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Mon Mar 30, 2015, 08:12 PM

Breaking in Indiana: Right Center (right) Indy Star Editorial: Fix this law Now.

Indystar is a Gannett paper. It leans right - but gives some voice to center and to center left. It is more sympathetic to business than to teaparty factions of the GOP. This Editorial takes a strong imperative tone (albeit some diplomatic/concilliatory face-saving parts for the GOP) but it is ground breaking. This is not an opinion columnist, this is the Editorial Board - that is notoriously delibrative. They work not to over-reach to hit a news cycle. They had to work fast on this one as events have unfolded quickly over the past 4-5 days.

http://www.indystar.com/story/opinion/2015/03/30/editorial-gov-pence-fix-religious-freedom-law-now/70698802/

Editorial: Gov. Pence, fix ‘religious freedom’ law now

We are at a critical moment in Indiana’s history.

And much is at stake.

Our image. Our reputation as a state that embraces people of diverse backgrounds and makes them feel welcome. And our efforts over many years to retool our economy, to attract talented workers and thriving businesses, and to improve the quality of life for millions of Hoosiers.

All of this is at risk because of a new law, the Religious Freedom Restoration Act, that no matter its original intent already has done enormous harm to our state and potentially our economic future.


more at above link.

The Editorial breaks through the Gov.s claim (echoed by rwing media) that this is the same as other laws in 20 states - in very clear language. Points out that the protections not provided in this law (but in the other states' laws) have been in place in Indianapolis for a decade.

I am going to cheat here and add a few more lines - because this is ground breaking per a Star editorial and per these quickly unfolding events:

We urge Gov. Pence and lawmakers to stop clinging to arguments about whether RFRA really does what critics fear; to stop clinging to ideology or personal preferences; to focus instead on fixing this.

Governor, Indiana is in a state of crisis. It is worse than you seem to understand.


Wow.

A few days ago I didn't intend to spend hours monitoring developments and sharing them on this front. But events started moving so quickly. And for once I had the space of time to keep checking and sharing. I think this is possibly momentous on a number of fronts (not necessarily the end result, which we don't yet know, - but the dynamics of the change in political climate even when it looked inhospitable, in how those dynamics between state events - national reactions - and the ongoing dynamic between the two - and the very strong actions taken by different players today that suddenly weaken the position of a dominant party (with presidential aspirations) the state house.

When this plays out - I will write about all of these interesting dynamics and how they have turned a super majority intent on not listening to the will of the state - into proverbial whipping boys. But for now I will try to keep finding and sharing each signal that the tidal wave of back lash (local and national) grows larger.

Peace,

salin


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Arrow 33 replies Author Time Post
Reply Breaking in Indiana: Right Center (right) Indy Star Editorial: Fix this law Now. (Original post)
salin Mar 2015 OP
RKP5637 Mar 2015 #1
salin Mar 2015 #2
Old and In the Way Mar 2015 #27
cwydro Mar 2015 #3
City Lights Mar 2015 #4
Skittles Mar 2015 #5
salin Mar 2015 #8
Skittles Mar 2015 #12
salin Mar 2015 #15
Skittles Mar 2015 #18
jeff47 Mar 2015 #31
foo_bar Mar 2015 #6
hatrack Mar 2015 #16
salin Mar 2015 #20
Cha Mar 2015 #7
salin Mar 2015 #9
Cha Mar 2015 #13
salin Mar 2015 #17
sheshe2 Mar 2015 #10
Downwinder Mar 2015 #11
niyad Mar 2015 #14
Jack Rabbit Mar 2015 #19
salin Mar 2015 #21
Ed Suspicious Mar 2015 #22
Iwillnevergiveup Mar 2015 #23
ismnotwasm Mar 2015 #24
NBachers Mar 2015 #25
herding cats Mar 2015 #26
lovemydog Mar 2015 #28
Gothmog Mar 2015 #29
Marthe48 Mar 2015 #30
GeoWilliam750 Mar 2015 #32
blkmusclmachine Mar 2015 #33

Response to salin (Original post)

Mon Mar 30, 2015, 08:15 PM

1. Thanks for the updates!!!

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Response to RKP5637 (Reply #1)

Mon Mar 30, 2015, 08:26 PM

2. thanks for the conversations (and kicks) - I think we are witnessing something important

a total implosion of rw supremacy in governance in a state (until recent years Indiana was reliably centrist republican, with some centrist democrats - and a few urban liberal democrats). Gov Dense's defense that this law is about Government Overreach - is ironic in this powerful backlash at... - political government overreach.

The Indy star comments until the last year or two have been so overloaded with rw trolling - that reading the responses now (far in the majority supportive of human rights) that it also suggests that even in red states tolerance and welcomeness have increased dramatically.

Ironically that something that started steeped in hatred and exclusion - seems to be giving way to something much more hopeful (not the legislation - but the attitudes and willing to fight of those in opposition.)

So glad to share this journey in conversation with you RKP!

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Response to salin (Reply #2)

Mon Mar 30, 2015, 11:36 PM

27. Fascinating observation.

When no RW trolls will comment in defense of this BS legilsation, you know you are screwed. True, you didn't write it, but you did sign it and that makes Mike a friggen idiot. Enjoy the end of your po.itical career....moron.

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Response to salin (Original post)

Mon Mar 30, 2015, 08:29 PM

3. K and R. nt

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Response to salin (Original post)

Mon Mar 30, 2015, 08:30 PM

4. Wow, thanks for posting this, salin!

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Response to salin (Original post)

Mon Mar 30, 2015, 08:31 PM

5. what exactly do they mean by FIX IT

the intention of the law is to DISCRIMINATE so how exactly would they FIX IT

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Response to Skittles (Reply #5)

Mon Mar 30, 2015, 08:42 PM

8. They are giving a face saving (sorta) fix

they aren't requiring a repeal. They requiring essentially adding sexual orientation in to the protected classes for civil rights - so that the nondiscrimination aspect (claimed by the GOP - but not backed up by their legislative history) is codified.

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Response to salin (Reply #8)

Mon Mar 30, 2015, 08:59 PM

12. what rights exactly are they trying to protect?

they don't seem to provide any examples of what was so lacking that they desperately needed this law

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Response to Skittles (Reply #12)

Mon Mar 30, 2015, 09:21 PM

15. indeed. Either on the eve of signing or the day after - the Gov was asked

about specific situations where an individual's religious freedom needed such protection. He admitted he knew of no such case.

The point is teaparty posturing. Or was. Indeed many of the Big Business interests lobbied against the bill - and reportedly were turned away by the (over confident) GOP. Some testified (raising the issues that have been raised in the past few days since the law was passed) - but the teapartiests wouldn't listen.

Interesting lesson in media coverage. Across both houses of the legislatures only 5 republicans vetoed the bill. Suddenly over the weekend they were of interest .. and were profiled in the INdystar. Of course no mention of the democratic members who vetoed.

This was a masquerade ball to let rw religious folks discriminate against the gays. The back lash has torn off the mask at the masquerade. The only options for the gov and legislature are to stand adamantly - and let the state's economy take huge multiple hits - and declare that the rights for a portion of the state to discriminate against gays is in the greater good of the state than having a healthy economy (kiss your political careers Good Bye!), repeal the law and acknowledge either you were ignorant about the law, or acknowledge and give mea culpa per the intent, or pretend (like Pence and the leaders of both the state house and senate did) that there was NO discriminatory intent - and pass a new piece of legislation (which is what the Mayor of Indianapolis called for tonight, what the CEO of 9 large businesses in Indy did tonight, and what finally, the Indy star called for tonight.

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Response to salin (Reply #15)

Mon Mar 30, 2015, 09:42 PM

18. excellent analysis, salin



I too believe this is more "dog whistle for teabaggers" bullshit, only THIS time people are asking questions

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Response to Skittles (Reply #12)

Tue Mar 31, 2015, 11:35 AM

31. The original trigger for these kinds of laws

was Employment Division v. Smith http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Employment_Division_v._Smith

Short version: Two men were fired because they used peyote in a Native American religious ritual. They tried to get unemployment, and were denied because they were fired for misconduct - using peyote.

The original laws were written to try and reverse this treatment by government. To formalize and broaden things like underage drinking laws being ignored during Communion - people under 21 drink wine.

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Response to salin (Original post)

Mon Mar 30, 2015, 08:33 PM

6. "our image" ...sigh.

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Response to foo_bar (Reply #6)

Mon Mar 30, 2015, 09:28 PM

16. What "image" would that be? Gay-bashing rednecks who circle jerk BBB like this . . . .

. . . while HIV infection clusters among IV drug users blossom in flat-broke corners of the state?

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Response to hatrack (Reply #16)

Mon Mar 30, 2015, 09:45 PM

20. while we ignore the cluster of months...because on "religious" grounds we

are against needle exchanges. Gov. signs a 30-day executive order to lift the needle ban. How much will that do? How long will it take in those 30 days to establish a program, how much can be accomplished in 30 days?

There is research that indicates that this is an effective approach to dealing with such epidemics. Both stories are tied together by the damage of religious beliefs trumping responsible governance. But in this second story - lives are at risk.

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Response to salin (Original post)

Mon Mar 30, 2015, 08:38 PM

7. "It is more sympathetic to business than to teaparty factions of the GOP." Yeah, I would think!

Gov Dense is getting majorly Scolded by the Indiana Star! "..to focus instead on fixing this.." Brilliant!

Mahalo, salin, for all you're doing on these breaking stories. Glad you have the time now.. Peace to you~

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Response to Cha (Reply #7)

Mon Mar 30, 2015, 08:46 PM

9. Thank you Cha.

It is, in my reading memory, unprecedented. Glad to be able to share - and hope that when the story ends - it ends with extended rather than further limited rights - and with a new blue print on how to leverage change in places with state house locks that make change seem impossible.

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Response to salin (Reply #9)

Mon Mar 30, 2015, 09:00 PM

13. Yes, I imagine it's unprecedented! This is what would have been in store for Gov Brewer

of Arizona if she would have been so obtuse as to let the AZ teaparty run her state.

Once again the teaparty overplays its hate and happens!

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Response to Cha (Reply #13)

Mon Mar 30, 2015, 09:33 PM

17. spot on.

She, however, was slightly smarter than Pence - er Gov Dense. So he didn't get to witness the aftermath.

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Response to salin (Original post)

Mon Mar 30, 2015, 08:48 PM

10. Kick

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Response to salin (Original post)

Mon Mar 30, 2015, 08:49 PM

11. That should build a fire.

Was thinking Gannett should be added to the boycott list, but maybe not.

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Response to salin (Original post)

Mon Mar 30, 2015, 09:05 PM

14. k and r

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Response to salin (Original post)

Mon Mar 30, 2015, 09:43 PM

19. Thanks for posting, but I cannot entirely agree with the Star

Why not simply repeal RFRA? First, it appears to be politically unacceptable for the governor and many Republican lawmakers.

Second, there are Hoosiers who support RFRA out of a genuine desire to protect religious freedom. To safeguard that essential freedom, 19 states and the federal government have adopted RFRA laws, largely without controversy. But states like Illinois not only protect religious freedom through RFRA but also provide gay and lesbian residents with protected legal status.

Third, repeal might get rid of the heat but it would not do what is most important – to move the state forward.

The intention of the law is to pit one group of citizens against another by allowing the first group to discriminate against the second. I cannot imagine a law to protect religious freedom as Governor Pence and the state legislators envision it -- Christianity not in the spirit of Christ but in the tradition of the Spanish Inquisition -- that would make an anti-discrimination statement that wouldn't simply gut the law.

Religious freedom is not threatened by gay rights. I would never propose a law that would force a priest or minister to perform a ceremony that he believes is an abomination, although I couldn't disagree with the priest or minister more. The priest or minister is free to rail against homosexuality from his pulpit. No one has to listen to, and I would hope no one would. Nevertheless, that's asking too much of an imperfect world and we taxpayers have better things to pay the police to do than try to stop hate speech in the name of Christ from some of his misguided followers.

Therefore, those who passed this law with the intent to license discrimination and now are worried that tourists who be be made to feel unwelcome in Indiana and will just plan their vacations elsewhere can't have it both ways. The only message that be construed as putting the situation right is to repeal the act as fast as the legislature passed it.

By the way, I have fond memories of a trip to Indiana whit I was five years old. Dad has signed up for some classes held in Warsaw, Indiana, near Winona Lake, so we drove more than halfway across the country from California. What was so wonderful about Indiana? I discovered fireflies there. I still think they are truly wondrous creatures.

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Response to Jack Rabbit (Reply #19)

Mon Mar 30, 2015, 09:49 PM

21. would love to k & r this post per your concern/objections to the Editorial

strong points!

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Response to salin (Original post)

Mon Mar 30, 2015, 09:50 PM

22. K&R

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Response to salin (Original post)

Mon Mar 30, 2015, 10:08 PM

23. I think this will have an impact,

but the fact that a few newspaper honchos felt it had to be written, makes me very sad.

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Response to salin (Original post)

Mon Mar 30, 2015, 10:22 PM

24. Thank you so much for posting

K&R

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Response to salin (Original post)

Mon Mar 30, 2015, 11:20 PM

25. This whole juggernaut of response is breathtaking- and it's gaining strength; it's not letting up.

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Response to salin (Original post)

Mon Mar 30, 2015, 11:22 PM

26. Slain, you're an amazing source of info on the local side of this.

I just wanted to let you know I appreciate that.

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Response to salin (Original post)

Mon Mar 30, 2015, 11:43 PM

28. Those hate-filled republicans should repeal the law

or suffer the economic consequences. The editorial gives some lame excuses for not repealing the law:

Why not simply repeal RFRA? First, it appears to be politically unacceptable for the governor and many Republican lawmakers. Second, there are Hoosiers who support RFRA out of a genuine desire to protect religious freedom. To safeguard that essential freedom, 19 states and the federal government have adopted RFRA laws, largely without controversy. But states like Illinois not only protect religious freedom through RFRA but also provide gay and lesbian residents with protected legal status. Third, repeal might get rid of the heat but it would not do what is most important – to move the state forward.

I disagree with the reasons cited. Just repeal the lousy law.

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Response to salin (Original post)

Tue Mar 31, 2015, 07:10 AM

29. Good Editorial

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Response to salin (Original post)

Tue Mar 31, 2015, 10:16 AM

30. If you want to worship your religion

stay the hell out of American government. People like Pence make me want to puke. Jesus Christ said it counted more to worship in secret than out in public. Oh yeah, once again, these fanatics are not Christian.

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Response to salin (Original post)

Tue Mar 31, 2015, 04:21 PM

32. Especially interesting

As this paper was run by the Quayle family for decades.

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Response to salin (Original post)

Tue Mar 31, 2015, 08:15 PM

33. Too little, too late.

 

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