3-Year-Old Kicked Off Airplane for Crying

[MADem]

This is an interesting "issue" post--I know pretty much everyone has an opinion about loud or crying or unruly children on airplanes:

It’s every grumpy passenger’s dream and every parent’s nightmare. An unhappy 3-year-old child and his undoubtedly unhappier father were kicked off an Alaska Airlines flight from Seattle to Miami over the Memorial Day weekend after the child wouldn’t stay buckled in his seat.

Mark Yanchuk of Everett, Wash., and his son Daniel were starting the first leg of their journey toward a family vacation in the Virgin Islands. The boy’s mother, grandmother and younger sibling were seated in first class, while the toddler and his dad sat in coach. While the plane was at the gate, the boy happily played with an iPad, but when the airline requested all electronic devices be turned off, the trouble started. The toddler was unhappy that his toy was taken away and his father couldn’t get him settled. Alaska Airlines spokesman Paul McElroy told MSNBC that flight attendants went to check on the father and the boy several times before departure to try to help calm the child, but Daniel was cranky and, like many 3-year-olds, wouldn’t sit up in the oversize seat and allow himself to be buckled in. In defense of the flight crew’s actions, McElroy noted that, “The [seat] belt was across his neck and the flight attendants were worried that he would begin to choke himself.” Yanchuk said he would never allow his son to get into such a precarious position.


The child was finally properly seated and the plane pulled back from the gate, but when a flight attendant noticed the child was lying sideways in the seat again, the captain was notified and the plane returned to the gate. Yanchuk and his son were then asked to leave the plane. His wife, mother-in-law, and 1-year-old child opted to leave as well. Their baggage, however, was able to continue on to the Virgin Islands.

Airline spokesman McElroy said, “Everybody wanted to make this work, just trying to work with the child and get him to sit upright.” Yanchuk disagrees. “I think they overreacted. I know you get kicked off planes for dangerous situations like not wearing a seat belt or running around or something dangerous. But I didn’t see the situation as being dangerous at all,” Yanchuk told MSNBC.

http://newsfeed.time.com/2012/06/02/3-year-old-kicked-off-airplane-for-crying/

I empathize with parents dealing with unruly kids, but I gotta say, I wish someone had taken the screamer off the last flight I was on! Talk about torture--if I were a spy and had the "secret code" I would have given it up to make that kid stop!!

[MadHound]

1. Good for the flight crew

They made more than reasonable attempts to keep the kid and father on the plane, but that simply didn't work. Rather than wait and wait for the kid, the flight crew decided against inconveniencing the other passengers and further and did the right thing, kick them off.

[treestar]

2. I wonder if something as wrong with the kid

A 3 year old can be calmed down by his father, I'd think. They also had the option of trading seats and putting him in first class. Still don't see why can't the plane take off, even if a kid is screaming? It's not like the pilot will hear him.

[MadHound]

4. The plane can't take off because the kid wasn't sitting in his seat properly

Nor did he have his seatbelt on properly. That's why he was kicked off.

[treestar]

10. OK. Though still how come Dad had such a problem?

Three year olds can have discussions of some type. Heck, even the FA could nicely explain, "we sit up" or make it a game or adventure. Or get Mom, who maybe kid listens to better.

[tammywammy]

13. That's an issue for the family if the dad couldn't get him to sit up

The flight attendants made an effort, they could have done exactly what you said for all we know.

Did the dad ask for the mom? Why didn't the dad bring some other toy to keep him entertained? Those are family issues and not the responsibility of the airline.

[treestar]

16. why take offense?

I am only wondering how it became impossible for that silly kid to sit up. I am not making it the responsibility of the airline.

It is the Dad's problem and it's strange he could not fix it somehow.

[tammywammy]

18. No offense taken

I agree it's strange that a dad couldn't get his child to sit up. Poor planning on the parenting front if they had only thought an iPad would suffice for entertainment for the whole flight.

[cleanhippie]

33. "It is the Dad's problem and it's strange he could not fix it somehow. "

Correct, but the time to start doing it differently and "fixing" it is not on the airplane. These things start at home.

[MadHound]

14. Who knows,

Perhaps the kid has some sort of disability. Or perhaps the kid was simply being a stubborn unruly kid. I don't know, but it sounds like the airline made every accommodation for kid and Dad, and it simply got to the point where they couldn't wait any longer.

[Skidmore]

19. Do you have kids?

Once in a while, a kid will have a meltdown. Complete and total and rational explanations do not fit in. I can't think of any children I've known who haven't been overwrought or overly tired or overly stimulated who hasn't had one once in their lives. Heck, I'll lay odds that you probably melted down too. I'd rather deal with kid having a rough patch than an insufferable adult any day.

[treestar]

21. No though I've had several in my life

Have a three year old niece right now, so I guess I'm comparing to her. She does have meltdowns at times, but I think she could be controlled on a plane. I don't think she'd have a meltdown on a plane anyway, because it would be too exciting to be on it. Maybe this kid flies a lot.

[virgogal]

22. You are right. I had six and sometimes nothing works. I have

a granddaughter that had BRUTAL meltdowns but now is a lovely 12 year old.

[Life Long Dem]

44. They took his toy away.

The boy was pissed off and wanted his toy. So he stayed upset like a spoiled little brat. He probably gets away with getting what he wants by throwing tantrums. But this time the father couldn't give him what he wanted.

[tabbycat31]

50. at 3, the kid's carseat should be installed on the plane

[tammywammy]

7. It wasn't that the kid was screaming

Mark Yanchuk of Everett, Wash., and his son Daniel were starting the first leg of their journey toward a family vacation in the Virgin Islands. The boy’s mother, grandmother and younger sibling were seated in first class, while the toddler and his dad sat in coach. While the plane was at the gate, the boy happily played with an iPad, but when the airline requested all electronic devices be turned off, the trouble started. The toddler was unhappy that his toy was taken away and his father couldn’t get him settled. Alaska Airlines spokesman Paul McElroy told MSNBC that flight attendants went to check on the father and the boy several times before departure to try to help calm the child, but Daniel was cranky and, like many 3-year-olds, wouldn’t sit up in the oversize seat and allow himself to be buckled in. In defense of the flight crew’s actions, McElroy noted that, “The [seat] belt was across his neck and the flight attendants were worried that he would begin to choke himself.” Yanchuk said he would never allow his son to get into such a precarious position.

The child was finally properly seated and the plane pulled back from the gate, but when a flight attendant noticed the child was lying sideways in the seat again, the captain was notified and the plane returned to the gate. Yanchuk and his son were then asked to leave the plane. His wife, mother-in-law, and 1-year-old child opted to leave as well. Their baggage, however, was able to continue on to the Virgin Islands.

http://newsfeed.time.com/2012/06/02/3-year-old-kicked-off-airplane-for-crying/#ixzz1wkshZXu5

[Egalitarian Thug]

45. Sounds to me like there is something wrong with his parents. I must have missed the memo

directing parents to cease and desist teaching their children how to conduct themselves in public, and that it is incumbent on the rest of us to tolerate their little monsters-in-training.

[Beaverhausen]

3. Your headline is incorrect. They were kicked off because the child wasn't properly seated and belted

not because he was crying. Makes a big difference and unfortunately, I think the airline did the right thing.

[MADem]

25. Blame TIME, not me! I cut and pasted it right from the article! nt

[proud2BlibKansan]

5. Misleading headline

Sounds like he was kicked off for not sitting in his seat with his seatbelt in a safe position.

[MADem]

26. Yep--Time.com needs to fire the headline writer. NT

[TheManInTheMac]

55. This problem is running rampant in the media these days.

I suppose it's always been a problem. Face it, no one will click if the kid was kicked off the plane because he wouldn't obey the safety rules.

Heck, I'll bet they didn't really even kick the kid.

[ProdigalJunkMail]

6. bullshit headline...

the state of reporting is a joke...the child was NOT kicked off the plane for crying but for not sitting and being buckled in...repeatedly. why the fuck can't the headline just say what happened instead of trying to make the airline look like assholes. why the fuck is this even a story. you don't buckle-in...you don't fly.

sP

[tammywammy]

8. +1 n/t

[MADem]

28. Sex sells!! Er....well, any kind of drama sells!

I'm guessing "Child refuses to sit up during take-off; removed from flight" is kinda dull. But who doesn't relate to a CRYING KID ON PLANE in one way or another...!

[tawadi]

36. Yeah, but 'not following safety procedures' isn't a juicy headline. eom

[SheilaT]

9. Having travelled with my own kids when they were very young,

and having been a passenger on flights with very young children, I see both sides. But, and this is the huge thing, even a three year old can have learned just a little more self-control than that. Parents who constantly entertain their children in some say (and electronic devices are increasingly common) do those kids no favors. Even young children can learn a variety of ways to amuse themselves, including non-electronic ones.

We got in the habit of always having our own crayons and paper with us when we went into restaurants, so our boys could draw while waiting for the meal. On vacations I often bought new small toys so they'd having something novel to play with. It's not rocket science.

[treestar]

11. Good point. It would have been easier if the parents had

simply prepared him - this is what we do on airplane rides. Go through the seat belt thing with him and along with the crew when they do it. It's easy to make things a game for a 3 year old.

[SheilaT]

61. My oldest actually flew somewhat frequently

during the first three or four years of his life.

One time when he was about three or so, we were seeing off a relative at the airport. My son was quite disappointed when it turned it he wasn't going to get on board the airplane. He didn't exactly have a meltdown -- that was something that child simply never did -- but his chagrin was quite evident.

[Auggie]

12. +1 ... parental failure.

[FreeJoe]

15. Never had it happen on a plane...

...but when my kids were 2-3 years old, we had a few spectacular melt down tantrums. These usually came when the child was really tired and really over stimulated. One I recall was when we had to leave a toy store after he had played with a train set for about 20 minutes. I just carried him how and forcibly buckled him into his car seat and then road back with him while Mrs. FreeJoe drove us home. My point is that I could see it happening to any kid, or at least a lot of kids, if all the stars lined up just wrong.

I feel sorry for everyone involved, but I don't fault the airline or even the parents. Sometimes things in life just don't work the way we plan them. I would have tried to negotiate with the airline for a later flight and some reasonable charge and I would have made darn sure that my child understood the gravity of the situation (like you will never touch another iPad in your possibly very short life again if you can't sit properly on the plane!).

[tammywammy]

20. The airline offered them the same flight for the next day

The family declined and is getting a refund.

[FreeJoe]

24. Very nice of the airline

[Darth_Kitten]

54. Well, at least their luggage will have some sun and surf.

[kestrel91316]

17. Unruly, screaming people of ANY age are a safety issue on an airplane.

On a long flight, the other passengers might become unhinged because of screaming and disruptive behavior on the part of some uncontrollable child.

The "children can do no wrong" crowd on DU might disagree with me, but I have experienced this same sort of situation up close and personal, and if I had been forced to listen to THAT particular screamer for 4 hours in flight in addition to the two hours on the ground, I might have lost my mind and become dangerous (said little darling was directly across the aisle from me while we sat on the ground because of a winter weather delay in departing - when she wasn't tearing up and down the aisle in her hysterical tantrum).

[MADem]

29. I recently endured a long flight with a wailing child...

...and the little darling didn't sound a thing like Bob Marley, which might have made the exercise more tolerable.

Pure misery. Earphones mitigated it only lightly.

[obamanut2012]

23. Why not a book or coloring book for the plane taking off?

Good for the flight crew.

[MADem]

31. A book would work, or a little non-electronic toy

But coloring--naah. Gotta have that seat/tray table in the full upright position!

[Ian David]

27. At least the plane wasn't in the air when they kicked him off. n/t

[Quixote1818]

32. LOL! Reminds me of this scene!

[MADem]

39. Ha ha ha--love the boxing gloves...and the GUN! nt

[Quixote1818]

30. Tough call. I probably would have let it go

I know airlines are worried about safety but the fact is after a jet takes off and reaches cruising altitude people walk around without seat-belts anyway. Air flight is one of the safest ways to travel so even with the belt close to his neck with his dad there nothing was going to happen to the kid period.

I am a photographer and work with unruly kids all the time. It's an art to be able to get them to settle down and you must show the kid respect. Flight crews should have stuffed animals they can use to break the ice or coloring books. Anything that will allow the child to feel comfortable with them.

However, if the kid was going to be acting up the whole way they might have feared it could escalate to something very disruptive to everyone else on board and in that case they may have done the right thing. I just don't buy the "safety" excuse.

[MADem]

37. The job of the flight crew, though, is passenger safety and adhering to FAA requirements.

Anything else is fluff. The parents should really be prepared to care for their children and not expect the flight crew to entertain or distract--the flight attendants aren't day care workers and there is a LOT to do around the cabin in preparation for take off.

The seat belt, worn properly, is required of all passengers able to sit in a seat and wear one. There is no wiggle room for the flight crew on that score. It's an FAA mandate. They don't have time while preparing the cabin to be digging around for books (coloring would not work--the tray table has to be UP) or toys--and who would pay for those? Toys on the plane for "unruly kids" increase the weight (and fuel costs) so that's not going to happen; that's why the napkins and plastic glasses are paper thin, if you get a utensil it is a thin plastic spork, and the drinks are half size.

The parents could have maybe worked on prepping the kid a bit better--or having the whole family all sit together so Mom could discipline where Dad failed. I'm wondering if they booked too late as Mom, Granny and the younger child were in First Class, and Paw and the Terrible Threes kid were in coach. I suppose they didn't all want to "suffer" in coach which is why the ladies were up front (nice work if you can get it!)?

[Quixote1818]

41. Good points. My sister use to be a flight attendant

so it will be interesting to get her opinion. I can't imagine with the millions of flights a year this is the first kid to do this so my guess is many more flight attendants allowed something like this to slide hundreds of times.

[MADem]

47. I also have family in the airline industry so I routinely get an earful about

FAA mandates and flight crew minimums and too much work with not enough staff.

I think, if I had to engage in pure speculation, the kid was being a major pain in the butt--beyond just laying across the seat--and they didn't feel like flying cross-country with him acting up.

Or maybe they had an inspector flying along, and were thinking "let's be sure to do everything by the book?"

Hard to know, not being there, but I am thinking that it had to be pretty annoying and/or potentially unsafe if they went back to the gate with Little Mister Troublemaker.

[Quixote1818]

49. Hopefully it was a good lesson for the kid and maybe even the parents.

I probably woulden't try to fly with that kid until he gets a bit older.

[treestar]

42. Maybe the 3 year old was the one to put in First Class

The younger kid could be settled more easily.

[MADem]

46. Hard to know--maybe they were doing it on the cheap

and had the littlest kid as a "lap kid." In that case a first class seat would be a bit more roomy. I don't know how people can stand that, myself--that was part of the reason why the kid on my recent flight, screaming to beat the band, was unhappy--there were four people including the kid in a row of three seats--and the other two people were two rather large strangers who were not "with" the mother so there could be no handing the kid around.

[treestar]

48. Sounds claustrophobic.

I don't have problems with the idea that they would charge for a seat for a kid no matter how young.

[tawadi]

34. Wonder if this would have happened if the mother was with the child

Just wondering.

[MADem]

40. I know--she was in First Class with the younger kid and granny! nt

[KansDem]

35. "I wish someone had taken the screamer off the last flight I was on!"

I think a lot of it has to do with the parents/grandparents.

A few years ago, I flew from Minneapolis to Kansas City. There was a young child and a woman who appeared to be his grandmother sitting in front of me. Well, once we took off, the kid started fussing. The grandmother slid the blind up over the window and the kid quieted down because he had something to do--he looked out the window at the floating clouds and Earth passing under us. Then, the grandmother closed the blind and the kid started fussing again. He was screaming and crying and the grandmother was saying, "Oh, oh dear, please quiet down! Oh, oh...What's wrong? You're safe...Oh, oh dear" This went on for some time until the grandmother slid open the blind and the kid quieted down because now he had something to amuse him. Then after a few minutes, she closed it and the kid started screaming and crying...again!

The grandmother went into her "Oh, oh..." schtick again, and after what seemed like an eternity, she opened the blind and...guess what?...the kid quieted down.

But she did this several times! I wanted to scream out..."Hey, lady! Just keep the fucking blind open!!! Savvy??!!!"

Fortunately, Minneapolis to Kansas City isn't that far...

[MADem]

38. Ha ha!! That's kind of funny, in a torturous way!

Good thing it was a short flight...and during daylight!

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

43. FAA regulations

...require passengers comply with all signs and instructions. Failure to do so can jeopardize the crews' abilities during an emergency. Constant screaming or noise can interfere with nearby passengers correctly/completely hearing instructions. Not being seated/belted properly is a risk that any sane airline or crew member would be willing to risk or accept. Anything that furthers occupies the crews' attention can become a serious issue in an emergency.

I fly very often. Kids are kids but truly unruly ones are very rare.

[Major Nikon]

58. I tried that on my wife one time

I have my own airplane, and I told her if she didn't follow all my instructions that I'd call the tower and have her arrested for interfering with a flight crew.

I also tried to get her to wear a stewardess outfit. That one didn't go over so well either.

[Logical]

51. Stupid of them to allow the luggage to stay on. A MAJOR security breech!

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

59. Just more poor writing

Luggage is loaded without being organized. The only way to retrieve loaded bags is to unload ALL of them and have the passenger identify or match stubs. Alaska flies mostly 737s like Southwest. Seattle to VI is going to be a lot people headed for vacation for probably at least a week. I'd figure 2 bags each. Their planes carry 140 to 170 or so. That's a lot of bags to unload.

Why would you think it was a security problem?

[Logical]

62. The worry is that someone throws a fit or gets their kid to cry so that they can get off the jet....

because they have a bomb in checked luggage.

The rules say to remove the luggage of any passenger you remove from the plane.

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

65. It would seem easier...

...to check your bag and just not get on the plane.

The rules say to remove the luggage of any passenger you remove from the plane.

What rule? Whose rule?

[Logical]

66. If you check your luggage and do not get on the plane they remove your luggage.

I have seen it happen 2 times. I used to fly a lot.
Unless it has changed in the last 3 years.

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

71. I've not seen that.

Of course I fly USAir mostly and they're rather infamous for doing baggage wrong.

[demosincebirth]

52. "like many three year olds?" I don't think so.

[treestar]

57. True, otherwise all those 3 year olds would get thrown off too

Since that's why the kid was thrown off, if it's that common, then so would the throwing off be.

[Darth_Kitten]

53. It must suck to be 3 years old and have your iPad taken away from you.

n/t

[obamanut2012]

56. lol

[MADem]

63. I still don't have one of those things! I've survived! nt

[Darth_Kitten]

67. I still don't have a flatscreen monitor for my computer; little Lord iPad can...

just suck it up about not having his widdle gadget. Life is sometimes cruel and unjust, kiddo.

Oh, and Mommy and Daddy were taking you to the Virgin Islands? I guess you don't get that much needed break from day-care and playing all day.

[Nikia]

60. The parents should have picked something different for him to play with

As a parent of a three year old, it is risky to take something away that they are enjoying in a confined environment where it is difficult to redirect them. The parents should have known that it would have to be turned off suddenly and perhaps caused a negative reaction. Toys that the child could have played with at all stages of the flight would have been more appropriate and the meltdown would have probably been avoided.

[MADem]

64. BINGO! You win the thread--pity you weren't the kid's parent on that plane! nt

[avebury]

68. I was on a trans-atlantic flight one time and

there were two young brothers (who were old enough to know better) who proceeded to chase each other in circles around the plane. I have know idea where there parents were sitting but they obviously were letting their children run wild. All I could imagine is what would happen if one of them tripped and ended up accidentally pulling on an external door handle. They were a hazard to the entire plane. I waited until they came around the corner and I grabbed the first boy by the arm which sent him flying. I kept him from going face first into the floor and told both both to go sit down. That worked for a while until they began round 2. At that point I just got the flight attendant on them. Later on in the flight a young girl started running laps in the plane. I just had the flight attendant deal with her. I had no idea where her parents were either.


I have seen some parents do an excellent job with their kids on flights and I have seen some families I would have loved to have thrown off the plane. If parents let their children run wild I would have no problem with the pilot setting down at the nearest airport and kicking the family off the plane and not providing them with a replacement flight to their destination. Poor parenting is no excuse for allowing children to potentially endanger everyone on a flight.

[Darth_Kitten]

70. Cool. How come your story didn't hit the Associated Press?

Kids running wild on planes was an accident waiting to happen. I admire your restraint.

I wonder how fast the parents run to tell their tales of woe, about the big bad airlines and everything not falling into place for their little darlings?

God, I'm in a mood tonight.

[roamer65]

69. Sounds like the kid is a spoiled brat.

The parents need to change their ways with this kid.

The airline complied with rules and regs. You must be buckled and seated properly for the plane to take off...period.