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Thu Apr 10, 2014, 10:06 PM

 

Just did my taxes and I feel ashamed

The more I make the less I pay

I'm fretting getting a return of what some people would call their annual. Its just plain wrong that with my position in life where a home healthcare, retirement are not of a concern because I have all those - the people struggling to get by - whom don't even make enough to worry about those things

PAY A HIGHER PERCENTAGE OF THEIR EARNINGS TOWARDS TAXES then I do

Don't get me wrong - I was there once - I know the reality of what its like living check to check, working tons of over time and still having to make decisions "Rent or Food" or my children wanting new clothes for school or even something nice to open on Christmas morning

Its just not right and I'll be the first to say it

The Rich are Fucking America

41 replies, 3156 views

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Arrow 41 replies Author Time Post
Reply Just did my taxes and I feel ashamed (Original post)
FreakinDJ Apr 2014 OP
cherokeeprogressive Apr 2014 #1
FreakinDJ Apr 2014 #2
cui bono Apr 2014 #9
progressoid Apr 2014 #14
JaneyVee Apr 2014 #28
Bigmack Apr 2014 #3
kelly1mm Apr 2014 #4
hfojvt Apr 2014 #6
BlueCheese Apr 2014 #10
kelly1mm Apr 2014 #25
hfojvt Apr 2014 #5
FreakinDJ Apr 2014 #15
hfojvt Apr 2014 #20
Major Nikon Apr 2014 #36
JI7 Apr 2014 #7
linuxman Apr 2014 #8
hfojvt Apr 2014 #11
linuxman Apr 2014 #12
hfojvt Apr 2014 #13
Reter Apr 2014 #30
kelly1mm Apr 2014 #24
hfojvt Apr 2014 #34
kelly1mm Apr 2014 #38
FreakinDJ Apr 2014 #16
kelly1mm Apr 2014 #23
B2G Apr 2014 #17
FreakinDJ Apr 2014 #18
B2G Apr 2014 #19
JustABozoOnThisBus Apr 2014 #21
otohara Apr 2014 #22
Exposethefrauds Apr 2014 #26
FreakinDJ Apr 2014 #39
peace13 Apr 2014 #27
TransitJohn Apr 2014 #29
JaneyVee Apr 2014 #31
goldent Apr 2014 #32
badtoworse Apr 2014 #33
lonestarnot Apr 2014 #35
Reter Apr 2014 #40
treestar Apr 2014 #37
Jgarrick Apr 2014 #41

Response to FreakinDJ (Original post)

Thu Apr 10, 2014, 10:15 PM

1. The only problem I have with this is...

 

The "Rich" didn't write the tax code.

I posit that if there were politicians more interested in making things right than getting re-elected, the tax code could be rewritten so as to make things more equitable. There aren't. Anywhere.

For that reason, I'm more likely to say The Politicians have, and ARE fucking America. Fuck them all.

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Response to cherokeeprogressive (Reply #1)

Thu Apr 10, 2014, 10:27 PM

2. Rich Republicans blame poor people for the Country's financial woes

 

Knowing full well they themselves pay a lower percentage in taxation

I find that pure evil

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Response to cherokeeprogressive (Reply #1)

Fri Apr 11, 2014, 12:54 AM

9. Sure they do. They pay the politicians to write what they want them to write.

And in some cases like with Alec they actually do write the laws.

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Response to cherokeeprogressive (Reply #1)

Fri Apr 11, 2014, 04:39 AM

14. Well, more than half of congress *are* millionaires.

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Response to cherokeeprogressive (Reply #1)

Sat Apr 12, 2014, 07:42 AM

28. The rich didn't write the tax code?!

 

Yeah they did. Congress is rich. The corporations who buy the congress are rich. Corporations write our tax code.

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Response to FreakinDJ (Original post)

Thu Apr 10, 2014, 10:58 PM

3. I feel the same...

 

... not ashamed, exactly, but pissed.

We could pay more taxes, but the fuckers would just piss it away on wars & weapons rather than health care & safety nets.

Bass-ackwards priorities...

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Response to FreakinDJ (Original post)

Thu Apr 10, 2014, 11:09 PM

4. If you really feel ashamed, you can make a gift to the US Treasury. Info is:

Gifts to the United States Government

How do I make a contribution to the U.S. government?

Citizens who wish to make a general donation to the U.S. government may send contributions to a specific account called "Gifts to the United States." This account was established in 1843 to accept gifts, such as bequests, from individuals wishing to express their patriotism to the United States. Money deposited into this account is for general use by the federal government and can be available for budget needs. These contributions are considered an unconditional gift to the government. Financial gifts can be made by check or money order payable to the United States Treasury and mailed to the address below.


Gifts to the United States
U.S. Department of the Treasury
Credit Accounting Branch
3700 East-West Highway, Room 622D
Hyattsville, MD 20782

Any tax-related questions regarding these contributions should be directed to the Internal Revenue ServiceExit the FMS Web site at (800) 829-1040.


http://www.fms.treas.gov/faq/moretopics_gifts.html

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Response to kelly1mm (Reply #4)

Thu Apr 10, 2014, 11:29 PM

6. be interesting to know

how much money they usually get that way.

Less than $200?

More than $1,000,000? From how many people? If each household donated just $1 that would be over $100,000,000.

Still a very small drop in a very large bucket.

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Response to hfojvt (Reply #6)

Fri Apr 11, 2014, 01:15 AM

10. I read an article about this once.

It was kind of sweet. A lot of donors were immigrants who were showing their appreciation this way, for example.

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Response to hfojvt (Reply #6)

Sat Apr 12, 2014, 04:03 AM

25. Per a 2011 SLATE article about 26 million between 1996 and 2011. Snip:

"The agency recommends that you send your donation to the Treasury's Bureau of the Public Debt. Your money will go into a special account to redeem outstanding government notes, bills, and bonds. Since 1996, Americans have donated about $26 million to reducing federal indebtedness, which represents 0.00018 percent of the current national debt."

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Response to FreakinDJ (Original post)

Thu Apr 10, 2014, 11:27 PM

5. the more you make, the less you pay?

I am not sure how you manage that.

What percentage do you pay?

My total income was $33,359.84 comprised of $31,987.12 in wages, $129.50 in taxable interest, $341.40 in qualified dividends, $901.82 in short term capital gains (on paper (meaning I really did not make that much, because I had losses on paper last year))

I maxed out my IRA deduction at $6,500, reducing my AGI to $26,859.84 and my total tax bill to $1,833. My tax rate is either 5.5% of my total income or 6.82% of my AGI. You are making more than that and paying less than that? How?

Of course, there was another $2,548.82 that I paid in FICA taxes and another $2,548.82 that my employer paid, instead of giving to me. Making my tax rate 20.78%.

There's also income that I don't have to count - now, because it is in my IRA account, or ever - because it is in my much smaller Roth IRA account. That's actually fairly substantial - $1,200 to $1,500. A decent chunk of change, but not something I can spend now. Still, it is nice to have it for eight years down the road when I CAN spend it. Or presumably it will be if I live that long. But how much tax free income are richer people getting from their Roth accounts.

I may try to find out.

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Response to hfojvt (Reply #5)

Fri Apr 11, 2014, 10:25 AM

15. I made just under 200K

 

State, Fed, Property taxes was 16%

You just barely don't qualify for an Earned Income Tax Credit.

Your tax burden would go up until you hit $110K and then it starts going down. Becomes very noticable around $130K

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Response to FreakinDJ (Reply #15)

Fri Apr 11, 2014, 11:12 AM

20. again, though, I don't see how that is possible

and I cannot find 2013 instructions right now, but EIC stops for a single, childless person at $13,950 so I am a long way from that. On the other hand, if I had even one kid, instead of three dogs, not only would I get another exemption and a $1,000 tax credit, but I would get an EIC of about $700. With two children, I'd get another exemption and another $1,000 credit and my EIC would be $2,000 or so.

Sure, your tax rate goes down as your income goes up, IF you include property taxes in the calculation. Because they are not directly tied to income. Except in the sense that higher income people usually buy more expensive houses and/or vacation houses and thus pay more in property taxes.

Even I, myself, had an extra piece of land, with a trailer, until I sold that in 2009.

And state taxes are often flat. In Kansas, for example, a person hits the top marginal rate at AGI of about $25,000.

But federal taxes keep going up as income goes up. Over $85,000 your marginal rate goes from 25% to 28%, except, of course, on dividend income, long term capital gains, and IRA earnings.

You say $113,000 though, which makes me think you are talking about FICA taxes as well. Yeah, that last $87,000 isn't subject to the 5.2% tax that lower income people pay.

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Response to hfojvt (Reply #20)

Sat Apr 12, 2014, 12:31 PM

36. It's possible if you're talking about FICA and/or investment income

As far as straight federal wage income, the more you make the more you pay all other things being equal.

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Response to FreakinDJ (Original post)

Thu Apr 10, 2014, 11:32 PM

7. maybe there should be a march of higher income people who call for more fairness

and want to pay more taxes.

march to congress and demand a system that is more fair .

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Response to FreakinDJ (Original post)

Fri Apr 11, 2014, 12:35 AM

8. Well...

 

Cut a check to the treasury.

I'm serious. They'll take it.

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Response to linuxman (Reply #8)

Fri Apr 11, 2014, 01:32 AM

11. that really solves nothing

the top 5% will get $1.3 trillion in Bush tax cuts over the next ten years.

I am pretty sure that everybody replying to this thread could donate ALL of our income over the next ten years and not even touch that.

Let's say the thread gets an amazing 200 replies. And that the people replying make an average of $100,000 a year (which is 3 times MY own income). Then all of our income over the next decade would be $200,000,000. That's a fairly substantial sum, but it's only 1.5% of the permanent tax cuts going to the richest 5% in the next decade.

Thus even 200 people with substantial income cannot do much to impact the tax cuts that the Democrats and Obama have made permanent for the rich, not even if they sacrificed everything they had.

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Response to hfojvt (Reply #11)

Fri Apr 11, 2014, 01:50 AM

12. He seems bothered by it.

 

It would make him feel better.

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Response to linuxman (Reply #12)

Fri Apr 11, 2014, 02:00 AM

13. seems more bothered by the entire system

perhaps bothered by the whole $1.3 trillion.

By the favorable treatment of dividend income versus wage income.

The final line of the OP

"The Rich are Fucking America"

One or even 1,000 rich people cannot stop that $1.3 trillion that is going from public purposes into private pockets. It takes policy to change that.

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Response to linuxman (Reply #12)

Sat Apr 12, 2014, 07:52 AM

30. He can send me a check

 

I need it more than the government, I'm lower middle class.

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Response to hfojvt (Reply #11)

Sat Apr 12, 2014, 03:56 AM

24. Didn't the Bush tax cuts expire in 2012? Are you menaing the tax cuts that President Obama made

permanent in 2012?

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Response to kelly1mm (Reply #24)

Sat Apr 12, 2014, 09:26 AM

34. only 13% of them were allowed to expire

87% of the Bush tax cuts were made permanent.

A move that highly favored the rich.

Of the $3.7 trillion in tax cuts, $2.4 trillion of them goto the top 20%.

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Response to hfojvt (Reply #34)

Sat Apr 12, 2014, 12:49 PM

38. So are the Bush tax cuts that President Obama made permanent now the Obama tax cuts

since the ones Bush put in expired?

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Response to linuxman (Reply #8)

Fri Apr 11, 2014, 10:29 AM

16. Actually I prefer to give to Real Charities

 

Childrens Hospital, Churches that feed the hungry

I don't consider Defense Contractors a Charitable Organisation

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Response to FreakinDJ (Reply #16)

Sat Apr 12, 2014, 03:52 AM

23. So, you are not really ashamed that you do not pay more taxes, you are ashamed that taxes

are not higher AND going to those things that you support? If so, that is fine. But your OP as written did not imply that. Rather, it implied that you should be paying more taxes and that you were ashamed of that (and several people responded that you could make a contribution to the Treasury so you could 'make amends')

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Response to FreakinDJ (Original post)

Fri Apr 11, 2014, 10:36 AM

17. You know you can voluntarily pay more, right? nt

 

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Response to B2G (Reply #17)

Fri Apr 11, 2014, 10:39 AM

18. You should have read post #16

 

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Response to FreakinDJ (Reply #18)

Fri Apr 11, 2014, 10:44 AM

19. Just did

 

and I agree with your approach.

Which is why I disagreed with the reduction in tax deductions for charitable donations.

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Response to FreakinDJ (Original post)

Fri Apr 11, 2014, 03:40 PM

21. Maybe you have more deductions?

A mortgage is a deduction. A IRA contribution is a deduction. Kids are deductions, in many ways. Charities are deductions. License plates might be deductions.

I think I paid a higher proportion when I was young, and single, and renting, and, and, and. I had no expenses, either, other than for, well, me.

I named a few of what I'd call "middle class" deductions. The rich have their own set of even better deductions, but their accountants and lawyers handle all that. I don't play in that league.

You're right, the rich are fucking America, and we keep electing their tools to Congress and to the governors' mansions and the state legislatures.

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Response to FreakinDJ (Original post)

Fri Apr 11, 2014, 05:04 PM

22. We Made Less - Pay More

 

My hubby is making 15,000 less and we have to pay for the first time in a couple decades.

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Response to FreakinDJ (Original post)

Sat Apr 12, 2014, 04:31 AM

26. Why feel ashamed you did not write the tax laws in the country or maybe you did?

 

Anyway you do make an interesting point. I make between 100,000 and 150,000 a year, under 65, no kids and between all the legal deductions Mortgage interest, 401k, donations and state and local taxes the only ones I take....I pay a 15.5% federal tax rate.

Is it right and fair, not really but until one buys a home, you are pretty much screwed when it comes to taxes in America. Squirt out a kid or 2 or a dozen and you get even more for a tax break, which I think is wrong, the more kids one has the more one should pay in taxes because they are the ones consuming the most resources. But that if for another discussion.

If I were in charge the first 50k a year one makes would be tax free regardless of source, a flat 10% for incomes between 50k and 100k a flat 15% for incomes between 100k and 150k. Incomes above 150k start paying a graduated rate toping out at a 90% rate.

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Response to Exposethefrauds (Reply #26)

Sat Apr 12, 2014, 03:50 PM

39. 50K to 85K is the highest tax bracket

 

and seems purely designed to prevent people from upward mobility for their children

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Response to FreakinDJ (Original post)

Sat Apr 12, 2014, 07:39 AM

27. Be sure to call your Congress critters!

 

Put a voice to your concern or donate the money to a cause that hits home or a neighbor who is struggling. There is no shortage of need in this country!

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Response to FreakinDJ (Original post)


Response to FreakinDJ (Original post)

Sat Apr 12, 2014, 07:59 AM

31. I need your accountant.

 

Made just under $117K last year and I owe money. I don't mind paying it though, just wish I could choose where it goes.

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Response to FreakinDJ (Original post)

Sat Apr 12, 2014, 08:37 AM

32. Another soution

would be to figure out how much more you should have paid in taxes, and donate that money to a charity of your choice. Maybe a charity related to something you think the government should be doing more about - it could be help for the homeless or very poor, medical research, education programs, etc. It's like directing where your taxes should be spent.

The thing about this is you will get a tax deduction next year on this charitable gift, and so you can give even more. This is known as "grossing up." Say you are in the 28% marginal tax rate. And say you think you should have paid $10,000 more in taxes this year. You can actually donate 10000/(1-.28) = $13889 this year which will account for the 10000 you underpaid in taxes this year, and account for the deduction you will get next year.

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Response to FreakinDJ (Original post)

Sat Apr 12, 2014, 08:45 AM

33. Nothing stopping you from sending more money if you want.

 

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Response to FreakinDJ (Original post)

Sat Apr 12, 2014, 10:05 AM

35. Write a check for the difference to the treasury.

 

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Response to lonestarnot (Reply #35)

Sun Apr 13, 2014, 11:20 AM

40. I think he's better off just donating the difference

 

Either to the poor or some kind of research.

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Response to FreakinDJ (Original post)

Sat Apr 12, 2014, 12:47 PM

37. I'm proud of you

You could be one of those people saying I earned it (which you did but when they say it it's different, lol) and the government shouldn't take it from me to give to the less deserving (though the military is ok).

The lower incomes should be more graduated. It seems to hit 10% once you have any taxable income at all. And the standard deduction should be enough to live on in basic poverty - it's 6100 for a single person, and that's way below what the federal government determines to be poverty level. Ridiculous any taxes at all should be payable until you are profitable, so to speak, as a unit, single or family.

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Response to FreakinDJ (Original post)

Sun Apr 13, 2014, 11:24 AM

41. So cut the Treasury a check for what you think is your fair share...

 



Problem solved.

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