Looks like all the lightbulb hoarders just got an interesting christmas 'present'

[ProdigalJunkMail]

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2011/dec/16/congress-overturns-incandescent-light-bulb-ban


sP

[Why Syzygy]

1. Moonie Times?

eek! Begin count for DU meltdown!

Try this one:
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1211/70534.html#ixzz1gfZYp9MM

[ProdigalJunkMail]

2. eh...saw it on FB...

so sue me...

sP

[Why Syzygy]

7. yah

I know how it goes. I was teasing. Although I normally do try to find a different news link. This article was harmless enough.

There ARE those purists who get very hung up on sources.

[Coyote_Bandit]

3. I would be

one of those lightbulb hoarders.

It probably has something to do with the fact that I am (1) vision impaired, and (2) poor and (3) live in a small old house. I need bright light without blue undertones in order to see well enough to read. I can't afford a $20+ LED bulb nor can I afford to replace light fixtures in my home just because I can't find bulbs that fit the fixtures.

You'd be wrong if you were to assume I hate the environment and want to destroy it.

[hlthe2b]

5. I can see your point.

I've wasted a lot of money on CF bulbs that just suck in terms of the quality and color of light they produce... Of course they last friggin forever, so I'm stuck with them--or throwing them out, which I can't bring myself to do.

[joeglow3]

8. Mine last about 25% as long as a regular bulb

After replacing a bunch for the second time (while all my regular bulbs were going strong), the clerk informed me they are intended to be turned on and left on. Apparently, their lives are shortened if you only keep them on for short periods of time. That made complete sense, since these bulbs are in my basement and only on for a short time. I replaced all the bulbs downstairs with regular bulbs and have not had to change one since.

Assuming this is true, when they measure how "effective" the bulb is, do they take into account I need to have lights on in my basement for 20 hours for every hour of use, or pay hundreds a year replacing these bulbs?

[hlthe2b]

11. I do use a few of mine in fixtures I want to leave on.... But I agree... If you turn them on and off

constantly, that dramatically shortens their life (referring to CFs), plus they don't come on right away....I think the wattage is low enough for where I am using them that is about like having a nightlight running 24/7.

But, no, they don't seem a very good solution for lamps and other fixtures you would want to use occasionally and for short periods of time. I guess LEDs come on instantly, but I've not bought any yet. I'm told they don't really put out that much light, but since they don't tell you on the packaging or displays what "normal" wattage bulb they are meant to replace--who knows?

[krispos42]

41. LEDs come on instantly

Output is best measured in lumens, not the power consumed (watts) because obviously different technologies will use different power levels.

I believe a 60-watt incandescent is about 1,000 lumens of light output.


I was able to get ~ 175-lumen LED (2 watts) lightbulbs for $6 each at WallyWorld last year, and I think I saw 900 or 1,000-watt LEDs at Home Depot for like 9 bucks on sale.


The "holy grail", I'm told, is making a 100-watt-equivilent LED.


The fundamental problem with both LEDs and CFLs is that they need a conversion system to turn AC to into DC. Incandescents don't care either way.

[hlthe2b]

43. That's helpful thanks...

[TalkingDog]

12. I don't know about leaving them on, but here are a few things that will cause faster burnout.

They will burn out faster if they are enclosed for instance, in a sconce or globe. And they should be turned "right side up" Annnnd don't shake them too much... slamming doors or under a "live" floor. They don't do well with vibrations or shocks.

Annnnd sometimes the base of the light doesn't quite make proper contact with the socket tab. This can set up an arc which burns the light out.



http://www.jsonline.com/realestate/beforeandafter/126417253.html

[saras]

22. Which is to say that, in general, they are not substitutes for incandescent lamps.

They're only suitable in the case of fixed lamps that are pointed in the right direction. (this room has one fixed ceiling light, and five flexible lights). Four to one in my shop, and seven to two in the living room. In order to save energy, nearly all of our lights can be moved and pointed where the light is needed. CFLs don't like this.

You also can't use dimmers on them to save energy, something we do a lot. And their life doesn't go up if you dim them, unlike incandescents.

And they do spill mercury when (in our case, when, not if) they break. And if they break on a carpet, you're screwed trying to clean them up. There's no good way to get mercury out of a carpet.

And, of course, you get what you pay for. Cheap incandescents are inferior, and cheap CFLs are inferior.

[TalkingDog]

34. The newer versions are working on those flaws. As for Mercury - Cost/Benefit re: coal plant emissons

http://www.energystar.gov/ia/partners/promotions/change_light/downloads/Fact_Sheet_Mercury.pdf

But you are right: you get what you pay for.

[TalkingDog]

10. freecycle

give them to somebody who wants them... or can't afford any lightbulbs, much less a cfl

or donate to charity for the tax break.... whichevs.

[OwnedByFerrets]

15. I wish mine lasted forever. They dont seem to last any longer than incandescent for me. nm

[ProdigalJunkMail]

17. in the same damned boat

pay 3 to 10 times as much per bulb and still change them at the same frequency...

sucks...

sP

[Selatius]

29. My bulbs are still working three years into it.

I was told the secret to longevity of CFLs is the on-off cycle. If you turn them on and turn them off quickly thereafter, they'll break a lot faster vs. just leaving them off or leaving them on for long periods. That, and you don't shake them or put them into fixtures that are constantly bumped or subject to vibrations or shocks.

[kudzu22]

21. My CFLs burned out

in about the same time that an incandescent did. I like saving energy as much as the next guy, but I hate throwing out (recycling) $5 lightbulbs after a few months. And they do produce inferior light. I might upgrade to LEDs sometime if someone can prove to me they'll last long enough to make it worthwhile.

[ProdigalJunkMail]

9. I am a hoarder as well...

so I guess I should have mentioned that...

sorry, not at all trying to malign hoarders...just lamenting...

sp

[Mugu]

23. Except the cheapest 100 watt halogen bulbs cost $3.97 at Home Depot

and you can buy regular incandescent bulbs all day long for less than $.50.

[Mugu]

30. Don't forget that some light fixtures will need to be replaced

due to the higher operating temperatures of halogen lamps.

I have work that must get done this evening. So I don't have time to chat, but this article has has a wealth of information about bulbs and is a great read:

http://donklipstein.com/bulb1.html

[Coyote_Bandit]

32. I can buy 8 incandescent bulbs

for the price of a single halogen bulb. That is a significant difference in cost. Especially if you are poor.

And the incandescent bulb will have a soft light not the harsh white light of the halogen bulbs. And that is an important consideration to those of us who have poor vision and strain to see.

[Coyote_Bandit]

37. Alas,I am poor and pinching my pennies

I can buy 8 incandescents for the price of a single halogen bulb.

That expense may be inconsequential to you but in this house it counts and it makes a big difference.

I can replace 8 incandescent bulbs in a year with 8 incandescent bulbs for the grand sum of $4 or I can replace them with 8 halogen bulbs for the sum of $32. That's a difference of $28. That $28 will cover my gasoline expense for a month. Or pay the majority of my monthly trash/water/sewer bill ($35/month) or my cell phone bill (also $35/month). When you're poor you pay attention to little shit like that. It adds up

And even when you are poor you know that there is always somebody who is trying to sell you something or make you feel bad because you couldn't/didn't buy whatever thay were selling.

Given their price tag, halogen bulbs are pretty far down my list of priorities.

[Coyote_Bandit]

45. And the problem with your argument is

that you apparently do not understand how poor people live.

Poor people generally do not have enough $$$ to meet all of their immediate expenses. They prioritize those expenses and the most pressing are paid first. Maybe you pay one utility bill in full to avoid losing service while making only a partial payment on another utility bill. If you're lucky you haven't had medical care in years. If you haven't been so lucky, you're either dodging bill collectors or making monthly payments for the rest of your life. The quality of necessary things (i.e. food) is traded down. You wear thrift store clothing and eat Spam and peanut butter. That $$$ savings is then be directed to meet other more pressing expenses. Maybe you are trying to scrape together a few dollars to give your kid or your mother a small gift for a birthday or Christmas. Maybe you missed a day of work because you were sick and you lost a day of wages (or lost your job or had your hours drastically cut). Those long-term savings are for folks that have the $$$ resources right now to save over an extended future period of time. Poor people don't have that luxury.

Try your hand and see how you fare at poverty. I'm guessing you'll quickly sse why high-efficiency lightbulbs are not a priority for folks who struggle to survive.
http://playspent.org/

[hlthe2b]

4. I've already replaced nearly all my incandescents...

It is baffling trying to sort through the array of Compact Fluorescents (which now fortunately are increasingly covering up that ridiculous screw shaped inclusion with a "normal-looking" bulb-shaped shell), LEDs and whatever else are out there (including supposedly more energy efficient incandescents). The LEDs, unlike CFs almost never tell you what wattage they are meant to replace--they just tell you how many watts they use. THAT is infuriating. And the price range is outrageous for the same bulbs.

I've gotten saddled with a lot of CFs that just put out a very strange and ugly kind of light, but damn if they don't last. But I've broken several and undoubtedly left mercury and other traces wherever they fell.


The industry has a LONG way to go, that's for sure. I think it is a mess, right now in terms of educating and aiding the consumer.

[pintobean]

6. Thank you Santa!

[bikebloke]

14. CF bulbs with warm light

When in South Africa recently, I stayed in hostels with the tooth paste CF bulbs. However, the toothpaste part was enclosed in another bulb that gave off a warm light like incandescents. I wish I could find something like that here. My eyes work better with that sort of light.

[qb]

18. Whew! That's a relief. Now the Tea Party can concentrate on winning the War on Christmas

[drm604]

19. There was no incandescent light bulb ban.

There were higher efficiency standards (for good reasons) but there was no ban on incandescent bulbs. Phillips, for example, markets an incandescent bulb that would have met the standards.

The "incandescent light bulb ban" is just another right-wing myth.

[sylveste]

20. if you have to meet standards

isn't that a defacto ban? maybe i like my old ineficient bulbs. why should the government be involved in this at all. seems like the free market could handle this with ease. i've never once looked at my lightbulbs and thought boy i wish the government would step in and make these more efficient. this is government nonsense.

[drm604]

26. It's not a de facto ban

because there are incandescents that meet the standard.

[hedgehog]

27. Wait - you're suggesting that the unregulated free market will produce

energy efficient products?



Seriously - lighting consumes about 10% of our energy usage IIRC. I do know my electric bill dropped significantly when I trained the kids to turn out the lights when they left a room.

[madinmaryland]

35. If the government didn't step in, corporations would NOT step in to make them more efficient.

It would cost them money to invest in the new bulbs to provide us with bulbs which they would not spend, because they would not be able to afford corporate yachts. That is corporate nonsense.

[hedgehog]

24. I must be the exception to the rule - I used to wash my fixtures whenever

i had to open them to replace a bulb. Now my CFLs last so long, I have to take the fixture down just to wash it. I suspect that CFLs have improved, i seem to recall replacing the earlier ones more frequently.

Purchase your lightbulbs based on lumens, not watts. Manufacturers seem to be all over the place when they compare watts to watts; one guy's CFL will put out 50% more lumens than the other guy's, but both claim to replace a 60 watt incadescent.

There are CFLs out there that produce different spectrums of light, you just have to do your research.

As it is, I figure that about the time I need to buy any new bulbs, LEDs will be down in price and bright enough!

[spanone]

36. guess we can't call them a do nothing congress now?

this is the burning issue of our times...

[Norrin Radd]

38. LED lightbulbs with better color are being developed:

The Future of Light Is the LED

http://www.wired.com/magazine/2011/08/ff_lightbulbs/all/1

[ThoughtCriminal]

40. "Stopping the bulb ban was a chief GOP priority coming into this year"

I'm just glad we weren't having debate whether to stop a massive asteroid approaching Earth. As soon as President Obama proposed a plan to stop it, the GOP would suddenly become "Pro-Impact".

[MjolnirTime]

42. There are no factories left making those things.

[Islandlife]

44. Oops. Never mind.

Let's get our agenda straight here.

Thought I could create my own secondary or black market. Anyone need some bulbs?