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(82,003 posts)
Wed Dec 12, 2012, 12:27 PM Dec 2012

For all those who got all happy about the MTFW&P wolf hunt closure around YNP

Attention to all who admire or are curious about wolves in the Rocky Mountains and Yellowstone NP:

I am sorry to inform everyone that all the hoopla about this paltry action taken by MTFW&P was all about the bad PR they got and nothing more. Many of we wolf advocates have fought nearly to the death about this for almost two decades and with little national attention (seriously, we are stalked and receive death threats and harassment and loss of employment regularly).

Now that 10% of the Yellowstone NP wolves have been killed in the hunts so far this season, it needs to be known that it isn't going to stop anything except that, like the "Crowder" event in MI yesterday, the PR machine will make this agency look better when they have done nothing in reality to relieve the issue except in the PR game. And it was in Wyoming that the majority of park wolves were killed by individuals sitting outside the park boundary with "calls" luring the wolves out of the park and then killing them. The quotas for hunting units are always filled on the perimeter of the parks where wolves live and are protected first.

Many have argued for a "buffer zone" around the entire perimeter of YNP to avoid this very issue... for years. So here's the map of the miniscule "closure" offered by MTFW&P after most of the wolves that would enter that area have already been killed:


Mind you, neither Idaho or Wyoming have any intention of doing anything like this along their park borders.

It is also necessary to inform the general public that the main purpose (official excuse) for allowing the hunting of a species that has just recently been removed, illegally, from the ESA list was to let the wolf hating crowd "blow off some steam" by letting them kill some. That was so much BS that it makes one wonder what century these people live in. Letting these "hunters" kill wolves only encourages them to demand more killing and now trapping. There are a number of web sites that glorify the disrespectful maiming, torture and slow deaths of these amazing apex predators. And this issue has only received national attention because a well known wolf from the park was killed last week. About three million people come to YNP to see wolves and other wildlife in a natural setting each year and all three states benefit heavily from the revenue tourism brings.

As far as management policies in the three Rocky Mountain wolf DPS (reintroduced) states, Montana actually has the most reasonable (if you can call it that), Idaho and Wyoming are absolutely hostile toward the species and are attempting to kill them all even if they give lip service to the idea that the wolves will be placed back on the ESA list should they decline below 150 wolves per state. In the majority of the state of Wyoming there is a "shoot on sight" policy, year round. This is all due to the fact that they were reintroduced by the "goddam gubbamint" and wolves are something that can be taken out with guns.

Please pay attention to this issue as much as any of those regarding our rights as the removal of important species serves to further degrade our ability to survive by allowing the extractive industries to frack and dig up what's left of our publicly owned wild lands. They claim that in the absence of wildlife there is no reason to protect the land.

What can you do about it?

Call, email, tweet, FB the Congressional delegates and the state government officials of these three states and tell them that you will not be spending your vacation $$ in their state because of their wolf management policies. I urge everyone who cares about this to do so. You can find their contact info here:



For wolf death tallies (overall population at time of delisting was approximately 1500 animals for these three states including park wolves):

Latest Posted Idaho Wolf Hunt Kill total: 114
Latest Posted Idaho Wolf Trapping Kill total: 6
Latest Posted Montana Wolf Hunt Kill Total: 87
Wyoming Wolf Kill Total: 58

Regional Total Reported Killed This Year: 265
Regional Total Reported Killed Since Delisting: 810

Source and for daily updates:

It's the biosphere, stupid.

Thanks for reading my rant, I hope you contact the officials recommended above.


For all those who got all happy about the MTFW&P wolf hunt closure around YNP (Original Post) 2naSalit Dec 2012 OP
Quite awful to hunt for no reason other than to extinguish a life Beringia Dec 2012 #1
Indeed 2naSalit Dec 2012 #2
K&R. n/t Egalitarian Thug Dec 2012 #3
Thank you. 2naSalit Dec 2012 #10
YVW. A million year sago when I was young I was one of those that fought and failed to Egalitarian Thug Dec 2012 #15
I guess so but it 2naSalit Dec 2012 #16
Done for the all good it will do montanacowboy Dec 2012 #4
Thanks, montanacowboy! 2naSalit Dec 2012 #9
And after that, what species will be next and then which species will be last? nt ladjf Dec 2012 #14
Thanks for what you do. nm rhett o rick Dec 2012 #5
Thanks for reading the thread 2naSalit Dec 2012 #8
what a bunch of self serving bs backwoodsbob Dec 2012 #6
When you receive death threats from the local bubbas just for 2naSalit Dec 2012 #7
this just in... 2naSalit Dec 2012 #11
K&R! ceile Dec 2012 #12
Thanks for your interest! 2naSalit Dec 2012 #13
thank you G_j Dec 2012 #17
You're welcome 2naSalit Dec 2012 #19
kick G_j Dec 2012 #21
We could use some wolves around here to Tsiyu Dec 2012 #18
Thank you for all you're doing...(eom) CanSocDem Dec 2012 #20


(4,291 posts)
1. Quite awful to hunt for no reason other than to extinguish a life
Wed Dec 12, 2012, 12:35 PM
Dec 2012

The voices for the wolf need to be strong


(82,003 posts)
2. Indeed
Wed Dec 12, 2012, 12:52 PM
Dec 2012

This killing issue has become a problem. All I can do about it anymore is to post threads like this. I have invested everything in this issue and lost nearly everything in the interim, including jobs when my employers figured out what I did in my spare time.

Thanks for the recs and comments. Please help by getting others to read, rec and act.



Egalitarian Thug

(12,448 posts)
15. YVW. A million year sago when I was young I was one of those that fought and failed to
Wed Dec 12, 2012, 04:41 PM
Dec 2012

re-introduce the species in Colorado. So, bad as this is, you all have done better than we could.


(82,003 posts)
16. I guess so but it
Wed Dec 12, 2012, 05:58 PM
Dec 2012

all seems to be going the other way now. Without a nonranching Sec. of Interior, we're sunk, worse yet so are the wolves. They will essentially become, once again something you mostly see in a zoo or stuffed in a museum.

There is a petition to have Rep. Raul Grihalva (D) Ariz. considered for the position, we certainly need to get Kenny-boy replaced ASAP.


Still needs a lot of signatures and some coverage.

But I am with you on the once, when I was young part. I'm a bit old and having a hard time with my personal stuff to be able to do much on the advocacy front at present. At least I have a computer and Internet access so I can speak up here and there.


(5,874 posts)
4. Done for the all good it will do
Wed Dec 12, 2012, 01:19 PM
Dec 2012

I am so sick and tired of this ongoing fight, it will never end until the pigs kill every last wolf alive.


(82,003 posts)
9. Thanks, montanacowboy!
Wed Dec 12, 2012, 02:15 PM
Dec 2012

After all the BS that surrounds this issue, I still have hope that enough people making their views on this known to those who legislate this way... it will make them act differently, even if it's only because they feel threatened by their actions themselves.



(6,001 posts)
6. what a bunch of self serving bs
Wed Dec 12, 2012, 01:52 PM
Dec 2012

you have fought nearly to the death?Really?

I have sponsored wolves for nearly 20 years and have raised an arctic from a pup until he died of old age...I have never had to fight nearly to the death over them.

Can we talk about wolves without the over the top rhetoric ?


(82,003 posts)
7. When you receive death threats from the local bubbas just for
Wed Dec 12, 2012, 02:10 PM
Dec 2012

speaking at a public hearing where you advocate for wolves, then you understand just how close you can be to dying for your cause. Try it sometime, getting pushed around at the door and followed to your vehicle and your home by pistol-packing rednecks isn't a pleasant experience.

Domestically raising a wild animal doesn't do much for them in the wild unless you are educating others about their importance in the wild.

Some of us actually do this kind of publicly visible advocacy and get hit hard from many directions for it. If you were actually doing something of this sort, you'd get it and see that it's not rhetoric, Mr. backwoods. I have no time for nor interest in rhetorical time-wasting. But I do know the experiences I and my colleagues have had and no sniping from you or anyone else can change that.

What I am doing here is bringing a stupid policy set to the attention of the public so that they can speak up and hopefully have some impact on the self-serving clods who think they are superior to all other life forms to the detriment of us all.


(18,186 posts)
18. We could use some wolves around here to
Thu Dec 13, 2012, 12:00 PM
Dec 2012

help with exploding white tail populations, but yahoos would just go out and kill them all.

Someone released some elk nearby a few years back; an old ass shot them all just for spite. They were on his lawn.

In some "good" minds, the loss of livestock and possible harm to humans makes them afraid of wolves. But their kids and they can be just as summarily killed by the endless stream of deer that jump out of the woods into car windshields around here. You pay one way or another.

This is why I believe the feds say we have no large cats here, even though we have large cats here.

If some people think there's a wild big cat within 200 miles of them, they just have to try to track and shoot it. Some people want absolutely no wildlife around them, as if the forests live on air.

You read some of the "creepy stories" some hunters tell, and they are absolutely terrified of the "woods."

Thanks for all you do, meandering post over......

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