Wed Apr 22, 2015, 08:48 PM

malaise (225,635 posts)

Liz Warren is correct - give the public the facts

If it's such a great deal, why the secrecy?

36 replies, 6204 views

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36 replies	Author	Time	Post
Liz Warren is correct - give the public the facts (Original post)	malaise	Apr 2015	OP
So damn true. What a scam. I love her. So clear and so smart. Wow, we need her. nt	Logical	Apr 2015	#1
Right, lay it all out, let the press & people see it as she said. Also how Americans have been	appalachiablue	Apr 2015	#6
Fugg the press and their hacks	malaise	Apr 2015	#8
Including independent, alternative media, not only M$M is likely what Warren meant	appalachiablue	Apr 2015	#15
OK to that part of the press n/t	malaise	Apr 2015	#27
The public will never the facts when they have been established. n/t	1StrongBlackMan	Apr 2015	#2
I think there's a typo in your post.	morningfog	Apr 2015	#4
Yes ... Darned "smartphone ...	1StrongBlackMan	Apr 2015	#7
After the law is passed?	WhaTHellsgoingonhere	Apr 2015	#11
That is not what is going to happen ...	1StrongBlackMan	Apr 2015	#13
How many of those days does Congress have to be in session?	WhaTHellsgoingonhere	Apr 2015	#16
I don't know; but, I suspect ...	1StrongBlackMan	Apr 2015	#17
120 days is a lot. Can't wait to see how they divvy it up once...	WhaTHellsgoingonhere	Apr 2015	#18
120 days is more than enough time for ...	1StrongBlackMan	Apr 2015	#20
So no public input as to what is or is not included,	morningfog	Apr 2015	#21
There has NEVER been public input into ANY international negotiation ...	1StrongBlackMan	Apr 2015	#24
You prefer it this way? You like NAFTA?	morningfog	Apr 2015	#25
Having participated in "high stakes" negotiation ...	1StrongBlackMan	Apr 2015	#29
It's a corporate coup!	JDPriestly	Apr 2015	#31
Yeah. Okay. n/t	1StrongBlackMan	Apr 2015	#34
On this issue she's the champion of the people - and also of democracy.	polichick	Apr 2015	#3
More than reasonable	still_one	Apr 2015	#5
Yes.	emulatorloo	Apr 2015	#9
Agreed.	KeepItReal	Apr 2015	#10
There are protests in the other signatory countries. And EU has protests about the TTIP.	djean111	Apr 2015	#12
The public will see it	KMOD	Apr 2015	#14
It's incredibly naive to think that after all the effort	morningfog	Apr 2015	#19
But Wyden won a provision that will allow the Senate to turn off the fast track authority .	KMOD	Apr 2015	#22
Plus Obama and the next President has Fast Track authority until 2021.	Elwood P Dowd	Apr 2015	#23
This has been addressed	MannyGoldstein	Apr 2015	#26
And where is Hillary Clinton on this issue?	SheilaT	Apr 2015	#28
K&R.	JDPriestly	Apr 2015	#30
Yep. So much for President Transparency, huh?	AzDar	Apr 2015	#32
https://jahanc.files.wordpress.com/2012/04/obama-laughing-on-af1.jpg	blkmusclmachine	Apr 2015	#33
The truth will set us all free. K&R	closeupready	Apr 2015	#35
stupid people think we just need to TRUST	Skittles	Apr 2015	#36

Response to malaise (Original post)

Wed Apr 22, 2015, 08:49 PM

Logical (22,457 posts)

1. So damn true. What a scam. I love her. So clear and so smart. Wow, we need her. nt

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Response to Logical (Reply #1)

Wed Apr 22, 2015, 08:53 PM

appalachiablue (30,237 posts)

6. Right, lay it all out, let the press & people see it as she said. Also how Americans have been

hurt by these trade deals in the past. Warren's truth and courage are precious, esp. in this corporate age-

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Response to appalachiablue (Reply #6)

Wed Apr 22, 2015, 08:56 PM

malaise (225,635 posts)

8. Fugg the press and their hacks

the vast majority of the press are corporate hacks. Make it public -let the people read and understand the deal.

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Response to malaise (Reply #8)

Wed Apr 22, 2015, 09:06 PM

appalachiablue (30,237 posts)

15. Including independent, alternative media, not only M$M is likely what Warren meant

when she brought up the press. The woman's smart, as we know.

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Response to appalachiablue (Reply #15)

Wed Apr 22, 2015, 09:35 PM

malaise (225,635 posts)

27. OK to that part of the press n/t

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Response to malaise (Original post)

Wed Apr 22, 2015, 08:50 PM

1StrongBlackMan (31,849 posts)

2. The public will never the facts when they have been established. n/t

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Reply #2)

Wed Apr 22, 2015, 08:51 PM

morningfog (18,115 posts)

4. I think there's a typo in your post.

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Response to morningfog (Reply #4)

Wed Apr 22, 2015, 08:54 PM

1StrongBlackMan (31,849 posts)

7. Yes ... Darned "smartphone ...

The public will HAVE the facts when they are established.

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Reply #7)

Wed Apr 22, 2015, 08:59 PM

WhaTHellsgoingonhere (5,252 posts)

11. After the law is passed?

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Response to WhaTHellsgoingonhere (Reply #11)

Wed Apr 22, 2015, 09:04 PM

1StrongBlackMan (31,849 posts)

13. That is not what is going to happen ...

there will be a release to the public (and Congress) 120 days before any congressional vote.

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Reply #13)

Wed Apr 22, 2015, 09:09 PM

WhaTHellsgoingonhere (5,252 posts)

16. How many of those days does Congress have to be in session?

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Response to WhaTHellsgoingonhere (Reply #16)

Wed Apr 22, 2015, 09:12 PM

1StrongBlackMan (31,849 posts)

17. I don't know; but, I suspect ...

the clock is based on congress in session.

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Reply #17)

Wed Apr 22, 2015, 09:15 PM

WhaTHellsgoingonhere (5,252 posts)

18. 120 days is a lot. Can't wait to see how they divvy it up once...

They start the clock.

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Response to WhaTHellsgoingonhere (Reply #18)

Wed Apr 22, 2015, 09:19 PM

1StrongBlackMan (31,849 posts)

20. 120 days is more than enough time for ...

the agreement to be released, advocates (on both sides) to analyze and parse every single line of the document, and then communication assent or rejection to our Congressional Reps.

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Reply #13)

Wed Apr 22, 2015, 09:19 PM

morningfog (18,115 posts)

21. So no public input as to what is or is not included,

and we'll be given 120 days to bark at the cloud. Meaningless. This is a secret deal to benefit those privy to it. Those on the outside are getting screwed.

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Response to morningfog (Reply #21)

Wed Apr 22, 2015, 09:24 PM

1StrongBlackMan (31,849 posts)

24. There has NEVER been public input into ANY international negotiation ...

this brand new "public input/negotiation transparency" bone being chewed is completely ahistorical.

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Reply #24)

Wed Apr 22, 2015, 09:32 PM

morningfog (18,115 posts)

25. You prefer it this way? You like NAFTA?

You think this is going to be a great deal?

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Response to morningfog (Reply #25)

Wed Apr 22, 2015, 09:45 PM

1StrongBlackMan (31,849 posts)

29. Having participated in "high stakes" negotiation ...

I recognize the efficacy of non-public negotiations, where only the final deal is made public.

You think this is going to be a great deal?

I don't know. But if I had to guess (based primarily on the speculation track record of DUers that are convinced it will be a bad deal), I would goal in that it'll be a GREAT deal.

But if I had to guess based on the available information ... I'd have to pass, as there is no way to know.

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Reply #29)

Wed Apr 22, 2015, 09:48 PM

JDPriestly (57,936 posts)

31. It's a corporate coup!

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Response to JDPriestly (Reply #31)

Wed Apr 22, 2015, 10:27 PM

1StrongBlackMan (31,849 posts)

34. Yeah. Okay. n/t

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Response to malaise (Original post)

Wed Apr 22, 2015, 08:50 PM

polichick (37,151 posts)

3. On this issue she's the champion of the people - and also of democracy.

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Response to malaise (Original post)

Wed Apr 22, 2015, 08:53 PM

still_one (77,018 posts)

5. More than reasonable

This is the DU member formerly known as still_one.

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Response to malaise (Original post)

Wed Apr 22, 2015, 08:56 PM

emulatorloo (38,000 posts)

9. Yes.

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Response to malaise (Original post)

Wed Apr 22, 2015, 08:58 PM

KeepItReal (7,761 posts)

10. Agreed.

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Response to malaise (Original post)

Wed Apr 22, 2015, 09:01 PM

djean111 (14,255 posts)

12. There are protests in the other signatory countries. And EU has protests about the TTIP.

Just Google TPP protest country of your choice.

Not just us protesting.

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Response to malaise (Original post)

Wed Apr 22, 2015, 09:05 PM

KMOD (7,906 posts)

14. The public will see it

The final wording of the Trans-Pacific Partnership has to be made public at least 60 days before Obama signs any agreement. Congressional action likely would take another two months, which Wyden said gives the public and lawmakers plenty of time to understand and debate the provisions in the trade pact, which is still under final negotiations.

http://www.oregonlive.com/mapes/index.ssf/2015/04/ron_wyden_reaches_deal_on_fast.html

http://www.finance.senate.gov/download/?id=FEC41212-F7AF-4A6D-BF83-978401999DAF

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Response to KMOD (Reply #14)

Wed Apr 22, 2015, 09:17 PM

morningfog (18,115 posts)

19. It's incredibly naive to think that after all the effort

put in this far, that it won't be signed at the end of the 60 and 120 days.

The problem is, any public input at that point would be aye or nay for a done deal.

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Response to morningfog (Reply #19)

Wed Apr 22, 2015, 09:21 PM

KMOD (7,906 posts)

22. But Wyden won a provision that will allow the Senate to turn off the fast track authority .

Wyden fought for, and won, a number of provisions aimed at ensuring greater public transparency in the trade negotiations, as well as a key provision that would allow the Senate to turn off the fast-track authority if the Obama administration fails to live up to certain requirements during the negotiations.

"One issue that has come up again and again is the excessive secrecy that seems to have accompanied so much of this debate," Wyden said Thursday. "American trade policy needs to be debated openly."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/post-politics/wp/2015/04/16/senators-bipartisan-bill-would-give-obama-key-powers-on-trade/

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Response to morningfog (Reply #19)

Wed Apr 22, 2015, 09:24 PM

Elwood P Dowd (10,898 posts)

23. Plus Obama and the next President has Fast Track authority until 2021.

Remember CAFTA? Bush submitted that using Fast Track authority given him a few years earlier. Everyone said it didn't have the votes to pass. They called a late night session, greased a few palms, twisted a few arms, and passed it at 2:00 AM one Saturday morning.

Passing TPA could come back to haunt us for years depending on who wins in 2016.

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Response to malaise (Original post)

Wed Apr 22, 2015, 09:35 PM

MannyGoldstein (34,589 posts)

26. This has been addressed

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026551860

The real question is why people are following a "former" Republican. Very telling, I think.

Regards,

TWM

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Response to malaise (Original post)

Wed Apr 22, 2015, 09:39 PM

SheilaT (23,156 posts)

28. And where is Hillary Clinton on this issue?

The oh, so populist Hillary these days. Have I missed all the threads crowing about how she's ahead of Warren on this issue? Do I need the sarcasm thingy?

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Response to malaise (Original post)

Wed Apr 22, 2015, 09:46 PM

JDPriestly (57,936 posts)