Is this a picture of a violent person? Should this poisin any compassion for them?

[WingDinger]

Shouldn't this person be killed for thinking about throwing that stone?



Hey, you get involved, you must expect what you get.



While I support wholly nonviolent Occupy reactions to the 1 percents mercenaries, can you really use fighting back against wholesale indignities to discredit the voice of the downtrodden? Isn't kettling for the purpose of creating violence, witholding meds, running a candidate that says outright he doesn't care about the very poor, a righteous goading of those targetted?

At what point can it be said that a human could not resist defending themselves? Do we REALLY expect those targetted to simply die for the purpose of not taxing the rich anymore, or having the FED cause unemployment, so as not to create wage pressure? Or inflation, which will diminish the stack o cash of the rich?

Is it better that the rich can employ mercenaries to throw their rocks for them? Does that make them unculpable?

I hear liberals, or at least Dem sympathizers say that any fighting back SHOULD destroy the Occupy movement and message.

You had better rethink that, as if the Rethugs somehow win the presidency, many will be sentenced to death. And they will not go silently to their graves. That is not how humans work.

This is not an incitement to violence, just a sober view on the ineviteable result of hating and punishing the poor. I will tell you this, if the choice is dying for the good of the rich, or fighting with any and all possible strength, at some point, you will see me there.

I have been told by many rethugs that my disease, and inability to pay for my care and food etc, I should just die. Sorry, but everyone has to go sometime. This is your time. They even tell me that is what Jesus would do.

Do you really expect all those sentenced to a slow painful death to say thank you sir, may I have another?

[rhett o rick]

1. You do bring up a good point.

While I strongly believe that violence would be welcomed by our overlords so they can ratchet up their brutality, I believe that if we are to prevail, we must continue with non-violence. I do not believe we have a chance by using violence. They are well equipped to win that fight. I do understand that we as a people should not accept slavery. We should not work in factories 12 hours a day and live in dorms by the factories. These things are happening today in China and our overlords think that if China can do it why not here? It's just capitalism. I dont know where that line is.

[WingDinger]

3. Calling those CHOICES to starve, withold meds, punish the poor simply the free market

or capitalism, is a royal copout. We are CHOOSING to kill our countrymen.

The rich want to make the free market GOd. And like the ins. companies, acts of God are not their responsibility.

[rhett o rick]

14. When I said, "It's just capitalism." I was being facetious. nm

[WingDinger]

15. Wasnt critisizing your point.

[mike_c]

2. nonviolence REQUIRES copious numbers of victims in order to work....

The most fundamental principle of nonviolent resistance is that many people will be harmed. Their suffering and death is the source of nonviolence's moral authority and power.

Not everyone has the stomach for going quietly into victimhood.

[jberryhill]

4. +1

I like the standard... "We were engaging in civil disobedience, and those bastards ARRESTED us!"

[rhett o rick]

11. Where did you get that "standard"? Arrests are expected. Even brutal treatment is expected.

That doesnt make it good. I hope you arent intimating that a violent revolution is the only option at this point.

[WingDinger]

13. I didnt get that. Violent revolution is only viable to those presently stockpiling weapons{Rethugs}

[Brickbat]

9. Very true. Any good movement is able to divide itself into different groups -- those who are willing

and able to put their bodies on the line, literally; those whose strength is organizing and managing; those who motivate; those who serve as footsoldiers; those who are there to make up crowds of peaceful protesters but who are expected to "drop out" when the going gets rough.

[WingDinger]

16. It takes a village. To stop the pillage.

[undergroundpanther]

5. so very true

....you cannot negotiate,reason,or appease a sociopaths, practice tolerance with a tyrannical sociopathic culture and thier loyal syncophants who believing themselves relieved of responsibility by the chain of command commit atrocity without shame.

sometimes beating the living shit out of a tyrant( or faceless fascism and corporations of the 1%) Is the only way to get rights the bullies take.
Sometimes the tree of liberty needs to be watered by the blood of tyrants.

To fail as citizens to fight to preserve our liberty in the face of tyrany is treason.

Hate the Rich,the 1% it's what tells us we are being abused and our human rights are being taken.


Exerpted From the Cure ~Fight


Fight fight fight
Just push it away
Fight fight fight
Just push until it breaks
Fight fight fight
Don't cry at the pain
Fight fight fight
Or watch yourself burn again
Fight fight fight
Don't howl like a dog
Fight fight
Just fill up the sky
Fight fight fight
Fight til you drop
Fight fight fight
And never never
Never stop

Fight fight fight
Fight fight fight

So when the hurting starts
And when the nightmares begin
Remember you can fill up the sky
You don't have to give in
You don't have to give in

Never give in
Never give in
Never give in

[gratuitous]

6. It requires more strength not to fight than to fight

Violent resistance will always be met with more violence, and as Dr. King noted, violence cannot drive out violence. It only multiplies, and if you're going to take on the American Wehrmacht, keep in mind that this is the only entity on earth that has used nuclear weapons on civilians.

It requires training, discipline and focus to employ non-violence. Our society is awash in the message of violence, and esteems violence as the panacea to all troubles; any problem that doesn't resolve through violence merely needs to have more violence applied to it. The gospel of violence is so pervasive, so thoroughly entwined in our culture that we can't even recognize the resolution of a problem through non-violence. We blink uncomprehendingly, then decide that the problem just resolved itself!

I WILL fight injustice. I WILL fight hatred. I WILL fight racism. I WILL work to make sure that everyone has what they need to live as God intends. I JUST WON'T FIGHT TO KILL.

And that makes me very dangerous indeed.

[WingDinger]

7. But, will you dismiss out of hand any that fight with physicality, or their movement?

And indemnify those that pushed the desperate to act in their defense?

I have heard many HERE that do so.

[gratuitous]

8. I wasn't talking about that at all

What I was talking about is that adopting non-violence isn't like slipping on your favorite old shirt, to be taken off when it gets a little gamey. Non-violence requires a training, discipline and commitment at least equal to military indoctrination and training, hindered by the fact that our society elevates violence to the level of omnipotence. The fact that a lot of people fail in their resolve to forego violence is unsurprising, given all the forces arrayed against them, as well as the handy excuses proffered by their putative allies.

[Robb]

17. Well said.

Stunningly so.

[WhoIsNumberNone]

10. Here's the problem with violent revolution

In most cases you are only exchanging the old despotism for a new one. The one exception I can think of is the American Revolution, which would be more properly called a war of Independence. The American colonists didn't overthrow the British government, they just cut ties with it and formed their own. As heart-warming as the thought of the Koch brothers getting the Romanov treatment may be, can anyone name an actual revolution where the old government was actually replaced with a kinder gentler one? Russia? Iran? Nicaragua? Even Egypt?

[WingDinger]

12. Mass revolution is a pipe dream.

Never happen. And our American revolution would have gone bad very quickly, had it not been for those Frenchies.

What will happen here, is guerrilla resistance. Almost guaranteed. Should we continue on the path we travel now.

This will spark hardships not unlike the Palestinians. Leading to a delegitimized rule of law. Not until the pain is visited upon the comfortable, will things truly change.