HomeLatest ThreadsGreatest ThreadsForums & GroupsMy SubscriptionsMy Posts
DU Home » Latest Threads » Forums & Groups » Main » General Discussion (Forum) » How deep is NATO support ...

Mon Nov 30, 2015, 09:14 AM

 

How deep is NATO support for Turkey?

There has been a statement of support for Turkey's defense of its "Territorial integrity" by the hawkish, overall head of NATO, however there are also plenty of signs that a number of the alliance's members are privately less than enthusiastic, to say the least.




NATO headquarters. (AP)


No From NATO? Alliance Has ‘No Reason to Back Up Turkey’


The mere hope that NATO membership could give Turkey carte blanche to do anything it wants is profoundly wrong; even though the alliance has publicly supported Erdogan’s version of how the downing of the Russian bomber happened, its rhetoric in private could be the polar opposite, according to Czech geopolitical reporter Jakub Mareš. “If Erdogan hoped that NATO membership is a carte blanche, which allows him to do anything, it is profoundly wrong,” reads Jakub Mareš’s post on the geopolitical website Blog.Respect.

After the attacks in Paris, he adds, the policy of France and NATO towards Russia and its anti-ISIL campaign in Syria has changed. Now they understand that they need Russia to solve the Syrian crisis. On the other hand, the reporter says Turkey's policy in Syria under Erdogan is “quite a thorn in the heel”; partly because of its brisk trade with the Islamic State.

However, for NATO, Turkey is an absolutely indispensable member state because of its control of the Bosporus and the Dardanelles, but Turkey's regional policy directly conflicts with that of the other members. One can only assume that regardless of its public support for Erdogan’s account of the shooting down of the Russian Su-24, its comments in private may be the polar opposite.

Diplomatically, the Turkish move did not delight anyone, the blogger adds, noting that the alliance does not have any specific reasons to vehemently back up Ankara.

(snip)



Read more at: http://sputniknews.com/world/20151130/1030976020/nato-turkey-russia-defense.html


14 replies, 1065 views

Reply to this thread

Back to top Alert abuse

Always highlight: 10 newest replies | Replies posted after I mark a forum
Replies to this discussion thread

Response to another_liberal (Original post)

Mon Nov 30, 2015, 09:15 AM

1. sputnik. LOL...nt

Sid

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to SidDithers (Reply #1)

Mon Nov 30, 2015, 09:18 AM

2. What's that again?

 

(yawn!)

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to another_liberal (Original post)

Mon Nov 30, 2015, 01:08 PM

3. It seems NATO and the West are more interested in derogating Russia than fighting terrorists.

But it doesn't really matter now that Turkey has wisely chosen to keep its planes out of Syrian airspace, so it's time for Russia and Syria to finish the job against the terrorists.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to forsaken mortal (Reply #3)

Mon Nov 30, 2015, 01:12 PM

4. I'll drink to that!

 

Hear! Hear!

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to another_liberal (Original post)

Mon Nov 30, 2015, 01:18 PM

5. Geeze, Sputnik News again? And they're quoting "Jakub Mareš" on a geopolitical question.

Jakub Mareš, for those of you not savvy to the world of geopolitical theory and strategy... is a footballer from Prague, which is about as close to a Henry Kissinger clone you can get without becoming sane

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Bucky (Reply #5)

Mon Nov 30, 2015, 01:38 PM

7. Character assassination without a shred of comment the subject in question . . .

 

One has no idea what this responder thinks about the actual subject of whether or not there is real support for Turkey's actions within nations of the NATO alliance. All he provides are personal attacks on the commentator who was quoted.

(sigh)

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to another_liberal (Original post)

Mon Nov 30, 2015, 01:20 PM

6. One historical event to look at could be the 1974 Turkish invasion of Cyprus...

 

... and how there was later releases of info that hinted the U.S. supported this tacitly with Turkey's NATO relationship with the U.S. through the CIA. I likely knew people who's parents were perhaps involved with this when I lived there not long before this invasion happened.

http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/us-involvement-1974-cyprus-invasion-questioned

Haven't had time to study this today, but I'm sure some research on how this was handled might show how we would work with Turkey today on similar controversies with Russia now. I personally knew someone who's father was one who was temporarily held in the Soviet Union after one of the last spy plane incidents in that region.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to cascadiance (Reply #6)

Mon Nov 30, 2015, 01:42 PM

8. And the Turks are still there, occupying half of Greek Cyprus.

 

Last edited Mon Nov 30, 2015, 05:56 PM - Edit history (1)

If I'm not mistaken, the international community still recognizes the territory Turkey seized as part of independent Cyprus, so how can we allow that aggression to stand?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to another_liberal (Reply #8)

Mon Nov 30, 2015, 01:55 PM

9. It is a complicated issue, and you have many Turkish Cypriots living in that part too...

 

... where it's hard to just say "go away" where many of them have lived there all of their lives, and would be exploited by a Greek run system there too. It's a similar problem that Israel faces with Palestinians, etc. too.

I think the residue of this conflict was a big reason why Turkey was kept out of the EU earlier too.

I'm not disagreeing with you that there is perhaps some justice that still needs to happen, but I'm not sure that the answer to that is that simple.

Similarly, it is hard to know what the right answer to what happened to a Russian plane going over Turkish air space is as well. I think there are more details that need to be worked out between those countries for the protocol of such flights. Russia probably pushed in without negotiating that first too much, and arguably Turkey responded to heavily too as well when they did what they did earlier. The Kurdish conflict with Turkey and the Kurdish conflicts with ISIS are also very complicated too. When all three of these entities have in effect been at war with each other, it is hard to sift out who's right and who's wrong in these situations. Probably everyone has a little bit or a lot of both. I think most of us agree that what ISDS is doing is wrong and it needs to be shut down. But the PKK actions and Turkey's actions towards them complicate things there.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to cascadiance (Reply #9)

Mon Nov 30, 2015, 04:55 PM

10. The Turks invaded and seized Greek Cypriot national territory . . .

 

They did so through armed aggression, with no meaningful justifications, and they now claim that land as sovereign Turkish territory.

As to the sanctity of Turkish airspace:

Turkish military aircraft violated Greek airspace last year not once, not ten times and not one hundred times. They blatantly violated sovereign Greek airspace over twenty-four hundred times. Remember, that is twenty-four hundred times in just one year.

The number of Turkish planes violating Greek airspace which were shot down? Zero.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to another_liberal (Reply #8)

Mon Nov 30, 2015, 05:03 PM

11. The same way we allowed the Russian aggression into Georgia, the Crimea and Ukraine to stand.

The same way we allowed the expansive and aggressive actions into Georgia, the Crimea and Ukraine to stand

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to LanternWaste (Reply #11)

Mon Nov 30, 2015, 05:17 PM

13. That isn't even "apples and oranges". . .

 

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to another_liberal (Original post)

Mon Nov 30, 2015, 05:04 PM

12. If we ever did throw the Turks under the bus, we could start helping out the Kurds

 

Turkey is the main obstacle to us doing so, because they have a large Kurdish minority in their southeast, and they're worried about the rise of an independent Kurdistan.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to KamaAina (Reply #12)

Mon Nov 30, 2015, 05:51 PM

14. Yes, we could . . .

 

There would be trade-offs to that strategy, however, foremost being that we have not had much record of success with attempts at nation building in the Mid-East heretofore. The Kurds may well deserve support in their desire for nationhood, but are we currently the nation to try and help them?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Reply to this thread