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cali

(114,904 posts)
Sat May 17, 2014, 06:10 PM May 2014

The arc of the moral universe



I don't know that the "arc of the moral universe bends toward justice." I'm not even sure that it's an arc. From where I stand, it's more like a sideways figure 8- the infinity symbol- ever looping back on itself.

That phrase is commonly attributed wrongly to Martin Luther King, but it was originally expressed by a Unitarian minister, Theodore Parker, in an essay in 1857 in reference to the scourge of slavery.

"Look at the facts of the world. You see a continual and progressive triumph of the right. I do not pretend to understand the moral universe, the arc is a long one, my eye reaches but little ways. I cannot calculate the curve and complete the figure by the experience of sight; I can divine it by conscience. But from what I see I am sure it bends towards justice.

Things refuse to be mismanaged long. Jefferson trembled when he thought of slavery and remembered that God is just. Ere long all America will tremble."

Dr. King when he spoke of the arc of the moral universe, put the phrase in quotes signifying that he was not the originator of it, but people persist in attributing it to him, including President Obama.

It's a nice, wholesome, encouraging sentiment but I'd never say it to a victim of injustice. Tell it to those who are starving, raped or beaten, caught in war torn countries, exterminated, tortured. It's cold comfort.
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The arc of the moral universe (Original Post) cali May 2014 OP
Something to keep one going. That's its value. No more , no less. Smarmie Doofus May 2014 #1
It once seemed that the arc of the universe bent toward justice, albeit every so slowly sometimes. merrily May 2014 #2
If Jefferson "trembled when he thought of slavery" Louisiana1976 May 2014 #3
Perhaps because he was economically dependent on having them? Which isn't a very good excuse nomorenomore08 May 2014 #6
What a horrible analogy - I don't believe things just work themselves out in the end. reformist2 May 2014 #4
Who specifically said it didn't involve human effort? Humans are part of the "universe," aren't we? nomorenomore08 May 2014 #7
Good point. But I've never really gotten the idea about justice being an arc, anyway. It's odd. reformist2 May 2014 #9
It does involve a greater implicit optimism than I'm usually willing to grant, admittedly. nomorenomore08 May 2014 #10
Chomsky: Bluenorthwest May 2014 #18
Very well stated. n/t nomorenomore08 May 2014 #19
Sure. Because there is no end. Warren DeMontague May 2014 #14
Parker certainly didn't mean it as a call to complacency. Jim Lane May 2014 #16
I wouldn't mention it as some kind of comfort to any victim. Yet I would to the general public, pinto May 2014 #5
Justice is still dependent on human effort, of course. It doesn't just happen by fate. n/t nomorenomore08 May 2014 #8
that's a very good observation cali May 2014 #17
Cold Comfort, Indeed! 2banon May 2014 #11
Thank You, cali. bvar22 May 2014 #12
hey bvar, how are you? cali May 2014 #13
All things are headed for fruition panader0 May 2014 #15
 

Smarmie Doofus

(14,498 posts)
1. Something to keep one going. That's its value. No more , no less.
Sat May 17, 2014, 06:14 PM
May 2014

Let's hope it's true.

There's plenty of evidence on both sides of the question, seems to me.

merrily

(45,251 posts)
2. It once seemed that the arc of the universe bent toward justice, albeit every so slowly sometimes.
Sat May 17, 2014, 06:16 PM
May 2014

Child labor laws, laws about overtime and time off, minimum wage, universal suffrage, welfare, OASDI, Medicare, the Civil Rights Act and the end of (official) discrimination in our military. All liberal ideas.

But, like the New Deal and the Great Society, a lot of those things have been taken away.

nomorenomore08

(13,324 posts)
6. Perhaps because he was economically dependent on having them? Which isn't a very good excuse
Sat May 17, 2014, 06:32 PM
May 2014

of course, I'm just speculating here.

reformist2

(9,841 posts)
4. What a horrible analogy - I don't believe things just work themselves out in the end.
Sat May 17, 2014, 06:24 PM
May 2014

If indeed there is a rainbow arc bending toward justice, I would argue someone had to bend it there, and we have to keep bending it!

nomorenomore08

(13,324 posts)
10. It does involve a greater implicit optimism than I'm usually willing to grant, admittedly.
Sat May 17, 2014, 06:44 PM
May 2014

But even being pessimistic by nature, I don't dismiss the possibility of individual or collective improvement.

 

Bluenorthwest

(45,319 posts)
18. Chomsky:
Sun May 18, 2014, 09:18 AM
May 2014

"Optimism is a strategy for making a better future. Because unless you believe that the future can be better, it’s unlikely you will step up and take responsibility for making it so. If you assume that there’s no hope, you guarantee that there will be no hope. If you assume that there is an instinct for freedom, there are opportunities to change things, there’s a chance you may contribute to making a better world. The choice is yours.”

 

Jim Lane

(11,175 posts)
16. Parker certainly didn't mean it as a call to complacency.
Sun May 18, 2014, 03:02 AM
May 2014

The life of Theodore Parker makes clear that he'd be horrified at any such interpretation. From his Wikipedia bio:

In Boston, Parker led the movement to combat the stricter Fugitive Slave Act enacted with the Compromise of 1850. It required law enforcement and citizens of all states- free states as well as slave states- to assist in the recovery of fugitive slaves. Parker called the law "a hateful statute of kidnappers", and helped organize open resistance to it in Boston. Parker and his followers formed the Committee of Vigilance, refusing to assist with the recovery of fugitive slaves, and helping to hide them.[11] For example, they smuggled away Ellen and William Craft when Georgian slave catchers came to Boston to arrest them. Due to Parker's effort, from 1850 to the onset of the American Civil War in 1861, only twice were slaves captured in Boston and transported back to the South. On both occasions, Bostonians combatted the actions with mass protests.[12]


Instead, Parker meant his words as encouragement to progressive activists. No matter how bad things look at the moment, we should continue to fight, because our side will prevail.

After all Parker's work for abolition, he died in 1860. He didn't live to see the Emancipation Proclamation or the Thirteenth Amendment. I'm sure he would say that it didn't matter. He was on the right side of history, and he did all he could to bend that arc. He would certainly agree with you that we have to keep bending it.

pinto

(106,886 posts)
5. I wouldn't mention it as some kind of comfort to any victim. Yet I would to the general public,
Sat May 17, 2014, 06:30 PM
May 2014

a politician, an organization, a nation. A good reminder and one I believe has merit.

 

2banon

(7,321 posts)
11. Cold Comfort, Indeed!
Sat May 17, 2014, 07:09 PM
May 2014

Very nicely put, cali.

It's a nice, wholesome, encouraging sentiment but I'd never say it to a victim of injustice. Tell it to those who are starving, raped or beaten, caught in war torn countries, exterminated, tortured. It's cold comfort.

bvar22

(39,909 posts)
12. Thank You, cali.
Sat May 17, 2014, 08:01 PM
May 2014
"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."
---Edmund Burke

Leaving it Up to the Arc
can be a rationalization for inaction.

panader0

(25,816 posts)
15. All things are headed for fruition
Sat May 17, 2014, 08:39 PM
May 2014

It's not an arc, or a pendulum or a figure eight,
It's a spiral, a revolution that progresses as it turns.
Maybe...

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