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Thu Dec 25, 2014, 03:09 PM

Can the Federal government disband the Police Union?

I can't help but think with the complete disrespect shown by the police union to the Mayor of New York and in some ways the President, is it possible for the federal government to disband the police union? As they have shown complete disregard of heirarchical authority and have remonstrated against any checks and balances, it is with that in mind that I asked the question, can the police union be disbanded?


Have a Merry Christmas DU.

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Arrow 53 replies Author Time Post
Reply Can the Federal government disband the Police Union? (Original post)
Hutzpa Dec 2014 OP
SickOfTheOnePct Dec 2014 #1
Major Nikon Dec 2014 #8
AngryAmish Dec 2014 #35
ileus Dec 2014 #2
Hutzpa Dec 2014 #6
pintobean Dec 2014 #10
Hutzpa Dec 2014 #13
Major Nikon Dec 2014 #12
Hutzpa Dec 2014 #26
Major Nikon Dec 2014 #28
pintobean Dec 2014 #9
Yo_Mama Dec 2014 #40
951-Riverside Dec 2014 #20
juxtaposed Dec 2014 #36
easychoice Dec 2014 #21
Posteritatis Dec 2014 #31
tammywammy Dec 2014 #3
Hutzpa Dec 2014 #14
tammywammy Dec 2014 #17
gladium et scutum Dec 2014 #27
tblue37 Dec 2014 #42
gladium et scutum Dec 2014 #47
SheilaT Dec 2014 #4
easychoice Dec 2014 #5
GGJohn Dec 2014 #11
Hutzpa Dec 2014 #16
GGJohn Dec 2014 #18
Major Nikon Dec 2014 #30
Yo_Mama Dec 2014 #41
X_Digger Dec 2014 #7
99th_Monkey Dec 2014 #15
Brickbat Dec 2014 #19
treestar Dec 2014 #22
DrDan Dec 2014 #23
TorchTheWitch Dec 2014 #33
DrDan Dec 2014 #38
Yo_Mama Dec 2014 #43
DrDan Dec 2014 #45
randome Dec 2014 #24
GOLGO 13 Dec 2014 #25
msongs Dec 2014 #29
tularetom Dec 2014 #32
Historic NY Dec 2014 #34
customerserviceguy Dec 2014 #37
Yo_Mama Dec 2014 #39
WillowTree Dec 2014 #44
Township75 Dec 2014 #46
Hutzpa Dec 2014 #49
MineralMan Dec 2014 #48
Nye Bevan Dec 2014 #50
Thinkingabout Dec 2014 #51
NaturalHigh Dec 2014 #52
Comrade Grumpy Dec 2014 #53

Response to Hutzpa (Original post)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 03:15 PM

1. I'm sure there are circumstances

under which the National Labor Relations Board can decertify a union, but over something like showing disrespect to an elected official? I highly doubt it, and would hope that they cannot be disbanded for that.

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Response to SickOfTheOnePct (Reply #1)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 03:25 PM

8. The circumstances are violations of certain labor laws

And even if they were decertified, they would retain the right to reorganize. At any rate it's an extremely rare event.

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Response to SickOfTheOnePct (Reply #1)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 05:00 PM

35. NLRB has no jurisdiction

 

Public unions are a state created creature.

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Response to Hutzpa (Original post)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 03:19 PM

2. So we're against unions on DU now?

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Response to ileus (Reply #2)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 03:22 PM

6. I am not against union

I am agianst an organization that refuses to rail in wayward members. Members that feel they're above the law or the law does not apply to them.

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Response to Hutzpa (Reply #6)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 03:26 PM

10. Who is we?

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Response to pintobean (Reply #10)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 03:28 PM

13. Probably need to edit that

Meant to write 'I'

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Response to Hutzpa (Reply #6)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 03:27 PM

12. No union has the responsibility to "rail in wayward members"

That is the job of management.

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Response to Major Nikon (Reply #12)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 04:12 PM

26. Then there in lies the problem

if we're in the opinion that no union should be held accountable for their actions, then I'm afraid we are in a way contributing to their abusive actions.

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Response to Hutzpa (Reply #26)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 04:19 PM

28. I'm not sure who "their" refers in your alleged problem

A union is responsible for it's own actions, not the actions of its members. A union works for its members, not the other way around. Your claim is like saying a lawyer should be responsible for their clients' actions.

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Response to ileus (Reply #2)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 03:25 PM

9. No shit.

If the first amendment doesn't apply to unions, we may as well just scrap the bill of rights.

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Response to pintobean (Reply #9)

Fri Dec 26, 2014, 08:47 AM

40. Yes, this is a fascist suggestion.

There is no type of organization more entitled to political speech than a union.

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Response to ileus (Reply #2)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 03:59 PM

20. ileus, the question should be: Do Police Unions stand in solidarity with YOU?

 

...or is it just a one way street?


Source


Source


Source

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Response to 951-Riverside (Reply #20)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 05:17 PM

36. police pretty much stick with themselves and the hell with the other unions

A few exceptions that i've seen have been Wisconson state capital and boston during a solidarity gathering with wisconson.

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Response to ileus (Reply #2)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 04:03 PM

21. nope,just gangs of criminal conspirators wearing badges...

biggest gang of terrorists in america...

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Response to ileus (Reply #2)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 04:37 PM

31. This place often gets pretty authoritarian about unpopular unions

Teachers' unions also come to mind, etc. It's depressing.

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Response to Hutzpa (Original post)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 03:19 PM

3. Giving the federal government the ability to disband unions they perceive as "disrespectful"

Isn't a path I'd want to go down.

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Response to tammywammy (Reply #3)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 03:33 PM

14. Yes but, I will like to investigate their efforts in

containing the use of excessive police brutality, wouldn't you agree?

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Response to Hutzpa (Reply #14)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 03:37 PM

17. I think the DOJ can and should investigate civil rights violations

I don't think the federal government should start investigating unions or individuals they perceive as disrespectful.

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Response to tammywammy (Reply #3)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 04:17 PM

27. With you on this

First the police Unions, next the Government employees, next the United Mine Workers, Teamster, IBEW, etc., etc., etc. If Government can disband a union, what happens when the Republicans control the Congress and the White House. Bad idea, imo.

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Response to gladium et scutum (Reply #27)

Fri Dec 26, 2014, 08:58 AM

42. Reagan was the union buster ( PATCO, remember?). We deplored that, for good reason,

and we should deplore any other union busting moves.

The proper route is to publicly *shame* the union jerks like Lynch for their disgusting remarks. Lynch actually has been pretty widely slammed for his comments.

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Response to tblue37 (Reply #42)

Fri Dec 26, 2014, 10:55 AM

47. 100 % Agree n/t

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Response to Hutzpa (Original post)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 03:21 PM

4. I rather doubt it.

 

If the union isn't a federal one, the federal government has no control over it, other than whatever federal laws apply in various circumstances.

Perhaps if the police union in question is chartered by the city or the state government, either of those two entities might be able to do something.

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Response to Hutzpa (Original post)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 03:21 PM

5. The Feds can smithereen any criminal enterprise...

anywhere any time.

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Response to easychoice (Reply #5)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 03:27 PM

11. Yes they can,

but police unions aren't criminal enterprises in any sense of the law.

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Response to GGJohn (Reply #11)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 03:36 PM

16. If the federal government feels

their is abuse of power within ranks or the carjoling of officers that are constantly abusing thier power, shouldn't the feds stepped in with sanctions?

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Response to Hutzpa (Reply #16)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 03:39 PM

18. I don't want to give the feds that kind of power,

it can be abused too easily by successive admins.

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Response to Hutzpa (Reply #16)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 04:27 PM

30. The feds sometimes do

But against the management who actually controls the workforce. Not the union who doesn't.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/07/24/justice/justice-department-new-orleans-police/

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Response to Major Nikon (Reply #30)

Fri Dec 26, 2014, 08:50 AM

41. Right, specific members or a group of members in management who are criminals

BUT NOT THE UNION MEMBERS.

Anyone who thinks the federal government should have a right to disband unions is a long way from Democratic thinking, IMO.

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Response to Hutzpa (Original post)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 03:25 PM

7. Yeah, it takes some chutzpah to suggest that unions be disbanded for 'disrespect'.

By what legal theory might that happen? Oh wait.. there isn't one.

*sigh*

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Response to Hutzpa (Original post)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 03:35 PM

15. The most despicable kind of authoritarian disrespects authority

 

when it suits their narrow selfish interests to do so.

Police "unions" operate more like a classic protection racket than a real union.

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Response to Hutzpa (Original post)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 03:49 PM

19. Wow, no thanks.

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Response to Hutzpa (Original post)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 04:03 PM

22. In this legal system, only people who are found to have committed the criminal acts

are responsible. None of us has a duty to rein in anyone else. That would be oppressive and burdensome. We can't control other people, period. If another white woman of Christian upbringing commits a crime, I have no duty to do anything other than cooperate if I'm a witness but take on no responsibility for reining her in. And that applies to every other race, religion and profession.

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Response to Hutzpa (Original post)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 04:05 PM

23. I can't believe I am reading this on DU

there was a similar post couple weeks ago calling for the end of collective bargaining for the police.

UNBELIEVABLE!

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Response to DrDan (Reply #23)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 04:54 PM

33. It's been said many times by many people

That's how lunatic the cop hate brigade is here. Actually, they're a hell of a lot worse than that.

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Response to TorchTheWitch (Reply #33)

Fri Dec 26, 2014, 08:00 AM

38. what a slippery slope this would be - what a HUGE victory for the rw

they would like nothing more than the ability to dissolve unions at will

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Response to DrDan (Reply #23)

Fri Dec 26, 2014, 08:59 AM

43. I hadn't seen an earlier post but this one shocked me awake for sure.

This is supposed to be Democratic Underground!

The implications of this are so frightening! If the federal government had the power to disband the police union, it would have the power to disband organizations that are leading the protests. That's for starters.

The maintenance of American democracy requires that we defend the rights of people to speak when we do not agree with them. If we lose that concept, we have lost it ALL.

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Response to Yo_Mama (Reply #43)

Fri Dec 26, 2014, 09:16 AM

45. so who would be next? the teachers unions? government employees?

The rw has already shown their "hate" for these two groups in the attacks the past few years.

Post this nonsense belongs on that (not-to-be-mentioned) other site.

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Response to Hutzpa (Original post)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 04:11 PM

24. 'The' police union?

 

Unbelievable.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]Treat your body like a machine. Your mind like a castle.[/center][/font][hr]

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Response to Hutzpa (Original post)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 04:11 PM

25. Showing their true colors when they talk about "getting rid" of any unions.

Your hatred of unions is quite telling. Please tell us who and who should not be unionized, please.

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Response to Hutzpa (Original post)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 04:20 PM

29. probably not, it hasn't disbanded the klan either and they may be similar organizations nt

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Response to Hutzpa (Original post)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 04:39 PM

32. Not for statements some asshole made

They should not be punished for exercising free speech. If they undertake a work slowdown, sick-in, or strike, the public, and by extension, its representative government, has to ask itself, how badly we need their services, and whether we would be better off without them. Or having their services provided in a different manner.

Many of us who live in remote areas are effectively without the services of law enforcement anyway. If our sheriff's department didn't exist, my neighbors and I would probably be unaware of the fact.

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Response to Hutzpa (Original post)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 04:58 PM

34. Only Reagan could do that...

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Response to Historic NY (Reply #34)

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 05:36 PM

37. Yeah, that was my thought

I remember when he shut down PATCO, and hired non-union workers to replace them. I don't want to see any governmental entity with that kind of power ever again.

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Response to Hutzpa (Original post)

Fri Dec 26, 2014, 08:45 AM

39. No, specifically forbidden by US Constitution

Unless it becomes a criminal organization, the First Amendment grants citizens the right to assemble peacefully and petition the government. It does not matter whether you or anyone else objects to what they have to say - they have the right to say it.

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Response to Hutzpa (Original post)

Fri Dec 26, 2014, 09:03 AM

44. What other unions would you like to see the Feds break up?

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Response to Hutzpa (Original post)

Fri Dec 26, 2014, 09:28 AM

46. Could Bush disband DU or MoveOn due to the disrespect shown to him

And others in the hierarchy?

This is fucking stupid to even think about.

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Response to Township75 (Reply #46)

Sun Dec 28, 2014, 04:17 PM

49. Is DU a union? Is MoveOn a union?

If so since when did these forums become a union? I'd like to know numpty and you call me stupid.

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Response to Hutzpa (Original post)

Fri Dec 26, 2014, 11:01 AM

48. No, it can't. Free Association and the Right to peaceably assemble.

The answer is almost never for the Federal government to disband anything. That's why the Constitution forbids such things.

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Response to Hutzpa (Original post)

Sun Dec 28, 2014, 07:39 PM

50. Disbanding unions for perceived disrespect towards those in authority?

Really?

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Response to Hutzpa (Original post)

Sun Dec 28, 2014, 07:59 PM

51. If the government starts disbanding unions it will continue to other groups, we

Don't want to start this. We. They could disband schools, churches and any group who shows disrespect. I do not condone the disrespect of the police turning their backs on Di Blasio but nit at funerals, they should be paying their respect. Very bad decision by their leaders, the leaders should have said "we will not disrupt arrangements for our fallen police, it will be another time and place" a good leader could have halted this before it happened.

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Response to Hutzpa (Original post)

Mon Dec 29, 2014, 11:40 PM

52. Is this even a serious question?

Surely you know that the federal government cannot shut down the police union and should not ever have that power.

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Response to Hutzpa (Original post)

Mon Dec 29, 2014, 11:45 PM

53. They ought to RICO the whole NYPD.

 

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