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Sheepshank

(12,504 posts)
Mon Dec 17, 2012, 09:05 PM Dec 2012

Breaking: Parents gave their elementary school kid a gun to take to school.

West Kearns Elementary School in Utah. Parents gave their elementary school kid a gun to take to school for "self protection" and possibly the protection of other students....this on local ABC4 news tonight. Thanks for the supporting links below.

Good God. This escalation is insane!

I noticed a one liner on the Consumer Protection notice when Jarts (lawn darts) were banned, and it said, "It is illegal to sell or re-sell an item that has been recalled". ....just thinking there may be an answer to assult rifles, and guns that use magazines with 20-30 bullets, how about a consumer protection recall?

52 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Breaking: Parents gave their elementary school kid a gun to take to school. (Original Post) Sheepshank Dec 2012 OP
Is there a link? Fridays Child Dec 2012 #1
Here it is: Bicoastal Dec 2012 #3
... Robb Dec 2012 #4
Madness ! virgogal Dec 2012 #2
Sometimes I think this isn't such a bad idea... LAGC Dec 2012 #5
Elementary kids? gollygee Dec 2012 #6
Oh yeah? How about giving them the keys to the SUV ... frazzled Dec 2012 #7
What's the other option? ComplimentarySwine Dec 2012 #23
I'm not ignoring the problem ... frazzled Dec 2012 #39
No. kiva Dec 2012 #12
Really? ElboRuum Dec 2012 #13
Do tell, how is the "genie" (guns) going to get put back in the bottle? ComplimentarySwine Dec 2012 #25
The issue (problem) has been with us for too many generations... sanatanadharma Dec 2012 #36
So, no idea then? ComplimentarySwine Dec 2012 #40
Personal choice... sanatanadharma Dec 2012 #48
It's easy to say, but HOW? ComplimentarySwine Dec 2012 #50
It's called "collective will". ElboRuum Dec 2012 #52
Nuts? ellisonz Dec 2012 #14
That is absolutely crazy sellitman Dec 2012 #20
I knew a 14 year old who accidentally killed himself Ilsa Dec 2012 #21
So your solution is more guns Cali_Democrat Dec 2012 #24
The adults in schools do not want to be armed. That is just one more thing the public wants. MichiganVote Dec 2012 #30
Are you out of your fucking mind? Jeff In Milwaukee Dec 2012 #34
We spend $60 Billion dollars on the DEA every yr. Why not take all those agents, helicopters & swat Warren DeMontague Dec 2012 #45
That's the most sensible solution I've heard yet. LAGC Dec 2012 #46
The story said it was unloaded Politicalboi Dec 2012 #51
The article about this doesn't say that his parents gave him a gun to take to school. Fridays Child Dec 2012 #8
you are correct, it does not say that. but, obviously, the child had access to the gun, so it niyad Dec 2012 #11
I made the same point but a parent giving a kid a gun to take to school... Fridays Child Dec 2012 #19
No, not really marions ghost Dec 2012 #27
Just to be clear, you think that parents making the mistake of not sufficiently securing firearms... Fridays Child Dec 2012 #37
Absoeffinglutely! marions ghost Dec 2012 #49
Well, why not say the parents killed JFK? cthulu2016 Dec 2012 #29
channel 4news said it and the fox13 link said the same thing.....go back and read Sheepshank Dec 2012 #43
Too bad the kid didn't have Jesus ... earthside Dec 2012 #9
Would you please correct your post title? kiva Dec 2012 #10
Oh, that's fuckin' helpful. Chorophyll Dec 2012 #15
Edit the Damn Headline! (please) cthulu2016 Dec 2012 #16
damn...repeating local headlines...read the fox 13link above before you employ righteous indignation Sheepshank Dec 2012 #44
... Granite District Spokesman Ben Horsley said that the student apparently brought the gun struggle4progress Dec 2012 #17
Hopefully the parents get locked up Superbot Dec 2012 #18
That is what needs to happen marions ghost Dec 2012 #28
Training em' young to be paranoid and fearful. Good goin' NRA. glinda Dec 2012 #22
In my state this kid would be expelled for a year proud2BlibKansan Dec 2012 #26
Mine too! And teachers would be fired for doing it. We People Dec 2012 #35
West Kearns Utah doesn't exactly have the brightest bulbs. liberalmuse Dec 2012 #31
Gun Nuts Never Cease To Amaze Me rbrnmw Dec 2012 #32
In CA there is zero tolerance for weapons in schools, IIRC. kestrel91316 Dec 2012 #33
I didn't think parents could be this stupid AZ Progressive Dec 2012 #38
Please check your facts anonymous444 Dec 2012 #41
Already tried reasoning with the OP. Fridays Child Dec 2012 #42
just repeating what I had heard on kutv4. Sheepshank Dec 2012 #47

LAGC

(5,330 posts)
5. Sometimes I think this isn't such a bad idea...
Mon Dec 17, 2012, 09:10 PM
Dec 2012

I mean, if the kid is trained.

We'd see kidnappings by strangers end overnight!

In all seriousness though, at least let the teachers be armed.

Things are getting crazy out there, and there's no way to put the genie (guns) back in the bottle, so the only solution is for schools to protect themselves.

At least let the adults be armed!

frazzled

(18,402 posts)
7. Oh yeah? How about giving them the keys to the SUV ...
Mon Dec 17, 2012, 09:14 PM
Dec 2012

to drive all their friends away in a getaway car?

Jeezus.

And no, do not put guns in the arms of school personnel or teachers, either. No, NO, NO. When you have a problem, you don't make it worse.

 

ComplimentarySwine

(515 posts)
23. What's the other option?
Mon Dec 17, 2012, 09:59 PM
Dec 2012

Putting your head in the sand and ignoring the problem? Do you REALLY think guns are going to go away regardless of what laws are passed?

frazzled

(18,402 posts)
39. I'm not ignoring the problem ...
Mon Dec 17, 2012, 11:06 PM
Dec 2012

Look at my sig line: renew the assault weapons ban. I don't give a good goddam if you think that won't stop anything. To not pass such a law is, as you put it, akin to "putting your head in the sand and ignoring the problem." And I won't be bullied out of that position. It's right, I know it's right, and it's going to happen. So you'll just have to deal with it.

You realize that it is completely insane to suggest, even in jest, that you should put a gun in the hand of a young child. That, my friend, is the most irresponsible thing I have ever heard. It's dangerous, it's offensive (especially in light of all the children who died), and it is just plain stupid.

ElboRuum

(4,717 posts)
13. Really?
Mon Dec 17, 2012, 09:32 PM
Dec 2012

"Things are getting crazy out there, and there's no way to put the genie (guns) back in the bottle"

Um, yes there is.

 

ComplimentarySwine

(515 posts)
25. Do tell, how is the "genie" (guns) going to get put back in the bottle?
Mon Dec 17, 2012, 10:00 PM
Dec 2012

Do you really think that guns are going to go away regardless of what laws are passed?

sanatanadharma

(3,699 posts)
36. The issue (problem) has been with us for too many generations...
Mon Dec 17, 2012, 10:31 PM
Dec 2012

...there is no way that we will ever end slavery,
give women the vote,
end prohibition (oh, wait- begin prohibition)

 

ComplimentarySwine

(515 posts)
40. So, no idea then?
Mon Dec 17, 2012, 11:32 PM
Dec 2012

As I recall, it took a brutal civil war to finally close out slavery, and descrimination arguably continues through today...

sanatanadharma

(3,699 posts)
48. Personal choice...
Tue Dec 18, 2012, 04:54 PM
Dec 2012

...disarm everyone. Since the gun-idolaters seem to be suggesting that means war, so be it.

 

ComplimentarySwine

(515 posts)
50. It's easy to say, but HOW?
Tue Dec 18, 2012, 06:56 PM
Dec 2012

If the government can't keep drugs and weapons out of prisons, how do you ever expect them to keep them out of the hands of "free" people?

ElboRuum

(4,717 posts)
52. It's called "collective will".
Tue Dec 18, 2012, 08:02 PM
Dec 2012

At one point in this country, nearly every adult smoked. Heavily. The health concerns of smoking became known and that began the anti-smoking movement.

It started out small, and it took decades to build, but the collective will was there and it remained. Now the numbers of smokers have dwindled. As a smoker myself, I find some of what I must deal with occasionally annoying, but I can't argue with the benefits to individuals and society at large for taking this stance. The benefits are real and profound.

The genie won't be going back into the bottle today or tomorrow, but so long as the collective will is toward tighter control and access to firearms, that genie WILL be put back in. The fact is that the human cost at the societal level to near absent gun regulation to access and use, at this moment, is too high to for that society to bear.

The problem with all of this is that "responsible gun ownership" should be not just some statement of esoterica, a flimsy platitude offered up by those with a vested interest in maintaining the status quo. I believe that there are responsible gun owners. However, just saying so doesn't make it so in any given case.

If you want to drive a car in this country, you need to pass a competency test and a knowledge test dealing with the rules of the road. You must pass an eye exam or have the appropriate corrective lenses. You must have proof of insurance, just in the event that you do inflict property or personal damage with your car. There are different classes of licenses for different types of vehicles, after all we wouldn't someone who knows only how to drive a car to get behind the wheel of a semi, would we? When you buy or sell a car, you must make the appropriate records of sale and transfer of title.

In a similar vein, you should have to prove your responsibility to own and use a firearm. Use whatever measures you like, but it is ludicrous that any jackass in this country can get a gun for any reason with a minimum of effort and no proof of competency with regard to its operation or understanding of the law regarding its use. The collective will should be at least the level of burden of proof of responsibility for the ownership and operation of a motor vehicle, something whose incidental capability of lethality is somehow more worrisome than something whose primary purpose is lethality.

Ilsa

(61,694 posts)
21. I knew a 14 year old who accidentally killed himself
Mon Dec 17, 2012, 09:57 PM
Dec 2012

With a gun, at a shooting range, and he had been shooting since he was about 7 years old.

They are kuds. They screw up. They aren't mature enough to carry out this level of responsibility consistently at that age.

Jeff In Milwaukee

(13,992 posts)
34. Are you out of your fucking mind?
Mon Dec 17, 2012, 10:24 PM
Dec 2012

Giving an elementary school kid a firearm for protection is the dictionary definition of "batshit crazy"

And your alternative suggestion, that a 60-year-old English teacher should be packing heat in the classroom is only slightly less idiotic. At what point did we decide that at every moment of every day in every location in every town in America, we're all living in a potential crossfire.

Fuck that shit. I don't believe in banning guns, but I'd rather ban guns rather than go there.

Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
45. We spend $60 Billion dollars on the DEA every yr. Why not take all those agents, helicopters & swat
Tue Dec 18, 2012, 02:15 AM
Dec 2012

teams off the ever-pressing hunt for pot plants in the back yards of chemo grannies, and put them to work guarding our schools instead?

 

Politicalboi

(15,189 posts)
51. The story said it was unloaded
Tue Dec 18, 2012, 07:06 PM
Dec 2012

And luckily for another class-mate, it was. Little asshole pointed at his head and told him he was going to kill him. And no adult should be armed IMO. It's just crazy to think about.

Fridays Child

(23,998 posts)
8. The article about this doesn't say that his parents gave him a gun to take to school.
Mon Dec 17, 2012, 09:17 PM
Dec 2012

If guns are accessible to him in his home, that's pretty awful but I don't see anything about his parents giving him the gun. If you have a link for that, fine. Otherwise, would you consider changing your post title?

niyad

(113,259 posts)
11. you are correct, it does not say that. but, obviously, the child had access to the gun, so it
Mon Dec 17, 2012, 09:27 PM
Dec 2012

apparently was not safely stored somewhere inaccessible.

Fridays Child

(23,998 posts)
19. I made the same point but a parent giving a kid a gun to take to school...
Mon Dec 17, 2012, 09:44 PM
Dec 2012

...is a different issue, don't you think?

Fridays Child

(23,998 posts)
37. Just to be clear, you think that parents making the mistake of not sufficiently securing firearms...
Mon Dec 17, 2012, 10:33 PM
Dec 2012

...is fundamentally the same thing, or just as bad, as parents actually giving their children firearms to take to school?

marions ghost

(19,841 posts)
49. Absoeffinglutely!
Tue Dec 18, 2012, 05:47 PM
Dec 2012

YES You Betcha

And that is why parents of kids who allow their kids to have any access to guns SHOULD GO TO JAIL. Take a gun to school = Parents IN jail. This would go a long way to addressing the issue.

Their child himself or others will be just as dead if the gun is loaded--regardless of the parent's level of complicity.

NO difference, NO excuses.



cthulu2016

(10,960 posts)
29. Well, why not say the parents killed JFK?
Mon Dec 17, 2012, 10:09 PM
Dec 2012

Obviously the gun was somehow accessible to the child.

Agreed.

That is a bad thing, of course. It doesn't not follow that any allegation against the parents is okay.

The issue here has nothing to do with the parents, it is about the OP willfully misleading people... lying, if you will.

That is never okay, not matter how good the cause or whether it tells a "larger truth" or whatever.

Falsehoods are these things that intellectually honest people don't stand for in any context.

kiva

(4,373 posts)
10. Would you please correct your post title?
Mon Dec 17, 2012, 09:27 PM
Dec 2012

None of the links given say that the parents approved or even knew about this - this is enough of a hot button issue without getting into the question of adults stupid enough to send a child to school with a weapon. Now the whole question of adults who are stupid enough to let an 11 year old get ahold of a gun is another question...

 

Sheepshank

(12,504 posts)
44. damn...repeating local headlines...read the fox 13link above before you employ righteous indignation
Tue Dec 18, 2012, 02:14 AM
Dec 2012

struggle4progress

(118,278 posts)
17. ... Granite District Spokesman Ben Horsley said that the student apparently brought the gun
Mon Dec 17, 2012, 09:36 PM
Dec 2012

to school because of the recent massacre at Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown Conn. where 26 people were killed, including 20 students. The 11-year-old boy wanted to protect himself and his friend in case something like that rampage occurred at his school, officials said ... http://www.ksl.com/?sid=23430406&nid=148

We People

(619 posts)
35. Mine too! And teachers would be fired for doing it.
Mon Dec 17, 2012, 10:29 PM
Dec 2012

I thought that, after Columbine, schools in most states instituted a Zero Tolerance Policy for ANY kind of weapon - including even a plastic knife (seriously). I guess all these people suggesting that school personnel be armed either don't have kids or know any teachers, or else their state doesn't have ZT in place.

liberalmuse

(18,672 posts)
31. West Kearns Utah doesn't exactly have the brightest bulbs.
Mon Dec 17, 2012, 10:20 PM
Dec 2012

So this story is not in the least surprising.

 

kestrel91316

(51,666 posts)
33. In CA there is zero tolerance for weapons in schools, IIRC.
Mon Dec 17, 2012, 10:24 PM
Dec 2012

I think nail clippers get you expelled. A gun would get you expelled and probably criminally prosecuted.

anonymous444

(1 post)
41. Please check your facts
Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:05 AM
Dec 2012

Please check your facts before you post things. I am closely affiliated with the school, and as of right now, it is UNCLEAR where the student got the gun.

 

Sheepshank

(12,504 posts)
47. just repeating what I had heard on kutv4.
Tue Dec 18, 2012, 02:18 AM
Dec 2012

The news was on in the background and someone above provided a fox13 article that says the same thing....mr. 1 post

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