etc.). How about some teachings from the Koran, etched in stone, hanging above your head as enter? Uncomfortable? Not your belief system, you say? Don't want someone deciding your fate or teaching your children based on their arcane religious beliefs?

Still worth pointing out. Again. And Again. And ...

Response to Galraedia (Original post)

Hugabear

(10,340 posts)
3. Who is this "we" that you speak of?
Wed Dec 28, 2011, 12:04 AM
Dec 2011
When we talk about prayer in schools, we merely talk about religious observance led by an institution.

Exactly what part of the Constitution allows religious observances led by a public institution?

Indeed, if it were teacher led, there'd be no need for objections because students could simply leave the classroom if prayer offended them so much.

Seriously? So you subscribe to the "if you don't like it, just get the fuck out" school of thinking.

Let me guess, you also support forcing students to stand and say the pledge of allegiance - or if they don't want to do that, letting them leave the classroom?


Enjoy your stay here on DU


JDPriestly

(57,936 posts)
4. Students are allowed to pray in schools and otherwise discuss their religion
Wed Dec 28, 2011, 12:18 AM
Dec 2011

in the classroom. Teachers represent the school -- the government -- so they cannot lead prayer or advocate for religious observances in the schools.

On edit -- for clarification:

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

The establishment clause is "[t]he First Amendment provision that prohibits the federal and state governments from establishing an official religion, or from favoring or disfavoring one view of religion over another."[1]

Originally, the First Amendment applied only to the federal government. A number of the states effectively had established churches when the First Amendment was ratified, with some remaining into the early nineteenth century.

Subsequently, Everson v. Board of Education (1947) incorporated the Establishment Clause (i.e., made it apply against the states). However, it was not until the middle to late twentieth century that the Supreme Court began to interpret the Establishment and Free Exercise Clauses in such a manner as to restrict the promotion of religion by the states. In the Board of Education of Kiryas Joel Village School District v. Grumet, 512 U.S. 687 (1994), Justice David Souter, writing for the majority, concluded that "government should not prefer one religion to another, or religion to irreligion."[2]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution

If the teacher who represents the government prays in the classroom he or she would be considered by the courts to be establishing a religion and that is what violates the First Amendment.

It isn't the practice of religion in the school. It is the establishment of a religion or religious practice by the school.

In their early schoolyears, my children attended a school in a country that was primarily Catholic and partly Protestant. Religious education was provided in the public school. We are neither Catholic nor the particular type of protestant religion that prevailed in that country. It was a real problem for us. My father was a pastor and sent us to after-school religion classes that were associated with the school. He was never very pleased with the theology we were taught.

Religion should be taught at home and at church or temple or the mosque or where the family worships, not in the public school.


To correct a misunderstanding:

That students do not have the right to pray in school is false. It is a right-wing myth. I quote from the ACLU website:

The ACLU vigorously defends the rights of all Americans to practice their religion. But because the ACLU is often better known for its work preventing the government from promoting and funding selected religious activities, it is sometimes wrongly assumed that the ACLU does not zealously defend the rights of all religious believers to practice their faith. The actions described below – over half of which were brought on behalf of self-identified Christians, with the remaining cases defending the rights of a wide range of minority faiths – reveal just how mistaken such assumptions are. (The list below includes examples from the past decade only.)

* * * *

The ACLU of Texas (2011) opposed a public high school’s policy prohibiting students from wearing visible rosaries and crosses in the Brownsville Independent School District. http://www.aclutx.org/2011/11/18/aclu-of-texas-demands-brownsville-isd-disclose-policies-banning-rosaries-and-crosses-at-school/

The ACLU of Nebraska (2011) opposed a policy at Fremont Public School that would prevent students from wearing Catholic rosaries to school.
http://www.aclunebraska.org/index.php/religious-liberty/127-that-gang-of-nuns-looks-pretty-dangerous

The ACLU of Virginia (2011) defended the free religious expression of a group of Christian athletes in Floyd County High School who had copies of the Ten Commandments removed from their personal lockers.
http://www2.wsls.com/news/2011/feb/25/aclu-virginia-defends-floyd-co-high-school-christi-ar-867856/

http://www.aclu.org/aclu-defense-religious-practice-and-expression

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