Should the U.S. government end support to Israel?

[JackRiddler]

60 votes, 0 passes | Time left: Unlimited
	End material support from U.S. federal funds.
	40 (67%)
	Continue material support from U.S. federal funds.
	20 (33%)
	Other
	0 (0%)
	0 DU members did not wish to select any of the options provided.
Show usernames Disclaimer: This is an Internet poll

[IronGate]

1. The US govt should back Israel to the hilt and provide her

with the necessary tools to defend herself from the terrorists.

[Scootaloo]

3. "To the hilt"

Etymology: based on the idea of pushing a sword into something to the hilt (as far as its handle)

[IronGate]

6. "To the hilt".

As in support Israel all the way.

[Scootaloo]

8. I figured the idiom's origin was worth mention, since it's very fitting for your "support."

[avebury]

13. How and we provide them wiht unwavering support?

They are using some of the same tactics on the Palestinians that were used against them by the Germans. I guess the Holocaust just means never again to US who cares about anybody else. They have lost the moral high grounds that helped them get the UN Mandate for a nation of their own. I guess most Americans have no problem supporting the Israelis given the US treatment of Native Americans. The Israelis are acting just like the Americans.

[morningfog]

15. Israel has everything they need to massacre the Palestinians. They don't need anymore from

us.

[IronGate]

16. Then get the terrorist org Hamas to quit lobbing rockets into Israel

and the fighting will stop, and get the terrorist org Hamas to recognize Israel's right to exist.

[Comrade Grumpy]

17. Those are your three favorite words: "terrorist org Hamas."

You use them in almost every post.

It's almost like you have a script or something.

Wow, you even got the phrase in twice in two sentences.

[IronGate]

19. No, my three favorite words are,

Fire is contained or Patient is stabilized.

[840high]

62. They are terrorists.

[morningfog]

61. That response does not fit my post or this thread. Is that just what you turn to when you

have nothing else to offer?

[TwilightGardener]

2. Continue support, but always continue to press for a peaceful solution.

[IronGate]

7. ^^^THIS^^^. nt.

[rudolph the red]

12. +1

[Cali_Democrat]

4. Other...

[BillZBubb]

5. Cut em off totally. They are not friends of the US.

Israel is the MAIN cause of US problems in the Middle East. They never do anything to help us reduce those problems--just the opposite in fact.

[DiverDave]

32. Sing it brother

just ask the guys who where on the Liberty if they...oh wait, you cant ask 34 of them because they were murdered by our "friends".
And before you go to the whitewash, the attack was deliberate.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Liberty_incident

Cut them off and raise teachers salary's across the whole country.

They've got plenty of my money, they dont need more.

[Jefferson23]

9. We're complicit in the continuing occupation and as a result have no credibility as a broker

in the peace process. We're not fooling anyone, either.

[kentuck]

10. Will there be an uptick in terrorist attacks on American installations?

...and interests?

I see that we had to desert the embassy in Libya because it got too hot to stay. There is no evidence it had anything to do with the Israeli invasion of Gaza.

Will there be further terrorism because of the invasion of Gaza and will most of it be directed toward America?

[conservaphobe]

11. They should follow the public polling on this one.

That's my position.

[Comrade Grumpy]

18. Because that's what leaders do. n/t

[conservaphobe]

35. In a representative democracy, that's what they should do. nt

[stranger81]

41. Given that's the case, why is there not a single senator or representative

representing the POV of the nearly 40% of Americans who oppose the IDF's action in Gaza? (Numbers from the latest NYT survey) Do we not deserve any representation at all?

[awoke_in_2003]

48. Only the wealthy are represented...

the rest is Kabuki theater (with the exception of a handful of politicians).

[stranger81]

52. Touche. [n/t]

[Hippo_Tron]

49. No, that defeats the purpose of representatives democracy...

We elect representatives to use their best judgment because the vast majority of us have day jobs outside of public policy and don't have the time to developed an informed opinion on most of the issues.

Unfortunately our elected representatives don't really have time either, because they have day jobs fundraising to keep themselves in office, but that's another story.

[Hell Hath No Fury]

14. It took me 30+ years to get here --

but it is time to cut them off and require certain actions for any re-institution.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

20. Just what are our "vital national interests" in Israel?

Humanitarian? What is humanitarian about giving military aid to Israel that is used to commit war crimes?

Economic? Because we do a lot of profitable business with Israel?

Cynical? The enemy of my enemy is my friend?

Or, is it just playing politics to gain votes and cash from the Israel Lobby?

[kentuck]

21. Haven't you heard?

They are our only "democratic" ally in the region.

They are "God's children".

God will smite those that speak out against Israel.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

23. Belief in a cruel God makes a cruel man. Thomas Paine

Ironically, the killers on both sides claim to believe in a "just" and "merciful" God who is guiding their hands when they pull the triggers, yank the lanyards, or push the buttons that kill the innocents.

[kentuck]

28. True...

Good quote.

[alsame]

45. Transferring taxpayer

dollars into the MIC is one of them.


Increased support for Israel opens more doors for Raytheon

<snip>

And that could give Tucson-based Raytheon Missile Systems — a key contractor in U.S. missile defense and already a partner on some Israeli missile-defense projects — a bigger role in the region and welcome new business.

<snip>

But even as the agreement on co-production is being finalized, Congress is poised to pour hundreds of millions of U.S. taxpayer dollars into the program.

A defense-spending bill passed by the House in June and a similar measure awaiting floor action in the Senate roughly doubles to $351 million Iron Dome funding the Pentagon had requested for fiscal 2015.

And just last week, congressional budgeters proposed an emergency appropriation — sought by the Pentagon at Israel’s request — of $225 million to help Israel buy more interceptors for its Iron Dome anti-rocket system, which Israel credits with intercepting most of the rockets it has targeted.

http://tucson.com/business/local/increased-support-for-israel-opens-more-doors-for-raytheon/article_5f833f3c-b121-53e0-8504-f9797fdcf575.html

[Yo_Mama]

22. The US should step up support, IMO n/t

[Wolf Frankula]

24. Yes, Cut off All Aid To Israel

Spend that money on Americans, in America.

Wolf

[NaturalHigh]

39. Does that apply to foreign aid to other countries or only Israel?

[Wolf Frankula]

47. Applies To Other Countries Too

We can't buy friends.

Wolf

[GeorgeGist]

25. It's time to cut the cord.

They're not children.

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

26. I voted end, but I see room for nuance.

End military support. Provide funding for joint Israeli-Palestinian projects. If they can work together, they both get money.

[cpwm17]

33. That could make sense

As part of our reparations to the Palestinians, we can help the future Israel/Palestine one-state solution succeed. There will be costs involved in helping the Palestinians in the territories get back on their feet.

That's not going to happen any time soon. It's going to get worse before it gets better. But it is essentially already one state and a one-state solution is the only possible direction Israel/Palestine can go. Any other solution is just more apartheid, or worse.

[HooptieWagon]

27. Time to end military support to all the Middle East

[riverwalker]

29. more than the $8.5 million per day

is the price we will pay in the lives of US Troops. Israel is only creating more hate and more extremists that we will someday have to deal with, not Israel.

[WatermelonRat]

30. If we end support, Iron Dome ceases to be sustainable on a large scale.

If that happens, Israel will respond far more harshly towards rocket attacks.

[JackRiddler]

31. Such interesting logic!

So U.S. military support for the armed forces killing Gazans is actually a form of humanitarian aid to the Gazans. Gotcha.

[cpwm17]

34. Or Israel can't brutalize the Palestinians with impunity

We need to stop our military support for Israel and stop protecting them from the consequences of their own bad behavior.

[TheDebbieDee]

36. As an African-American, I have felt for many years now

That I dont like the fact that ANY of my tax dollars are used to support ANY government that harrasses, discriminates against and criminalizes a large percentage of its citizenry.

Of course, this includes our own government, too.

[BlindTiresias]

37. Cut off support

Make it clear support will resume once a concrete legal status for Palestine/Palestinians has been passed, whether it be a two state solution or a single state solution will full citizenship to Palestinians.

Continuing support and "urging peace" has been the status quo and it is clearly not working.

[BlindTiresias]

42. What the hell are you talking about?

More fever dream crap.

[betterdemsonly]

44. +1000

[stopbush]

38. Until there is an actual Palestinian State, there will be no end to "terror" attacks.

The Palestinians don't have the wherewithall to fight or even negotiate as a state. They are a mouse compared to the lion that is Israel.

This is the way the disenfranchised and non-empowered fight for their cause - by using tactics that the well-armed, well-funded side will always refer to as terrorism. They don't have nukes or tanks or standing armies. They have the cheapest thing they can get their hands on that allows them to fight for what they believe are their rights.

Our media and politicians need to stop acting as if the Palestinians have the ability to act as a State in this conflict. They don't.

Cutting off aid to Israel isn't the answer. Implementing the two-state solution is the answer.

[betterdemsonly]

43. I would cut them off unless they make a serious effort

to create two real states.

[bluedigger]

46. Let's give it another fifty years or so.

We can't expect them to make peace or stand on their own overnight after all. A fifty year deadline should give them the proper motivation.

[Caretha]

50. Detroit needs the money

and our US citizens need the water & support.

Cut them off completely. Not one more red cent should come from my pocket to theirs until everyone of my American brothers & sisters have water.

Btw, did you know that Israel loans back to the US part of our aid to them & charges us interest?

[JackRiddler]

51. How so?

Do you mean, by buying T-bills?

[Caretha]

54. Yes

http://www.rense.com/general31/rege.htm

Since 1992, the U.S. has offered Israel an additional $2 billion annually in loan guarantees. Congressional researchers have disclosed that between 1974 and 1989, $16.4 billion in U.S. military loans were converted to grants and that this was the understanding from the beginning. Indeed, all past U.S. loans to Israel have eventually been forgiven by Congress, which has undoubtedly helped Israel's often-touted claim that they have never defaulted on a U.S. government loan. U.S. policy since 1984 has been that economic assistance to Israel must equal or exceed Israel's annual debt repayment to the United States. Unlike other countries, which receive aid in quarterly installments, aid to Israel since 1982 has been given in a lump sum at the beginning of the fiscal year, leaving the U.S. government to borrow from future revenues. Israel even lends some of this money back through U.S. treasury bills and collects the additional interest.

[JackRiddler]

57. Excellent, thanks for that

I only wish you had avoided linking to the repost from the horrible rense.com, which may draw criticism, even though in this case it's just a reposted material, mostly by Stephen Zunes, from the Washington Report on Middle Eastern Affairs (WRMEA.org).

http://www.wrmea.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=5696

[Maedhros]

53. No Federal money should go to any nation in violation of the NPT.

Period.

[nilesobek]

55. Further,

the US should shock the region with some interesting UN vote changes at the Security Council level. Far too long we have been the lone voice defending the indefensible.

[madokie]

56. Yes we should

Should have a long time ago. If they can't stand on their own they should just go away

[Tetris_Iguana]

58. Go away how?

Just pack up and leave, or another jewish genocide?

Which scenario do you think is more likely?

[840high]

63. Go where?

[IDemo]

59. Israel is a modern country with a strong military and economy

It's ludicrous to suggest they will crumble without the continuous infusion of US taxpayer dollars.

[KoKo]

60. It does seem it's time for them to stand on their own two feet.

I don't want my tax dollars going to all our Drone Killing of innocent children and to support a country that pens citizens in a prison camp because they consider the whole population a terrorist threat. That's dangerous stuff for a Democracy ..which Israel claims it is and so does the USA claim Israel is.

Tired of these wars when our whole society at home is crumbling away.

[JackRiddler]

64. Results after about a day...

Keeping in mind this is a voluntary poll and at best only indicates opinions of DU posters, it's hardly surprising:

205 votes, 2 passes

End material support from U.S. federal funds.
151 (74%)

Continue material support from U.S. federal funds.
48 (23%)

Other
6 (3%)

[JackRiddler]

65. July 29 bump with 200+ votes.

146 favor ending U.S. government material support to Israel, 49 are against. About 3:1.