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Tue Feb 16, 2016, 03:18 PM

Justice Antonin Scalia's Health Woes Weren't Publicly Disclosed Before His Death

Source: ABC News

Justice Antonin Scalia's Health Woes Weren't Publicly Disclosed Before His Death

By MEGHAN KENEALLY
Feb 16, 2016, 1:16 PM ET

Even though the relatives and doctors of the late Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia reportedly knew about his health conditions, the fact that the concerns were kept from the public is in keeping with the practices of the court, experts said.

Unlike the White House, which regularly releases updates on the president's health, the Supreme Court does not have set guidelines regarding what they do and don't disclose publicly.

Scalia's Health History

When the 79-year-old justice was found dead on Saturday in a hotel room at a luxury ranch in Texas, the county's presiding judge, Cinderella Guevara, was called and pronounced him dead.

Guevara said she spoke to Scalia's doctor in Washington who told her that Scalia had been sick and had visited his office twice during the week leading up to the trip.

The Associated Press reported that Guevara said the doctor told her that Scalia had a history of high blood pressure, heart trouble and was considered too weak to undergo shoulder surgery following a recent injury.

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Read more: http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/justice-antonin-scalias-health-woes-publicly-disclosed-death/story?id=36975416

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Reply Justice Antonin Scalia's Health Woes Weren't Publicly Disclosed Before His Death (Original post)
Eugene Feb 2016 OP
JustABozoOnThisBus Feb 2016 #1
book_worm Feb 2016 #2
Xipe Totec Feb 2016 #3
JustABozoOnThisBus Feb 2016 #4
pinboy3niner Feb 2016 #6
Xipe Totec Feb 2016 #8
pinboy3niner Feb 2016 #9
MADem Feb 2016 #23
Xipe Totec Feb 2016 #24
MADem Feb 2016 #41
Xipe Totec Feb 2016 #7
backscatter712 Feb 2016 #11
SickOfTheOnePct Feb 2016 #14
Xipe Totec Feb 2016 #15
Bernardo de La Paz Feb 2016 #16
bpj62 Feb 2016 #21
nadinbrzezinski Feb 2016 #22
Stryst Feb 2016 #37
JustABozoOnThisBus Feb 2016 #38
Stryst Feb 2016 #39
JustABozoOnThisBus Feb 2016 #40
hifiguy Feb 2016 #44
Baitball Blogger Feb 2016 #5
Bernardo de La Paz Feb 2016 #17
mythology Feb 2016 #26
hifiguy Feb 2016 #47
JI7 Feb 2016 #29
Frustratedlady Feb 2016 #10
houston16revival Feb 2016 #20
Javaman Feb 2016 #12
unapatriciated Feb 2016 #42
beac Feb 2016 #51
MisterP Feb 2016 #13
valerief Feb 2016 #35
Bernardo de La Paz Feb 2016 #18
3catwoman3 Feb 2016 #30
hifiguy Feb 2016 #46
TNNurse Feb 2016 #19
Liberty Belle Feb 2016 #25
47of74 Feb 2016 #48
3catwoman3 Feb 2016 #31
mgmaggiemg Feb 2016 #27
Warpy Feb 2016 #28
King_Klonopin Feb 2016 #32
Mira Feb 2016 #33
malaise Feb 2016 #34
valerief Feb 2016 #36
greymouse Feb 2016 #50
CommonSenseDemocrat Feb 2016 #43
hifiguy Feb 2016 #45
UCmeNdc Feb 2016 #49

Response to Eugene (Original post)

Tue Feb 16, 2016, 03:22 PM

1. Too sick and weak for shoulder surgery ...

... but good to go when it comes to shooting ducks, or buzzards, or whatever the heck a quail is.

On the other hand, if I had to pick a place to check out, that ranch with accommodations seems like a nice choice.

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Response to JustABozoOnThisBus (Reply #1)

Tue Feb 16, 2016, 03:23 PM

2. Actually I read he didn't shoot--only observed.

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Response to JustABozoOnThisBus (Reply #1)

Tue Feb 16, 2016, 03:24 PM

3. He should have taken the time to receive last rites while he could. nt

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Response to Xipe Totec (Reply #3)

Tue Feb 16, 2016, 03:32 PM

4. We don't know that he didn't receive them.

And I don't know when his last confession was. Maybe the previous Sunday?

Can they perform last rites on a corpse? Does he have to be alive at the time? I'm not a Catholic, and not much of anything else either, so I don't know how this stuff works.

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Response to JustABozoOnThisBus (Reply #4)

Tue Feb 16, 2016, 03:35 PM

6. He reportedly was given Last Rites Saturday afternoon, after he was dead. nt

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Response to pinboy3niner (Reply #6)

Tue Feb 16, 2016, 03:40 PM

8. Then it was not last rites

The last rites are the last prayers and ministrations given to many Catholics when possible shortly before death.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Last_rites

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Response to Xipe Totec (Reply #8)

Tue Feb 16, 2016, 03:48 PM

9. That's what was reported by a spokeswoman for the Diocese, according to the NYT

Scalia Received Last Rites From a Texas Priest
Laurie Goodstein Feb 13, 2016

Justice Antonin Scalia received last rites from a Roman Catholic priest, the Rev. Mike Alcuino, who serves at a parish in Presidio, Tex., and at several missions nearby, said a spokeswoman for the Diocese of El Paso, Elizabeth O’Hara.

Father Alcuino was called to the ranch in West Texas where the justice died on Saturday afternoon, she said.

The Death of Justice Scalia: Reactions and Analysis
http://www.nytimes.com/live/supreme-court-justice-antonin-scalia-dies-at-79/scalia-received-last-rites-from-local-priest/

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Response to Xipe Totec (Reply #8)

Thu Feb 18, 2016, 12:35 AM

23. You're not technically dead until there's a death certificate.

It's why, in some jurisdictions, if there's no doc about to say "He's dead," the deceased must be transported by ambulance.

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Response to MADem (Reply #23)

Thu Feb 18, 2016, 12:55 AM

24. Funny you should mention an ambulance in this regard

But first, regarding the death certificate, Presidio County Judge Cinderela Guevara said she pronounced Scalia dead over the phone at 1:52 p.m. on Saturday.

Now about the ambulance, this is a true story from my youth.

A motorcyclist got in the way of a dump truck at the intersection of two boulevards and ended up slamming into a reinforced concrete wall across the street from where I lived. The man was basically ground beef after the impact but still breathing. An ambulance was called but when they arrived the ambulance refused to pick up the body because they anticipated that the man would not make it alive to the hospital. If they picked up the man and he died in route they would then have to go to the funeral home instead of the hospital and they would waste the entire day there. So they wanted to call the funeral hearse and leave. My neighbor was not pleased with this so he went inside his home and came back out with a revolver. He threatened the ambulance crew that if they didn't pick up the guy and take him to the hospital, the hearse was going to pick up more than one body. With a gun literally inches from their face the orderlies reluctantly picked up the broken man from the sidewalk, put him in the ambulance, and drove away.

Kind of the same story but in reverse.

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Response to Xipe Totec (Reply #24)

Thu Feb 18, 2016, 12:54 PM

41. Wow, horrible orderlies~!

I was in a reverse situation where I had to take possession of a deceased non-military individual who had died at sea, and couldn't get an ambulance to come to the remote port where the remains were, and also couldn't get a hold of a doctor to declare the person dead so I could get a hearse (or a pickup truck) to remove him to the morgue which was some distance away. No doc, no death certificate, no hearse. This was happening in the context of a series of military evolutions that involved dozens of ships and thousands of personnel--there really wasn't time for this, but it was just 'one more thing.'

I ended up stuffing the body in a large fridge-cooler until a ship came by that had a doctor aboard who could do the sad duty. Then--like you have 'em onhand routinely--no one had a damn death certificate. So, I had to ask everyone in the vicinity to dig through their local files and see if they couldn't come up with one. That poor guy rested in the fridge for a good half day. Good thing we had the fridge, though--the temperatures got up in the high nineties and it was a very soupy, steamy and miserable day. After that, I ordered up death certificates and distributed them to all and sundry, just in case. Ya never know...!

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Response to JustABozoOnThisBus (Reply #4)

Tue Feb 16, 2016, 03:38 PM

7. Yes, you have to be alive and give your final confession while alive.

Otherwise, your last sins will go unpardoned.

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Response to Xipe Totec (Reply #7)

Tue Feb 16, 2016, 04:09 PM

11. And booooy, does he have a lot of sins to account for in his afterlife. n/t

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Response to Xipe Totec (Reply #7)

Tue Feb 16, 2016, 11:34 PM

14. Last Rites can absolve you without confession

I've not heard of them begin given after death, but confession isn't a requirement for absolution when Last Rites are administered.

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Response to SickOfTheOnePct (Reply #14)

Tue Feb 16, 2016, 11:36 PM

15. Good to know

Bless me father for I have sinned.

It's been 56 years since my last confession.

God willing, it will be 57.

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Response to SickOfTheOnePct (Reply #14)

Wed Feb 17, 2016, 04:13 PM

16. What a lot of convenient hooey for weak-minded Scalia to believe. Strict constructionalist? Bah. nt

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Response to SickOfTheOnePct (Reply #14)

Wed Feb 17, 2016, 09:57 PM

21. John Kennedy

Kennedy was basically dead on rhe table at Parkland Memorial Hospital but Jackie refused to let them pronounce him dead until last rights had been administered. You do not have to be concious to recieve them. Also they now call it The Sacrament of the sick.

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Response to bpj62 (Reply #21)

Wed Feb 17, 2016, 10:31 PM

22. Correct, one of my EMTs was a seminarian

 

so yes, he carried his sacraments and in more than one case administered them, even to people who have been obviously dead for a while. (As in rigor mortis has set in)

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Response to JustABozoOnThisBus (Reply #1)

Thu Feb 18, 2016, 11:54 AM

37. I had to look it up

But I think quail are some kind of miniature chicken? Maybe? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quail

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Response to Stryst (Reply #37)

Thu Feb 18, 2016, 12:02 PM

38. All I know is they're some kind of bird. And they can fly.

I don't know if chickens can fly, but they can use their wings to get up onto things, like picnic tables.

I have seen turkeys fly, so maybe a quail is a kind of turkey.

The only "hunted" bird I've eaten is pheasant. They're very tasty, but you have to avoid biting down on a piece of shot.

Bon apetit!

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Response to JustABozoOnThisBus (Reply #38)

Thu Feb 18, 2016, 12:08 PM

39. My first thought when I saw the picture on Wikipedia was

"Chicken". Then I realized that all birds pretty much look alike to me, so maybe not.

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Response to Stryst (Reply #39)

Thu Feb 18, 2016, 12:19 PM

40. Ha, yeah, I couldn't tell the Audubon Society from the Autobahn Society.

Except one is good for birds, the other not so much.

And I'm sure that any bird that flies up at that ranch will be called "Quail!!!" and thirty guns will open up on it.

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Response to JustABozoOnThisBus (Reply #38)

Thu Feb 18, 2016, 05:25 PM

44. "As god is my witness I thought turkeys could fly."

 

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Response to Eugene (Original post)

Tue Feb 16, 2016, 03:33 PM

5. Do you think he got bitter at the end and that's why he became so nasty and ornery?

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Response to Baitball Blogger (Reply #5)

Wed Feb 17, 2016, 04:14 PM

17. No, Michael Dukakis reports Scalia a racist in law school supported State's Rights to discriminate..

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Response to Baitball Blogger (Reply #5)

Thu Feb 18, 2016, 02:25 AM

26. Did you mean the end of kindergarten?

 

I'm guessing he was a sanctimonious asshole his entire life.

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Response to mythology (Reply #26)

Thu Feb 18, 2016, 05:30 PM

47. I worked briefly for a man who was a classmate of Scalia's.

 

Judging by what he said about him, you are correct. The Dukakis interview pretty much seals it.

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Response to Baitball Blogger (Reply #5)

Thu Feb 18, 2016, 03:05 AM

29. when was he not this way ?

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Response to Eugene (Original post)

Tue Feb 16, 2016, 04:04 PM

10. If he was in such bad shape he couldn't undergo surgery,

perhaps he should have penned a letter of resignation?

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Response to Frustratedlady (Reply #10)

Wed Feb 17, 2016, 05:00 PM

20. Perhaps

waiting for a GOP President

or in denial of health problems, the devoutly religious sometimes are

I would think someone so prominent, with the wherewithal, would have
a personal aid with him 24/7 if he knew he had health problems

But doctors can only recommend, the patient will do what he likes

and he died in his sleep, as many wish to, so who can argue with that
personal choice?

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Response to Eugene (Original post)

Tue Feb 16, 2016, 04:15 PM

12. don't you all worry, the right wing nuts will think the doc is a CIA plant. nt

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Response to Javaman (Reply #12)

Thu Feb 18, 2016, 03:20 PM

42. I know of one trump supporter who does indeed believe there was a cover up.

She is the only co-worker who is a trump supporter.
She was going on and on how disrespectful Obama is in regards to Scalia (because he was not going to the funeral). Stated he should have called for an autopsy considering Scalia was just as important as the president. She claimed it was a cover up and stated she thought he was murdered. Her proof was that he was found with a pillow over his head.

She really hates Sanders (Obama too) and calls him a communist who if elected will declare war on Russia.
Obama care is unfair because it forces her to buy health insurance (even though we are covered by our employer).
I could go on and on with what she said today in our break room but I'm sure you have heard the same shit from trump supporters.

She thinks trump is the only one who can save us. He will magically make everything peachy keene.


what is really crazy to me is she is AA.

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Response to unapatriciated (Reply #42)

Fri Feb 19, 2016, 10:08 AM

51. That people are latching onto the pillow is so nuts.

Yes, a murderer would smother someone with a pillow and then LEAVE THE PILLOW to be found.

Not to mention, if Obama was a murderous tyrant, why wouldn't he off Scalia sooner so that he wouldn't have to deal with this "let's wait until the next prez" nonsense?

Never mind that he was a fat, 79-year-old smoker with a bad heart. And surrounded by Republicans when he died. And his own family didn't want an autopsy.

The stupidity, it burns.

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Response to Eugene (Original post)

Tue Feb 16, 2016, 10:16 PM

13. OT, but "Cinderella Guevara" is the most awesome name I've heard today

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Response to MisterP (Reply #13)

Thu Feb 18, 2016, 10:51 AM

35. I concur! It's a MOST awesome name.

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Response to Eugene (Original post)

Wed Feb 17, 2016, 04:20 PM

18. By hiding his ill health, Scalia's enablers have enabled this huge conspiracy theory to bloom

Scalia was overweight, very probably obese, and maybe even morbidly obese.

Only right wing nut cases are surprised that a 79 year old obese man died in his sleep. Most of the nut cases won't live to be 79 because they won't sign up for Obamacare and love them some pork rinds (only some, just a few) and are very practiced at raising their blood pressure over phantom muslim sharia Presidents.

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Response to Bernardo de La Paz (Reply #18)

Thu Feb 18, 2016, 03:12 AM

30. Morbidly obese...

...is a pretty safe bet, IMO. As I have looked at the size of his face over recent years, I have speculated that his blood vessels were likely so clogged with plaque that the blood cells were having to squeeze thru in single file.

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Response to 3catwoman3 (Reply #30)

Thu Feb 18, 2016, 05:28 PM

46. An old man who obviously ate like a horse, smoked

 

and had a highly volatile temperament is a massive coronary just waiting to happen. The greater wonder is that he lasted as long as he did.

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Response to Eugene (Original post)

Wed Feb 17, 2016, 04:32 PM

19. I knew from the first moment I learned

how his death was pronounced there would be drama. In TN death can be pronounced by an MD with info from other medical personnel...RN, Paramedic. When only one of those involved is not medical, you are asking for problems. When someone that high profile dies unexpectedly ( at least for many), a doctor should have been involved....not necessarily a full autopsy but some kind of exam. Also in TN, the medical examiner for the county would have decided about an autopsy and if he or she ordered the family canot refuse.

The state of Texas apparently has a system that is bizarre. I was told it was created because of the limited number of MDs in rural areas so judges and Justices of the Peace were involved.

I was not a fan by any means but he was a Supreme Court Justice and there should have been an MD involved somehow.

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Response to TNNurse (Reply #19)

Thu Feb 18, 2016, 02:22 AM

25. Agree, you'd think they could at least run a toxicology screening

to rule out poisoning and quiet the conspiracy nuts.

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Response to Liberty Belle (Reply #25)

Fri Feb 19, 2016, 05:53 AM

48. I don't think even if Scalia came back from the dead

I don't think even if Scalia came back from the dead and said what happened it would shut up the nuts.

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Response to TNNurse (Reply #19)

Thu Feb 18, 2016, 03:24 AM

31. "Tele-medicine" is all the coming thing

If you can treat someone by phone, why not pronounce them dead by phone?

Some of the parents of our pediatric patients have access to something called Teladoc thru their employer-provided health insurance. These docs will diagnose and prescribe over the phone without ever having any IRL contactw ith you.

I have been a nurse practitioner for almost 40 years and find this idea appalling. When I am on call after hours and speak with parents who try to persuade me to prescribe sight-unseen, I always tell them that the very best I can do over the phone is to make a guess, and that I would hate to guess wrong for their child.

If telemedicine is the way of the future, I am very glad I am nearing retirement. Electronic medical records are bad enough.

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Response to Eugene (Original post)

Thu Feb 18, 2016, 02:39 AM

27. the 24/7/365 conspiracy theory factory

will continue enthusiasm unabated, by facts.

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Response to Eugene (Original post)

Thu Feb 18, 2016, 03:00 AM

28. I knew his color was getting bad and vaguely remember remarking about it.

That slightly dusky coloration is a sure sign of impending disaster.

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Response to Eugene (Original post)

Thu Feb 18, 2016, 05:30 AM

32. But he did NOT have hemorrhoids --

He was a perfect asshole.

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Response to Eugene (Original post)

Thu Feb 18, 2016, 09:26 AM

33. This entire thread

is a DUzy

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Response to Mira (Reply #33)

Thu Feb 18, 2016, 09:32 AM

34. And then some

The funniest part for me - an atheist who grew up with an obsessed Catholic mother - is that it matters whether the mumbo jumbo takes place before or after death. It's all BS anyway.

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Response to valerief (Reply #36)

Fri Feb 19, 2016, 08:42 AM

50. get a grip

There is no evidence whatsoever that Roberts has a drug problem. Let's not descend to the level of Republicans and other conspiracy nuts.

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Response to Eugene (Original post)

Thu Feb 18, 2016, 03:54 PM

43. So much for SCOTUSCare

 

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Response to Eugene (Original post)

Thu Feb 18, 2016, 05:26 PM

45. How unusual. An overweight 79-year-old man with high blood pressure,

 

an iffy heart, who smoked, dying of a massive heart attack. That NEVER happens. CONSPIRACY!!!!!

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Response to Eugene (Original post)

Fri Feb 19, 2016, 05:59 AM

49. They keep calling it a hotel room but it really sounds like a private home.

It sounds more like Scalia was at a rich person's private home not a hotel.

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