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Tue Jul 29, 2014, 10:11 AM

Did YOU hear RFK, Jr. mentioned in the Public Eye over the last 18 months?

"Public Eye" meaning the national news media. If so, was it:

News RFK, Jr. is against certain vaccine formulations?

Or:

News Bobby Kennedy, RFK, Jr.'s father, the Attorney General of the United States and later a U.S. Senator, thought the President of the United States was assassinated as a result of a conspiracy that may or may not have included Lee Harvey Oswald?

If not, please add your vote and your thoughts.

Like Homeland Security likes to say: Thanks totally in advance!




26 votes, 0 passes | Time left: Unlimited
News he's against certain vaccine formulations.
10 (38%)
News his father, Attorney General Robert Kennedy, thought President Kennedy was assassinated by a conspiracy.
3 (12%)
Both
3 (12%)
Did Not Hear RFK mentioned in the national news media
10 (38%)
Other
0 (0%)
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Disclaimer: This is an Internet poll

147 replies, 9618 views

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Arrow 147 replies Author Time Post
Reply Did YOU hear RFK, Jr. mentioned in the Public Eye over the last 18 months? (Original post)
Octafish Jul 2014 OP
SidDithers Jul 2014 #1
REP Jul 2014 #23
SidDithers Jul 2014 #24
RobertEarl Jul 2014 #55
zappaman Jul 2014 #59
RobertEarl Jul 2014 #62
zappaman Jul 2014 #63
RobertEarl Jul 2014 #65
NuclearDem Jul 2014 #66
zappaman Jul 2014 #68
RobertEarl Jul 2014 #76
zappaman Jul 2014 #83
Octafish Jul 2014 #34
H2O Man Aug 2014 #146
MannyGoldstein Jul 2014 #106
SidDithers Jul 2014 #112
MannyGoldstein Jul 2014 #113
SidDithers Jul 2014 #114
HuckleB Jul 2014 #2
Octafish Jul 2014 #48
HuckleB Jul 2014 #49
Octafish Jul 2014 #52
HuckleB Jul 2014 #53
Octafish Jul 2014 #58
zappaman Jul 2014 #61
Octafish Jul 2014 #121
HuckleB Jul 2014 #3
Octafish Jul 2014 #50
HuckleB Jul 2014 #51
HuckleB Jul 2014 #4
longship Jul 2014 #5
Iggo Jul 2014 #6
Octafish Jul 2014 #35
SidDithers Jul 2014 #7
SidDithers Jul 2014 #8
zappaman Jul 2014 #9
sabrina 1 Jul 2014 #11
jberryhill Jul 2014 #28
sabrina 1 Jul 2014 #42
jberryhill Jul 2014 #43
sabrina 1 Jul 2014 #119
REP Jul 2014 #33
Art_from_Ark Jul 2014 #127
sabrina 1 Jul 2014 #10
villager Jul 2014 #26
sabrina 1 Jul 2014 #37
NCTraveler Jul 2014 #12
Octafish Jul 2014 #36
NCTraveler Jul 2014 #44
Octafish Jul 2014 #47
sabrina 1 Jul 2014 #103
msanthrope Jul 2014 #13
NuclearDem Jul 2014 #16
zappaman Jul 2014 #18
msanthrope Jul 2014 #19
4Q2u2 Jul 2014 #56
mathematic Jul 2014 #14
Octafish Jul 2014 #117
ChiciB1 Jul 2014 #15
Electric Monk Jul 2014 #21
ChiciB1 Jul 2014 #29
NuclearDem Jul 2014 #17
Douglas Carpenter Jul 2014 #20
REP Jul 2014 #22
Octafish Jul 2014 #54
REP Jul 2014 #60
Octafish Jul 2014 #64
REP Jul 2014 #75
SidDithers Jul 2014 #82
Octafish Jul 2014 #86
SidDithers Jul 2014 #87
Octafish Jul 2014 #122
bobduca Aug 2014 #140
Octafish Feb 2016 #147
johnnyreb Jul 2014 #25
wildbilln864 Aug 2014 #142
Doctor_J Jul 2014 #27
H2O Man Jul 2014 #30
zappaman Jul 2014 #31
SidDithers Jul 2014 #32
RobertEarl Jul 2014 #57
SidDithers Jul 2014 #67
RobertEarl Jul 2014 #69
SidDithers Jul 2014 #70
NuclearDem Jul 2014 #72
RobertEarl Jul 2014 #73
NuclearDem Jul 2014 #78
RobertEarl Jul 2014 #93
NuclearDem Jul 2014 #102
wildbilln864 Jul 2014 #134
NuclearDem Aug 2014 #135
wildbilln864 Aug 2014 #137
NuclearDem Aug 2014 #144
wildbilln864 Aug 2014 #145
zappaman Aug 2014 #136
RobertEarl Aug 2014 #139
wildbilln864 Aug 2014 #141
RobertEarl Aug 2014 #143
SidDithers Jul 2014 #74
RobertEarl Jul 2014 #77
NuclearDem Jul 2014 #79
SidDithers Jul 2014 #81
RobertEarl Jul 2014 #95
SidDithers Jul 2014 #96
NuclearDem Jul 2014 #80
MattBaggins Jul 2014 #90
NuclearDem Jul 2014 #71
MattBaggins Jul 2014 #88
zappaman Jul 2014 #89
RobertEarl Jul 2014 #91
MattBaggins Jul 2014 #92
RobertEarl Jul 2014 #94
MattBaggins Jul 2014 #97
RobertEarl Jul 2014 #98
MattBaggins Jul 2014 #99
RobertEarl Aug 2014 #138
NuclearDem Jul 2014 #104
Punkingal Jul 2014 #101
DisgustipatedinCA Jul 2014 #111
SidDithers Jul 2014 #115
DisgustipatedinCA Jul 2014 #126
sabrina 1 Jul 2014 #39
H2O Man Jul 2014 #40
sabrina 1 Jul 2014 #41
H2O Man Jul 2014 #45
sabrina 1 Jul 2014 #118
CanSocDem Jul 2014 #46
bananas Jul 2014 #84
sabrina 1 Jul 2014 #107
zappaman Jul 2014 #108
sabrina 1 Jul 2014 #109
Hekate Jul 2014 #128
Rex Jul 2014 #38
Octafish Jul 2014 #85
LWolf Jul 2014 #100
MrMickeysMom Jul 2014 #105
Hekate Jul 2014 #110
Octafish Jul 2014 #120
H2O Man Jul 2014 #123
Octafish Jul 2014 #124
H2O Man Jul 2014 #125
sabrina 1 Jul 2014 #129
H2O Man Jul 2014 #130
sabrina 1 Jul 2014 #131
H2O Man Jul 2014 #132
sabrina 1 Jul 2014 #133
2banon Jul 2014 #116

Response to Octafish (Original post)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 10:28 AM

1. Keep tugging that forelock, octafish...nt

ETA: Oh, and your description "against certain vaccine formulations" is completely misleading.

He believes that thiomerosal in vaccines causes autism.

That's not being against "certain vaccine formulations".

Sid

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Response to SidDithers (Reply #1)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 03:13 PM

23. I found this interesting:

An outspoken opponent of vaccination, in June 2005 Kennedy authored an article in Rolling Stone and Salon.com alleging a government conspiracy to cover up connections between the vaccine preservative thimerosal and childhood autism.[47] The article contained a number of factual errors, leading Salon.com to issue five corrections and ultimately to retract the article completely on January 16, 2011. The retraction was motivated by accumulating evidence of errors and scientific fraud underlying the vaccine-autism claim.[48] Previous to this retraction, sometime in 2010, Rolling Stone had also deleted Kennedy's article from their archives without explanation.[49][50] As of January 2011, the original, uncorrected, version of the article was still posted on Kennedy’s website, including his factual errors which Salon had corrected.[50]


Wiki article

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Response to REP (Reply #23)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 03:46 PM

24. Yeah, Salon put this up in place of the article...

Correcting our record

RFK Jr. really doesn't have a leg to stand on with this issue, and his defenders are just as willfully blind.



Sid

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Response to SidDithers (Reply #24)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 02:54 PM

55. Salon is a corporate rag

 

Salon has sold itself out and is a whore to the corporate world.

They are asshats, too.

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Response to RobertEarl (Reply #55)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 02:59 PM

59. Coming from someone who loves ENEnews...

that's quite amusing!

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Response to zappaman (Reply #59)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 03:08 PM

62. Salon is a whore to corporations

 

Enenews.com is hated by corporate whores.

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Response to RobertEarl (Reply #62)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 03:13 PM

63. Uh huh.

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Response to zappaman (Reply #63)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 03:18 PM

65. Do you not Love Enenews?

 

Enenews is one of the most anti-corporate whore websites ever. And very well read, too.

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Response to RobertEarl (Reply #65)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 03:22 PM

66. You misspelled batshit.

 

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Response to RobertEarl (Reply #65)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 03:33 PM

68. Thank you sincerely for the first laugh of the day!

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Response to zappaman (Reply #68)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 04:27 PM

76. First laugh?

 

You mean, like everyone else, not even you laugh at your jokes?

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Response to RobertEarl (Reply #76)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 05:13 PM

83. I humbly bow to your hilariousness.

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Response to SidDithers (Reply #1)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 08:50 PM

34. Why do you keep repeating that, SidDithers of DU? Do you want me to be a Republican?

Condescension is what Republicans do. When DUers do it, I find that, uh, strange.

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Response to Octafish (Reply #34)

Fri Aug 1, 2014, 12:12 PM

146. There are a few

community members who, at least in my opinion, have never added anything of value to the discussions on this forum.

Those with very little to say often keep saying the same meaningless nonsense, however.

Just my opinion ......

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Response to SidDithers (Reply #1)

Thu Jul 31, 2014, 01:13 AM

106. 50,000 people were killed by Vioxx alone

 

FDA estimate.

Interesting that you only attack the anti-vaccers.

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Reply #106)

Thu Jul 31, 2014, 06:06 AM

112. Millions have been saved by vaccines...

Interesting that you defend the anti-vax asshats.

Sid

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Response to SidDithers (Reply #112)

Thu Jul 31, 2014, 07:09 AM

113. I defended anti-vaccers? Really?

 

Where?

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Reply #113)

Thu Jul 31, 2014, 07:21 AM

114. Oh, sorry, I thought we were playing the false-accusation game...

like were you accused me of only attacking anti-vaxxers.

Sid

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Response to HuckleB (Reply #2)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 01:43 PM

48. When was the last time William K. Black appeared on US television?



William K. Black: Justice Department is the Dog that has Refused to Bark for a Decade

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Response to Octafish (Reply #48)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 01:48 PM

49. Who gives a crap?

Stop making excuses.

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Response to HuckleB (Reply #49)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 01:52 PM

52. Excuse for what? You denigrating Robert F. Kennedy Jr.?

I'm asking people to consider what the hell kind of information they are getting from Corporate Media and from DU.

It's why so many people, obviously, don't know squat. For those interested in learning:

Corporate McPravda owns the airwaves.



And Corporate Tee Vee is still where most Americans get most of their information, including their ideas about these two statues. Wonder what people would think were they to learn from the tee vee what pater and fils have really done with their power?



The Propaganda System That Has Helped Create a Permanent Overclass Is Over a Century in the Making

Pulling back the curtain on how intent the wealthiest Americans have been on establishing a propaganda tool to subvert democracy.

Wednesday, 17 April 2013 00:00
By Andrew Gavin Marshall, AlterNet | News Analysis

Where there is the possibility of democracy, there is the inevitability of elite insecurity. All through its history, democracy has been under a sustained attack by elite interests, political, economic, and cultural. There is a simple reason for this: democracy – as in true democracy – places power with people. In such circumstances, the few who hold power become threatened. With technological changes in modern history, with literacy and education, mass communication, organization and activism, elites have had to react to the changing nature of society – locally and globally.

From the late 19th century on, the “threats” to elite interests from the possibility of true democracy mobilized institutions, ideologies, and individuals in support of power. What began was a massive social engineering project with one objective: control. Through educational institutions, the social sciences, philanthropic foundations, public relations and advertising agencies, corporations, banks, and states, powerful interests sought to reform and protect their power from the potential of popular democracy.

SNIP...

The development of psychology, psychoanalysis, and other disciplines increasingly portrayed the “public” and the population as irrational beings incapable of making their own decisions. The premise was simple: if the population was driven by dangerous, irrational emotions, they needed to be kept out of power and ruled over by those who were driven by reason and rationality, naturally, those who were already in power.

The Princeton Radio Project, which began in the 1930s with Rockefeller Foundation funding, brought together many psychologists, social scientists, and “experts” armed with an interest in social control, mass communication, and propaganda. The Princeton Radio Project had a profound influence upon the development of a modern "democratic propaganda" in the United States and elsewhere in the industrialized world. It helped in establishing and nurturing the ideas, institutions, and individuals who would come to shape America’s “democratic propaganda” throughout the Cold War, a program fostered between the private corporations which own the media, advertising, marketing, and public relations industries, and the state itself.

CONTINUED...

http://truth-out.org/news/item/15784-the-propaganda-system-that-has-helped-create-a-permanent-overclass-is-over-a-century-in-the-making



Thankfully, to help spread light when the protectors of the First Amendment won't, Maria Galardin's TUC (Time of Useful Consciousness) Radio. The podcast helps explain how we got here and what we need to do to move forward, starting with putting the "Public" into Airwaves again:



Alex Carey: Corporations and Propaganda
The Attack on Democracy


The 20th century, said Carey, is marked by three historic developments: the growth of democracy via the expansion of the franchise, the growth of corporations, and the growth of propaganda to protect corporations from democracy. Carey wrote that the people of the US have been subjected to an unparalleled, expensive, 3/4 century long propaganda effort designed to expand corporate rights by undermining democracy and destroying the unions. And, in his manuscript, unpublished during his life time, he described that history, going back to World War I and ending with the Reagan era. Carey covers the little known role of the US Chamber of Commerce in the McCarthy witch hunts of post WWII and shows how the continued campaign against "Big Government" plays an important role in bringing Reagan to power.

John Pilger called Carey "a second Orwell", Noam Chomsky dedicated his book, Manufacturing Consent, to him. And even though TUC Radio runs our documentary based on Carey's manuscript at least every two years and draws a huge response each time, Alex Carey is still unknown.

Given today's spotlight on corporations that may change. It is not only the Occupy movement that inspired me to present this program again at this time. By an amazing historic coincidence Bill Moyers and Charlie Cray of Greenpeace have just added the missing chapter to Carey's analysis. Carey's manuscript ends in 1988 when he committed suicide. Moyers and Cray begin with 1971 and bring the corporate propaganda project up to date.

This is a fairly complex production with many voices, historic sound clips, and source material. The program has been used by writers and students of history and propaganda. Alex Carey: Taking the Risk out of Democracy, Corporate Propaganda VS Freedom and Liberty with a foreword by Noam Chomsky was published by the University of Illinois Press in 1995.

SOURCE: http://tucradio.org/new.html



If you find a moment, here's the first part (scroll down at the link for the second part) on Carey.

http://tucradio.org/AlexCarey_ONE.mp3

It's important for there to be more than a handful of companies providing "news." Democracy depends on it. That obviously is a foreign concept for many.

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Response to Octafish (Reply #52)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 01:53 PM

53. You can conflate, all you want.

RFK, Jr. is pushing sick conspiracy nonsense about vaccines. That is not ok.

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Response to HuckleB (Reply #53)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 02:58 PM

58. Not conflation. Denigration is the issue.

Smearing RFK, Jr. serves to diminish his important news about his father's beliefs in regards to the assassination of the President.

The Warren Commission report was a "shoddy piece of workmanship."

Forty-some years later, "Breach of Trust" by Gerald D. McKnight spells out how the Warren Commission failed the nation. Published by the University of Kansas, the work by the Hood College professor emeritus of history spells out precisely how.

http://www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/viewer/showDoc.do?docId=10182

The Warren Commission Report on the assassination of President John F. Kennedy . . . was instantly implausible because the authors hid the secrets they knew (and ignored the ones they didn't). -- David Ignatius, Washington Post Book World



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Response to Octafish (Reply #58)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 03:02 PM

61. "important news about his father's beliefs in regards to the assassination of the President."

more like "unverifiable hearsay" about an event that was solved decades ago.

What did RFK actually say about the WC?

Oh, look! Actually audio!



You are welcome, my friend!

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Response to zappaman (Reply #61)

Thu Jul 31, 2014, 04:33 PM

121. ''Your manners overwhelm me.''

For those interested in learning what we've learned since then:



Bobby Kennedy: America's first assassination conspiracy theorist

May 13, 2007
BY DAVID TALBOT

One of the most intriguing mysteries about the assassination of John F. Kennedy, that darkest of American labyrinths, is why his brother Robert F. Kennedy apparently did nothing to investigate the crime. Bobby Kennedy was, after all, not just the attorney general of the United States at the time of the assassination -- he was his brother's devoted partner, the man who took on the administration's most grueling assignments, from civil rights to organized crime to Cuba, the hottest Cold War flash point of its day. But after the burst of gunfire in downtown Dallas on Nov. 22, 1963, ended this unique partnership, Bobby Kennedy seemed lost in a fog of grief, refusing to discuss the assassination with the Warren Commission and telling friends he had no heart for an aggressive investigation. "What difference does it make?" he would say. "It won't bring him back."

But Bobby Kennedy was a complex man, and his years in Washington had taught him to keep his own counsel and proceed in a subterranean fashion. What he said in public about Dallas was not the full story. Privately, RFK -- who had made his name in the 1950s as a relentless investigator of the underside of American power -- was consumed by the need to know the real story about his brother's assassination. This fire seized him on the afternoon of Nov. 22, as soon as FBI chief J. Edgar Hoover, a bitter political enemy, phoned to say -- almost with pleasure, thought Bobby -- that the president had been shot. And the question of who killed his brother continued to haunt Kennedy until the day he too was gunned down, on June 5, 1968.

Because of his proclivity for operating in secret, RFK did not leave behind a documentary record of his inquiries into his brother's assassination. But it is possible to retrace his investigative trail, beginning with the afternoon of Nov. 22, when he frantically worked the phones at Hickory Hill -- his Civil War-era mansion in McLean, Va. -- and summoned aides and government officials to his home. Lit up with the clarity of shock, the electricity of adrenaline, Bobby Kennedy constructed the outlines of the crime that day -- a crime, he immediately concluded, that went far beyond Lee Harvey Oswald, the 24-year-old ex-Marine arrested shortly after the assassination. Robert Kennedy was America's first assassination conspiracy theorist.

SNIP...

A stunning outburst

Meanwhile, as Lyndon Johnson -- a man with whom he had a storied antagonistic relationship -- flew east from Dallas to assume the powers of the presidency, Bobby Kennedy used his fleeting authority to ferret out the truth. After hearing his brother had died at Parkland Memorial Hospital in Dallas, Kennedy phoned CIA headquarters, just down the road in Langley, where he often began his day, stopping there to work on Cuba-related business. Bobby's phone call to Langley on the afternoon of Nov. 22 was a stunning outburst. Getting a ranking official on the phone -- whose identity is still unknown -- Kennedy confronted him in a voice vibrating with fury and pain. "Did your outfit have anything to do with this horror?" Kennedy erupted.

SNIP...

Kennedy had another revealing phone conversation on the afternoon of Nov. 22. Speaking with Enrique "Harry" Ruiz-Williams, a Bay of Pigs veteran who was his most trusted ally among exiled political leaders, Bobby shocked his friend by telling him point-blank, "One of your guys did it." Who did Kennedy mean? By then Oswald had been arrested in Dallas. The CIA and its anti-Castro client groups were already trying to connect the alleged assassin to the Havana regime. But as Kennedy's blunt remark to Williams makes clear, the attorney general wasn't buying it. Recent evidence suggests that Bobby Kennedy had heard the name Lee Harvey Oswald long before it exploded in news bulletins around the world, and he connected it with the government's underground war on Castro. With Oswald's arrest in Dallas, Kennedy apparently realized that the government's clandestine campaign against Castro had boomeranged at his brother.

CONTINUED (internet archive, can't find mention via Chicago Sun-Times search)...

https://web.archive.org/web/20070518094233/http://www.suntimes.com/news/otherviews/383811,CST-CONT-kennedy13.article



At the Duquesne conference, Talbot explained why RFK may have taken the pro-Warren report position in public. If his brother were killed by a conspiracy, most, if not all, of its members would still be at large.




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Response to HuckleB (Reply #3)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 01:49 PM

50. When was the last time Greg Palast appeared on US television?

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Response to Octafish (Reply #50)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 01:51 PM

51. Yawn.

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Response to Octafish (Original post)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 11:12 AM

5. He's an anti-Vax kook.

As well as a JFK assassination conspiracy theorist kook.

In other words, he's just another kook.

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Response to Octafish (Original post)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 11:50 AM

6. In the national news media?

I'd have to say neither.

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Response to Iggo (Reply #6)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 08:57 PM

35. Here in Detroit, his dad's POV regarding JFK assassination was reported in the Free Press...

http://pqasb.pqarchiver.com/freep/doc/1268960348.html?FMT=ABS&FMTS=ABS:FT&date=Jan+13%2C+2013&author=&pub=Detroit+Free+Press&edition=&startpage=&desc=JFK%27s+nephew+doubts+report+about+killing

...but circulation is near the lowest in living memory. Nothing at all on tee vee.

Every person I've asked, about a dozen in all, reported the same: Don't remember seeing or hearing about RFK, Jr. in either regard.

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Response to Octafish (Original post)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 12:07 PM

9. Still upset the Kennedy kids didn't blow the lid of the assassinations last year...

like you predicted?

Sorry, but RFK JR is flogging a book and using his name to promote quackery that could endanger lives.
THAT'S why he's in the news.

Saying his daddy once told him something that is unverifiable is not news.
It's HEARSAY.

Now you know!


BTW, he's not "against certain vaccine formulations".
He says vaccines cause autism.

Now you know!


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Response to zappaman (Reply #9)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 12:16 PM

11. His 'daddy' was Robert F. Kennedy whose opinion on his brother's assassination is of great interest

to the American people, IF they had been informed about it. His 'daddy', Robert F. Kennedy was himself assassinated, another great tragedy for this country, at least for Democrats.

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Response to sabrina 1 (Reply #11)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 04:43 PM

28. Ted, on the other hand, was bought off?

“Late in 1964, Bobby asked me to review the Warren Commission’s newly released report on the assassination because emotionally he couldn’t do it. The commission had been established by President Johnson seven days after Jack was killed in Dallas, and was charged with determining who had shot Jack, and why. John appointed Earl Warren, the former California governor and chief justice, to chair the commission….When I reached him by telephone, Warren told me he would be glad to give me a briefing and go over the parts of the report that were particularly contentious and likely to generate the most questions from the press and public. I remember the commission’s office as large but spare, about half the size of the attorney general’s office….Warren gave me a full briefing, as I’d requested. I asked many questions. The whole process took about four hours. Afterward, I reported to Bobby that I accepted the commission’s report and thought he should too. Bobby agreed readily. He did not want to continue to investigate Jack’s death.” (page 211)

Considering that Ted knew, as he wrote True Compass, that the book would be published after his death, what sort of inducement do you propose was used to get Ted to play ball.

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Response to jberryhill (Reply #28)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 11:31 PM

42. Ted Kennedy was a human being who was not infallible. He was eg, totally wrong about Bush Jr's

'Education Program' and voted FOR IT. That was a very bad error of judgement on his part, but he was not an Educator and way too trusting that Bush wouldn't lie about to him about that disastrous 'education' program.

He made other mistakes also, other errors of judgement, but overall he was a good man, but not infallible as we know.

Apparently Bobby changed his mind. Perhaps he received more information, had he lived, we might have learned more. But he didn't, he was murdered too.

Sometimes people do not want to believe something so evil that it would shatter all their faith in something that is very important to them, in Ted Kennedy's case, his country.

And it's interesting to see the smear campaign now in progress against RFK Jr. Whenever I see that, I KNOW someone is trying to distract the public from something more important, and without fail, we have been right. In RFK's case, I have my theories.

It's fascinating to watch always when these smear campaigns pop up. I like trying to figure out why, some are easy enough, some are not and it often isn't until later that we learn the real reason for them.

In this case, I have a fair idea of what it is, but I am not completely certain so I'll wait before sharing my suspicions.

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Response to sabrina 1 (Reply #42)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 11:49 PM

43. so, Bobby got more information and changed his mind...

And Ted didn't get that information or hear that Bobby changed his mind.

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Response to jberryhill (Reply #43)

Thu Jul 31, 2014, 03:06 PM

119. How would I know, I wasn't privy to their personal conversations. It's very likely that he did not

discuss his suspicions with his brother but did with his children. Is that inconceivable to you? Brothers always share their innermost thoughts with their brothers? Not in my experience. As to who gave him information, whoever they were if they did so, would have been in dire danger had they been exposed. Another reason why he might not have shared information with his brother, placing a heavy burden on him that might have endangered him too.

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Response to sabrina 1 (Reply #11)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 05:49 PM

33. His "daddy" worked for McCarthy and retained a great fondness for him

Papa Joe loved McCarthy and brother John said, "How could I demand that Joe McCarthy be censured for things he did when my own brother was on his staff?"

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Response to REP (Reply #33)

Thu Jul 31, 2014, 09:09 PM

127. RFK made a remarkable transformation between the '50s and '60s

In the '60s, after essentially asserting his independence from his overbearing father, RFK became known as a vigorous supporter of civil rights and anti-poverty programs. As Attorney General, he vigorously prosecuted the Mafia and corruption, and as US Senator he became a leading opponent of the Vietnam War.

And as far as the relationship with McCarthy goes, he was pushed into working for McCarthy by his father at the age of 27, but "by 1954 Robert F. Kennedy and McCarthy's chief aide Roy Cohn had had a falling out, and Robert no longer worked for McCarthy."

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Response to Octafish (Original post)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 12:12 PM

10. Lol, thanks Octafish. Apparently it worked as I saw a snarky comment yesterday about 'waiting for

Kennedy kids to' reveal something about the assassination, or something like that. I was not surprised that they missed the news about what they had said, with all the anti-RFK posts that have suddenly appeared.

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Response to sabrina 1 (Reply #10)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 04:42 PM

26. Many here at the "underground" are quite content with their programming

 

Last edited Tue Jul 29, 2014, 10:31 PM - Edit history (1)

And they certainly don't want to rock any boats!

You must be thinking of some other kind of "underground!"

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Response to villager (Reply #26)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 10:27 PM

37. I've noticed that too.

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Response to Octafish (Original post)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 12:16 PM

12. When dealing with conspiracy theories....

 

Would one be in the beginning stage if they use the line "may or may not have included" or is that when they think they are really "locking it down"?

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Response to NCTraveler (Reply #12)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 09:13 PM

36. Not sure. I do know RFK, Jr. and his sister said what their good father told them.

Here's what another kind of political dynasty is about:



For some reason, the FBI looks the other way for them, though.

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Response to Octafish (Reply #36)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 08:20 AM

44. Not sure? Interesting. Kennedys are about as large of a dynasty as you will ever see.

 

Some like to pick and choose their approved dynasties.

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Response to NCTraveler (Reply #44)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 10:40 AM

47. Oh, I'm sure I prefer the Kennedy over the Bush philosophy.

The Clinton would be somewhere in between.

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Response to NCTraveler (Reply #44)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 11:24 PM

103. Since dynasties appear to be 'in' these days, I most definitely 'like to pick and choose' as you put

as you put it. Given the choices, which would you pick, the Bush dynasty or the Kennedy dynasty?

For me that is an easy choice, how about you?

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Response to Octafish (Original post)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 12:20 PM

13. Well, we've done appreciation threads, 50 shades threads....is RFK going to be the new thing we all

 

lose our shit over????

Does someone have the schedule? Can they PM it to me?

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Response to msanthrope (Reply #13)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 12:54 PM

16. A few years out of date, but some things are timeless.

 

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Response to NuclearDem (Reply #16)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 01:21 PM

18. December is my favorite!

Nothing like a good moon bombing thread!

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Response to NuclearDem (Reply #16)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 01:52 PM

19. We gotta make a "Summer Camp" weekly schedule! If I knew how to do that, I would, but

 

the best I can do is post YouTube videos.

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Response to msanthrope (Reply #13)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 02:57 PM

56. Well

As we say here in Mass. We will drive off that bridge when we get to it.

Is this a clockwise or counter clockwise circle while waving hands in the air? Or no hands at all.

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Response to Octafish (Original post)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 12:26 PM

14. What's the point of this?

1) To gauge people's awareness of media reports of RFK, Jr?
2) To gauge people's awareness of RFK, Jr's positions?
3) To gauge media representation of RFK, Jr?
4) To contrast media's representation of two of RFK, Jr's positions?

To start off, the national news media reported both of these things. People's awareness of that depends solely on how much they follow the national news media. Plenty of people get their news from a network of online kooks and then assume that there's no reportage in mainstream national news media.

Analyzing the frequency of reporting of RFK, Jr's positions is even more problematic. RFK, Jr's statement about JFK's assassination is something that came up once: during the 50th anniversary of a historical event last fall. The newsworthiness of his statement is somewhere in the neighborhood of "novelty" and "useless", since it was an unverifiable statement about somebody else's opinion from 45 years ago.

On the other hand, RFK, Jr's positions about vaccines deal with an ongoing issue. For the past decade he has actively and successfully worked to reduce public safety by undermining public trust in science and medicine. He has access to policy makers. He has access to opinion makers. As a result, his work is extremely newsworthy.

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Response to mathematic (Reply #14)

Thu Jul 31, 2014, 10:52 AM

117. My purpose is to gauge DUers' awareness of Attorney General Robert F. Kennedy's real views.

Thank you for the analysis of my methodology. I will take it into account before I publish.

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Response to Octafish (Original post)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 12:48 PM

15. Just Commenting Right Now So I Can

come back to this later. At least I'll try. These days I stay CONTINUALLY overwhelmed by the amount of information I can deal with every single day! I no longer know what America REALLY stands for, but most importantly how the hell I'm supposed to get myself out of this paper bag that I I seem to be in!

And I do realize that more and more people feel the same way I do. Unfortunately, very few of us seem to have any answers anymore. It's so frustrating that I meet so many people who have COMPLETELY tuned out! They tell me I'm the crazy one because I no longer enjoy life because I try to say informed. Rarely can I have a conversation with most people who give a fly F--K! I am the one who screws up a situation because THEY are having a good time and "I'm" raining on the parade!

Basically telling me to just SHUT-UP because I'm the one ruining their "good time!" If it were just once in a while I wouldn't whine... but it seems to be all the time anymore! I do get it "ignorance is bliss" but I can't find a way to deal with lot!



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Response to ChiciB1 (Reply #15)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 02:06 PM

21. Following your tangent, Alvin Toffler predicted this, way back in the 1970s

 





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Response to Electric Monk (Reply #21)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 04:47 PM

29. I Obviously Missed His Book! But I Do Think "I'm"

interested in reading this. I've thought for some time now that technology is moving too fast for myself, but then I'm a Boomer so naturally I would think this way.

I do recall way back when I saw President Carter sitting in the Oval Office in his sweater talking about "energy" etc., but he was attacked as some sort of kook! I felt it made sense given "gas lines" back then and time has proven him to be way ahead with his comments. It was a bold step for a President to make, but VERY FEW supported him.

Yes, I find myself unable to keep up with new ways of communicating and have decided it's consumed too much of my time trying to figure it all out. I've told my grandkid how uncomfortable I am with the lack of "human" interaction and how I feel about how they HAVE to have something in their hand to keep in touch! I have to admit that I ignore texts because I feel it's so impersonal. And "tweeting," not even going there! They can call me any names they want, but perhaps I won't be here in 25 or 30 years!

To think ahead about what's going to happen is more than depressing. I just don't recall generations moving at such a fast pace. I have theories about what it means, but kind of scary to talk about. Sure generations change, but we are speeding at a rate that makes me worry too much!

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Response to Octafish (Original post)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 12:55 PM

17. Still not changing that RFK Jr is a dangerous batshit crazy asshat.

 

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Response to Octafish (Original post)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 01:57 PM

20. a lot of perfectly normal people believe crazy things. Believing that vacines cause autism in

children is a CRAZY notion and it is a dangerous notion to spread. But I don't think RFK Jr. or anyone else who believes that nonsense is altogether a bad person. They just happen to believe one or two things that are nuts, like lots of people.

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Response to Octafish (Original post)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 03:09 PM

22. I heard him say some incredibly stupid things

I heard him say he had some crazy thoughts about his father's death that occurred when he was 14, and some equally wack shit about vaccines.

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Response to REP (Reply #22)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 02:43 PM

54. I heard him say some incredibly brave things.

I heard him speak at my alma mater, Wayne State University in 2007.



Robert F. Kennedy, Jr. called George W Bush "that sonofabitch" and said the guy was a crook, turning over the government to the lobbyists and gangsters who've emptied our Treasury, polluted our water, land, air and children, and used humanity as cannon fodder and slave labor.

He also pegged ABCNNBCBSFoxNoiseNutwork for what they are. Among other things, he called Antonin Scalia the son of a Nazi and explained why. I would've taken notes, but I wanted to hear everything the guy said.

Most Americans known nothing of this. They need to do some more reading. A good start is with the writings of law professor Donald E. Wilkes:



DESTINY BETRAYED:
THE CIA, OSWALD, AND
THE JFK ASSASSINATION


Published in Flagpole Magazine, p. 8 (Dec. 7, 2005).

Author: Donald E. Wilkes, Jr., Professor of Law, University of Georgia School of Law.

In place of the strong sense of faith in man and mankind, we now have a heavy feeling of a failed mission, of destiny betrayed and unfulfilled. – Rav Alex Israel

The deepest cover story of the CIA is that it is an intelligence organization. – Bulletin of the Federation of American Scientists


Today, 42 years after President John F. Kennedy was assassinated in Dealey Plaza in Dallas, Texas, on November 22, 1963, few responsible researchers who have studied JFK’s murder accept the Warren Commission’s main conclusion that Lee Harvey Oswald, acting alone, committed the crime. (The Warren Commission was the body appointed by President Lyndon B. Johnson to investigate the Kennedy assassination; it released its Report in September 1964.) As these researchers have shown again and again in scores of books and articles, evidence available to the Commission but improperly evaluated, erroneously rejected, or simply not pursued by that body, together with new evidence unavailable to the Commission, discredits the principal finding of the Warren Report. JFK’s death was, these researchers believe, carried out by a conspiracy; it was not the act of a lone assassin. Different researchers, however, have different conspiracy theories. Conspiracy theorists also disagree about Oswald: some maintain that he was simply one of the conspirators; others claim that, while he was a member of the conspiracy, he was also unknowingly a dupe of the other conspirators who intended for him to be the fall guy; and still other theorists think that Oswald was a wholly innocent person set up by the conspirators as the patsy. Furthermore, the theorists who regard Oswald as a conspirator disagree as to whether he fired any of the shots in Dealey Plaza.

SNIP...

The theory that JFK’s murder was engineered by the CIA (or by persons affiliated with the CIA), and that the CIA covered up its connections to the murder, warrants serious consideration and should not be peremptorily rejected. In the 1960’s the CIA more resembled an untouchable crime syndicate than a legitimate government entity. Lavishly but secretly funded, unrestrained by public opinion, cloaked in secrecy, conducting whatever foreign or domestic clandestine operations it wished without regard to laws or morals, and specializing in deception, falsification, and mystification, the CIA was riddled at all levels with ruthless, cynical officials and employees who believed that they were above the law, that any means were justified to accomplish the goals they set for themselves, and that insofar as their surreptitious activities were concerned it was justifiable to lie with impunity to anyone, even presidents and legislators. Many of these individuals, thinking he was soft on communism, that he would reduce the size of the military industrial complex, and that he was to blame for the Bay of Pigs disaster (the failed CIA-sponsored invasion of Cuba in 1961), hated and despised Kennedy. The CIA routinely circumvented and defied attempts by the executive and legislative branches to monitor its activities. It was involved in innumerable unlawful or outrageous activities. It illegally opened the mail of Americans. It interfered with free elections in foreign countries and arranged to destabilize or overthrow the governments of other countries. It plotted the murder of various foreign leaders. It arranged to hire the Mafia to help with some of these proposed murder plots. It unlawfully stored–in quantities, UGA political science professor Loch K. Johnson notes, sufficient “to destroy the population of a small city”–exotic toxic agents, including cobra venom and shellfish toxin, for the purpose of committing murders. It manufactured and used sinister lethal weaponry, including what Prof. Johnson calls “the ultimate murder weapon,” an electric handgun (the CIA called it a “noise-free disseminator”) with a telescopic sight which could noiselessly and accurately fire poison-tipped darts (the CIA called them “nondiscernible microbioinoculators”) up to a distance of 250 feet. It undoubtedly carried out multiple secret murders and other heinous crimes which it successfully kept hidden. Furthermore, it is now firmly established that after the JFK assassination the CIA simultaneously lied to, and withheld important information from, the Warren Commission.

One of the first serious investigators to raise credible claims that CIA operatives or ex-CIA operatives were involved in the JFK assassination was Jim Garrison, who served as the district attorney in New Orleans, Louisiana from 1962 to 1974. (A brief chronology of Garrison’s life and investigation is set forth at the end of this article.) Garrison and his office investigated the assassination for about five years, from late 1966 until early 1971. His investigation led Garrison to believe that, regardless of whoever actually fired the shots in Dealey Plaza, the assassination was the result of a plot hatched in New Orleans by persons with CIA connections. Furthermore, Garrison concluded, following the assassination the CIA engaged in a coverup to protect itself and the assassins. Garrison brought to trial the only criminal proceeding in which someone was actually charged with involvement in the JFK assassination. Garrison wrote two important books, the first published in 1970, the second in 1988, in which he recounted his investigation and shared the important new facts he had discovered.

In the words of journalist Fred Powledge, who wrote a magazine article on Garrison published in 1967, Garrison thought that “the assassins were CIA employees who were angered at President Kennedy’s posture on Cuba following the Bay of Pigs disaster, and that the CIA was frustrating his investigation, although the agency knew the whereabouts of the assassins.” Philosophy professor Richard H. Popkin, in another magazine article published in 1967, summarized Garrison’s views on the assassination as follows: “The thesis Garrison has set forth is that a group of New Orleans-based, anti-Castroites, supported and/or encouraged by the CIA in their anti-Castro activities, in the late summer or early fall of 1963 conspired to assassinate John F. Kennedy. This group, according to Garrison, included (Clay) Shaw, (David) Ferrie, (Lee Harvey) Oswald, ... and others, including Cuban exiles and American anti-Castroites.... (T)heir plan was executed in Dallas on November 22, 1963. At least part of their motivation ... was their reaction to Kennedy’s decisions at the Bay of Pigs and the changes in U.S. policy toward Cuba following the missiles crisis of 1962.”

In a 1967 interview, Garrison himself phrased his basic conclusions this way: “(A) number of the men who killed the President were former employees of the CIA involved in its anti-Castro underground activities in and around New Orleans.... We must assume that the plotters were acting on their own rather than on CIA orders when they killed the President. As far as we been able to determine, they were not on the pay of the CIA at the time of the assassination.... The CIA could not face up to the American people and admit that its former employees had conspired to assassinate the President, so from the moment Kennedy’s heart stopped beating, the Agency attempted to sweep the whole conspiracy under the rug.... In this respect, it has become an accessory after the fact in the assassination.”

CONTINUED...

http://www.law.uga.edu/dwilkes_more/jfk_22destiny.html



Prof. Wilkes' bibiliography is an excellent survey of what was available at the time of his writing that article. Several new works have been published since. I'll try to get back and recommend them to you when I get the time.

Remember: Readers are leaders. Those who believe the tee vee go along with wars in Iraq and Vietnam and wherever else its profitable.

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Response to Octafish (Reply #54)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 03:01 PM

60. You're confusing "bravery" with "hubris"

When one is extremely rich, entitled and the scion of a famous family, it takes nothing to say any silly thing that wanders into the head in public.

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Response to REP (Reply #60)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 03:17 PM

64. No. Brave is standing up to the powerful and speaking truth.

Which is why I find it important to report he called Bush "a son of a bitch" and Scalia Sr. "a Nazi."

Not many people are brave enough to speak those truths in public in front of 800 people.

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Response to Octafish (Reply #64)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 04:24 PM

75. Name-calling by a powerful man is not brave. It's childish.

If you think that's brave, I'm a fucking super hero in your world.

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Response to REP (Reply #75)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 05:09 PM

82. Childish indeed...

RFK Jr, Robert to his friends, once called Paul Offit a "biostitute", rhymes with prostitute.

Paul Offit is a world leading pediatric immunologist, who, surprise!, thinks children should be vaccinated.

Kennedy thinks Offit, and doctors like him, are biostitutes.

Sid

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Response to SidDithers (Reply #82)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 08:23 PM

86. Yeah. Like the time you implied Naomi Klein was a drunk in college.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022146890#post82

Or was it Naomi Wolf? You got them confused, seems like.

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Response to Octafish (Reply #86)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 08:44 PM

87. I don't get them confused. You do...nt

Sid

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Response to SidDithers (Reply #87)

Thu Jul 31, 2014, 04:41 PM

122. Did you actually see Naomi Klein drinking, SidDithers of DU?

You wrote you "remember."

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022146890#post82

Or did you hear she was a "big drinker"?

Going by your writings, I don't think you two ran in the same circles.

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Response to Octafish (Reply #122)

Fri Aug 1, 2014, 11:25 AM

140. Naomi Klein

Everybody knows about her benders in Canada!

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Response to bobduca (Reply #140)

Fri Feb 26, 2016, 10:41 AM

147. Liberals and progressives are so low.

I keep hearing such nonsense from SidDithers of DU.

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Response to Octafish (Original post)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 04:38 PM

25. Big Media and debunkers

Nobody I know heard about RFK Jr's remarks with Charlie Rose. And I didn't learn of it from a debunker.

His mention of such thoughts at a recent historic event could have at least sold more commercials for Big Media. Perhaps they don't need more revenue. But surely there are those who would aggressively promote such wacky statements, such as was done with the Dean Scream, or with Ross Perot's "You People".

Nobody I know ever heard of the 12-year old case of 10,000 9/11 families' claiming that the Saudi elite managed and funded at least some of the hijackers;


And nobody I know ever heard about it from a dedicated debunker.


Nobody I know ever heard that Democratic Senators have been supporting the families' case;

Now, in sworn statements that seem likely to reignite the debate, two former senators who were privy to top secret information on the Saudis’ activities say they believe that the Saudi government might have played a direct role in the terrorist attacks.
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/01/us/graham-and-kerrey-see-possible-saudi-9-11-link.html

And nobody I know ever heard about these Democratic Senators' heroic efforts from a debunker.


Nobody I know ever heard about the US Supreme Court ruling last month finally "green-lighting" the case;

And nobody I know ever heard it from a debunker.


Very few that I know ever heard that Democratic Congressmen and Senators have been trying to declassify the 28 pages of the Joint Congressional Inquiry that B*sh redacted;

Representative Stephen Lynch, victims’ families demand release of 28 pages from 9/11 report
March 12, 2014
http://www.boston.com/politicalintelligence/2014/03/12/representative-stephen-lynch-victims-families-demand-release-pages-from-report/lAgUUGOtpz4MkFMDeJTQgM/story.html

Congressmen “absolutely shocked” of Foreign State involvement behind 9/11 attacks
Dec 17, 2013
http://benswann.com/congressmen-absolutely-shocked-of-foreign-state-involvement-behind-911-attacks-video/

And we didn't learn about this from a debunker.

Big Media does not keep Americans informed. Debunkers don't have the credibility to.

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Response to johnnyreb (Reply #25)

Fri Aug 1, 2014, 11:56 AM

142. hey man glad to see you still hanging around! n/t

 

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Response to Octafish (Original post)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 04:43 PM

27. Need one more option

 

I consider Sid Dithers to be the Public Eye

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Response to Octafish (Original post)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 04:54 PM

30. "Other"

Call it speculation on my part, but I think that I know Robert better than anyone else on this forum. We've been friends for about 25 years, though we have worked on some issues for even longer.

There are industries that have people who -- along with other responsibilities -- are tasked with harassing Robert in public, and spreading misinformation and disinformation in the media and internet, to try to discredit him. (Some of this is documented, beyond any question or doubt, in his second book.)

While the topic of vaccines is one where he and I do not necessarily agree, it is a minor part of the work he has done, and positions he has taken, in decades of attempting to protect people from various environmental poisons. Yet even on DU, we witness a few clowns who focus an undue amount of attention on this.

The timing, I can say with certainty, is because of some of the important work that he is currently engaged in.

Again, Robert and I have had plenty of issues that we haven't seen eye-to-eye on. But he is an extremely intelligent, dedicated man, who works long, hard hours. And he really doesn't have to -- he could be sitting back, just enjoying himself and his family. But instead, he opts to work for all of us, including those who engage in cowardly attacks on him.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #30)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 05:30 PM

31. I'm sure he's a good guy and his environmental work is stellar

But his stance on vaccines is ludicrous and since he has a name that people know, it can be very dangerous.
Endangering the public is not "working for all of us" and he deserved to be called out on it.
He AND Jenny McCarthy.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #30)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 05:37 PM

32. Sorry, but Kennedy is the clown here...

He's dangerous because he's a Kennedy, and gets exposure and access that's not available to any other anti-vaccine crank.

If you know him so well, talk some fucking sense into him. Every kid that doesn't get vaccinated, because Kennedy has scared their parent, is a kid that becomes a potential vector for diseases that are entirely preventable.

Next time you see "Robert", make sure that you tell him he's a dangerous asshat, and he should stick to what he knows.

Sid

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Response to SidDithers (Reply #32)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 02:57 PM

57. Almost no more mercury in vaccines

 

RFK has been successful in getting the health professionals to see the wisdom of keeping mercury poisons out of vaccines.

And all some people can do is complain about that wisdom? Crazy talk.

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Response to RobertEarl (Reply #57)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 03:33 PM

67. ...



Keep trying.

Sid

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Response to SidDithers (Reply #67)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 03:41 PM

69. They quit using mercury

 

That's the truth. Objection to that wise decision is crazy talk.

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Response to RobertEarl (Reply #69)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 03:47 PM

70. And autism rates continued to rise...

so thiomerosal wasn't the cause.

So Kennedy is wrong. Thiomerosal doesn't cause autism.

But your trying to credit Kennedy with the removal of thiomerosal from vaccines is pretty fucking hilarious.

Sid

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Response to SidDithers (Reply #70)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 03:55 PM

72. RFK Jr got thiomersal removed from vaccines!

 

You know, the same way the starfish die off that started before Fukushima was being caused by Fukushima.

Duh.

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Response to NuclearDem (Reply #72)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 04:12 PM

73. You saying RFK had no effect on thiomersal being removed?

 

Then what are yall complaining abut?

Is it just RFK's Free Speech yall are objecting to?

You do realize you just put to shame all the anti-RFK arguments?

Leave it to you, nuclear, to ruin the fun sid was having. You just proved to us that sid is just complaining to hear himself complain. Thanks!

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Response to RobertEarl (Reply #73)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 04:38 PM

78. Here, let's review.

 

1999 - FDA review of thiomersal in vaccines found no evidence, outside of very unique cases, that the compound was harmful.

American Association of Pediatrics and the Public Health Service advised removing thiomersal the same year as a precaution, despite the lack of evidence of danger.

2001 - Virtually all thiomersal is removed from vaccines by this year.

2005 - Deadly Immunity is published.

So, no, he didn't get thiomersal removed, since his abortion of a study wasn't released until four years after it had been removed.

It's his continued batshit nonsense that vaccines cause autism that I object to.

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Response to NuclearDem (Reply #78)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 09:34 PM

93. You are confused

 

Not surprising.

It isn't the vaccine that causes the problem; it could be the mercury that is in the vaccine to keep it clean, that is the alleged problem.

If you have any science that claims that injecting mercury into kids is safe, now is the time to post it, eh?

As it stands, the medical community had it removed and that is the fact. Aren't yall claiming the medical community is wrong? Yes, you are. And proving RFK has a point. Thanks, hope now your confusion is cleared up.

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Response to RobertEarl (Reply #93)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 11:24 PM

102. The fuck are you blabbing on about?

 

First of all, not all mercury is the same.

Second, way to completely dishonestly misrepresent the entire issue. You did the same thing with Fukushima, and it's no less despicable now.

Finally, no, I'm not saying the medical community was wrong. Removing thiomersal was a good call under the precautionary principle. It's also true that the FDA's studies found no real danger with thiomersal, but there's still no loss at all in its removal.

RFK's "point" was that thiomersal causes autism, which is complete and utter bullshit.

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Response to NuclearDem (Reply #102)

Thu Jul 31, 2014, 11:12 PM

134. WTF? Not all mercury is the same?

 

How many different mercuries are there in the periodic table of elements? Hint: one!

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Response to wildbilln864 (Reply #134)

Fri Aug 1, 2014, 01:16 AM

135. ...

 



So there's no difference between ethylmercury and methylmercury?

I mean, after all mercury is only there once in the periodic table! What are compounds, anyway?

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Response to NuclearDem (Reply #135)

Fri Aug 1, 2014, 09:49 AM

137. mercury compounds are different!

 

thats not what you said though is it?
What ever the compound that has mercury. It still is mercury.

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Response to wildbilln864 (Reply #137)

Fri Aug 1, 2014, 12:02 PM

144. Anyone with a functioning knowledge of chemistry knows what I meant.

 

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Response to NuclearDem (Reply #144)

Fri Aug 1, 2014, 12:06 PM

145. right! anyone can read your mind,

 

lol. such bullshit! anyone can see it! throw that shovel away you've dug deep enough.

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Response to wildbilln864 (Reply #134)

Fri Aug 1, 2014, 02:08 AM

136. Wow.

You might want to self delete...

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Response to wildbilln864 (Reply #134)

Fri Aug 1, 2014, 11:17 AM

139. See what I put up with?

 

ND wrote, and by gawd has left it stand:

" NuclearDem (8,514 posts)
102. The fuck are you blabbing on about?

First of all, not all mercury is the same.

Second, way to completely dishonestly misrepresent the entire issue. You did the same thing with Fukushima, and it's no less despicable now."

****************

""Not all mercury is the same"", ND claims. And you showed his bs for what it is. These pseudo-science types are full of yellow journalism.

Let readers beware of anything else ND posts, eh?

"Not all mercury is the same" ... if I ever wrote anything so f'n stupid, I'd delete he post and then apologize. ND? Ya still around?

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Response to RobertEarl (Reply #139)

Fri Aug 1, 2014, 11:39 AM

141. I know.

 

I think it's called Dunning-Kruger effect. Many here have a severe case.

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Response to wildbilln864 (Reply #141)

Fri Aug 1, 2014, 11:57 AM

143. Too bad there is no vaccine for that

 

If they desired that mercury be included in such injections, i'd approve.

But just in this case, for these posters. <sarcasm>

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Response to NuclearDem (Reply #72)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 04:18 PM

74. It's the magic time machine...

Where Kennedy was responsible for the removal of thiomerosal in 1999, despite not writing his Deadly Immunity article until 2005.

Can you believe this shit?



Sid

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Response to SidDithers (Reply #74)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 04:31 PM

77. You have been blaming him all along

 

Glad to see you finally admit that the medical community did insist it be removed from vaccines.

I guess that the medical community are anti-science according to sid?

You are all over the place, with your-hair-on-fire blaming everything on RFK when it was the medical community that got that fucking poison out of vaccines.

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Response to RobertEarl (Reply #77)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 04:39 PM

79. The medical community advised it removed as a precautionary principle.

 

Despite no evidence of it causing problems outside of some rare cases.

Please do some research on the precautionary principle before you embarrass yourself further.

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Response to RobertEarl (Reply #77)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 04:54 PM

81. Comedy gold...

Any time you try to post about science.

Pure comedy gold.

Sid

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Response to SidDithers (Reply #81)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 09:42 PM

95. And you?

 

Off the wall. No real scientist goes around calling good people nasty names like you have called RFK. But such is expected of your posts. Since that is all you have to offer in this situation. Just your opinions and some corporate owned website.

And, we're done.

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Response to RobertEarl (Reply #95)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 09:44 PM

96. Oh, you were done a long, long time ago...



Sid

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Response to SidDithers (Reply #74)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 04:48 PM

80. I've long since stopped being surprised by the anti-science nonsense that gets posted here.

 

If I keep my expectations fairly low, I have the pleasure of being surprised when someone who actually knows what they're talking about posts.

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Response to RobertEarl (Reply #69)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 09:22 PM

90. Objections to that is not crazy talk; it's science.

Thiomersal has never been shown to actually be harmful other than mild allergic reactions.

removing it did harm many third world country children when the supply of cheaper multi-use vials were disrupted just to appease the chicken littles in the western world who were running around screeching "squawk mercury squawk squawk".

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Response to RobertEarl (Reply #57)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 03:52 PM

71. Uh.

 

You're aware the controversy over thiomersal started...after the stuff was removed as a precautionary measure...

Right?

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Response to RobertEarl (Reply #57)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 09:14 PM

88. What wisdom?

Thiomersal was never the boogey man people made it out to be.

Waiting with bated breath for links to mercola or natural news.

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Response to MattBaggins (Reply #88)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 09:28 PM

91. So why was it removed?

 

And there have been a few reports of no links and a few reports of links.

And then there are the people calling a good man all kinds of names because he thinks there is a link.

Of course that man is also a herald of the injustices done in many places by big money interests, so it is not surprising big money interests would want to tear him down.

If you have any science that says putting mercury in vaccines and injecting that mercury into children, this would be a good time to post such a link, eh?

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Response to RobertEarl (Reply #91)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 09:32 PM

92. I told you why it was removed

MERCURY... OMFG IT"S MADE OF MERCURY. WE'RE ALL GONNA DIE ANY DAY NOW.

So it got removed so that people would STFU.


My description may be a bit sardonic but I feel it gets to the gist of it.

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Response to MattBaggins (Reply #92)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 09:38 PM

94. That is only your opinion

 

Which is worth a whole lot less than RFK's.

The fact is, mercury was removed because just about everyone knows mercury will fuck you up. And after 15 years they have decided to not use it in many vaccines. See, some of us post facts and some just post opinions.

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Response to RobertEarl (Reply #94)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 09:45 PM

97. No no no.. Not opinion.. Medical research even from the time it was removed

never found any harm from thiomersal.

Organic mercury compounds are not always harmful. Ehtylmercury, methylmercury and environmental mercury are not metabolized by the body in the same way.

Your layman's claim that "everyone knows mercury will fuck you up" shows THAT YOU IN FACT are not using anything even remotely resembling a fact.

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Response to MattBaggins (Reply #97)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 09:58 PM

98. So they put it back in? No

 

What is great about this is the free adverting yall are giving RFK and his new book. It will probably be a best seller, thanks to yall arguing about it and trying to defend mercury being injected into the poor little kids.

Take a bow, and be sure RFK is sitting back laughing his ass off at some of you.

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Response to RobertEarl (Reply #98)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 10:06 PM

99. I don't give a flying fuck about RFK jr

I was responding only to the nonsense about thiomersal

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Response to MattBaggins (Reply #99)

Fri Aug 1, 2014, 11:04 AM

138. Here is RFK being quoted at link posted

 

"Robert F. Kennedy Jr. told me that the book he commissioned has a chapter “we were going to leave out, because it’s so controversial, but the evidence is so strong that thimerosal causes autism,” that he’s keeping it in.
Yet in the next breath he said he wasn’t going to publish the book (even though it has a publisher and is going through edits right now) because it is so explosive that he doesn’t want it to prompt a mass panic: “I don’t want parents to stop vaccinating their kids.” (“I’m pro-vaccine,” he insisted several times during the call.)

http://www.cjr.org/the_observatory/robert_kennedy_jr_vaccines_aut.php?page=all

****************

And guess what? As I said, the medical community has insisted that thimerosal be removed from vaccines, and it was. So your opinion is useless.

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Response to RobertEarl (Reply #98)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 11:26 PM

104. No they didn't.

 

Holy shit, you really do not have the faintest idea of what you're talking about.

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Response to SidDithers (Reply #32)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 11:17 PM

101. Why do you have to keep calling him an asshat?

Can't you disagree with his stance without name-calling and hatred? And why in the hell do they put this crap in vaccines, anyway? Isn't there a way to make them without chemicals?

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Response to SidDithers (Reply #32)

Thu Jul 31, 2014, 02:46 AM

111. Gosh, do I trust H2O Man, or Sid? Tell you what, sport

 

Why don't YOU go to someone in real life and tell him what an asshat he is. Try this 3 or 4 times, then come back and post your experience about having your face pounded into a sidewalk for inadvertently bringing your Internet tough guy routine to the real world. The Internet is full of tough guy cowards. I wouldn't like to think you're in their ranks.

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Response to DisgustipatedinCA (Reply #111)

Thu Jul 31, 2014, 07:29 AM

115. Gosh. RFK Jr, Jenny McCarthy, Alex Jones, naturalnews and whale.to ...

or the World Health Organization, American Academy of Pediatrics, Health Canada, the CDC, the NHS, Australian Dept of Health, and practically everyone else in the fucking world.

Who to believe?



Sid

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Response to SidDithers (Reply #115)

Thu Jul 31, 2014, 07:21 PM

126. When you look again, you'll see I was not commenting on the OP

 

I was commenting on your braggadocio and rudeness to another poster.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #30)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 10:48 PM

39. Thank you, most of us here on DU are pretty smart. Whenever we see something that looks like a

smear campaign against good people, we KNOW they have probably been targeted in order to try to discredit them. And why would anyone want to do that? Generally it is because they are doing something very important that threatens Corporate or other powerful entities.

How we know this for certain is it has happened several times and has been EXPOSED just as often to be exactly what we suspected.

Michael Moore eg, when he made the movie SICKO, it was viewed as a direct threat to the Private Health Insurance Industry. The smear campaign was vicious, the intent was to try to stop the distribution of the movie. There was too much truth in it.

Most DUers and other Progressives KNEW it was a campaign. We were called names, etc etc, which only confirmed for me that someone was desperate enough to shut him up, to perhaps, PAY for it.

Even Dr. Gupta was brought in to try to discredit him.

And then, a Whistle Blower from the very industry we suspected of being behind the smear campaign, finally stepped forward. Wendell Potter admitted that they had spent MILLIONS of DOLLARS to try to smear Michael Moore (we still see some of the bought and paid for talking points around btw).

Potter said that he was part of it. But then he had an epiphany, he saw the Third World type Clinics Americans were forced to use because they could not afford HC. He never realized how bad it was.

To make a long story short, Potter made a public apology to Michael Moore and MM himself went after Sanje Gupta, another tool of the corporate media forcing him to debate him over the lies he had told. In the end Gupta too apologized.

That is ONE example of these kind of smear campaigns that we were proven right about. Glenn Greenwald is another.

You cannot threaten the Corporate Powers in this country IF you have any influence, or you will be the target of a smear campaign.

I suspect that RFK is working on something important, possibly FRACKING, just a guess, and they are out to make him look like an 'asshole, wacko' etc. Same words were used against MM btw.

It won't work, it didn't work with MM and it isn't working with Greenwald.

But it's interesting to watch it in action, AGAIN.

Even more interesting is where it is coming from.

Thank you for your excellent post. I would say you are in a far better position than anyone on this forum to know RFK Jr, and to put it kindly, I would take your word over the combined efforts of all those engaged in this latest attack on a Democrat who has demonstrated his credibility on so many issues.

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Response to sabrina 1 (Reply #39)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 11:06 PM

40. Thanks.

One of those wonderful characters is attempting to engage me in a "debate" on this. I can't recall ever reading any meaningful contribution that he's made to the this forum -- I can't say that I've read any of his nonsense, including anything directed at me.

I do notice, however, the timing of his attacks. And I understand why.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #40)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 11:11 PM

41. You are a wiser person than I am H20 Man, not to engage such wonderful people. I'm afraid I can't

help myself, perhaps it is a touch of masochism, or so people tell me, but I actually enjoy engaging them. I know, most use their ignore feature, I am told, but I believe in education especially for those reading. And they do tell me a lot when I engage them, and they tell others a lot too. Probably without realizing it!

Too bad we don't have more people like RFK Jr in this country. A great Democrat and someone who, as you say, could simply take care of himself and not worry at all about what happens to anyone else. Who needs the nastiness, the knowledge that such negative, nasty people even exist, but that is not who he is and we all benefit from his work for this country.

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Response to sabrina 1 (Reply #41)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 09:31 AM

45. 14 years ago,

a racist hate group targeted my nephew for attack. His "offense" was being a brown-skinned scholar-athlete, who got state-wide attention in the media. Seventeen thugs attacked him -- from behind -- in a dark field that served as a parking lot at a canoe regatta. Three of the thugs beat him after he lay unconscious, with his hands in his pockets, until they believed he was dead.Then, they left him.

Robert was among the first to come to my family's aid. At first, he did so in a low-key, non-public manner. But, when the local (in)justice system showed itself incapable of prosecuting white men for viciously assaulting a non-white high school student, Robert stepped in, at a public level.

With his assistance, we were able to use the case to highlight the failure of the justice system to address racism and violence. For about five months, while three trials took place, the area communities (including two NAACP chapters) were able to coordinate with regional press, radio, and television news.

The gang leader -- who admitted punching and kicking his unconscious victim more than a dozen times -- got a $50 fine -- he had an open beer at the time of the attack. That's the system we were dealing with. So, you bet we appreciated Robert's concern and assistance.

The hate group had their supporters, too, of course. And they hated Robert, almost as much as they hated my nephew.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #45)

Thu Jul 31, 2014, 03:02 PM

118. Horrible that this happened to your nephew. And wonderful of RFK Jr to come to your assistance in

trying to get justice for him. That is the RFK Jr I know and no amount of smears or attacks or accusations or childish name calling is going to change that. I will watching to see what it is they are so desperate to hide, I know of his environmental work and know also that he, like anyone who dares to oppose them, is a target of the profiteers.

We need more like him in this country and in our government.

Thank you for your input on what is clearly an orchestrated attack on a good Democrat.

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Response to sabrina 1 (Reply #39)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 09:51 AM

46. Well said.

 



The smear campaigns are as tiresome as they are predictable. Not to mention, disappointing that these same half dozen members are given free rein to peddle their essentially undemocratic POV's.

Declaring that there is no concerted effort to maintain corporate control over the PUBLIC INTEREST is an indication that they weren't around before, during or after the JFK assassination. Now they show only fear that the world might not be the lollipops and rainbow fantasy that they are being shown everyday.

.

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Response to sabrina 1 (Reply #39)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 07:55 PM

84. That's a good example, thanks for the reminder.

It can get pretty discouraging around here.

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Response to bananas (Reply #84)

Thu Jul 31, 2014, 01:21 AM

107. Yes, it can. It's not the DU we first came to, that's for sure. But it's the internet, and we have

be vigilant in recognizing what is really going on. In this case, the attacks on someone who has been a courageous opponent of those who are destroying our environment, should raise a whole lot of red flags. Something else is going on here, that is certain.

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Response to sabrina 1 (Reply #107)

Thu Jul 31, 2014, 01:43 AM

108. Too funny.

No one on DU has ever criticized RFK Jr on his environmental stance.

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Response to zappaman (Reply #108)

Thu Jul 31, 2014, 02:03 AM

109. Of course not, that would be foolish on a Democratic Forum.

Do you really think DUers are that stupid?

We KNOW what is going on, we get it. Divert, distract, blah, blah. I remember when even I used to fall for these tactics, sort of.

But the overuse of any tactic, tends to render it ineffective.

Tailoring propaganda to specific parties? Lol! Done any research on how the smear campaign is being sold to the Far Right? Same smears, different tactics. There they DO attack him on his environmental positions. On Dem forums, they know better. Not sure what your point was, but back to the point. Someone wants to silence him, and most of us are pretty sure we know who.

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Response to sabrina 1 (Reply #39)

Thu Jul 31, 2014, 09:38 PM

128. VERY astute: "I suspect that RFK is working on something important, possibly FRACKING, just a guess"

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Response to Octafish (Original post)

Tue Jul 29, 2014, 10:29 PM

38. Funny, those very same people are in this thread!

 

Not so much the national media.

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Response to Rex (Reply #38)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 08:18 PM

85. Remember Ohio in 2004? RFK, Jr. wrote about it in Rolling Stone in 2006.

If anyone understands the importance of leadership, he does. So, where were the nation's news media? AWOL.

DU talked about it, a bit.

Sad, remembering all the good DUers who no longer post here.

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Response to Octafish (Original post)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 11:08 PM

100. I don't listen to or watch any national news media.

I do read news from multiple sources.

I did not read anything about RFK Jr. in any news sources. I believe I did see a thread title about vaccination on a discussion board somewhere online, but I didn't click on it.

What is it you'd like me to vote on?

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Response to Octafish (Original post)

Wed Jul 30, 2014, 11:53 PM

105. Those who study the Kennedy assassinations understand these cogent arguments to "Public Eye"

… Only too well, we do.

So, instead of getting sidetracked by the logical fallacies (by the usual silly persons here locked and loaded with those fallacies), the REAL direction after your questions here is why it has taken as long to re-try what has never been properly brought to justice. This is evidence as to why there was more than one shooter of RFK, and simple ballistics and evidence that should be retried, but have not been, due to the way this case was "tried".

Now, jokesters comments aside (petty annoyances), here's what anyone curious enough who has not lived through this history may WISH to read. You are well acquainted with the author, Octafish -

http://www.ctka.net/2011/Grand_Illusionpt1-a.html

Thank you the thread,

MMM

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Response to Octafish (Original post)

Thu Jul 31, 2014, 02:26 AM

110. Only at DU, Octafish. Only at DU.

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Response to Hekate (Reply #110)

Thu Jul 31, 2014, 04:18 PM

120. The only business mentioned by name in the Constitution is the Press.

Back in 1776, they figured an informed citizenry will make sound decisions.

Seeing the son of the murdered Senator and nephew of the murdered President denigrated on DU makes me angry.

You and I know since the assassination of President Kennedy, it's been pretty much "money trumps peace" through endless wars for profit.


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Response to Octafish (Reply #120)

Thu Jul 31, 2014, 04:46 PM

123. They don't count.

Take into consideration the sum total of that group's meaningful contributions here: zero.

What they say simply doesn't matter. No one takes them seriously,. They are cartoons.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #123)

Thu Jul 31, 2014, 04:50 PM

124. Thank you. You are correct.

It's delayed me from writing what I'd like to write.

For example, I saw something interesting about the Nixon Tapes.

Most of all, I wanted to say that you do have good kids.

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Response to Octafish (Reply #124)

Thu Jul 31, 2014, 06:03 PM

125. Thanks!

The new book of Nixon tapes is interesting. Both Richard N and Henry K are rude -- neither has the capacity to let others finish a sentence. (I keep thinking how different that is than, say, a meeting at the Longhouse. I find the White House interruptions to be obnoxious; more, how can they possibly reach the best possible answers that way? Strange.)

Per these gentlemen on DU:GD -- a tree is known by its fruit. A few DUers have contacted me, both with DU e-mail, and otherwise, to comment about how bitter and obnoxious two in particular are. My cousin was able to provide me with some information on one of the two. I assume he is actually a democrat; it's just that he's at the very edge of the party's right-wing. And apparently an unhappy fellow, who is frustrated that he amounts to little in life. Hence, his splattering of bitter, meaningless posts.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #123)

Thu Jul 31, 2014, 10:19 PM

129. No truer words have been spoken. What they say does not matter at all

especially considering the usually anti-democratic nature of what they have to say.

'Zero', exactly.

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Response to sabrina 1 (Reply #129)

Thu Jul 31, 2014, 10:35 PM

130. Thanks.

I wonder if scoring them at zero isn't giving them too much credit?

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #130)

Thu Jul 31, 2014, 10:42 PM

131. Lol, that reminds of Wilbur from Charlotte's Web when he tried to argue that

there is 'nothing less than zero' after being told that something was 'less than zero'. Poor Wilbur, he was so sweet and honest. He took everything so literally.

I think zero explains it very well. They have zero influence here that's for sure, except among themselves.

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Response to sabrina 1 (Reply #131)

Thu Jul 31, 2014, 10:45 PM

132. I think this thread,

followed by the one tonight about CNN's "1968" special, put things in a good context. Did you see the show? If our good friends here did, they might have a clue that they've been played. Gently. But played.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #132)

Thu Jul 31, 2014, 11:05 PM

133. I did see it. And I thought about DU's Kennedy bashers and wonder how I came to be on

a forum that harbors such people. I left other forums long ago where almost the exact same attacks were constantly made on the Kennedy family, but those forums were dominated by the far right. I sought out Democratic forums in order not to have deal with it. Breitbart eg, is a perfect example of Kennedy bashing. His attacks on Ted Kennedy were no different to what we are seeing here on RFK Jr.

I am glad to see that most DUers dismiss them, put them on ignore, or let them know what they think of them. Still, it would be nice to have one place on the web where we could escape that kind of garbage.

I thought the show tonight was very good. It provided a lot of information on that period. I wondered when I saw the photo of RFK announcing his run for the WH with several of his children sitting behind him, if one of them was RFK Jr.

It is hard to understand how at the end of that tumultuous period this country ended up with Nixon. That I cannot understand.

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Response to Octafish (Original post)

Thu Jul 31, 2014, 09:16 AM

116. "other"

 

Thankfully, I've "cut the cord" with cable and satellite.. so I never "heard RFK Jr mentioned in the "news". However I have read about his comments on both subjects from time to time here on DU. that's about it.

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