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H2O Man

(73,528 posts)
Tue Jun 23, 2015, 03:02 PM Jun 2015

What ever happened to DU's H2O Man?

[A] Strength vs. Power: What is Behind Them

National Geographic: “What is the greatest power?”

Tadodaho Leon Shenandoah: “I myself have no power. It’s the people behind me who have the power. Real power comes from the Creator. It’s in His hands. But if you’re asking about strength, not power, than I can say that the greatest strength is gentleness.”


Sometimes when I read a number of OP/threads on DU:GD, I imagine this forum as a model of the human brain. Various forum members make contributions that I apply to various sections of that brain, including from the most evolved layers that distinguish our species from all of our relatives on earth. Others contribute thoughts or feelings that I attribute to the various other sections, right down to the bulb of our brain’s stem.

When that joyous season we call “the presidential primaries” come around, it is if they “waking brain” and the “sleeping brain” (highly technical terms, I know) are both turned on and highly active, both simultaneously and at the same time (one descriptive term for each level). The tensions between the two are charged by the various electrical impulses that energize the forum/brain.

Often, one section of the community will say, “But DU does not represent the United States electorate.” I say, “Thank goodness!” Could you imagine if we were condemned to spend time inside a republican party brain? Yikes! Far more pleasurable to be here.

Even in this DU brain, we note that some segments, or sub-systems, are convinced that they are the “real” form of high consciousness, and thus attempt to silence what they view as annoying thoughts that keep popping up. Thus, we see that a lot of the primary debates tend to be less about the individual candidate, and more about the individual(s) behind them. And that’s good, for we should know who supports what candidate, and why.

In fact, when we are deciding upon who will be president, we should consider who is behind their campaigns, and why.


Respect

Onondaga Chief Paul Waterman: “It’s hard for people from one culture to really understand another. There’s a site in West Virginia, where I have been asked to rebury 664 remains. But they are held in an Ohio museum. The people in Ohio asked me why I want to rebury people in West Virginia. And here I was wondering why they want to dig them up?

“I’m not sure everything can be explained. Some things you either understand, or you just don’t. Maybe the goal should be to teach respect for other people, even if you don’t fully understand them.”


When I read something on DU:GD, no matter if I agree or disagree with it, I tend to try to assign it to some reference point -- or, “file” -- in my brain. Frequently, I’m able to do that with some degree of accuracy. I “know” some people here, and am familiar enough with certain topics, that I am comfortable in doing that. I assume that I know what they are “really saying.” The problem in doing that -- both here and in real life -- is that sometimes I’m wrong. That’s part of being human, of course; the only people who honestly believe they approach every person and topic with a completely open mind are those incapable of being fully honest with themselves.

No matter if I am fully correct, totally incorrect, or somewhere in that wide range found in between, I have the constant option of having respect for the other person ….if not his or her opinion or actions. That, of course, can be difficult. Sometimes, very difficult -- for example, there are some issues that I think are really clear-cut, and that strike an emotional reaction. Usually, these are issues in which a person’s opinion is closely related to actions that cause some type of injury to others. These can range from people who attempt to justify violence -- from adults who hit kids, to those who advocate war -- to those who seek financial profit from engaging in the destruction of the living environment. “Fracking,” for example, poisons the water that sustains life on earth.

Yet there are many areas where disagreements are not so clearly defined, where there is not only one “correct” answer, or where there really isn’t a “wrong” answer. Thus, because other forum members have had different life-experiences than me, they are going to process some of the same information as me in a very different way. They have different “files” or reference points built into their gray matter. We all do, and that’s a good thing.

Recently, while discussing an area where I have disagreement -- strong disagreement -- with a small group of people who live in my area, my younger son reminded me of something. He said that I have to remember that most people did not grow up with mentors such as Leon Shenandoah, Paul Waterman, or Rubin Carter. Much less all three. So the chances of them viewing the issues in the same way, were rather small. And that even if I was convinced that I was 100% correct, I needed to listen closely to those other people. That I might even learn something.

Peace,
H2O Man

56 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
What ever happened to DU's H2O Man? (Original Post) H2O Man Jun 2015 OP
Hi and thanks. mmonk Jun 2015 #1
Hey! H2O Man Jun 2015 #2
Well that's how me and you are you know. mmonk Jun 2015 #4
That's what H2O Man Jun 2015 #23
To paraphrase a line from a movie... kentuck Jun 2015 #3
Amen mmonk Jun 2015 #5
Thanks, Brother Kentuck! H2O Man Jun 2015 #24
How ya doin' ? kentuck Jun 2015 #36
I'm good! H2O Man Jun 2015 #40
as always, thanks, kick and rec NRaleighLiberal Jun 2015 #6
Thank you! H2O Man Jun 2015 #25
There are two ways of looking at water bodies RobertEarl Jun 2015 #7
Outstanding! H2O Man Jun 2015 #26
Recommending this post as well, perfect AuntPatsy Jun 2015 #31
amen G_j Jun 2015 #8
Thanks! H2O Man Jun 2015 #27
RIP, H20 Man. You will be missed. randome Jun 2015 #9
I miss him already! H2O Man Jun 2015 #28
Time will heal all wounds... kentuck Jun 2015 #41
And, as John Lennon said, H2O Man Jun 2015 #42
I recall reading he was moving to Ireland Hoppy Jun 2015 #10
November. H2O Man Jun 2015 #29
What is the status of the road rage murder trial? Hoppy Jun 2015 #47
I wonder sometimes if there were no political parties how people would respond to certain issues. sabrina 1 Jun 2015 #11
Right! H2O Man Jun 2015 #32
I found his last posting: Gidney N Cloyd Jun 2015 #12
Yay! I was getting worried. calimary Jun 2015 #21
I think that H2O Man Jun 2015 #34
Awww... calimary Jun 2015 #46
Very nice! H2O Man Jun 2015 #49
Thank goodness! H2O Man Jun 2015 #33
Great power Capt. Obvious Jun 2015 #13
Exactly! H2O Man Jun 2015 #35
"but if you're asking about strength, not power, then I can say that the greatest strength is panader0 Jun 2015 #14
Uncle Leon was H2O Man Jun 2015 #39
Four letters on his gravestone... Flying Squirrel Jun 2015 #15
He was an odd fellow ..... H2O Man Jun 2015 #43
I think you hit on something there. zeemike Jun 2015 #16
+1 mmonk Jun 2015 #17
Right. H2O Man Jun 2015 #50
I never got a chance to see that series. zeemike Jun 2015 #56
pshaw--even sheep have a neocortex! (KnR) MisterP Jun 2015 #18
Even Richard Nixon has got soul. H2O Man Jun 2015 #51
It seems your younger son annabanana Jun 2015 #19
Thank you! H2O Man Jun 2015 #52
Always the Voice Of Reason. Thank you. byronius Jun 2015 #20
Thanks! H2O Man Jun 2015 #53
I think Aretha agrees with you. malthaussen Jun 2015 #22
Beautiful! H2O Man Jun 2015 #54
I'm always puzzled by lack of respect... malthaussen Jun 2015 #55
Writing thought provoking honest and sincere ops for us to enjoy, last. Heard AuntPatsy Jun 2015 #30
Makes me remember D. Ray White seveneyes Jun 2015 #37
Thank you H2O Man. lovemydog Jun 2015 #38
Mentors, routinely have been marginalized, defamed or silenced for many years. kickysnana Jun 2015 #44
KnR, H2O Man. I always read your posts. Hekate Jun 2015 #45
I mentioned you in a reply a couple of days ago.. see it here... Ghost in the Machine Jun 2015 #48

H2O Man

(73,528 posts)
24. Thanks, Brother Kentuck!
Tue Jun 23, 2015, 05:11 PM
Jun 2015

In my opinion, you are --based upon your contributions on DU:GD -- of the part of our community's brain that creates logical insights, based upon rational thought. I always enjoy reading the things you post on DU ....and absolutely appreciate when you add your thoughts to one of my posts.

H2O Man

(73,528 posts)
40. I'm good!
Tue Jun 23, 2015, 05:34 PM
Jun 2015

Thanks for asking. And how are things your way?

(I have been involved in a few communities' events in a manner which, already today, has resulted in two friends calling to say that they are upset by some peoples' (verbal) attacks on me. I understand why they are upset. But I assure them that I don't feel that stick. I'm comfortable in doing that which I am convinced is right.)

H2O Man

(73,528 posts)
25. Thank you!
Tue Jun 23, 2015, 05:13 PM
Jun 2015

It's a strange time in social-political life in our nation. But we can keep DU:GD at a calmer, more open to disagreement place. And your contributions to just that are appreciated!

 

RobertEarl

(13,685 posts)
7. There are two ways of looking at water bodies
Tue Jun 23, 2015, 03:22 PM
Jun 2015

One is to see just the reflection; The sun or other light shining on the surface.

The other is to look into. To look into one must get around the reflection. And when one does, the realization that there is life in that water, indeed, a whole 'nother world that lives in water, often comes as a great surprise.

Given our bodies are made up mostly of water, are we not looking at a water body when we look at each other?

I'd write more but I have to go pee. <grin>

H2O Man

(73,528 posts)
26. Outstanding!
Tue Jun 23, 2015, 05:16 PM
Jun 2015

I love it!

The symbolism of a pond (lake, ocean, etc) is fantastic. And surely, insightful people throughout time have used it this way, to illustrate the various levels of human consciousness.

I'm really happy that you posted this on this OP/thread. It is certainly the stuff of an outstanding OP. (I'll be looking for it!)

 

randome

(34,845 posts)
9. RIP, H20 Man. You will be missed.
Tue Jun 23, 2015, 03:27 PM
Jun 2015

Oh. Wait. That's not...I didn't...never mind.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]"If you're bored then you're boring." -Harvey Danger[/center][/font][hr]

H2O Man

(73,528 posts)
29. November.
Tue Jun 23, 2015, 05:19 PM
Jun 2015

I did get a call from my normal brother on Sunday; he said that I need to hurry up and meet him over there. He is finding the Old Sod transformational.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
11. I wonder sometimes if there were no political parties how people would respond to certain issues.
Tue Jun 23, 2015, 03:39 PM
Jun 2015

When they had no reason to defend a politician, their team, would they look more closely at the issue?

I believe a few of the FFs warned against political parties accurately predicting what would happen once they were established, which happened pretty quickly airc.

Imagine a country where a politician did not have a party machine with all its trappings, pundits, advisers, political 'experts' testing the 'waters' to see what would 'sell' in an election?

My observations, and I was once very much part of it, are that many people will ignore the consequences of decisions being made if the politician and/or party they support are making them.

Great observations, as usual, H20 Man.

H2O Man

(73,528 posts)
32. Right!
Tue Jun 23, 2015, 05:22 PM
Jun 2015

Very good. And exactly on target.

Sometimes, when enough people think in a good way, and are thus influenced to act in that way, it can move mountains. I think that your post, like Lennon's song "Imagine," is about the benefit to human-kind, in moving in that direction.

H2O Man

(73,528 posts)
34. I think that
Tue Jun 23, 2015, 05:26 PM
Jun 2015

all of us on DU:GD are stuck with that crusty old character, H2O Man. Such a mean old man. But his sister calimary can always be counted upon to bring rational, up-beat contributions to his forum.

H2O Man

(73,528 posts)
33. Thank goodness!
Tue Jun 23, 2015, 05:23 PM
Jun 2015

If I had seen that posted on here before I wrote & posted my OP, I wouldn't have had to write and post it. I already would have.

panader0

(25,816 posts)
14. "but if you're asking about strength, not power, then I can say that the greatest strength is
Tue Jun 23, 2015, 03:45 PM
Jun 2015

gentleness." Truer words were never spoken.

H2O Man

(73,528 posts)
39. Uncle Leon was
Tue Jun 23, 2015, 05:31 PM
Jun 2015

an amazing human being. It was funny: in his later years, he liked to work as a grounds-keeper at Syracuse University. I know this is speculation on my part, but I don't think that many people there knew who that old fellow working with the plants on the campus's lawn really was. But, those who did, counted themselves lucky.

There's a great book that I know you would appreciate, "To Become a Human Being: The Message of Tadodaho Chief Leon Shenandoah."

zeemike

(18,998 posts)
16. I think you hit on something there.
Tue Jun 23, 2015, 04:03 PM
Jun 2015

The lack of mentors with wisdom.

In this time our only wise men appear in TV screen or on a stage as an image or a show. There is nothing real about it...and the wisdom is questionable.

H2O Man

(73,528 posts)
50. Right.
Wed Jun 24, 2015, 09:58 AM
Jun 2015

Your response got me thinking .....the last time that I can recall a serious televised series on people with wisdom to offer was a series by Bill Moyers, that I believe was called "A World of Ideas." For Moyers had learned of what is known as the Power of Ideas.

My favorite interview, not surprisingly, was with Leon and Paul's nephew, Chief Oren Lyons, a Faith-Keeper at Onondaga. I remember how impressed Mr. Moyers was that the collective wisdom of the Iroquois was an unbroken chain, that went far, far into humankind's past. And that it offered nourishment for hungry minds today -- for, as Oren says, great truths are constant.

zeemike

(18,998 posts)
56. I never got a chance to see that series.
Wed Jun 24, 2015, 01:48 PM
Jun 2015

It may have been a time when I did not have TV...but Bill Moyer is a rare intellect on TV.

But I looked it up. it is on you tube and so is chief Chief Oren Lyons...now I have something new to watch.

H2O Man

(73,528 posts)
52. Thank you!
Wed Jun 24, 2015, 10:11 AM
Jun 2015

Even at his young age, I have more regard for his insight and advice on social-political issues, than for that of those I've worked with for longer than he's been alive. Obviously, I've had some influence on him, but not only did he grow up knowing the three gentlemen he mentioned, but he's had formal (and informal) educational opportunities very different from my own. I learn a lot from him!

byronius

(7,392 posts)
20. Always the Voice Of Reason. Thank you.
Tue Jun 23, 2015, 04:40 PM
Jun 2015

And may nothing ever happen to you that is not Good.

Wait -- on edit -- nothing bad happened to H2OMan, right?

H2O Man

(73,528 posts)
53. Thanks!
Wed Jun 24, 2015, 10:15 AM
Jun 2015

(The "title" to this essay was a tongue-in-cheek commentary on some of the negative undercurrents on the forum. Likely one of those sad attempts at humor that is only a giggle for me. But I'm fine. Enjoying life.)

malthaussen

(17,184 posts)
55. I'm always puzzled by lack of respect...
Wed Jun 24, 2015, 10:23 AM
Jun 2015

... well, that's not accurate, I'm not puzzled by it at all, it comes from ignorance (if we are being generous) or the simple desire to put others down (if we are being realistic). But logically, I'm puzzled how anyone can justify telling someone they are not experiencing/have not experienced what they say they have. How do I become the authority on your life?

-- Mal

lovemydog

(11,833 posts)
38. Thank you H2O Man.
Tue Jun 23, 2015, 05:30 PM
Jun 2015

I listen to you and appreciate your thoughts. Sometimes I learn something. Sometimes it's nice knowing there are good hearted people out there. I appreciate reading from all here who have compassion toward the earth and other beings on our often whacky planet.

kickysnana

(3,908 posts)
44. Mentors, routinely have been marginalized, defamed or silenced for many years.
Tue Jun 23, 2015, 08:14 PM
Jun 2015

Some notably murdered. We are living in "interesting times".

The total control of the media, the rise of anti-democratic politics in communities, Churches, schools and workplace have made living in America a nightmare for far more than the dream promised by our Bill of Rights and Constitution.

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