Let Me Ask You A Second Question... Why Would A Young Voter Join The Democratic Party After..

pretty sharp, passionate and committed, I believe she will be back.

I also believe the young people she was speaking to heard her clarion call and will take up the gauntlet as well despite party betrayal.

Thanks for the thread, WillyT.

Nobody has a good answer.

Endorsing Republicans because you are a liberal ideologue who didn't get his pony is entirely another level of evil.

we wouldn't win back the house in 2014. See it's all about "politics". At least that's what I have heard on DU.
The party is broken. When Democrats support a right wing jerk over someone in their own party, there is a serious problem.

Unless you are on DU of course. Then it's just 11 dimensional political chess.

On average the Democratic party is more likely to support a whole range of issues that people, young and old should care about.

And if your theory is taken to Republicans, look at the way many establishment Republicans didn't support Cuccinelli.

A) They're not as gullible to the trite Americana crap that was tossed at us during OUR youths...

B) They are now able to check out BULLSHIT in nanoseconds, get challenged and /or confirmed in said time and space.

C) They are young... and don't tend to trust the rest of us.

D) Been there, done that.

'pragmatic' policies. They are way more informed than previous generations and do not get their info from the Corporate Media. As their numbers increase, they are going to be a real threat to the status quo, according to reports.

That is not a surprise to me as a I know so many of them, just reaching the age where they CAN make a difference. They KNOW what is going on. OWS was a manifestation of the new generation and was impressive in the sense that they are SO aware of the corruption in our electoral system, the ties to Wall St. the corrupting influences of money in our electoral system.

That was the first opening shot of the new generation and as they increase in numbers, which they are, more and more of them are rejecting the Status Quo which has so harmed their futures.

and the future of the country.

Why surrender the party to the corrupt assholes?

Why are they even there ?

AND.. what do you think these Dems expect for this behavior ???

Connections in the next Clinton Administration, or Christie Adminstration?

Why are they there? Because they are there. As Will Pitt said, those who show up decide everything. They get themselves elected on a local level and work up from there.

disgusting, those doing that should be unwelcome here and in the Party. 'I've got money so I get to dictate' is what Koch Bros say. Fuck all the rich out to be richer by destroying democracy.

They are able to understand intricacies of politics that require that the party prioritizes their spending to maximize gains. Throwing money into an unwinnable race is mismanagement.

Party leaders endorsing candidates that have zero chance is bad politics, especially for a President.


As for local NJ politicians endorsing Christie....probably a matter of self preservation.


There was no amount of money that could have been spent in NJ that would've stopped Christie.


In addition... If he was going to win... It is to our political advantage for his 2016 plans to get momentum. We want a GOP civil war. Having a candidate front runner that the tea party and RW media loathes helps fan the fires of that civil war.


You can't see the forest for the trees. There's a bigger war going on out here. Read Sun Tzu.

Mole hill.

He won by 500,000 votes.

Get real, here. He didn't win because a bunch of nobodies in NJ endorsed him.

Period.

By refusing to endorse Buono.

And by spending playtime with Christie in full photo op mode while ignoring his Democratic challenger.

By that same logic, I am correct in saying that when you criticize Obama you are implicitly supporting the GOP.


There's no such thing as an implicit endorsement. The act of endorsing is an explicit event.

ODS.

Sid

Ultimately, I blame it all on the Pope.

he implicitly endorsed Christie.

Sid

We just get stupider and stupider from birth and by the time we are ready for SS we don't know shit.

Even when they are in the minority.

Pretty good for a group that doesn't understand the rules of the game.

The GOP got creamed last night, with the exception of NJ.

Despite their best efforts, they haven't stopped ObamaCare.


They (GOP) certainly don't think they're winning.

They lost the shutdown big time... And they're a party that is cracking up.

I don't see that as a loss for the Republicans, or at least not for those who control them anyway.

is the appeal to supporting their party

Mole hill.

That's DU Social Networking...

And SN has tossed some serious wrenches into the mix.

With Liberty, Justice, and Fairness being in the top tier.

Money talks in politics, unfortunately.

But you are correct about how the younger generation. It was THEY who launched the movement OWS and it was an impressive revelation of just how informed they are and how smart and active they are. The old ways are being rejected by the new generations. And that is why the old, corrupt system tried so hard to stop them. But you can't stop an idea, you can brutally attack them, as they did, you can force them out of the pubic square with guns and weapons and false arrests, but you cannot stop them, and they haven't stopped them.

With each new blow to democracy, with each new betrayal, more are enlisted to a movement that will continue to the corrupt, status quo. I am encouraged by the RL movements of Progressive Dems across the country in reaction to the phoniness and the deceptions that has effectively destroyed their futures..

Cuccinelli lost the day the government was shutdown.

It was a fait accompli.


And even before that, it was a tied race.


The moment Cuccinelli got the nom, it became a winnable race.

NJ was lost a year ago when Christie embraced Obama.

And the embrace showed voters in NJ that Christie wasn't a tea party nutjob.

Hurricane Sandy, and Christie's working with Obama in the aftermath of it, sealed Christie's reelection.

be used to 'seal' a Republican victory is smarmy business from a second term President. Ugly, nasty politics of the sort that I reject vehemently. Democrats should not be props for Republican image making.
NJ must really suck, other States have disasters and we just expect the governor to do his job no matter what the Party, we do not fall into a shocked stupor when a man simply does what he is paid to do. Christie did nothing special during that disaster that others have not done each year of our history.

If Obama, Clinton, Dean, and other national democrats poured money and effort into NJ... Only to have Christie win big anyway... Then Christie's win takes on an even larger meaning.

He could justifiably say:

"The Democrats threw everything they had at me, and I still won. This is how we win nationally. The people of NJ showed that the Democratic message is devoid of merit. If anyone had any doubts before about how America has tuned out this administration, those doubts have been answered."

The pundit class would be talking about nothing else, and tuesday would have a much different spin than it does now.

The current conventional wisdom about tuesday is that Democrats won everywhere they tried to win, and the only GOP win was by a non tea partier in a state where they went up against the Democratic JV team.

The big loser of the election was the tea party. The winner was the Democrats.

Sometimes a strategic retreat in one battle helps one win the overall war.

happened and victims were left to try to pick up the pieces without resources or help from their state. THAT was the issue that could and SHOULD have been used against him.

And I'm not sure what you mean by the 'embrace showed voters in NJ that Christie wasn't a tea party nutjob'. What has that got to do with Dems voting for a Republican? He's still a Right Wing Republican and I sure hope that embrace was not meant to signal support for him over a Dem Candidate. It sure didn't for me. I don't care who hugs who, a Republican is a Republican and Christie had some serious issues that were ignored by the Dem Leadership, not to mention the STate Dems actually DERAILING their own party candidate.

It is just disgusting, especially since it's become a pattern now, along with all the same old excuses.

uh...NO

You must not live in VA...

Failed to support buono, to solicit their funds from someone else

Isn't that what good Democrats are supposed to do?

Obama allowed himself and his office to be used as a set piece for the Christie Image Project. Stupid is the word for it, but also craven or simply 'Bipartisan Centrist'.
You all poison the well then blame the thirsty for drinking. The hubris is disgusting.

Younger voters are idealistic. And why reject the party over 50 state Democrats in one state not handling a thing the way you'd like?

not party hacks from individual states or where the money goes.

Minimum wage?

Education?

Democratic leaders in NJ just endorsed someone on the wrong side of all three of those issues and many more and of course it's fine with you.

It's the liberal ideologues who are the real problem in the Democratic party, if we could just get rid of them then total victory would be within our pragmatic moderate centrist grasp.

lead of more than 50 'prominent Dems'?

Why would any Dem support a Corporate puppet like Christie? Can you explain that?

...that "Democrat" doesn't automatically equal "progressive".

any circumstances.

a Democrat when it got interested in politics.

To stop onslaught on gays, women, and ethnic minorities? To stop the full speed privatization of the public square? Lot's of reasons to support Dems that ought weigh one off-year governor's race.

He IS the onslaught against us, he and his fellow Republicans and 'Moderate Democrats' who defend him. Yesterday was our Party laying down and rolling over for a Republican who is no different than Ted Cruz.

so whether you think he is right wing or not...he could have fought with every tool available to delay this, but he chose to let it go. That is much different than Ted Cruz.

I'll bet that some of the same people that encouraged her to run went on to endorse Christie. They wanted Christie to have an opponent, they didn't want him unopposed, but they didn't have anyone with deep pockets that was willing to oppose him.

If Buono had some big money backers, I'll bet many of those 50 would have at least not endorsed at all rather than actively endorsing a repuke.

As for the arguments "Hey, that's politics", "There's a bigger picture here" and "Those Dems did what they had to do", that message should have been CLEARLY communicated to Buono. Yes, SOMEONE had to run against Christie, and no, they weren't going to have a real good chance. The state party leaders SHOULD have communicated this clearly to her from the get-go to avoid a speech just like this one, which has the potential to do more damage to NJ Democrats than her actual election loss did.

Depending on your location, the ration of internal to external battles will be different, but there will always be internal opponents and there will always be a need to fight the internal battles. If people want the Democrats to get better, someone has to join and do the hard work. I'm not a big fan of the "I'm not going to join you until after you win" mentality.

That would be my reason.

and vowing to fix things no matter what he had to do. He bucked his own party, went to Obama even. Refused to play politics when the voters of his state needed help.

I don't personally like the guy, but I see why he won his race. I suspect it would have been suicidal for any state Democrats to oppose him.

Sometimes politics is local.

If he runs for president, it's a whole different race.

But of course it isn't...you're just one of those leftists who doesn't know better.

...to base their decisions on a broad range of issues, perhaps even being motivated enough to join to change what they don't like?

where a big chunk of one party or another crosses over...

I'm not saying that I like or approve of it, but it does happen...

Hell, just four years earlier Dems in Virginia defected en masse to support McDonnell

If you have been around party politics for any length of time. You learn to recognize that some times a candidate is put up for a race that nobody expects to win. Yes we need them to pull enough votes to continue our listing as a major party. We don't want them to bring shame or disgrace to the party. And it is a chance for them to get some publicity, exposure to the party, etc.

supporting Dems since 1959 myself..I voted straight Dem - When Dems Were Still Dems- and unfortunately--beyond because I had faith and trust. I shoulda stopped after Carter.

It's hard to face the truth about them-while still hanging on with those Few who Are working for us. I'll support them still--But the Wall Street/Erskin Bowles/Pete Peterson/Clinton/Third Way/No Labels/New Dem Coalition is nothing in my eyes-a group of corporate friendly Politicians who have been, are and will continue to try to convince the masses that what we've watched happen since NAFTA/CAFTA/the repeal of Glass-Steagall is still the answer, coupled with cuts/cuts/cuts to social services We fund, as The Only solution to our economic ills..because the wealthy don't have enuf and they need to be incentivized with More Tax Cuts that are then paid for by the Old, the Hungry, the young, our Vets, the Sick and the working poor aka: formerly Middle Class.
They now try to get us to believe that the Whole Country is moved to the Center Right. Bull Shit. Clearly, when we speak-even through our votes, they have their fingers in their ears screaming "nah,nah,nah,nah,nah" as thery stand there in front of the cameras - shaking their heads over the sad state of the GOP, not understanding how They are out of touch with the American people. That's laughable and a poor performance.
It's just not easy to see politicians I once trusted and believed In and Voted For--stab us in the back alongside the GOP as they lay 100% of the blame on Them. The GOP is about as undeniably Corporate as they come-they don't even Try to hide it anymore...so When are we going to Wake up and accept the Undeniable Truths we are being Shown-with evidence-that the leadership/top ranking Democrats are in on it too?

If you're gonna screw us--for God's Sake Own it.

That is why I take what they say with a huge grain of rice...they knew nothing when they voted for Reagan and they are still know nothings. I have no doubt they LOVE the repuke they helped put in office. DINOs suck.