We lost Kennedy's seat, We lost Feingold's seat, and this. It should be very clear that the country

[still_one]

has shifted right, and in a major way

When labor and the so-called "reagan democrats" sold their soul and voted for reagan in the 80's that was start of destruction of the unions, deregulation, and it will get worse.

The writing is on the wall. Women's rights, social security, and medicare are an endangered species, it is only a matter of time.

I guess the total collapse of our financial system due to republican and blue dog policies is not enough for the idiots in this country. They haven't had enough

[NRaleighLiberal]

1. The country hasn't, but those who have the money to influence it (ad $$, media propaganda) sure have

And it is simply all about money and power - and greed.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

9. These need to be targeted

[sudopod]

16. With what?

I don't see how we win (using the current political system) against this much money and established power without either inventing 1) some sort of weaponized memes that bust through confirmation bias or 2) some sort of breakthrough in applied psychology.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

35. by being a nuisance

[progress2k12nbynd]

49. I thought it was all about racism??

At least according to most posts here.

[Quantess]

58. Uh yeah, you clearly ARE confused.

[NRaleighLiberal]

60. Yes - that too. Definitely. Corporations - $$$. Racism - many right wing voters.

[dennis4868]

2. But I thought we are supposed to blame Obama...

Damn that Obama...I blame him for Reagan starting all of this....

[JDPriestly]

5. Obama has not come out strongly enough against Citizens United or in favor

of unions and worker's lives.

[Drunken Irishman]

10. You're kidding, right?

He slammed Citizens United during his SOTU right in front of the goddamn Supreme Court. He's railed against it on the campaign trail at almost every stop.

Have you been paying attention?

[TheWraith]

14. Of course not. Paying attention would interefere with Obama-bashing.

Then he couldn't complain as easily that Obama wasn't doing things that he actually has done.

[JDPriestly]

27. But we haven't heard much from him about it since then.

He should be out there using it as a campaign talking point. He should be supporting an amendment to the Constitution to clarify that the First Amendment applies to the press and to real people, not to anonymous corporations. He hasn't done that.

[Drunken Irishman]

32. That's on you...

I hear it all the time. He always brings it up when campaigning.

[sweetapogee]

67. my biggest fear

in my opinion is correcting the mistake called citizen united without causing another problem and that is preserving the rights of unions and special interest groups that are Dem friendly to contribute funds.

I think a simple, truthful, unified message can overcome any amount of funding by the 1% on election day. We need results, not excuses. We need to focus on improving the economy like a laser beam. End of rant.

[crunch60]

44. Ya, ya hear, the O' Rove/Walker "Divide and Conquer"

strategy seems to be working. Got the Dems saying Obama didn't do this or that. He railed strong against Citizens United and I heard him. We have to get that disastrous SCOTUS ruling overturned.

[dionysus]

66. .. now now, don't get in the way of someone on a mission to blame him for everything...

[Arkana]

62. Are you fucking joking?

You don't get much more prominent than a mention in the State of the Union, and Citizens United was first under the hatchet.

[yourout]

3. Sadly I agree.....we have not hit bottom yet. I will probably take another generation before......

the light goes on and we at least attempt to right the wrongs.

[Baitball Blogger]

4. The only way to destroy Republican policies, is to expose their corruptions.

Why wouldn't voters vote for Republicans? They get away with all kinds of unethical things.

[freshwest]

8. We've exposed their corruptions, but it does no good. We are talking about having ethical government

And see crimes against that, when they see government as the ultimate criminal. They are destroying government to break this country down into smaller, more manageable feifdoms by their corporate patrons. Those will be run with church values and a system of patronage which does not respect anything that is not a part of this. This is not a new thing. This is the dynamic we are up against and refuse to admit it.

[RonWF]

17. I hate to tell you this, but

"a system of patronage which does not respect anything that is not a part" of it is hardly limited to Republicans. Come to Illinois, the political home of President Obama, and you will see just such a system, run by Democrats, in the City of Chicago, Cook County and the Illinois State legislature. This is not a secret, and it's not paranoid rambling, it's a plain fact. Democrats need to clean their own house if they expect people to listen to them.

[freshwest]

30. Your third post. Did you attack Democrats in the other two?

[ManyShadesOf]

37. FWIW

the complete corruption of the political system is what we all are fighting

[HangOnKids]

40. Yes Yes Of Course

and you were saying.....

[ManyShadesOf]

43. not in polite company

[NYC_SKP]

50. Dear RonWTF....

[newspeak]

72. and like I told my repug SIL

sure there are some democrats, however, it's the degree of participation. And, being in the repug club, being corrupt, many get away with it just by association. Whereas, a democrat, who has committed a minor act is expected to be crucified. I give you martha stewart's insider trading and little boot's apparent insider trading of his own damn company. Stewart, less money involved and she didn't have daddy's friend in the SEC and oh, she didn't own the company. Then there's diaper dan, I believe he's still in congress; but, spitzer out as governor.

We have a media who is as right wing as their corporate masters; and any scandal, even small (or fabricated) they will willingly shout it to the rooftops if it's a democrat. A scandal involving a repug, it's got to be pretty bad before they'll mention it once. For over thirty years the right wing has been repeating the liberal media lie until the plebes repeat it like zombies.

[Baitball Blogger]

20. We really haven't exposed their corruptions.

And I completely agree with your assessment. Very well written.

The reason why those fiefdoms work for them is because they are corrupting a core group within those fiefdoms. They have shills to take over positions of leadership to confuse people and corrupt lawyers (from both parties) are part of the inner circle. Everyone outside that circle is fucked.

So maybe we fight them, one fiefdom at a time? If all politics is local, then we take them down, one at a time?

[freshwest]

34. That's the dangerous part. And blaming Obama as master puppeteer won't help. The USA is what it is.

It's very diverse and not as unified as it was in the past. I am guessing it's a part of the aging of a country.

[still_one]

13. It won't matter, they control the mass media and the message /nt

[Baitball Blogger]

22. I agree. But we have to find a way.

[still_one]

26. we need to stand for something. We have been caving in for years. Now social security, medicare,

and civil rights, labor, women's rights are being threatened

Isn't it about time we stood up to those issues at least?

[Baitball Blogger]

39. Let me sleep on it.

Today has been exhausting.

[crunch60]

48. We must support OWS, keep the revolution going, fight for change as

we have seen in Wisconsin, a lost battle, but a good battle. They want us to run with our head between our legs, instill more fear, take a little more. If we acquiesce, we will loose.

[Baitball Blogger]

70. I keep harping on the corruption angle.

Look, how can they be Christian AND Corrupt? We need people who are good at marketing to help sell that image, because that's what the Republican party is composed of today. Christians who continually look the other way when their leaders are corrupt.

[crunch60]

76. Yes, the Dems need a kick in the butt, need to fight fire with fire. nt

[JI7]

6. this is too simplistic, if Coakley had actually campaigned she would have easily won

the problem people had with Feingold was they wanted him to be more of their senator. bring home the pork and shit.

but i agree voters are fools.

[TheWraith]

18. One of the lessons, perhaps, is to get better candidates.

Not referring to Feingold here, but Coakley and Barrett were both pretty milquetoast as far as I can tell. Coakley felt entitled, and Barrett had previously gotten beaten two years ago.

[magical thyme]

64. I don't often agree with you, but milqtoast, "entitled" dem candidate

against very strong independent democratic and creepy teaparty is how Maine ended up with Gov. 38%.

Dems either need to get much better candidates or, as in Maine's situation, when they see they are losing badly 2 weeks ahead of the election, maybe throw their support to the independent democrat.

They need to remember what they are fighting for and stick to that, instead of thinking it is a basketball team and voting my team or nothing.

I didn't love the independent dem, and I waited until the last possible moment before throwing my vote to him simply because by evening, with them still in a statistical tie at 37 and 38%, he still had the best chance of keeping the teabagger out.

I do think here they have learned their lesson, as the minute a strong independent announced to run for the upcoming senate seat, the strong dems decided to not run this time around specifically to prevent splitting the vote 3-ways. Let the lesser known's get known, but support the left-leaning independent may at least keep the senate seat from going tea party.

Politics makes strange bedfellows. Instead of castigating and blaming independents, include them when it makes sense.

[pstokely]

25. people don't like pork going to every other state besides theirs

they only want it for their state, socialism for them only

[AverageJoe90]

7. We may need to charge a lot of people with treason one of these days.

I'm serious. I'm tired of criminals like Scalia, the Kochs, etc. running this country into the ground. We are DONE if our efforts fail in November.

We may even need a Second Revolution in the worst case scenario.........

[MannyGoldstein]

11. When Dr. Dean ran our Party, we won like crazy

When we triangulate, we lose.

The Third Way must go.

[ProSense]

15. A lot of DLCers won.

"When Dr. Dean ran our Party, we won like crazy...The Third Way must go."

So that theory is nonsense. I'm always glad to see a Blue Dog/DLCer type go down, but they gained in the party during Dean's tenure.

Don't kid yourself.

[MannyGoldstein]

23. When the DLC took over the party in 1993 we immediately lost both houses of Congress

And they stayed lost until Dr. Dean took the reigns.

Because Dean fought for every fucking seat. Not just the seats that were easy.

[ScreamingMeemie]

31. ^^^This exactly.

[ProSense]

36. Yes

"Because Dean fought for every fucking seat. Not just the seats that were easy."

...and those seats that weren't "easy" were conservative/moderate Dems. In fact, a number of the Blue Dogs who lost in 2010 were elected during Dean's tenure. So were current Sens. Casey and McCaskill.

[still_one]

19. and Dr. Dean believed we should open our party to "everyone", including those who we disagree with

on fundamental principles

I personally think it is about time for Democrats to stand for progressive causes, and let the blue dogs join the repukes

It obviously hasn't gotten bad enough yet, but the way things seem to be going it will

[Arkana]

63. If you think that every Democrat who won in 2006 and 2008

was a liberal in the mold of Kennedy or Sanders then I have a bridge in Brooklyn to sell you.

[MannyGoldstein]

65. Nope. But it was progress.

This game won't be won quickly.

[Mairead]

73. I think you're on a hiding to nowhere on this issue, Manny

You can't win when you've people on your team batting for the other side.

[ProSense]

12. It's clear

that the media is a huge problem. I tuned them out, but I recently caught the spin against high-speed rail in full effect on CNN. Still, there are too many people who don't get this. They didn't when the media aided the Swift Liars against Kerry, and they still don't. They spin it as Dems not doing enough when it is in fact a media-driven shift. In fact, the media will prop up politicians of any stripe who helps the cause (see NJ and NY).

When the Democratic message can get through, it works, but it requires the kind of unified voice (despite the media) that drowned the right in 2008 (aided of course by the fact that the public was sick of Bush).

[Major Hogwash]

21. Well said

But they don't read your posts as often as I do.

[still_one]

24. another thing we can thank bill clinton for. Still the stupidity of the American people never cease

to amaze me

[Larkspur]

28. From what I understand, Walker started advertising his lies early this year

and thanks to the millions he got from his billionaire masters, he could spread his lies thick and often.

The Democratic challenger only had a month to campaign against Walker directly. He first had a primary and then the general election.

Also the recall seemed to be a replay of the 2010 election with Barrett being the same alternative choice to Walker. Barrett did well in the debates, but the lack of time and money prevented him from getting his message out over Walker's purchased airwaves.

My only suggestion is that unions will need to devise a way to modernize and IMPROVE their messaging.

And Democrats need to figure out how to survive in a landscape where union power is limited and shrinking.

[young_at_heart]

29. Brainwashing is easier than we think

Critical thinking has been replaced by lots of 'isms'. Republicans have learned well how to create and sustain fear. Very sad!!

[HangOnKids]

42. They control the message because they BULLSHIT people on TV

People need to shut off that IDIOT box. They use their $$$$ on TV ads and BS TV shows. Shut that shit off. End. Of. Story.

[crunch60]

51. Yes, the MSM are the one's rolling in big bucks, they are the one's

who have profited, especially during elections. paid millions to push the propaganda of their landlords, Murdoch, Koch, Rove and the rest of the super PACs. I haven't had TV for years, it's all bullshit, the dumbing down of America.

[hfojvt]

33. the terms may matter

it was not Kennedy's seat - it belonged to the people of Massachusetts.
Nor was it Feingold's seat - it belonged to the people of Wisconsin.

One thing I think Wisconsin voters said with Feingold, is that some are tired of lifetime incumbents. Feingold had done 3 terms in the Senate, 18 years and was running for a fourth, for 24 years. How much is enough? If he had won, would he be running again in 6 years, and then running again in 12 years, and then running again in 18 years until he died in office like Kennedy and Byrd?

Some voters are just sick of these lifetime appointments. At least enough are, perhaps, to tip an election in an off year.

[gtar100]

38. And if we don't defeat fascism at the ballot box and in the public square,

inevitably the result will be a violent revolution our children and grandchildren will fight.

Conservatives learn nothing from history. And billions suffer in misery over generations because of them. Some can be nice people in person but they have no idea the horrors they have caused and are causing to this day.

[LeftyMom]

41. Policy doesn't back that up.

And you really can't lump together a piss poor campaign and two badly underfunded ones in a grand total of two states and draw national conclusions. That's just silly.

[glinda]

45. Only paper ballots' results would prove that to me.

[robinlynne]

47. Thank-you. I hate watching people justify stolen elections. over and over and over.

[glinda]

75. Seriously. All energy is wasted when the system will turn out same results.

I can say this til blue in the face but I have little faith any more on elections until we have paper ballots and hand counting and strong oversight as well as prosecutions for disruptions to peoples' right to vote, robocalls with lies, etc.....

[robinlynne]

46. It is not the voters. Our elections are counted by right wing private companies. wake up!

[ecstatic]

52. That, or it could be a matter of dems throwing other dems under the bus

Clearly, there must have been some dems who voted for Walker because they didn't care about unions. I'm not in a union, but if I lived in Wisconsin I damn sure would have taken my ass to the polls to vote Walker out. We should stick together, even when the issue at stake doesn't seem to affect us personally. United we stand, divided we all fall.

[StarrMatthieu]

53. We lost Kennedy's seat, We lost Feingold's seat, and this. It should be very clear that the country

[IMG][/IMG]It is amazing!

[jeanV]

54. Sorry, but polls invalidate the title of this thread

"It should be very clear that the country has shifted right, and in a major way" is an affirmation not backed by facts.

Look up the site of 'Pew Research Center' http://pewresearch.org/
There is an history of party affiliation (leanings) over the past 30 years.
(I don't have time to find the exact page, but I have a copy somewhere on my hard drive)

The result: party affiliation (Democrat/Independent/Republican) never varied by more than +/-2 points over 30 years.
Facts do not support the claim the US shifted right.

However, the economic crisis started in 2008 led all incumbents facing a new election to be defeated, be they left or right wing: Labor Gordon Brown in the UK, PSOE Aznar in Spain, Sarkozy in France

There would have been a hope of reelection for Obama in the fact that the unemployment was receding: 10% in 2010, 8% in 2012.
But the curve is currently leveling out at 8%, and economists predict a recession in the last two quarters of 2012

Which doesn't bode well for Obama's reelection chances.

[uppityperson]

71. You seem to be confusing "shifted right" with party affiliation. Both parties have shifted right

over the years. What now is center Democratic position is what used to be just center between both and Republicans have shifted so far right.

[Egalitarian Thug]

55. That's not clear at all, you're leaping to an erroneous conclusion.

What has shifted is who is running the Democratic Party. It's too late to go through it all now, but think about what's happened to this party since the "moderates" got enough power to run it.

The country has not shifted to the right, it has lost its voice from the left.

[ananda]

56. I'll wager..

.. it's because the liberals don't have a candidate any more.

I haven't felt represented in years. I still vote, but I know a lot
of people who take it more to heart and won't vote.

I guess Wisconsin has become Texas lite. Your liberal cities are
being drowned out by affluent suburbs and rural communities.

Simple emotions are so strong and united, and people with them
vote and want to beat down all other voices. This is where rich
money and laws like Citizens United gain leverage.

[dinopipie]

57. Only the naïve still cling to the outdated concept

That change will happen via the ballot in a post citizen united world.

[FlaGranny]

59. The easily led,

the dumb who can't think for themselves, the ones who believe everything they're told. Until those folks are enlightened - money will have the loudest voice.

It is extremely difficult to believe that if they could think, they'd vote republicans in and watch the economy and jobs tank - every time - and still keep doing it.

[Mairead]

61. Nope.

What it demonstrates is that there's no obvious, substantive differences between the parties, and that working people are not organised.

Obvious, substantive differences are those that are big enough to be seen even through a fog of opposition propaganda, that don't need to be "explained", and that are desired by those who vote.

Anyone who believes that's not true has to somehow account for the polls that year after year show the majority of US adults favoring left/lib principles and goals.

In grad school, we were taught that there are two levels of significance: academic and clinical. Clinical (street) significance is when the effect is big enough to be seen with the naked eye. If the only way to see it is through the magnifying lens of statistical analysis, it's not significant at the street level. Academics might find it useful to fatten their publications list for tenure, but for those up at the sharp end such tiny effects are meaningless.

People at DU are like academics. Any effect is cherished and treated as important. But people out on the street don't care about publication, they care about pocket. They want stuff to be big enough that they don't have to hunt around or have some political expert explain it to them. They don't want to have to sort through a fog of claims and counterclaims. They want it to be real, visible, and delivered. That's not happening, and so the people in the street feel no loyalty.

[kentuck]

69. We have difficulty explaining the truth.

Our messaging is terrible. The vote in the Senate yesterday is a good example. The Republicans voted against Equal Pay for equal work for women. And they pay no political price.

You are right that people don't want to sort thru claims and counterclaims. They want it to be clear and visible.

[lonestarnot]

68. Oh so what is this, a game of rope a dope?

I like games.

[shcrane71]

74. Dems need new leadership. This is absolutely unacceptable to lose this recall election.

I mean fucking seriously. The man is under CRIMINAL INVESTIGATION!

Seriously. This is bullshit.