What happens to the democratic party if we lose in November?

[cali]

I'm assuming, as I always have, that Hillary will be the nominee. Say she loses to Trump. Will there be any backlash against the party bigwigs that helped clear the field for her and shoved her relentlessly down the throats of democrats?

The corrupt DSW will be out? Who will replace her? The Clintons will be irrelevant. What will Obama's role be? Will a loss precipitate change in the party?

Who becomes the leader of the opposition in Congress? Does Pelosi stay on as minority leader?

[ananda]

1. I think any Democrat will beat any Reep.

..

[cali]

12. That goes against any analysis

Historically, the Party seeking to retain the party after 8 years, loses.

Republican turnout in NH and Iowa has been much higher than dem turnout. It was very high in SC

Republicans are much more enthusiastic than democrats

Hillary is a fantastic GOTV tool for republicans

[redstateblues]

30. Bernie was supposed to drive turnout

To historic levels. Not so much so far.

[JonLeibowitz]

32. This is not GDP

[DUbeornot2be]

36. Well...

...since Hillary had 20000 fewer votes in NH than she did last time his job has been harder... But he did get over 30000 votes more than anyone ever before in NH...

Seems Hillary is the one hurting thrnout...

[Hortensis]

59. It may be partly because both he and Hillary

are seen as acceptable, and fairly similar choices by most. There just isn't a big negative in the primary that would drive Democrats to go vote against.

[That Guy 888]

103. Reagan, Reagan, GHW Bush.

I keep hearing that analysis, and it just struck me; Reagan followed by bush wasn't that long ago. I think there's a good chance herbert-walker would have got a second term if it he hadn't said "Read my lips, No New Taxes!" and then raised taxes.

Much of the political analysis (by the corporate media not you) seems to be geared at following a script.

[CoffeeCat]

33. The polls have been showing since spring of 2015 that Hillary loses to Trump

Sanders supporters have been trying to pound this reality into Hillary supporters. It's not just about Bernie. It's about saving our party.

But never, mind--continue to wave your pom pons for the Goldman Sachs girl. The rest of us in the reality-based community will stand in horror as our party is destroyed in slow motion and President Trump is elected.

And those polls, by the way--Hillary does worse and worse against Trump as her campaign rolls along.

[DCBob]

61. Not true.. Hillary currently leads Trump +2.8 in the RCP average.

RCP Average 2/2 - 2/17 -- -- 45.3 42.5 Clinton +2.8
FOX News 2/15 - 2/17 1031 RV 3.0 47 42 Clinton +5
USA Today 2/11 - 2/15 1000 LV 3.0 43 45 Trump +2
Quinnipiac 2/10 - 2/15 1342 RV 2.7 44 43 Clinton +1
PPP (D) 2/2 - 2/3 1236 RV 2.8 47 40 Clinton +7

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/us/general_election_trump_vs_clinton-5491.html

Once the real campaign starts and the focus is on two candidates these numbers will improve even more for Clinton. In the end she will trounce him with Latinos and African Americans leading the way.

[Hortensis]

62. CoffeeCat, the data causing your worry are

at best extremely inadequate and misleading.

I promise you as earnestly as I can that, if Bernie were our candidate, by November his reputation would be as smirched as hers -- among those prone to believe it. That would include almost all conservatives and a large number of independents.

The good side is, very few of those soaking up the horror stories would vote Democrat anyway. Independents aren't really all up for grabs -- most lean right or left and most of those predictably end up voting right or left accordingly.

Most analysts believe that Bernie would be hit much harder than Clinton by the typical general election negative propaganda (i.e., lies!) because it'd be new. Some would titillated, some would be confused and concerned, but all would be a lot more interested in rumors that Bernie is not just an "Israel-Firster" who has dual U.S. and Israeli citizenship but is a secret agent of the Mossad than would want to hear about Benghazeee! yet again. I haven't heard a "Mossad agent" lie (yet!) but the others are already out there, just waiting to catch fire if needed.

Dual Citizenship Treason: Will Bernie Sanders Submit to a Lie Detector Test? No, Bernie Sanders does not have dual Israeli citizenship...According to the Mossad http://www.veteranstoday.com/

Here's a fun one, but Bernie'd be the senator who murders those in his way as soon as he became a bigger threat to the right than Hillary:

RUSH LIMBAUGH (HOST): You know, not only was Hillary anti-gay marriage, she was anti-gay marriage as recently as 2008 during that campaign, folks. Anti-gay marriage. She was also pro-Iraq War. She voted for the Iraq War. Now, poor crazy Bernie has tried to make that point. Crazy Bernie just does not make it forcefully enough. Crazy Bernie knows, I mean, he doesn't want to be the kind of guy that dies by virtue of suicide with two gunshots in his head. So he's playing it close to the vest.

There's a big market for this crap.

This all, of course, would affect poll results dramatically. For more reasonable people, how about 4 solid months of pundits, Rush included of course, explaining why Bernie's lying about his economic plan?

BTW, even before all this gets going, I think you know, from Nevada for instance, that from here on out Hillary is going to beat Bernie in most states, and pretty handily overall. Her lead is based on strong support from her party. You don't have to prefer her to Bernie to take comfort from that at least, right?

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

35. True, if we have a candidate that will excite people of all ages to vote.

Hillary will excite people of a certain age to vote.

[Justice]

88. I agree.

[HughBeaumont]

2. DWS should have been long gone anyway.

The Democratic party has suffered immensely under her "leadership"; continued losses in the House, lost the Senate, denied Bernie the future access to the party's 50-state voter file, and will surely seal it if our Nominee loses to the worst Republican candidate in history (and that includes Dubya).

[RKP5637]

3. How is DWS held in that position. Is she voted in somehow? n/t

[HughBeaumont]

6. Selected by the President, elected by vote and confirmed by the DNC.

[RKP5637]

11. Thanks!!! n/t

[jwirr]

73. Okay but in the OP we lose the WH - who selects the head

of the DNC then? And "elected by vote" of DNC members? How do we ever have a say in this?

[Chan790]

93. How to have a say.

Join your local party organization. They select the representative membership of the state organization that selects their representative membership to the DNC. If you join your town party organization...you will have a say in choosing the people at the statewide level that elect the people that represent you to the DNC and have a vote on who will be the next DNC chair.

You could be one of those people yourself. I urge all real Democrats to get involved in their local party organization...the revolution will come from the grassroots. Only we can push to make the Democratic party hostile to corporatists and fake Democrats.

[jwirr]

95. Thank you. For people in my state that means going to the

caucuses on March 1. And I am going.

[YOHABLO]

101. Is Shultz up for reelection?

[RKP5637]

111. I don't think so. I was just curious how it worded. n/t

[merrily]

4. There's going to be backlash no matter what.

[Hoyt]

5. I think it depends upon whether Sanders' supporters decide they'll "show em" and don't vote.

[cali]

13. If they don't the blame is on hill and her supporters.

Even if they do she won't win

[Hoyt]

28. No, the blame is on poor losers who really aren't acting like Democrats.

[cali]

39. No, hill has smeared and slimed his supporters and bernie

So stupid and arrogant. Disgustingly Clintonian

[Hoyt]

41. Like Sanders' supporters bashing Civil Rights Icons for supporting Clinton isn't swiftboating and

reminiscent of the Dixiecrats I was forced to grow up with.

[leftynyc]

49. Hillary has slimed his supporters?

Where? When?

[Kingofalldems]

67. Well said.

I am god dam tired of this shit.

So obvious.

[leftynyc]

48. No - the blame

will be on those who stay home having a hissy fit. If the death of Scalia doesn't get their asses to the voting booth or if they think Hillary would nominate the same judges a con would, they're too stupid to vote.

[LiberalArkie]

55. So if Hillary does not win the GE it is Bernies fault that she was not able to get people to vote

for her? So again it is never a Clintons fault.

[leftynyc]

57. WTF

are you babbling about. I CLEARLY put the blame where it belongs - on those who stay home - not on Bernie, not on Hillary. If they stay home, IT'S THEIR OWN FUCKING FAULT. Is that clear enough for you?

[Chan790]

96. Clear and clearly wrong.

Nobody is entitled to our votes. Any candidate that wants them must earn them and any candidate that fails to earn the votes to be elected is the only person responsible for their loss.

So...if Hillary is the nominee and loses, Hillary is to blame for Hillary losing. Not Sanders supporters, not Democrats so disgusted with her that they cross the aisle and vote for the GOP nominee, and not voters that choose to stay home. Hillary is responsible for Hillary winning or losing. Nobody but Hillary.

So...if Bernie is the nominee and loses, Bernie is to blame for Bernie losing. Not Clinton supporters, not Democrats so disgusted with him that they cross the aisle and vote for the GOP nominee, and not voters that choose to stay home. Bernie is responsible for Bernie winning or losing. Nobody but Bernie.

(Stop trying to shuck the blame because you're supporting a loser candidate.)

[leftynyc]

98. With Scalia's death

all that pathetic bullshit takes a back seat. Anyone who doesn't do whatever they can to make sure a repub doesn't fill that seat is to blame. PERIOD. I'll leave alone which one I consider a loser candidate because it FUCKING DOESN'T MATTER. I'll vote for whoever has the D behind their name because of the court alone. I wish people would keep these threads in GD-P because these battles are like swimming through a sewer.

[Chan790]

108. You're still wrong.

Your opinion on this is pretty much what I most consider to be diseased and broken about the Democratic party most days...there is a belief on the part of "pragmatic" moderates and supporters of the various Third-Way/DLC/New-Democrats organizations that they are automatically entitled to support on the basis of being Democrats...no matter what they compromise or what Republican values they embrace. They just quite simply are not entitled to support.

Support is earned, not an entitlement. Regardless what you think, blame lies with losing candidates. It always without condition or exception lies with losing candidates and their campaigns and nobody but losing candidates and their campaigns. Nothing, nothing in existence, will ever alter that fact as much as you wish it to be not a fact.

It is, regardless of circumstance, inerrant and objective fact. Nobody is entitled to support they don't earn. Further, every candidate is responsible for the support they have no means to earn because their past actions and positions have broken the trust of the electorate to support them.

(...and while it might reflect on the primary, this isn't about the primary, it's true of every electoral race in America...and as-such it doesn't belong in GD: P.)

[leftynyc]

110. And your opinion still

means absolutely nothing to me. If you don't vote to make sure a repub doesn't fill Scalia's seat you're only telling me you don't give a shit about civil rights, women's rights, privacy and a whole host of other things. You just don't care. You can stay on your high horse and pretend you are playing to a higher calling but it's nothing but bullshit. This is the way things are - the court decides all these issues, not the President, not the congress. If you can't understand that, that's entirely your problem but I'm thoroughly unimpressed with those who will sit on their asses thinking they're doing something worthy - you will be making yourself irrelevant.

[enid602]

114. cruz

Especially if we end up getting Ted Cruz on the Supreme Ct.

[leftynyc]

116. Plenty of judges just as bad

or worse than cruz. THIS is the #1 priority now - nothing else even comes close. What the fuck will income disparity mean if civil rights are gone, women's rights gone, VOTING rights gone, the environment destroyed? All those things are effected by who sits on the federal bench (not just supreme court - ALL the federal courts). Far too many on our side of the aisle haven't figured this out yet and are too busy whining about Hillary's speaking fees. Just trivial bullshit when our rights are hanging in the balance.

[RobinA]

118. Jeez, How Old Are You?

You are voting in your own interest, not the candidates'. Your vote isn't a gold star for a candidate who did everything right in your opinion, it's an investment in your future.

[global1]

50. I Don't See Sanders Supporters Saying We'll Show Them....

What I do think will happen is the enthusiastic Millennials that have gravitated to Bernie will feel that they have been had by The Establishment and that will reinforce their original thoughts that their vote doesn't count. With their enthusiasm kicked out from under them they will sit the election out. When Dem voter turnout is low - we lose. I'm not concerned about the Party as much as I'm concerned about us 99%er's that will never again have the opportunity to recover from an all Repug control of all three branches of government.

This is what is at stake folks and I don't know if this is worth the risk because they feel it's Hillary's turn or we want a women president.

[Hoyt]

53. Well, they can go through the next 40 years seeing how much their non-vote did count when

3 right wing Supreme Court Justices get seated by the GOPers.

Sorry, if Millennials are that stupid, they are in for a tough life of their own choosing. I would hope that wise folks, like older Sanders' supporters, will try to convince them their vote counts . . . . . . but don't throw it away on Trump or Rubio.

[RobinA]

119. I'm Supposed

to vote for Bernie because if I don't millennials will pout about their voice not being heard. And then will ensure that their voice isn't heard by not voting?

There's only one way for your voice to be heard, vote. If you don't vote, you can't complain that you weren't heard, because you didn't say anything. I just don't get this "candidates didn't reach out to me" entitlement. Vote your interest and not to reward or punish a candidate.

[JHB]

70. However, that applies both ways...

Let's recall that despite Hillary's concession to Obama's win in '08, a portion of her supporters introduced us to the term "PUMA".

Should Bernie pull out a win, will that resurface? Especially if Bloomberg jumps in?

[Hoyt]

71. I see no evidence Clinton supporters would stay home, definitely no threats like Sanders' folks.

We'd be stupid to do so, and not much of a Democrat.

[YOHABLO]

102. At the country's own peril.

[MineralMan]

7. We won't lose unless people don't show up to vote.

That's the answer to your question. I'll be out there, as always, doing GOTV. I recommend that all of us do that, regardless of who the Democratic nominee turns out to be.

A helluva lot depends on it. More than most of us realize. The future starts in November. We'll either control it or lose control for a very, very long time to come.

I'll be holding my breath once the convention is over, but I'll be out trying to get Democrats to the poll. I hope everyone else here does the same. If not, then we may just get Republicans in control of all three branches of the federal government. Anyone who can't see what a disaster that would be is simply not paying attention.

[RKP5637]

18. I'll never understand psychologically what is going on in some peoples minds

when they don't bother to vote, and then whine afterwards about how horrible everything is. I think in the US many often think someone else is doing the heavy lifting for them, they just can't seem to comprehend how important each and every vote is.

The other important area is voting for local judges where applicable. Sometimes it's difficult to figure out what the candidates are about, so people don't bother. So, that leaves an opportunity for the RW loons to organize and get their nutty candidate elected as a judge.

[MineralMan]

20. It's not just a matter of not voting.

Most people will vote and vote for the Democratic nominee. The problem is with GOTV. Unenthusiastic voters don't get out the vote. They may vote, but that's not enough in 2016. We must bring others to the polls with us.

Some say they're just not enthusiastic about one or the other candidate. To them, I say, "Are you enthusiastic about having a Republican President?"

[DrDan]

105. in this particular campaign, I think we will have a lot of "I told you so" non-voters

saying that is more important than recognizing the damage from a GOP president

[RKP5637]

112. I'm concerned about that too. Sometimes voters/non-voters don't use the best of logic. n/t

[eissa]

66. Look, a sane response!

As someone who plans to vote for the Democratic nominee, all this primary shit-flinging by our candidates' supporters is really troublesome. If Trump wins his party's nomination, we will be given a gift on a silver platter. A bigoted blowhard who would be an opposition researcher's dream. The amount of crap that man has spewed over the years (never mind this election cycle) is a gold mine. I've spoken with lifelong republicans who say they are "mortified" and "embarrassed" that he may be their party's nominee. And the other two -- a hateful theocrat and an empty suit -- would be just as easy to beat. Yes, they've had record turnouts, but I believe that if any of those three are the nominees, that alone will get liberals to the polls. And if they don't, then we have only ourselves to blame for turning our backs on all the hard-fought accomplishments this President has made.

[bigwillq]

8. Regroup and focus on 2018

The only thing that can be done. Parties lose elections. Ds have, Rs have. And that will continue probably for the rest of time.

I hope DWS and Pelosi both go, even if Ds win in 2016. I think the party needs new leadership.

[RKP5637]

19. It definitely does. It's become the SOS and stale. n/t

[yourpaljoey]

9. The party will be crushed all down ticket

The hope Bernie inspires will evaporate;
apathy will set in once again.
The country will never recover.
A candidate like Bernie will never again be permitted to run,
I am guessing the plans to prevent that are already on the table.

[RKP5637]

21. My fear is the country could take a very very hard right turn. Frankly, I'm quite concerned as to

what the country could turn into after the 2016 GE. I'm always amazed at how many Americans often vote for the candidate least interested in their needs and concerns. The propaganda runs thick and heavy in the US.

[Zing Zing Zingbah]

45. Hasn't it already taken a hard turn right? n/t

[RKP5637]

47. I think under Trump, for example, it could go far right. n/t

[jwirr]

75. So we are just going to let this movement die on the vine?

Change can happen from the bottom as well as the top. Bernie is trying to build a movement towards change I am in it to bring about change even if I cannot have the WH.

[Andy823]

10. Same thing that happens

If Bernie is he nominee and loses. Republicans end up in the WH and go about taking down everything that was accomplished during Obama's time in the WH.

The thing is that won't happen if Democrats get out and vote for the nominee, no matter which one wins. We have to come together and vote, it's pretty much that simple. Either candidate is a thousand times better than any of the republicans.

[MineralMan]

29. Yes, exactly.

That's why I've abandoned GD-P and have switched focus to the general election. We will have a nominee. We must help that nominee win.

[cali]

40. No, it's very different. And obvious

[vi5]

14. It will be liberals fault....

It's always liberals fault and it will (as it always does) mean that the party didn't move right enough.

Like Republicans, ConservaDems can never fail they can only be failed.

[Cobalt Violet]

15. I would hope the Third Way will go away.

But I think they will double down and move more right. Terrible.

[spanone]

16. if we can't beat this boat of clowns we should shut it down form new party

[RKP5637]

24. There will definitely be something very seriously flawed with the democratic party. One problem

IMO is the entrenched leadership. I think fresh ideas and directions are often squashed by the party establishment.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

17. Jeez, what's with all the negativity this morning?

Let the cards fall where they will.

[Andy823]

43. The doom and gloom crowd

Negativity seems to be the talking point for today.

[Hortensis]

22. First, we're almost certainly not going to lose.

In spite of the national media's usual attempt to create a close "horse race" out of elections, this time the GOP is in terrible trouble. And, in fact, the views of most Republicans have been diverging from those of the wealthy elite pulling the strings for some years now, The Donald's disastrous "success" being a giant red flag.

That said, what would we do if we lost ? Well, SCOTUS would be packed with ultraconservatives choosing cases to dismantle the principles our nation was founded on, and everyone who cared about our government of the people, by the people, and for the people, from the left and right, would have to gird for a difficult war to regain power. Eventually, I expect the Democratic Party, and perhaps a new conservative party, would regain enough power to impose term limits on SCOTUS. Repeal, or more likely "privatization" of Social Security, continuing economic disasters, and lowering of wages should help get people involved.

As for the DNC, the DNC does not get to say who runs for office (check the GOP for confirmation). The DNC did not choose Hillary. She chose herself. The DNC did not make Hillary the frontrunner. We did.

The DNC does raise funds for and is, of course, providing assistance to our frontrunners/best chances for the presidency and for hundreds of lesser offices. That's what political parties are supposed to do. That's why I donate to the DNC. To elect Democrats.

[Journeyman]

23. "I am an old man," Mark Twain observed, "and have known many troubles . . .

"I am an old man and have known many troubles, most of which never happened." ~ Mark Twain

"Sufficient unto the day are the troubles therein." ~ Matthew

"Don't mourn. Organize!" ~ Joe Hill

[PFunk1]

25. On is the creation of a new party for starters

Democratic Independents due to many leave the democratic party in the aftermath (as stated by many in numerous posts) and just drop out of the political scene all together.

Another is a DINO/Third Way-backed democratic primary challenge to Bernie in Vermont as payback.

The (possible) ditching of both DWS and the Clinton's and the party looks to find new blood in hopes of regaining folks back in.

(Maybe) the progressive wing of the democratic party somehow takes control and starts acting like and actual opposition party again.

Interest in the Green and other third parties to join by former disaffected dems goes up.

The losing democratic party quickly begins to find a scapegoat to pin it on.

Can think of others but those to come first to mind.

[KoKo]

26. I suspect little change...

It will take a very long time to undo the damage. We were at our strongest during the Bush years. The party worked hard to make sure the Activists were culled out when Nancy became Madame Secretary and "Impeachment" and a lot more were "Off the Table." When Obama was elected it was the wipe out for the Activists. War Policy was off the table and we just coasted towards oblivion as we defended Obama against the RW and forgot about everything else. LBGTQ did very well..but then seemed to drop off when their issues were addressed. We lost a lot of money and influence, even though it was for a greater good.

[EmperorHasNoClothes]

27. They'll play musical chairs,

blame something irrelevant, and everything will go on the way it always has. The rich will get richer, the rest of us will get poorer, and the planet will continue to be destroyed.

[BillZBubb]

31. What happened after Gore "lost" to bush?

It will be a repeat of that. The third way, conservaDems will still control the party because money talks and to get money the party elite will keep the sources of big money happy. Nobody who wants a future in the party will rock the boat.

If Hillary is the candidate and loses, the party elite will claim the left is to blame. If Bernie is the candidate and loses, the party elite will claim the left is to blame.

[stage left]

34. Bridges you cross before you get to them

are almost always over rivers that aren't there. I'm assuming that Bernie Sanders will be the nominee.(And I'm really hoping that this country isn't stupid enough to elect Trump.) That may not be the case but it doesn't hurt me, or anyone else, to think that way.

[rainy]

37. TOO FAR RIGHT! It's a shame that we have to go soooo far to the right before people wake the hell up

I know why it happens, money, corruption, no real public media. Because of these things we have to be pulled so far to the right and look who is now running for president on the right. The extreme of extremists and they are treated like they are normal and Bernie is the freak.

So what I think is that enough is enough and the left will come out in droves to fight the right. Occupy may regroup, other organizations will ignite, campuses will rise to the cause because the students now have a taste of how it feels to be involved in the political process.

[pampango]

38. The losing party always has a fight between its 'center' and its left (D) and its right (R).

The wing of the party that believes we have to stand for something or people will not vote for us vs the wing that you have to compete for the moderate middle in order to win national elections.

When the republicans lost in 2008, their right has been quite successful in winning the battle - with the large exception of the Romney nomination in 2012 whom the republican far-right was not happy about. So far in 2016 their right is playing a huge role in their nominating process and their 'establishment' is largely on the run.

IF we lose this November the intra-party battle will depend on WHO lost. If it is Hillary, the 'center' will be discredited and the left made stronger. If Bernie were the one to lose the opposite would be the case. Given the horrible cast of characters on the republican side, let us fervently hope that neither of ours lose.

[Depaysement]

42. There's a lot of dirt on Trump too

And it's easy to collect. He's an op researcher's dream.

Hillary will win a lot of the Bush and McCain Republicans who despise him. People like Bloomberg will support her. I think you underestimate the effect of a unified political establishment against him. And no one will have any qualms firing at him.

A lot of the Republican Party voters are not turning out for him - he is only getting about 1/3 of the Republican vote right now. Rebuke turnout is high because they have a smorgasbord of candidates and the Dems only have two.

There comes a point where his shtick gets old, the ugly visuals get noticed a bit more, people realize they have to watch and listen to him for four years, his policies get more closely examined, people realize he has his hand on the nuclear trigger. That's when the show closes.

I'm not seeing this Trump victory thing.

[a la izquierda]

100. Maybe. Not in my family.

Most of my family members are moderate Republicans who will not vote for Trump. They will not vote for Clinton either.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

44. One thing we can count on if she loses. The left will be blamed.

They will say that she wasn't a weak candidate but one that was weakened by Bernie and the Left because we didn't hold our noses and follow the script.

The party will survive because it's for sale and will simply lower its prices a bit to attract the buyers.

[OkSustainAg]

46. For me.

No matter the outcome. I will work to promote the move politics to the left. Every election. Every state. Support primaries against DINOs. Walk through Walmart declaring higher wages. Promote single payer healthcare. 65+ won't last forever.

[jwirr]

84. I like this and work from the bottom up to change not only

the party but the country.

Many things were changed in the 60s from outside the government. That does not mean that we ignore politics but that we force the party to follow us.

Anyone know if the party was called anything other than Democratic when FDR was running? Looking for a new name for a new party if we must.

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

92. I think we need 'Labor' in the name.

Or 'workers'.

[jwirr]

94. Yes, that is a good start. I just cannot see how we are going

to deal with Hillary supporters when we let them out of our ignore rooms. It is clear our two groups are totally different.

[madfloridian]

51. The call will go out for more "bipartisanship", and it will all be our fault that we lost.

[haikugal]

85. Agree...nothing will change. The status quo will be secure.

I will say that the party will find people leaving in even larger numbers.

[EdwardBernays]

52. it depends

remember that most Hillary supporters are in a bubble... I'm not sure that losing in the GE will pop that bubble... plus so much of her financial support is people hedging bets... those people will just reinvest in other corporate candidates...

The Democratic Party isn't very progressive or forward thinking... their betting all of their chips on slow incrementalism... it may be time for a few new parties to spring up and represent all of the true progressives out there... The DNC will fight it, obviously, but if they keep shooting themselves in the face and ignoring reality they'll eventually collapse... same as it ever was.

[MineralMan]

54. Already writing an obituary for the Democratic Party?

Rumors of its death are decidedly premature.

How about helping, instead? How about organizing some GOTV efforts? How about promoting the election of Democratic candidates?

That'd be great! Thanks.

[kimbutgar]

56. This is the most depressing thread

I guess I should prepare myself for having president trump and a complete republican takeover.

This post is so depressing I'm taking a couple of days off DU

[hfojvt]

58. if I had a crystal ball

I would be using it to pick stocks.

Why worry and talk about imaginary futures?

I assume that the left will be blamed (again) and rightly so. The left, of course, will blame Hillary and the DLC. Some of them still cannot admit the blame that Nader deserves.

Nobody is clearing the field, except Hillary. In the 2008 primary, she got more votes than Obama. My hope is that a) she wins South Carolina fairly large, and wins most of the contests on Super Tuesday, and we can forget all this "feel the Bern" and "political revolution" nonsense.

The other alternatives - a) a longer primary or b) a victory by the socialist wing, look pretty scary to me. We survived a) in 2008, but we also had a huge amount of M$M support then (for whatever reason) and right now the M$M seems to be gunning for Clinton, has been for months now.

I was ABC in 2008 and have been wishing for years that the Clintons would just go away (although Bill has given some very good speeches at the conventions) but to replace the Democratic Party with the Democratic Socialist party looks like a death wish to me.

One that many young people are embracing, perhaps. Like Salinger said - "a young person wants to die nobly for a cause, whereas an old person wants to live humbly for it."

[bravenak]

104. +1

[La Lioness Priyanka]

60. i would worry more about the American people and the world, before worrying about the democratic

party in the scenario you just laid out.

[chrisa]

63. Our site becomes true DU again. :)

[Eleanors38]

64. The Sanders organization will continue on and revitalize the Party, or...

...the Party will move to 3rd party status in a 2-party system.

The GOP wins because the Democratic Party has shown a superior ability to collapse faster than the far right. I agree with those who say the far right stands a good chance to achieve its stated goal of "permanent power."

[ieoeja]

65. DWS's term is up. Been decades since we gave a Chair two full terms. She is out regardless.

No predictions on Obama. I don't think he will take Bill Clinton's former place as the Democrat to emulate. He is too urbane and intellectual for an American body politics that is steeped with anti-intellectualism.

Common wisdom among the punditry and party officials will be an assumption this was a replay of 1968. It will be those damned young people and Liberals that cost us the election. I feel extremely confident in predicting the party learns ... nothing.

[Nuclear Unicorn]

68. It's almost as if some people think elections matter.

The Establishment has the game rigged; it doesn't matter which candidate gets the most votes because at the end of the day The Establishment wins.

[randome]

69. Then we will have the government we deserve?

That would be especially true, IMO, if enough Sanders supporters choose petulance over cooperation and don't vote at all. Although, actually, I doubt that will happen to any measurable extent outside DU.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]Birds are territorial creatures.
The lyrics to the songbird's melodious trill go something like this:
"Stay out of my territory or I'll PECK YOUR GODDAMNED EYES OUT!"[/center][/font][hr]

[mahatmakanejeeves]

72. Circular firing squad. NT

[KamaAina]

74. Same thing that happens to the whole country.

[elleng]

76. Bad crap.

[daleanime]

77. We'll be told, again.....

that we need to move further to the right.

[Jezza]

78. the folks in this blog are the future

more of us just need to vote

then encourage convergence to change policy and improve this country.

[still_one]

79. What happens if Hillary is the nominee, and we win in November?

[Cobalt Violet]

107. Then we keep working longer for less while Wall Street rapes us for 4 more years.

The same thing as if Trump or any republican win for that matter. Same ole nothing for working folks.

[Rebkeh]

80. The party will have to evolve

The boomer generation is going to lose their grip eventually and the millenials will be the largest voting bloc anyway.

You'd think they would see that coming and get prepared now.

[Purveyor]

81. This...

[vdogg]

82. We will soul search and recalibrate

As we always do after a loss. Our attention will turn to congress as we try to fill seats to block or stave off the republican agenda. This will not be hard after 2 years of republican rule, congress will practicality fall into our hands. We won't go away and we won't give up, we'll fight as we always have. That said, I believe this to be a moot issue. I fully expect Hillary to win.

[valerief]

83. It won't be Hillary and Trump. If Hillary, it would be Hillary and Paul Ryan.

In that event, the plutocrats would get what they want from either of them, and our power would continue to be non-existent. The war machine would continue. Wall St. will bubble and burst at ever-greater explosions. The great color divide would still exist, and killer cops would continue following their orders to lock up as many black people as possible. Immigration reform? Nah, they're gonna keep that unresolved issue alive. Charter schools would blossom, public (real ones) would die. Private prisons would blossom to where they'd equal in number to state prisons. More and more public lands would be sold to polluting industries and plutocrats who want their own little kingdoms. Our biggest utility bill won't be for heat/air conditioning but for water.

If Hillary wins, though, there's a better chance for some social rights to be retained (abortion, gay marriage, maybe even some of Obamacare), although we shouldn't expect improvements. Plutocrats don't give a shit about the social stuff. They just use that as leverage to get what they want. Which is more and more money.

If Ryan wins, it's time for us all to become heroin addicts. We'll be fucked. We'll be a bona fide theocracy then. Anyway, we can't let our soldiers work in Afghanistan go to waste, so we might as well all get fucked up.

[CobaltBlue]

86. Coming this November…

cali writes,

I'm assuming, as I always have, that Hillary will be the nominee. Say she loses to Trump. Will there be any backlash against the party bigwigs that helped clear the field for her and shoved her relentlessly down the throats of democrats?

The corrupt DSW will be out? Who will replace her? The Clintons will be irrelevant. What will Obama's role be? Will a loss precipitate change in the party?

Who becomes the leader of the opposition in Congress? Does Pelosi stay on as minority leader?

Good questions.

Valid points.

But the Democratic Party's fate in the 2016 United States presidential election is not my personal concern.

If the party nominates Hillary Clinton, and wins, my vote didn't make a mathematical difference.

If the party nominates Hillary Clinton, and loses, my vote didn't make a mathematical difference.

I like the freeing feeling knowing that I, as just one individual human being and resident of the United States, am not accountable for the fate of a major political party.

There are some people who have convinced themselves otherwise.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

87. That's the one matchup the Democrats would be likely to win.

If the Democrats nominate Sanders, or the Republicans nominate anyone except Trump, then the Republicans will go into the election as the favourites (one might make a case for Clinton/Cruz being 50/50).

But Trump is widely hated outside his core vote; if the Democrats nominate someone who isn't a self-proclaimed socialist then they'd be likely to beat him.

[roamer65]

89. I think this country will have a hard time staying together no matter who wins. N/t

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

90. My guess?

There will be a push by the party apparatus to move even more states from primaries to caucuses, and especially closed caucuses. To ignore the fact that the Party is shrinking by giving regular voters even less control over any aspect of the primaries, and make it so that only those steeped most deeply in 'team spirit' get any say in who makes it to the general. And proclaim that it only makes sense because these are the people who have 'paid their dues'.

In short, the Democratic Party will continue to become ever less democratic.

[Maedhros]

91. The up-side to a Republican win is that Democrats will switch back to criticizing warmongers

instead of cheering them.

[Blasphemer]

97. Realistically, it would be a bump in the road

The country is at the beginning of a leftward correction. The winds have been blowing in that direction for awhile and though the pols have been reluctant to accept it over the past few years, Scalia's death made it official. A lot of the upheaval and divisiveness we are seeing on the left is due to the fact that we are at the precipice of something new and trying to navigate our way through it.

The GOP has a lot more to lose. A win puts enormous pressure on the party to have a successful presidency after the bust that was Dubya's reign. If they lose this election, they are done. If they win but the president is a failure, they are done. The Democrats can survive an election loss. And a moderate to liberal-leaning (though I am hoping for a well-cloaked strong liberal) replacement for Scalia will ultimately be beneficial to the Dems.

[cwydro]

99. Sneaky way to slide a primary thread into GD.

This belongs in GD - P, but you already know that. I won't bother alerting since the hosts must know it's here.

Trashing thread.

[Cobalt Violet]

106. The Third Way will die a long overdue miserably painful death!

Well I wish anyway. Unfortunately I think they will blame Hillary's recent movement to the left a bit. I don't think they will get it. I don't think they are capable of seeing where the electorate is really at.

[Deadshot]

109. What's the difference between Trump and Hillary?

Both are similar, as far as I'm concerned. The only difference is that Trump won't lie to your face.

[librechik]

113. It doesn't matter. Other people we don't know run the country

and they aren't elected.

They've been doing exactly what Bush would have wanted, no matter who is "in charge"

Nothing much will change


http://www.bostonglobe.com/ideas/2014/10/18/vote-all-you-want-the-secret-government-won-change/jVSkXrENQlu8vNcBfMn9sL/story.html

[WhaTHellsgoingonhere]

115. It appears to me that the R Party is 2 cycles ahead of Dems

The Rs were infiltrated by the Tea Party and its national pols have moved further to the right. Bernie has demonstrated one thing: the Third Way establishment is falling out of favor and being forced to, at least campaign, to the left as both Obama and now Hillary are doing. The radical R governs the way they campaign whereas the Dems campaign left, then govern right of center. To their own detriment: it can only turn people off. The next step would be to see a New Deal party aligned with Bernie's ideas to emerge. The Third Way is DOA.

[johnlucas]

117. This negative talk is why the Democratic Party is a bunch of wimps & weaklings

We are NOT losing in November.
We will CRUSH the Republican Party once & for all in 2016.

Talk with some strength & quit with this mealy-mouth whimpering.
That's why you don't win on framing narratives.
That's why you don't win on commanding public opinion on issues.
The Democratic Party has been WEAK WEAK WEAK for DECADES & it's time for it to stop.

The BERN is a Purifying Fire.
After these flames this party will be strengthened & renewed.
And it's heat will melt what's left of the Conversative Confederate Coalition & the Republican Party that houses it.

This weakness in the Democratic Party I want to see PURGED.
Democrats are just too scared & weak.
And that's why you lose. That's why you will CONTINUE to lose.
You wanna WIN? Pick up some goddamn courage & get back in the fight.

Blowtorch dem MFers!
BERN 'EM!!

John Lucas