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trof

(54,255 posts)
Wed Apr 11, 2012, 07:01 PM Apr 2012

My take on the Martin-Zimmerman case:

Yeah, there haven't been near enough threads on this.

Whatever...
Here's one old guy's thoughts.

It's a sad and regrettable situation.
I feel sorry for Trayvon's family and friends, but I also feel sorry for George.
He must be scared shitless right now, and wondering how and why he ever got himself into this mess.
His life is over, no matter what the outcome.
Of course his family is devastatingly affected too.

I don't think he went out with the idea of actually shooting anyone.
What we've learned about him is that he appeared to be a cop wannabe who couldn't make the grade.
About all I've learned about Trayvon is that he was apparently innocently on his way to a home in the neighborhood.
At night.
Wearing a hoodie.
Maybe...MAYBE grounds for police to question him (shouldn't be, but given the times...)


But George took it upon himself to confront Trayvon.
Even though he'd been in contact with the Sanford police dispatcher, who told him to stand down.
Told him to cease pursuing Trayvon.

George then became frightened when he pressed on and did confront Trayvon and maybe got more than he bargained for.
And he had the gun and so it goes.

I don't think George went out that night with a plan to shoot a black teenager.
2nd degree murder sounds about right.

But George was certainly aided and abetted, even INSTIGATED by Florida laws that said he could carry a concealed weapon and that given some kind of confrontation he didn't have to take the prudent action of just leaving the scene.

It's very sad that two families' lives have been forever darkened and saddened by this.






29 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
My take on the Martin-Zimmerman case: (Original Post) trof Apr 2012 OP
you are a better person than I, then. Whisp Apr 2012 #1
i don't feel sorry for gz. he could have stepped up & taken responsibility. let ellenfl Apr 2012 #2
Sorry it bothers you so much. Solomon Apr 2012 #3
I think you are absolutely right. shimonitanegi Apr 2012 #26
I have NO sympathy for George or his family Politicalboi Apr 2012 #4
I don't think good intentions... orpupilofnature57 Apr 2012 #5
If you really want to know who let Zimmerman down tularetom Apr 2012 #6
I wonder when Zimmerman's whiney little brother is going to Whisp Apr 2012 #8
The Entitlement mentality , orpupilofnature57 Apr 2012 #10
+1000 guitar man Apr 2012 #14
Sums this situation up to a tee indepat Apr 2012 #24
He was rejected as a PO because of his violent history HockeyMom Apr 2012 #7
i don't feel sorry for the murderous thug or his family at all, he has a history of violence against JI7 Apr 2012 #9
It was premeditated murder jenwilson Apr 2012 #11
Millions carry guns in public every day without killing anyone. hack89 Apr 2012 #22
I hear you and feel the same way Voice for Peace Apr 2012 #12
I hear ya , Trayvon Martin can't orpupilofnature57 Apr 2012 #16
I have great sympathy for emilyg Apr 2012 #13
I have no sympathy for Zimmerman's family. provis99 Apr 2012 #20
If the one crying was Trayvon, and it lasted a minute WingDinger Apr 2012 #15
If Zimmerman wasnt carrying a gun none of this would have happened abelenkpe Apr 2012 #17
Well, this has sure generated some interesting replies. trof Apr 2012 #18
Zimmerman has had legal problems in the past that seem to have been avebury Apr 2012 #19
Apparently he has a solid lawyer now flamingdem Apr 2012 #21
Also, George was never taught that life is sacred and to take a life that can never be Cleita Apr 2012 #23
I disagree. I think he was determaned to kill someone at some point. notadmblnd Apr 2012 #25
There is no evidence that GZ "confronted" Martin. He followed him, then Martin Honeycombe8 Apr 2012 #27
I have no idea what Zimmerman was thinking, ZombieHorde Apr 2012 #28
If it makes you feel better, GZ did bring this on himself. Honeycombe8 Apr 2012 #29
 

Whisp

(24,096 posts)
1. you are a better person than I, then.
Wed Apr 11, 2012, 07:03 PM
Apr 2012

because my sympathies lay with the parents and friends and family of the dead kid.

I do feel sorry that zimmerman is a hateful bigot tho.

ellenfl

(8,660 posts)
2. i don't feel sorry for gz. he could have stepped up & taken responsibility. let
Wed Apr 11, 2012, 07:04 PM
Apr 2012

let the chips fall as they may. he didn't.

Solomon

(12,305 posts)
3. Sorry it bothers you so much.
Wed Apr 11, 2012, 07:05 PM
Apr 2012

I don't see it the way you do. If not Trayvon, it would be somebody else.

 

Politicalboi

(15,189 posts)
4. I have NO sympathy for George or his family
Wed Apr 11, 2012, 07:09 PM
Apr 2012

He was able to walk away. He was able to tell his story through his father and "lawyers". He has gotten support from Shit Hannity and the rest. He decided to chase the kid. He should have at least left his gun in his car. But Zimmerman is a coward who felt a bigger man with his gun. Zimmerman should have stayed in his car if he felt the need to protect the sidewalk from a black kid. I think it should be murder in the first degree. The 911 dispatcher should have deterred Zimmerman from continuing to chase Trayvon. He blew his chance.

 

orpupilofnature57

(15,472 posts)
5. I don't think good intentions...
Wed Apr 11, 2012, 07:11 PM
Apr 2012

or lack of bad ones, is any excuse when a person leaves his home with a gun .Policing WITH A GUN ,should be left to the police ,and if a Volunteer neighborhood watch Citizen is told to " Stand Down " , like any other Citizen they should Obey the law.

tularetom

(23,664 posts)
6. If you really want to know who let Zimmerman down
Wed Apr 11, 2012, 07:12 PM
Apr 2012

just look at his dumbass father, who pulled his chestnuts out of the fire every time he did something stupid and made him think he was invulnerable to prosecution for any action he took.

Well, he finally did something that daddy won't be able to help him with. And he is finally going to have to man up and pay the price for his actions. You're absolutely correct that, whatever happens in this case, Zimmerman's life is effectively over. He won't be safe in prison and even if he walks on these charges, he'll be looking over his shoulder every time he leaves his house.

Don't waste your sympathies on his family, they are responsible for the sick, sad SOB they raised.

 

Whisp

(24,096 posts)
8. I wonder when Zimmerman's whiney little brother is going to
Wed Apr 11, 2012, 07:17 PM
Apr 2012

whine more about how close George was to vegetable death because of all powerful Trayvon and his bag of candy.

That pathetic whiney shit condescending voice just bugged my ass.

guitar man

(15,996 posts)
14. +1000
Wed Apr 11, 2012, 07:37 PM
Apr 2012

Hammer, meet nail.

I had a second cousin, he was the only child of my great uncle, and every time he got in trouble, my great uncle would go bail him out and do whatever it took to keep him out of the slammer. It got worse and worse until my uncle literally had to "hock the farm" to keep him from going to prison. If he had just let him take his medicine the first time or two it may have never gotten to that point.


The same thing has happened here. If GZs daddy hadn't flexed his influence and gotten him off every charge he ever faced, it might not have gotten to this point. One thing is for certain, GZ wouldn't have been able to get his CCW permit had his daddy let him fall. Whether or not he would have gone ahead and carried the gun illegally without the permit.... there's no way to know.

 

HockeyMom

(14,337 posts)
7. He was rejected as a PO because of his violent history
Wed Apr 11, 2012, 07:16 PM
Apr 2012

So he decided to become a vigilante. I have no sympathy at all for him.

JI7

(89,182 posts)
9. i don't feel sorry for the murderous thug or his family at all, he has a history of violence against
Wed Apr 11, 2012, 07:21 PM
Apr 2012

others . and a history of making all those 911 calls.

this wasn't some rare thing that just happened.

fucker claimed to be neighborhood watch so shouldn't he be held t ah igher standard.

fuck him and anyoen who defends his thug ass.

 

jenwilson

(47 posts)
11. It was premeditated murder
Wed Apr 11, 2012, 07:24 PM
Apr 2012

Zimmerman intentionally left home with a murder weapon. Why would he have had one of those things unless he intended on using it? They cost more than half a thousand dollars or more. You don't accidentally acquire one of them.

I just don't understand this quote, "I don't think George went out that night with a plan to shoot a black teenager." If he didn't then why was he so well prepared for the murder with all of the tools needed at his fingertips?

hack89

(39,171 posts)
22. Millions carry guns in public every day without killing anyone.
Wed Apr 11, 2012, 08:43 PM
Apr 2012

people don't carry with the intent to kill. It was not premeditated. Second degree murder is appropriate.

 

Voice for Peace

(13,141 posts)
12. I hear you and feel the same way
Wed Apr 11, 2012, 07:28 PM
Apr 2012

Every baby starts out innocent. Stuff happens, people grow up
and go bad; and at first, at least, it's usually not their fault.

So yeah. There but for fortune. Everybody needs more
love.

 

orpupilofnature57

(15,472 posts)
16. I hear ya , Trayvon Martin can't
Wed Apr 11, 2012, 07:40 PM
Apr 2012

And he won't be growing up ," but for fotune " , is growing up without being shot dead.

 

WingDinger

(3,690 posts)
15. If the one crying was Trayvon, and it lasted a minute
Wed Apr 11, 2012, 07:38 PM
Apr 2012

Then Zimmy is guilty of murder two. He pulled the gun in revenge. And shot point blank at a boy begging for his life. His banged nose, and scraped head, are motive for the revenge. Now, proving he planned it, is tough, as there were no eyewitnesses. So, murder two.

Trayvon had already went by Z's truck, and asked what his problem was. Then, Z shows up on foot. I would kill his ass too, with one punch. Without any warning. If I saw him reaching for his pocket, he is a dead man. Trayvon DESERVED to defend himself, even unto z's death.

The fact that Z had already MADE T, makes T's doing any harm, even if he wanted to, moot. So, Z, was wasting his time, even chasing him. Z, enjoyed intimidating others. Thus, he was stupid in revealing himself.

The fact that he then flipped T after shooting him, also shows some culpability.

The fact that he profiled T, means that his entire stint in prison, will be in solitary. If he tries to enlist Aryan Nation to protect him, he will wind up in supermax.

If he is convicted, all his paypaling, and dog whistle fundraising will be confiscated, so he doesnt profit from his crime.

abelenkpe

(9,933 posts)
17. If Zimmerman wasnt carrying a gun none of this would have happened
Wed Apr 11, 2012, 07:40 PM
Apr 2012

Trayvon would still be alive and Zimmermen would still be thinking he was better than kids who wear hoodies. Which btw, I don't get why anyone thinks a hoodie is anything that makes one appear suspicious. My kids school sends a list of supplies every year. You know the usual stuff: pencils, paper, backpack and a hoodie. Why the hoodie? Because they are cheap, come with a hat built in and pockets for cold hands and can easily be stuffed into their backpack. A hoodie is just a coat. It's not a symbol of anything else. Everyone has one.

trof

(54,255 posts)
18. Well, this has sure generated some interesting replies.
Wed Apr 11, 2012, 07:42 PM
Apr 2012

And thanks for them.

I don't believe anyone is absolutely good or evil.
Not even Michelle Bachmann or Rick Santorum.


I still try to put myself in Zimmerman's shoes.
There ain't no winners in this one.

avebury

(10,946 posts)
19. Zimmerman has had legal problems in the past that seem to have been
Wed Apr 11, 2012, 07:45 PM
Apr 2012

covered up - perhaps due to parental influence. If so, his father's influence did not end up doing him any good. Maybe if he had had to be held accountable for any on of his previous legal mishaps he might have learned his lesson and this tragedy averted.

flamingdem

(39,304 posts)
21. Apparently he has a solid lawyer now
Wed Apr 11, 2012, 08:38 PM
Apr 2012

so we can count on our justice system to prevail, that's all we have now ... he may have given his freedom for an end to Stand Your Ground Laws at least

Cleita

(75,480 posts)
23. Also, George was never taught that life is sacred and to take a life that can never be
Wed Apr 11, 2012, 08:46 PM
Apr 2012

returned is a grave, grave misdeed. Sorry, but in all my seventy years I never even thought of killing another human being, no matter how threatened I felt. I would have found a way to disable that person, and have done so in the past, but I would never dream of killing him. (I was a bartender for a period of my life and got threatened about once a month.) George is a psychopath. That's all he is and should never have been allowed near any kinds of weapons, especially firearms.

notadmblnd

(23,720 posts)
25. I disagree. I think he was determaned to kill someone at some point.
Wed Apr 11, 2012, 10:22 PM
Apr 2012

I also think he could have been looking for an opportunity to kill someone for a long time. He took advantage of the opportunity because he thought he could get away with it. He would have too, if it hadn't been for the persistance of his family in demanding justice.

If Trayvon's family had thrown their hands up in the air and told themselves that there was nothing they cold do but accept what the authorities told them, George Zimmermann wouldn't be losing a wink of sleep over it. I don't feel sorry for him. I feel sorry for his wife and kids. George Zimmermann let his hate become more important to him than his family and now.

Honeycombe8

(37,648 posts)
27. There is no evidence that GZ "confronted" Martin. He followed him, then Martin
Wed Apr 11, 2012, 10:28 PM
Apr 2012

noticed him, and approached Zimmerman and asked why he was following him.

We know this from the 911 call.

Zimmerman was following, but did not confront Martin, as far as we know, so far. We do know that Martin approached Zimmerman and confronted him, though. Not a wise thing to do, and how I wish he would've just cont'd on his way. But Martin was very young and apparently didn't know what he was up against.

ZombieHorde

(29,047 posts)
28. I have no idea what Zimmerman was thinking,
Wed Apr 11, 2012, 10:34 PM
Apr 2012

but your take-a-deep-breath approach is probably a good one for one's health.

Honeycombe8

(37,648 posts)
29. If it makes you feel better, GZ did bring this on himself.
Wed Apr 11, 2012, 11:15 PM
Apr 2012

He was a loose cannon, patrolling the area with a gun. Neighbors & homeowner's assn knew it, police knew it. His family seems to have known it. He had a violent history, seems like. It was only a matter of time before someome got hurt. It was foreseeable. And he did it to himself.

It wasn't like neighbor John, driving the neighborhood with a gun in his car for protection, calling 911 when he sees something suspicious. This was different.

Tragic. One life lost, another ruined.

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