I was getting a tattoo today and the young lady giving me my tattoo

[xoom]

Was complaining about only being able to get 29 hours now or working part time. Because since the first of the year 30 hours is considered full time and employers are keeping employees on part time so they don't have to pay their medical. Plus she was barely getting by with 2 part time jobs. She will have less hours overall now.

It's still hard out there for people..

[Cheronin]

1. interesting times

It is indeed

[Kingofalldems]

24. Interesting post indeed.

[lumberjack_jeff]

209. Even those who arrange and design shrubberies are under considerable economic stress. nt

[elleng]

2. Yes it is,

and if repugs keep it up, will continue to be hard. OTOH, things are looking up, there has been momentum, so improvement should continue.

[xoom]

3. I hope it continues...

[tledford]

105. See post 87. eom

[independent2013]

4. Confused

Obama's new rules made 30 hours "full time" so how is it the repubs fault? I'm confused on your reasoning?

People are in business to make a profit, if they cannot make a profit, they cannot pay people or stay in business. That's reality.

This economy is literally worse than the Great Depression, but for some reason the media isn't reporting that sad fact.

[Fumesucker]

6. The OP didn't mention Republicans

Where did you get that from?

Welcome to DU, BTW!

[MADem]

152. Say goodbye--that troll has gotten the boot! nt

[cynatnite]

12. Bwahahahahahaha! Buh-bye! n/t

[lpbk2713]

23. Was here less than twenty minutes ... LMAO

Houdini wasn't even that good of a vanishing act.

[ismnotwasm]

19. So, are you saving your tin foil for reuse and rationing your toilet paper?

Hopping on trains? Picking seasonal crops?

[Elwood P Dowd]

20. Economy worse now than depression? That is a big fat lie.

My 91-year-old uncle says what we are going through now is heaven on earth compared to that. Almost 50% of the banks that were operating in 1929 had closed by the time FDR took office. Unemployment in many areas was over 30%. Hunger and poverty were at record setting levels. Waiting in line for hours to get some bread and a bowl of soup was common in many cities.

[A HERETIC I AM]

39. There are many long time DUer's that want to insist this is a depression.

My mother and late father lived through it as well. I asked mom once "what was it like?"

She said " there wasn't any money."

"How do you mean?"

"I mean there WASN'T ANY MONEY! There was no FDIC and if your bank went under, like so many did, that was it. People had no money."

The differences between now and the thirties are stark. Not one single person lost a single red cent from a demand deposit account over the last five years.

Not a single cent.

Wasn't true in the great depression.

[Tempest]

102. BULLSHIT!

The only ones I see saying it's a depression are the new low count posters.

Us long timers remember the results of the depression, our parents lived through it, and know there is no comparison.

[A HERETIC I AM]

158. BULLSHIT right backatya!

I'm posting from my phone and I'm out to
dinner, so I'm not inclined to find the related posts, but I can tell you without equivocation that there are plenty of old members who have repeatedly said that this is a depression.

Many of them regular posters in the much vaunted "Stock Market Watch" thread, a more useless regular occurrence on DU being difficult to find.

[Samantha]

188. Krugman has called it a depression more than once, if that helps

"If ever there was a moment for fresh thinking, this is surely it. Indeed, Paul Krugman argues in “End This Depression Now!,” without a radical change in economic policy in both the United States and Europe, the likeliest outcome is a prolonged depression, perhaps not as “great” as in the 1930s but with clear similarities, above all in the immense human cost of needlessly high unemployment. As Krugman sees it, fiscal austerity, a fashionable idea on both sides of the Atlantic, can only make matters worse. This new “austerian” conventional wisdom, Krugman says, has “completely thrown away Keynes’s central dictum: ‘The boom, not the slump, is the time for austerity.’ ”

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/06/17/books/review/end-this-depression-now-by-paul-krugman.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0
Entitled "Why would Keynes do?" by Matthew Bishop, who reviews Krugman's viewpoints

Sam

PS I too have thought it was a depression more than a Great Recession.

[kestrel91316]

124. That's exactly what my grandmother told me about the Great Depression -

There WASN'T ANY MONEY. I couldn't even wrap my head around that, and I was in college. What do you mean, there was no money, I asked - she said there was literally no money to be had. It literally vanished.

[A HERETIC I AM]

168. What many don't seem to grasp....

Both of the general population, certain DUer's and the likes of the "let's do away with the Federal Reserve" types is this;

Before we had a strong central bank in this country, depressions, particularly localized ones were commonplace. Banks used to fail with remarkable regularity. If the only bank for 200 miles failed in the days of the railroad, and you and everyone you knew banked there, you and everyone you knew were screwed.

In the old days when the bank of Reno produced a $20 silver or gold coin there was no guarantee that the bank of Atlanta would give you twenty for it. Not to mention that many banks issues their own script, as there was no national currency for much of the beginning decades of this republic.

The reason the money vanished is because the idea backing it up wasn't respected by every bank.

Now it is.

[SidDithers]

33. Come back soon, again...nt

Sid

[Carni]

36. I'll bet you ARE confused...

EOM

[maxrandb]

69. "Eff" that and the "effing" feudal system thinking

If that's the way the owner of the tattoo parlor wants to treat the people that help make him money, I'd take my business elsewhere. It that's how he treats his "valued" employees, then I'd be surprised if they sterilize the needles they use.

It's like that asshat from Papa John's bitching about having to add $0.14 to the cost of a large pizza to pay for health care for his employees, while at the same time building himself a 40 - "effing" - thousand square foot mansion with a private golf course and moat. Not to mention his pizza is like putting ketchup on a saltine cracker.

Instead of bitching about all the "great" benefits and pay that union folks and government employees are getting, you'd be better off spending your energy bitching about why YOU DON'T!

We've spent the past 30 fucking years lording over the "job creators" and pissing on the working class. Let that fucking tattoo parlor owner make a living with NO FUCKING EMPLOYEES

I wish the OP would give us the name of this business so we could ensure we don't go there and enourage others not to go there. Makes me think that maybe this whole OP is one of those right-wing fables.

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

94. "independent2013"

[MADem]

151. "Literally worse than the Great Depression?" Really? I think you need to get to a library and do

a little reading.

You plainly have no appreciation of how ghastly it was during the Great Depression.

[Drunken Irishman]

157. You certainly are confused.

[PoliticAverse]

5. The penalties for not providing insurance to full-time employees don't kick in until Jan. 1 _2014_..

(and only apply to businesses with 50+ employees)

See:
http://www.irs.gov/uac/Newsroom/Questions-and-Answers-on-Employer-Shared-Responsibility-Provisions-Under-the-Affordable-Care-Act
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patient_Protection_and_Affordable_Care_Act#Effective_by_January_1.2C_2013

[xoom]

9. Well they are starting now..

She said something along the lines of the IRS can look back up to 12 months from the time the law kicks in which is jan 1, 2014. 12 months before is right now. So employers are starting people to that 30 hour max so if they get looked at 12 months the person isnt considered full time by 2014 standards.

[PoliticAverse]

17. Only 6 months during the transition period...

19. Is transition relief available to help employers that are close to the 50 full-time employee threshold determine their options for 2014?

Yes. Rather than being required to use the full twelve months of 2013 to measure whether it has 50 full-time employees (or an equivalent number of part-time and full-time employees), an employer may measure using any six-consecutive-month period in 2013. So, for example, an employer could use the period from January 1, 2013, through June 30, 2013, and then have six months to analyze the results, determine whether it needs to offer a plan, and, if so, choose and establish a plan.

[Yo_Mama]

38. That's correct

Businesses have the option to pick different periods, but for seasonal businesses, it may be best to work from January.

[tledford]

107. See post 87. eom

[Historic NY]

179. +1

[countingbluecars]

7. Must be quite a large tattoo parlor

to have more than 50 employees.

[RandiFan1290]

11. and pay them all hourly

[RomneyLies]

56. I've never heard of such a thing

Every tattoo artist who EVER put a needle to my skin worked on commission.

[JoeyT]

86. I've never gotten one done at one,

but there are places that pay by the hour. I never got a tattoo there because every one I saw that came from the places was completely mangled. Like "Did you pay your tattoo artist in dope, and pay him in advance?" kind of fucked up. At least here I think it's usually people that can't cut it at places that pay on commission.

[RomneyLies]

88. Such a shop won't last long

Nor will they have more than 50 employees.

[Tempest]

106. Far too much down time to pay hourly

The lies, misinformation and downright deception is thick in this forum.

[JoeyT]

114. They'll last a while,

but they sure as hell won't have 50 employees. The ones I'm thinking of probably don't have more than 2 or 3.

Edited to add: I'm pretty skeptical of the OP too. Someone in the chain of information was full of crap.

[Tempest]

123. They won't last long paying people to sit around

At most you'll get 2-3 hours of work out of that hourly employee.

You'll be out of business in 2 months, tops.

[obamanut2012]

196. They often charge by the hour

Not the same thing.

[JoeyT]

199. Yeah, I've been to two that charge by the hour.

These dudes got paid by the hour by the owner. It wasn't much either, like 9 or 10 bucks an hour.

They're the kind of places that even if you've never seen meth before, you know you can go there to buy it.

[obamanut2012]

206. I mean $150-200 an hour for work

Instead of per piece, if it's a really big piece.

[RomneyLies]

52. That's 30 artists, MINIMUM

Probably even more than 30 to hit that fifty total employee mark.

The rent on the space for such a shop alone would kill it. My gosh, he went to the WALMART OF TATTOO PARLORS. Hell, you'd almost need a damned WAREHOUSE for such a tattoo parlor.

I've never heard of such a thing.

[Recursion]

66. Or a non-franchised chain

Though I have never heard of a tattoo parlor where the artists are W2 employees.

[Tempest]

112. Non-franchised chains are mainly local

No local non-franchised chain is going to have that many tattooists.

Competition is too strong.

[dkf]

70. Are all the rules and regs for the ACA written and published?

I wonder how many are going by incomplete and erroneous info.

[xoom]

89. See post 87.

[tledford]

108. See post 87. eom

[Tempest]

125. He's milking that fail for all it's worth

Poor guy doesn't realize how ignorant he looks.

[AgainsttheCrown]

8. Thought I resurrected the the Little Caesar's thread

But it doesn't come up...anyway...

Little Caesar's and other chain restaurants are cutting to 25 to prevent the Obamapocalypse (as I heard one gun nut/dealer call it)

It seems as if American companies have shifted from being amoral and greedy, to immoral and malevolent forces against us.

[truedelphi]

201. And all of this to avoid raising the price of pizza some 14 cents or so.

I think most consumers would rather pay that extra 14 cents if it means people are getting health care.

[bettyellen]

10. a tattoo parlor with 50 employees? cool story, bro.

[xoom]

13. Thanks for your concern, bro.

[RomneyLies]

57. Dude, you were caught

You must have failed to remember that many DUers have tattoos.

Tattoo artists do not work on hourly rates, nor do tattoo parlors employ more than fifty people.

[xoom]

90. See post 87.

[RomneyLies]

101. .

[tledford]

110. See post 87. eom

[Fumesucker]

15. Doesn't mean the OP is lying, could well be the employer either stupid or lying to employee

Or even the employee lying.

One thing I've learned is that just because someone owns a business does not imply they are all that smart or well informed.

[1StrongBlackMan]

28. That was my thought ...

as well.

There are probably 1,000s of employers that have just heard about the 30 full-time employees, and are acting without researching the matter.

There are 1,000s others, whose employers make business decisions based on political ideology.

In either case, the worker gets screwed.

[Yo_Mama]

37. Or one corporation operating multiple businesses.

There are also legal prohibitions in the law about "splitting" companies to get around this provision of Obamacare.

[RomneyLies]

58. Tattoo artists are not paid hourly. n/t

[Lone_Star_Dem]

91. I've never know a tattoo artist who didn't work on commission.

This could be an exception, but I don't see how you'd make a living that way. The length of time it takes to do a tattoo varies. What are you gonna do, stop in the middle and say, " sorry dude, I gotta go clock out. Come back at 3:00 tomorrow when my shift starts."

Also, your clientele follows you from shop to shop. If one place treats you poorly you leave and your customers follow you. The old shop sure doesn't want to be responsible for color touch ups and such on your work.

It doesn't sound right to me. Someone someplace wasn't telling the truth.

[blm]

14. Businesses have been doing that since the 80s. ALL companies picked up by Bain did it.

And most companies that consulted with Bain practice that strategy.

[kelly1mm]

16. This may not be related to Obamacare but I have heard from some of my clients that the

reason they switched to part-time employees almost exclusively is to reduce unemployment insurance claims. Here is how it works; they KNOW that their part-time employees have two (or more) part time jobs. So, if they let a worker go, and they try to get unemployment, their claim will be denied as htey are still working 20-29 hours per week at the other job. The UI they could get from the job they lost is lower than what they are making so no UI.

[seabeyond]

18. other reasons employers have not been giving people full time. they lie about the reason now.

it is a bullshit story.

companies started not giving fulltime over a decade ago, because it is to their advantage.

[Kingofalldems]

21. I don't believe your story at all.

[Tempest]

27. There's no reason to.

At most, a tattoo parlor is going to have 5 employees and won't be affected by the reform law.

Unless it's a chain, and I can't think of one tattoo parlor chain in America.

[jmowreader]

63. Lots of them have more than five

There might be one or two in the US that have enough to meet Obamacare minima...and does the law have provisions for independent contractors?

[Tempest]

65. I'll bet none of them have 50 or more.

So none of them are affected by the law.

[xoom]

92. See post 87.

[tledford]

111. See post 87. eom

[LiberalFighter]

22. I seriously doubt that they have the minimum number of employees for the law

to kick in.

Part time employees are also included in the calculation.

[4 t 4]

29. omg, be careful here

if you hit the wrong crowd and you have a small post no. .... they will destroy you, . kinda like this thread. Nice work guys

[tabasco]

40. Yes, we have a low tolerance for scumbag idiot liars.

Have a great day!

[4 t 4]

47. who doesn't

what do you base your decision on ?

[Rex]

194. On the fact that a lost post troll upthread got banned?

What about you?

[TexasBushwhacker]

59. Yeah, if you have 75 employees working 20 hours a week

you would have the equivalent of 50 employees working 30 hours a week and 30 hours a week qualifies, under the law, as full time. But employers give people less than full time schedules for other reasons. I don't think they have to pay for unemployment insurance for part time workers. If they offer vacation and/or sick leave to any full time employees, they have to offer it to all full time employees. You can't, for example, have paid vacation for management only.

[Tempest]

26. I'm calling B.S. on your story

Unless the tattoo parlor has more than 50 employees (highly doubtful), it won't be affected.

[4 t 4]

31. are you kidding me

you don't think every scum bag owner is using this to their advantage, please.....

[Tempest]

34. Nothing to do with the story he pawned off on us. n/t

[RomneyLies]

81. A tattoo parlor owner is not going to stay in business by pissing off artists

But that's beside the point, since tattoo parlor owners do not pay the artists on an hourly basis.

[xoom]

93. See post 87.

[Tempest]

96. So you're changing your story after getting your ass handed to you

Classy.

[tledford]

113. See post 87. eom

[RomneyLies]

146. And we have the newest DU meme

Whenever somebody obvious posts an obvious thread, we simply post:

"See post 87. eom"

[OriginalGeek]

183. LMAO!

I like it.

GUYZ WAIT! SEE POST 87!

[RandiFan1290]

192. Pardon me

[pinboy3niner]

200. You call that a meme?

[RomneyLies]

30. I call BULLSHIT

There isn't a tattoo parlor in the country that employs more than fifty people.

[4 t 4]

42. Really,

how the hell would you even know that?

[4 t 4]

44. oh ,by the way

you ALL bulshit, huh, what ? Just knock it off and be a little nicer!

[RomneyLies]

49. oh, by the way

Being a spelling nazi in this age of smart phones is so out of vogue.

[uppityperson]

210. Unless you reply to yourself, like he did.

[zappaman]

72. Your words reply #61...

"no , it's just I know how bad if feels when you say and or spell poorly and or just some how hit the wrong thread. The next thing you know everyone hates you or they think you have a good point. Sometimes it is hit or miss. I don't know I just feel bad for anyone who isn't an obvious fuck head and is being bullied."

So, good call out here on the spelling!

[RomneyLies]

45. I have over a dozen tattoos.

The biggest tattoo parlors in LA, Miami, and Vegas employ MAX, 15 people, and they are usually in transition over the apprentices with that many.

you need a front person, somebody on cleanup, the artists, and a few apprentices learning the art. A HUGE shop may have as many as eight artists.

For a shop to employ fifty people would require 30 artists minimum. That's just not going to happen.

[Recursion]

71. How many even give *any* artists a W2? I don't see the logic there

There's a reason tattoo parlors, hair salons, etc. have the artists/stylists/what have you work as 1099's: there's not much business logic behind having a salaried position there.

[RomneyLies]

73. There is zero business logic in having an hourly employee there, too.

It's just not a credible story.

[Recursion]

75. Thanks, I meant "hourly"

Or, to put it another way, if the parlor owner is paying the artists an hourly wage even when they aren't tattooing people rather than taking rent for a chair, he's got much bigger problems ahead than ACA.

[RomneyLies]

77. Not to mention when the owner of a tattoo parlor brings in a new artists,...

they expect a certain level of clientele to come in due to the fact that the artist has been brought in.

The artist accepts the gig because the artist expects to expand his/her clientele via word of mouth, walk ins, etc.

[xoom]

95. See post 87.

[tledford]

115. But, but, but ...

See post 87.

[RomneyLies]

122. Somenever learn

Safest play would have been to delete the OP as soon as it was evident and let the thing die.

[Tempest]

131. Why play it safe when you have a sock defending you? n/t

[tledford]

133. I *do* apologize for all the replies but it was just TOO MUCH FUN! :-)

Is it just me or has the number of trolling right-wingers increased since the election?

[Tempest]

142. It's always fun to pick on cons

They make it easy and fun with their low information and low effort thinking.

[RomneyLies]

145. OOOH, I know

I'll talk about somebody who was cut back in working hours over Obamacare.

EVEN BETTER, I'll say it was somebody working for a tattoo parlor because the hippees all love their tattoos!

[Tempest]

147. Makes me wonder what's coming next

A guy who knows a guy who knows a girl who said she knows someone who...

[Enrique]

32. Papa John?

is that you?

[Yo_Mama]

35. Very hard n/t

[onethatcares]

41. ya know what?

the bullshit about it being 50 employees or 28 hours or whatthefuckever is just that, bullshit.

Here in the fucking supposedly greatest country in the world, we depend on employers to provide for our healthcare which most civilised
countries take care of as a matter of life.

Here our representatives worry about those fuckers making 250,000.00 a year but don't give a rats ass about those folks making 28k or 16k and are worried about going to school or feeding their kids or buying a new pair of boots.

what do you expect employers to do?

[riverbendviewgal]

154. America is not the greatest country in the world

It has more a bombs, more guns but nothing else....
America lost its way.

[Cleita]

43. Single payer would have averted that problem. Everyone would be covered

with the same quality health care no matter how many hours they worked or if they didn't work. That girl too, if she had children, wouldn't have to worry about her kids getting coverage either. But the insurance companies won this one and until we force them out of the health care business will continue to have unequal health care coverage.

[JI7]

46. the Tattoo place has 50 employees ?

[4 t 4]

48. sometimes some of you here

on this site will come to find out you may be wrong. Just try and be little more nice and patient, the truth will almost always come out in the end.

[RomneyLies]

50. Nice

Just nice.

[Tempest]

126. Condesending and not worthy of response IMHO.

[RandiFan1290]

51. Why so White Knight?

[RomneyLies]

60. Do you even need to ask?

It takes work sometimes to protect a sock

[4 t 4]

61. no , it's just I know how bad if feels when

you say and or spell poorly and or just some how hit the wrong thread. The next thing you know everyone hates you or they think you have a good point. Sometimes it is hit or miss. I don't know I just feel bad for anyone who isn't an obvious fuck head and is being bullied.

[notadmblnd]

53. Does anyone in the republican party ever actually read the bills they pass?

Or do they just have one person assigned to that task and then the rest just play a game like "the telephone" game we all played as kids?

You know the one, it starts out with a person saying something in another's ear and by the time it gets passed around the entire group, it is totally different than what was originally said?

I think it's hard for one to believe that the party of accountability, responsibility, personal productivity and success with no help from no one- would be too lazy to verify what they are told by those that claim to have their be$t intre$t$ at heart. Don't you?

[Tempest]

144. You don't want to go there.

The Patriot Act was passed with Democratic support and not a one of them read the bill before voting yea.

[notadmblnd]

172. My statement wasn't limited to congress people

I was referring more to the entire party and every individual in it. Especially the armchair politicians over at the FR ghetto that manage to get their BS stories posted here.

[Tempest]

173. Blanket statements like that are not productive

"I was referring more to the entire party and every individual in it"

I know many Republicans who do not fit your description.

I also know many Democrats who fit it.

[notadmblnd]

182. I'm sure you do.

" It's always fun to pick on cons

They make it easy and fun with their low information and low effort thinking. "


However, if you feel the need to chide people for making "blanket statements", it's best not to paint with a broad brush yourself.

After all, you know many Republicans who do not fit your description.

You also know many Democrats who fit it. Besides, it's not productive.

[Tempest]

184. My comment was based upon two different studies

Two studies have found conservatives are low intelligent, low effort thinkers who use fear as the main emotion for making decision.

Apparently you're not familiar with either of them.

[notadmblnd]

186. So when I make blanket statements, it unproductive

when you paint with a broad brush, it's fact based unbiased studies that you never bothered to cite and that makes it alright for you.

M'kay.

Enlighten me please, Oh wise one.

[Tempest]

187. When your statement is based upon opinion and emotion, yes.

When a statement is based upon research, that's called evidence.

"based unbiased studies that you never bothered to cite"

You seriously never heard of them? You must have been gone during the many days they were discussed here and on every other Democratic and liberal web sites.

But since you appear to require assistance:

http://pss.sagepub.com/content/early/2012/01/04/0956797611421206.abstract

[notadmblnd]

190. Now you're going to say your statement wasn't based on emotion?

When you clearly stated that it was "easy and fun" for you to pick on cons.


If that statement is not emotional, I don't know what is.

So I get it. It's ok for you to make an unproductive emotional statement because you have knowlege of a study. It's not ok for me to make a statement clarifying a question that I originally asked about right wing individuals because I haven't read that study. Right?

Furthermore, based on your study, my opinion regarding right wing intelligence (and it wasn't even intelligence that I was questioning, it was their lazyness; you know, it's what they accuse others of being constantly) was correct.

Note to self *Only people that read studies can make unproductive remarks about "cons" and how fun it is to pick on them.

[Codeine]

54. Tattoo artists are usually considered independent contractors.

They normally set their own prices and such. This story is nonsense.

[Recursion]

67. Yeah, all the tat artists I know are 1099's

I'm not saying it's impossible, I just don't see the logic for a W2 tattoo artist, any more than for a hairdresser, you know?

[RomneyLies]

79. I've known of apprentices who were minimum wage employees

But the vast majority of their work was cleaning the shop and being piss boy for the artists. They had to wait years before they were even allowed to put needle to skin for the first time.

[RomneyLies]

55. I've just been thinking. I have NEVER had a tattoo artist who was paid hourly put a needle to me

I don't think I ever would.

Tattoo artists work on strict commission on the work they do.

[4 t 4]

62. I bet there are some in

Las Vegas that get paid by the hour!

[RomneyLies]

64. I bet you don't have a clue what you are talking about.

Tattoo artists do NOT work on an hourly basis. They are artists. Each piece is a commissioned piece.

Love Hate Tattoo in Miami employs six artists. One of the biggest shops in town.

Hart & Huntington Tattoo in Vegas employs seven artists.

[Tempest]

129. Sucker bet. It's obvious. n/t

[4 t 4]

68. you know ,this is ai good example and very simple way

of thinking. The workers are always on the losing end of IT all. Come on now , anytime it comes between the workers and the owners, in Any capacity, the worker's loose. Stop and think about it and always stick up for the workers in any capacity.

[RomneyLies]

74. This has nothing to do with "owner" vs. "worker"

You have no clue about the relationship between the tattoo parlor owner and the artists.

Seriously, not a clue.

[Recursion]

80. Generally, the tattoo artist is both the owner and the worker

The person who owns the parlor provides the chair and the location (along with insurance, the receptionist, etc.), but he's not the artist's employer, he's a vendor the artist uses. It's really a lot like most barber shops.

[MineralMan]

76. How many tattoo artists work at

fulltime positions for companies that have over 50 workers? I know of none.

[Recursion]

78. Yeah, it's generally not a "job" in the strict sense

The artists are usually contractors who get paid per tattoo and pay rent on the chair, like barbers. That's why for any serious ink (I'm not talking about a $20 lower back tattoo of a chinese character you don't know the meaning of) you schedule it well in advance, because the artist isn't even there all or even most of the time.

[RomneyLies]

84. On top of that, most really good pieces take multiple appointments.

Ink is serious business.

[Tempest]

135. Serious enough in my town to have one burned down

By a competitor from across the street.

[ag_dude]

82. Strange

Tattoo parlor owners always strike me as people that would be completely 100% up to speed on the intricacies of relatively complicated employment law and not jump to unfounded conclusions.

[Chan790]

85. Many of the ones I've known...

have also been exactly the kind of libertarian scum to lie to take advantage of this.

Not all of them, but I'd say at-least 1/3.

[Tempest]

98. How many constitutes "many"?

Context is everything.

[Chan790]

117. About a 1/3: 10ish out of 30ish?

One of my best friends is an alternative model who poses for magazines like Inked.

I know a fair number of tattoo artists through her. She's conservative so that may skew things a bit.

[Tempest]

132. If she's conservative, it does skew things

By a lot.

I live in a city that votes 65% Republican and if you're not one of them your business doesn't survive.

[ag_dude]

136. Oh come on.

I live in the heart of freaking Bush country and that's not true. You just don't talk politics with customers.

I've never understood why business owners think their political views should ever come into a business transaction.

[Tempest]

138. I live in Kern County

The reddest part of the west coast. Redder than most of Texas.

Business owners here require you to talk politics and agree with them or they'll refuse your business.

When I first moved here I naively got into a political conversation at a hardware rental place and had my money thrown back in my face and asked to leave and never come back.

[xoom]

87. UPDATE: she was not talking abut her job at the tattoo parlor!!! She has 2 part ti.e jobs and does

Tattoos for commission like everyone is saying.

[Tempest]

97. UPDATE: I'm getting hammered so I'm changing my story

Not real convincing.

You need to try harder.

[LisaLynne]

99. Thanks for the translation. ;) nt

[RomneyLies]

103. .

[4 t 4]

100. oh, really take a look at this

TTOP NOTCH TATTOOS AND ARTWORK BY BRANDON NOTCH aka (Sacred Saint)





...Top Notch Tattooing...
***Tattoo Photo Gallery***
Contact Me
***Animation/Games***
***Tattoo After Care***
...Friends And Links...
???Asked Questions???
***About Brandon Notch***
...Oil Painting/Custom Artwork...
--Clothing Store--
...Tattoo Hourly Rate...












Brandon Notch aka(Sacred Saint)






TOP NOTCH TATTOOS BY BRANDON NOTCH


You can See More of My Work At The Web Pages Below..



Check out some more websites!!!

•World Famous Sacred Saint Gallery Los Angeles CA | Sacred Saint Art Gallery | Sacred Saint Gallery Artist Brandon Notch
The Art Work Of Brandon Notch
•Sacred Saint - American Dreamer Tattoo Book
•WORD OF NOTCH ** Animated Tattoo Life of Brandon Notch
•Sacred Saint Tattoo - Work of Brandon Notch Los Angeles
•Skin Art Videos by Brandon Notch
•Sacred Saint Skateboards
•MySpace.com - TOP NOTCH TATTOOS


Tattoos BY Brandon Notch Flickr Photos



More Photos!!


www.flickr.com




WWW.SACREDSAINT.COM








Unique Custom Artwork By Top Notch Himself... Brandon Notch...






Send A Fun Postcard FREE!!! Animated Ecards! Click on the photo below.







Tattoo Artist Brandon Notch







Artist Brandon Notch













***Brandon Notch's myspace!***







Tattoo The World With Art!!


Tattoo Artist Brandon Notch***







LA Tattoo Artist Brandon Notch











Tattoo hourly rate



Previous

Next

List





Tattoo hourly rate is as follows:

***Now Working in San Bernardino CA. And for the convenience of my out of state clients i will be booking in Los Angeles CA. as well. Email me for hotel info..

*You will get nothing short of Top quality, Clean, Safe, Artistic
Tattooing by internationally recognized artist Brandon Notch (aka) Sacred Saint...

*** I will do my part to keep America beautiful and keep people from getting bad tattoos.... So... Large work like sleeves, back pieces, etc. I will do a sitting of 4 hours for 340.00 each sitting. An all day sitting of 5- 6 hours for 500.00... Anything over the 6 hours will be 120.00 an hour.. Because not only the Rich deserve a bad ass tattoo. PS: I love doing large work so much that I will get you in the chair and tattooed asap.
* $120.00 an hour. (price is said to be negotiable on Large work)
* $100.00 drawing fee/deposit that is included in to the tattoo fee.
* I quote you a price for smaller work, and I stick to my quoted price.
To set up a consultation please email me.
*I do not take appointments over the phone.**** As I will require a consultation with a 100$ min. deposit before I will book a time and day (apt.)
*You will get nothing short of Top quality, Clean, Safe, Artistic
Tattooing by internationally recognized artist Brandon Notch (aka) Sacred Saint.

---------------------

*SACRED SAINT TATTOO STUDIO - SHOP RULES*


No one under 18 years old allowed in the studio unless accompanied by an adult.

No children under 18 allowed in the studio - NO EXCEPTIONS!!!!

You must be 18 years old with a valid state issued photo ID to be tattooed.

NO smoking, drugs, or alcohol allowed in the studio. Anyone noticeably
under the influence will be be removed.

CASH ONLY - "No Checks" (I do take paypal)

Appointments ONLY !!! If you can't make your appointment, just call or email
and I'll reschedule. 323-614-6768

CANCELLATIONS WITHOUT NOTICE WILL FORFEIT YOUR DEPOSIT. Don't show, don't call and you're at the back of the line also forfeiting your deposit.

Only one guest per client may be present during a tattoo.

All work is at the sole discretion of the artist. THIS IS AN ART
STUDIO AND I MAKE ART

We reserve the right to refuse service to anyone for any reason.

We DO NOT sell tattoo ink, equipment, or piercing needles to the


general public. PLEASE DON'T ASK.


I found in a secound with google

*** I Work By APPOINTMENT ONLY..

Email Me To Book Your Appointment.







All artwork and tattooing by Brandon Notch aka:Sacred Saint (copyright) Sacred Saint Tattoo And Art Gallery Los Angeles CA. All Tatoos are done by appointment only. The charge is by the hour. All disclaimers must be signed by current client. All other is null and void.

[RomneyLies]

109. Uh, dude. that's an independent artist who charges by the hour

Really, dude, you're reaching.

Especially reaching when it comes to the sock.

[Tempest]

120. I haven't seen a fail like that in some time

At least here.

[zappaman]

137. This thread keeps giving....

and giving!

[Tempest]

140. It's keeping me entertained. n/t

[tledford]

127. Yeah, but there are *50* Brandon Notches that work at this gallery. :-) eom

[tledford]

128. See post 87. eom

[JaneyVee]

116. Do you not know how to add a link???

[Tempest]

134. A link would have cut through his B.S.

Better to make a long post no one will read all of.

[Lone_Star_Dem]

141. First you attempt to defend the PPR'd troll upthread...

Now you think this is a valid argument defending the OP. You're too adorable.

[tledford]

104. See post 87. eom

[RomneyLies]

119. Would have worked out better just deleting the OP

and letting the thing die, huh?

[tledford]

121. But not nearly as hilarious. :-) eom

[Oilwellian]

170. It probably would die...

if you just fucking LET IT. This thread reminds me of a bunch of laughing hyenas circling their prey.

And I agree with the OP. Part time workers, who for the most part are the uninsured in this country, will remain uninsured. We should all have a problem with that goddamned FACT.

[RomneyLies]

171. See post 87. eom

[Ikonoklast]

189. And 1099 employees aren't covered AT ALL.

The OP is more full of turds than your local sewage treatment plant.

And so are his recently awakened socks.

[4 t 4]

130. see post 91

[tledford]

118. See post 87. eom

[Orrex]

176. In the interest of pretending that I believe your story...

What are her other jobs?

[RomneyLies]

178. .

[nolabear]

191. Thank god! I thought I'd never find post 87!

[theKed]

193. I was expecting more

after all the lead up to this, the much-advertised Post 87. Is this ... is this how the wife of the guy in those erectile dysfunction drug ads feela, before her husband takes up musical theater?

I mean, cmon. Throw down an animated gif, or something. Make it worth my time.

Two out of five stars. And you only get those two for trolling the thread so hard with your "see post 87" posts, with no helpful link.

[Rex]

195. Then why did you include the story about the tatoo parlor as your main premise?

NM...cool story bro!

[xoom]

204. Because that's where the conversation took place.

RomneyLies

[chrisau214]

205. IT'S POST 87

And, sadly, other than post 100 this is the sorriest excuse for a post 87 that I've ever seen.

Oh well.

I'm sure the next post 87 will be more interesting.

[xoom]

207. This is a sorry execuse for a reply. Thanks for playing

[xoom]

139. Regardless of what you think about my "story"

There are people who are getting or will be getting fucked because of this 30 hour part time shit.

Its going to hurt those who need the most help. But who cares if they have to work 3 part time jobs to just get by.


Ok now get back to my story.

[Tempest]

143. The fact that you admit it's just a "story"

Eliminates all possibility of you ever being believed again.

I keep hearing these "stories" but as of yet have not been shown any concrete evidence.

Just a lot of whining from right wingers about what they plan to do. And wingers rarely follow through on their threats.

[JaneyVee]

148. If you have to work 3 part time jobs chances are you may qualify for medicaid under Obamacare.

[RomneyLies]

149. See post 87. eom

[xoom]

153. Would you agree that this blows for those on part time work?

[RomneyLies]

155. See post 87. eom

[xoom]

156. RomneyLies

I figured you couldnt answer a simple question.

[RomneyLies]

159. See post 87. eom

[xoom]

160. RomneyLies

[RomneyLies]

161. See Post 91. eom

[xoom]

163. RomneyLies

[RomneyLies]

166. See post 152. eom

[xoom]

167. RomneyLies

[RomneyLies]

169. See post 162. eom

[Liberal_in_LA]

150. lol. DU can make one sorry they shared.

[notadmblnd]

185. It will not hurt them

There will be exchanges available for workers to buy into and depending on their income, one could be required to pay little or nothing for coverage.

[NoGOPZone]

162. I may recommend this thread just for the replies

including post 87

[xoom]

164. Seriously!?!? You would do that??

[NoGOPZone]

180. You're up to 187 posts now

just sayin'

[obamanut2012]

197. This thread has everything

Including Post #87.

[xoom]

202. Umm it has the ORIGINAL post 87!!!

[PeaceNikki]

165. See post 87.

Will be the next DU meme.

[ecstatic]

174. Are you arguing that large employers shouldn't

have to provide healthcare coverage? What exactly are you saying?

[Oilwellian]

175. Post 87 was clarification for those who are a little slow

The original OP, which obviously has been unedited, clearly states the tattoo artist had TWO part time jobs. Obviously, the hourly wage that has been salivated over by a bunch of hyenas, applied to the tattoo artist's SECOND part time job.

The responses in this thread are neon examples of the mocking and bullying that has become common place. For a party that just won the Senate and Presidency, we're a pitiful sight to behold.

[RomneyLies]

177. See post 87. eom

[iwillalwayswonderwhy]

181. Oh please

This is one of the funniest threads I've ever read. You have to laugh at the clearly obvious.

And if you can't understand that, I humbly advise you to see post 87.

[obamanut2012]

198. uh huh

[xoom]

203. Thank you. Bullying is bad and can lead to bad things. I guess some people are just bullies..

[Fla Dem]

208. Employers have been doing this for a long time.

Used to be full-time employees were valued. They got reasonably good benefits, were assured of a fairly good paycheck and in turn the employee felt some loyalty to the job. Now it's like a throw away society. Employers don't care about the employees and in turn, the employees don't care about the job. They'll move on when they get bored, don't get the hours or get a better offer. This has been happening since the late 90's even in jobs that were traditionally full time. I often wonder with the constant turnover, and the constant hiring process and training, if it's costing the employer more to use only PT employees.

[TexasBushwhacker]

212. And the employers that rely on permatemps

I worked at an oilfield services company through a temp agency for 2.5 years. I was actually getting health insurance and vacation pay through the agency, but enough was enough. I asked them to hire me but they had a policy that the only people they hired permanently were engineers. I was just in a support position.

[Iggo]

211. Train Rec!!!