Sincere question for the women of DU

[senseandsensibility]

Do you feel women's lives are valued in this country? I am feeling like not so much. Sexism is alive and well. The most recent example for me is the reaction to Nancy Pelosi and the attack on her husband, along with the most recent video that came out. It was barely mentioned on my local media which is in Pelosi's district. If any male in government had this happen to them, I feel that it would be nonstop coverage and something would be done.

Also today, a man who tortures his female victims has been running loose in Oregon after being convicted of assaults against two other female victims in Nevada. Served a couple of years in jail and was released to do it again. Now he's on the run and recruiting females from dating aps. Not to mention the almost constant stream of females being murdered by their SO's. We have become immune, it seems.

[SleeplessinSoCal]

1. I've sensed the uptick in misogynistic talk via right wing paid mouthpieces.

Limbaugh was notoriously misogynistic. And he gave license to a lot of pea-brained a-holes to flaunt their misogyny. Add major misogynist Musk and we have definitely sunk to new lows for the 21st century.

[senseandsensibility]

2. Yes, I agree

And then there's TFG. He also flaunted his misogyny.

[czarjak]

97. "I cherish women" though?

[calimary]

121. My ass he "cherishes" women.

And to answer the question in the OP: no. I still think women get short shrift. We’re still disrespected and blamed and exploited. We’re STILL not fully equal.

And I don’t know how long it’ll be before we finally are.

[jcgoldie]

105. Cawthorn and Hawley, et. al

I'm not a woman so maybe no qualified to say much in this thread but the new ideology of "masculinity" that has been being voiced louder and louder by far right GOP legislators like Cawthorn and Josh Hawley seems right out of the 19th century. Feminist women are emasculating men. Single women need to be married off so their husbands can control their voting behavior. The Dobbs ruling is just the tip of the iceberg, these fuckers want their their sexist hegemony back and they so often use religion to justify it.

[SleeplessinSoCal]

134. And they won't even acknowledge their backwards thinking is Taliban-like.

Women's rights ushered in the middle class. They appear to want to do away with the middle class entirely. Too bad there are women condoning their behavior. It needs condemnation to save the country.

[niyad]

3. Of course they are not.

For an in-depth look at the answer, check out the thread in Women's Rights And Issues "Are Women's Rights the Canary in the Coal Mine of Democracy's Decline (sorry I cannot link to it, my pos computer does not let me link). Article from Ms. Magazine.

Women do not count in ANY patriarchal institution, and America IS a patriarchal institution.

[sheshe2]

14. Here you go.

https://msmagazine.com/2023/01/19/democracy-usa-womens-rights-abortion/

The United States was designated a backsliding democracy in late 2021, when it appeared on a prominent European think tank’s annual global ranking. Today, half of the world’s democratic governments are on the decline, according to The Global State of Democracy, a report released by the International Institute for Democracy and Electoral Assistance (IDEA) this past November.

Six months before the Supreme Court decision in Dobbs v. Jackson Women’s Health Organization, with Texas SB 8 already in effect—the U.S. made its disconcerting debut on the list. Advocates raised real-time questions about the correlation between regression on abortion rights and degraded democracies. A New York Times article asserted that such a descent is precisely when “curbs on women’s rights tend to accelerate.”

We think that’s a proposition worth flipping on its head. What if, instead, we looked at the United States’ persistent abysmal track record on gender equity as the potential smoking gun for its downward spiral? While the timing of the United States’ inaugural inclusion on the IDEA list made it easy to point to the grift of Trump and the rise of Trump-ism as the culprit, the hard truth is that our democracy has been flailing—by failing women, particularly women of color—as it has designed to, since the nation’s founding.
Let’s start with the century-long fight to enshrine equality in the U.S. Constitution.

Eighty-five percent of United Nations member states currently have explicit constitutional provisions that prohibit discrimination on the basis of sex and/or gender. The United States is an outlier. Even as the federal Equal Rights Amendment navigates the path to ratification—and some 30 states have ERAs or comparable language in their own constitutions and/or active mobilization efforts—women in this country have no guarantee of equality.

[niyad]

30. Thank you!

[sheshe2]

34. It is a good read, niyad.

Thank you for bringing it to my attention.

[niyad]

40. You are most welcome. I was more than a little disheartened reading that. Along

with the other things I am reading this week, including, "Hysterical: A Memoir", and "The Bonobo Sisterhood", one wonders how we have even made it this far.

NEVERTHELESS, SHE PERSISTED!!!

[efhmc]

42. Thank you for the article. Sad though it is, it is the truth.

[sheshe2]

47. You're welcome.

Eighty-five percent of United Nations member states currently have explicit constitutional provisions that prohibit discrimination on the basis of sex and/or gender. The United States is an outlier.

[Samrob]

86. What really hurts is that almost half of the women who are RW-buy into the misogyny.

Just look at the votes in the past three elections.

[sheshe2]

90. I know.

Worse part, the educated ones, the women that are the lawmakers vote against us. They vote for misogyny. FFS, they voted against easing baby formula shortages! They don't give a ra about women, only money and power.

Breaks my heart.

[LiberalLoner]

112. +1👏

[wnylib]

4. It's a consequence of the influence of RW extremists in

society and government. They push their agrnda loudly in social media and on their own right leaning media. The vast majority of them are misogynists. It's a trait of fascism.

[senseandsensibility]

6. Exactly.

The almost unquenchable desire for these "men" to feel better than someone else and have power over them is ruining our society. And no one seems to want to talk about it.

[ShazzieB]

74. RW extremists sre definitely the problem.

And not just men. One of the leading opponents of the ERA was Phyllis Schlafly, a conservative activist who launched a grassroots movement to block its ratification. She had more to do with it not being ratified by a sufficient number of states than any other single individual. She was all over the news in those days, screaming about how the ERA would mean no more separate bathrooms for men and women, among other ridiculous claims. Oh, how I hated her.

She opposed feminism in general, as well as gay marriage, abortion, and basically anything the least bit progressive. Just an all around delightful individual.

Fun fact: she supported Trump's bid for the presidency but didn't live long enough to see him elected.

[betsuni]

75. And lecturing women to stay home, not work, while she was always working and never home.

[ShazzieB]

76. Yes!

I remember it well. Such a huge hypocrite.

We came so close with the ERA. SO close. Schlafly has been at the top of my "Why we can't have nice things" list ever since.

[niyad]

82. I challenged her on that hypocrisy. Also asked if the males and females in her

house used separate bathrooms. Also asked her why, if it was so horrible for our daughters to go to war, why it was so noble for our sons. On none of those occasions did she ever answer me.

There were times I really regretted not running her over when I had the chance. Had I but known. . .prison would have been worth it.

[wnylib]

77. I remember Schlafly. She also advised women

in one of her books, or columns on how to keep their husbands happy and sexually interested. I never read anything of hers but one piece of written advice made the news. It was that a woman should spice up her marriage by greeting her husband at the door wearing nothing but Saran Wrap.

For a woman who advised other women to stay home as good little obedient housewives, she sure spent a lot of time working away from her home and making a name and career for herself.

[niyad]

104. To be fair, that was actually marabel morgan, another reichwing shill. There was

a very funny scene in "Fried Green Tomatoes" where Kathy Bates' character did exactly that,.

[wnylib]

116. I looked it up because I was pretty sure

that Schlafly had given that "advice." I found some sites that attributed it to Morgan and others to Schlafly. My guess is that Morgan might have originated it and Schlafly repeated it.

I was going through a divorce when the ERA was being promoted (and opposed). My attorney was a conservative Republican, which I did not know until after I had paid for a few sessions and the divorce papers were filed. Too much invested then to switch.

One of the things he said to me was that it was good that I had filed before the ERA was accepted because, if the ERA was successful, I'd be paying alimony to my ex for the rest of my life.

[niyad]

117. That bs about alimony was one of the lying scare tactics they used to frighten

people about the ERA.

When I was managing a B. Dalton's, it was always very hard to find copies of morgan's drivel, or schlafly's, and similar on the shelves. Funny how they were always getting misplaced.

[wnylib]

122. My second husband was also once a B. Dalton manager.

I saw through the attorney's scare tactics at the time. He annoyed me about a couple other areas of the divorce. Later he got into politics and it became clearer to me why I had sometimes felt more like he was representing my husband than me.

[raccoon]

5. No.

[mcar]

7. No, I don't

You named several examples. I would point you to (but I won't link to it), WaPo's lead story today trashing VP Harris. It's all "sources say" and "some staffers have quit" crap.

Never did I see that for any other VP.

[senseandsensibility]

8. The examples are too many to mention

and so obvious if you are open to it. Unfortunately, we've become immune.

[mcar]

12. Exactly

Just look at the double standard for HRC.

[betsuni]

25. The "she was overprepared" one was just...

Come on, man. Among the millions of other examples.

[mcar]

61. As Stephanie Miller says

I will never not be mad about it.

[niyad]

107. Instead, putler, the media, misogyny, forced the most underprepared puppet

in our history on us, and the damage continues.

[allegorical oracle]

110. Just another way for ignorant people to say she was "too intelligent". Some men are clearly

intimidated by intelligent women. It's linked to the right's claims of how women are emasculating men.

[yardwork]

23. I saw that headline and it made me mad.

"Some Democrats say..." I didn't even read the article. Bunch of crap.

[mcar]

24. It is a bunch of sexist crap

[Coventina]

9. No, we aren't even people.

Last edited Mon Jan 30, 2023, 06:35 PM - Edit history (1)

I'm waiting for even the acknowledgement that violence is a gender problem.

Every time we hear of a mass shooting, there's nearly 100% chance it's a male perpetrator.
Well over 90% of violent crimes are done by men.

When is society going to start asking WHAT IS WRONG WITH MEN?

But no, it's women's freedoms that need to be curtailed, not men.

We don't even get bodily autonomy.



on edit: typo

[senseandsensibility]

11. It's like it's understood that you can't mention

that on corporate media. I think they are afraid of losing male viewers.

[3catwoman3]

51. "When is society going to start asking WHAT IS WRONG WITH MEN?"

I ask myself that all the time, but have avoided asking it publicly.

Thank you for having more courage than I do.

[Scrivener7]

81. Great post.

[SamKnause]

10. No, the evidence is all around us.

They never have.

[mgardener]

13. I have to say

I think things are better then when I was growing up in the 70's.

But, things seem to be regressing instead progressing.

[senseandsensibility]

15. In the 70's there were all these serial killers

of women running around and I don't remember anyone mentioning the elephant in the room: they were all male killing all females. No one talked about that in terms of what was wrong with men.

[meadowlander]

21. Susan Faludi's book Backlash looks at some of the drivers for this.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Backlash:_The_Undeclared_War_Against_American_Women

[50 Shades Of Blue]

16. Nope. Especially not now.

[haele]

17. I believe 60 -70% of the country values or at least respects women as citizens with equal rights.

1 believe another 15 -20% see women in general like they do people other than themselves or their immediate "tribe" of either family or friends - as in, not considered to be part of the tribe they choose to affiliate with - and not to be respected as fellow human beings. A lot of this number are powerful people who live in social bubbles, and are responsible for overlooking women in the work place because "she's not one of us".

That leaves about 15% who actually fear, resent, or hate women simply for being women. Unfortunately, one angry man (or angry woman) can do a lot of damage to a lot of others before being stopped or caught.

A victim is one person, but a victimizer can make hundreds of victims in his or her wake, causing all sorts of collateral damage (as in, through influence or deceptive, hypocritical behavior) and making the problem greater than it should be.

Haele

[nini]

18. no

Being a woman in the tech industry really is a challenge.

The ERA never been made into law. That tells me all I need to know though I have plenty of examples in my own life to know women are not thought upon equally.

[NewEnglandAutumn]

19. It depends

Within my family and social group yes
Within society at large no

[yardwork]

20. No, I do not.

Women, as well as men, are guilty of sexism against women. It's a systemic problem.

[senseandsensibility]

22. Systematic sexism is certainly a problem

and women fall prey to it all too often. But at least they don't usually get violent.

[BigmanPigman]

26. Last night I pondered this question on my own.

After seeing a TV for "Plan B" an after unprotected sex pill I was thinking if the GQP will try to close that option down. That led my thoughts to think of a world where men get pregnant and how different the last couple of thousands years of male dominated societies. I think women will always be treated like crap due to the fact that women are the ones who get pregnant amd have to raise and protect a child. Just a theory.

[GopherGal]

53. I think one of the organizing principles of patriarchies is...

the woman must be controlled so that the man doesn't have give any of his resources toward support of offspring that aren't his own.

30 years old men "sowing their oats" before marrying teenage virgins. Virginity tests. Young women not allowed out of the house unless accompanied by a male relative.

Part of what makes patriarchy so compatible with Republicanism. "You're not using my tax dollars to help anybody pay for someone else's kid's health care or tuition!"

[BigmanPigman]

83. Well said!

I agree 100%

[ananda]

27. No, not valued at all, in any way.

Period

[FakeNoose]

28. Go back even further - look how Hillary Clinton was treated as a candidate for President in 2016

No male candidate - even the most unqualified, poorly-prepared among them - has ever been so thoroughly insulted and mistreated by the media as the way they treated Hillary.

She was repeatedly assaulted in print and on the airwaves, accused of lies, disrespected, victimized by misdirection and falsehoods by right-leaning "journalists" and Faux Noise pundits during her entire campaign. It made me sick and disgusted for this country, and I never want to see another woman be treated that way ever again.

[DENVERPOPS]

54. I keep repeating, the cause of the republican media bias

against women and dems:

80+% of all media......Cable, Newspapers, Magazine, Radio, TV is owned and/or operated by rich or uber rich Republicans.

There were regulations against one person or company owning more than a few outlets/markets before Reagan got in. He threw those regulations out, and here we are 40+ years later...............

One of the very first things Hitler did was take complete control over the press and radio..........

It's PRAVDA in Russia.......

KATIE BAR THE DOOR

[betsuni]

57. Not only the right and mainstream media.

[Kaleva]

58. Look at how she was treated here in 2008

Those archived threads make for interesting reading

[Celerity]

29. I think on balance human lives (& yes women are treated worse than men) are treated poorly in the US

compared to the way they are treated in many other nations. Certainly worse than here in the Nordics, for instance.

[happybird]

31. No. It's been on my mind a lot lately

Organizing my thoughts, there are many, and will detail when able to express it all succinctly.

[senseandsensibility]

45. Yes, please do.

I could benefit from organizing my thoughts very often. But on a topic like this, it is sometimes difficult because for me, anyway, it can be emotional.

[LAS14]

32. Sexism certainly isn't as alive and well as it was 60 years ago. I've watched...

... steady improvement. The #MeToo movement is the latest. It's not that it's worse. It's that the light is shining on it.

[niyad]

84. I give you Dobbs, and the hundreds of pieces of legislation around the country

taking away women's autonomy.

[LAS14]

98. That's one issue. There were/are LOTS of issues. nt

[niyad]

106. I did not say that there are not. But that is the biggest and most obvious one

today, and a frightening indicator of the backward slide of this greatest, bestest nation in the world.

[Tansy_Gold]

33. I post the daily Stock Market Watch thread. . . .

. . . . in the Economy Group here on DU. Today my "Quote for the Day" was selected from a 1973 book, The Subversion of Women, as Practiced by Churches, Witch-Hunters, and Other Sexists. I rarely venture beyond that group on DU, so that quote was chosen hours before I saw this post.

If the overturning of Roe wasn't enough of a clue that women are of less than full-value humans in this country, I don't know what else a thinking person needs.

There was a meme posted on some site a day or so ago, pages out of a newspaper listing the reasons mass shooters do what they do; all the explanations began with "He."

There is still no Equal Rights Amendment.

Hillary was right; Hillary won.

Sexism is far more than just violence. And it exists right here on DU, too.

[Scrivener7]

80. Everything Tansy just said!

[niyad]

85. Hear! Hear!

[sheshe2]

91. You are 100% correct.

Everything you said is a fact.

[barbtries]

35. Not by enough people.

not by a long shot. Abortion anyone? right to privacy, personal physical autonomy?

I know many men who do respect and value women as human beings. The most important thing I tried to raise my sons to do. I also know that there are too many women who don't respect themselves in that same way. They are willingly subservient to the men in their lives.

I think the people who are blaming all this brouhaha on the Womens Movement are dying out though. At least in a lot of the world. Iran, Afghanistan, and other terribly oppressive regimes are marching their nations right back to the dark ages. The USA, thanks to republicans, racists, fundamentalist religions, and corporate media, I don't think we're doing that well.

fuck the patriarchy
i hate republicans

[LogicFirst]

36. My question to you is

Do all women respect each other and themselves? If we do not, then we can’t expect men to respect us either.

[onecaliberal]

41. When have women ever passed a single law to control a man's right to make decisions for

His own life?

[sheshe2]

44. I disagree with your comment.

I do not respect any woman that is voting to take away a woman's right to choose over their own bodies. EOM!

[BlueMTexpat]

103. AMEN!!!

LOVE seeing you, ss2!

[sheshe2]

115. Hi Blue 🥰

Good to see you too!

[Ms. Toad]

49. Wow.

Sounds a lot like comments to women repeatedly abused by their partners - "Why didn't she respect herself enough to leave?"

[MontanaMama]

70. So...let me get this straight...

Because some women do not respect other women, the rest of us should not expect respect? Some women don't have a lot of self respect because they've been beaten down forever...physically, emotionally and spiritually. Those women don't deserve respect? How will they learn that they deserve respect if they are not respected at some point. I wholeheartedly disagree with your post. If we wait to be respected...we will all die disrespected. Nope.

[Scrivener7]

79. That's just nutty.

[niyad]

87. Explain, please, how the women got that way. who controls education? the

churches? corporations? media? every aspect of culture? politics? EVERY SINGLE AREA OF OUR LIVES ARE CONTROLLED BY MEN. So, do, please, tell me why this is OUR fault.

[herding cats]

92. We don't deserve respect because some other woman may have been disrespectful of our gender?

Not a very logical argument but it is one used against all minorities and marginalized populations by those who are threatened by them since forever.

I have a lot to say on this topic. I await your explanation.

[Hortensis]

37. Yes, absolutely. Just not by everyone. HALF of "this country" are women,

Last edited Mon Jan 30, 2023, 07:21 PM - Edit history (1)

though, and no one should fail to include something that basic when considering an issue like this. Or give respect due to ALL who do value women.

Some feelings I'm reading on this thread are a classic example of many LW activist types believing, in their enthusiasm, that more is possible than is realistic. That leads to them responding to genuine, important advances -- they helped create -- with feelings of despair and defeat because unrealistic expectations weren't met.

Instead of the deserved pride in being part of them that is critical to sparking enthusiasm for the next steps. What I'm describing here has become a serious problem for the activist left, and there are a lot of important articles online that can be pulled up from activist leaders describing its crippling effects on their movements. Or google Bill Moyers eight stages of successful social movements from the 1970s; there's nothing new to this syndrome, and it is very pernicious and destructive to success.

The reality here is that the cultural status of women is the product of many millennia. What equality for women means to cultures is extremely profound, deeply affecting every aspect, so much so that resistance to equality for women goes FAR deeper than resistance to equality for men of minority races. It's not possible to completely obliterate and replace that in just a few years, not completely even in a few centuries.

I've seen and lived ENORMOUS gains in my lifetime. Comparing changes over the past 50 years from the 200 before, the acceleration of advances in the legal and actual status of women in the western world is staggering. The pace of changes to whole cultures and the feelings of individuals is much slower and lags, sometimes tremendously; but that is as should be expected. A hundred years from now, some will still be fighting the same fights as today and 50 years ago, but against far fewer knuckledraggers.

But for now, congratulations to us all for what we've been part of. Just helping embed the changes by living them is important participation. So, though, is recognizing they're very real and refusing to be among those who deny them.

[betsuni]

69. Agree.

Speaking of the status of women in the western world, I think of the fact that it's still a law in Japan that married couples have to take the same family name officially on their family registry (naturally about 98% or so women are the ones changing names). The reason usually given (by the old men in charge) is that it would be confusing if a child had parents with different names. Oh yes, we're all morons who cannot grasp the concept. I have the same family name as my brother, does that mean we're married? Ridiculous.

[Hortensis]

73. "Ridiculous" excuses are so typical. This sounds like

it was left over or come up with when ones that have become completely unacceptable had to be abandoned, like it'd be too confusing to the woman or no one would know who she belonged to.

[efhmc]

38. Going backwards.

[onecaliberal]

39. No.

[Iris]

43. No. -eom

That's it. That's the message.

[littlemissmartypants]

46. ...

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1117&pid=13428

[ancianita]

48. Nope.

[SunSeeker]

50. No. nt

[DownriverDem]

52. No they aren't

There's more women than men, but some women go with the righty men because of the their money. Either it's their husband's money or their own. Michigan has shown that women can win big elections. Things will not change until more women are elected to office.

[Sky Jewels]

55. Valued?! HAH!

We've been shat upon repeatedly my entire life, and well before I was born. We couldn't even pass an amendment to the Constitution stating that women have equal rights as Americans! The fucking Opus Dei Catholic loons on the Supreme Ct. made us into third-class citizens after men and fetuses. I have several friends who were raped by males at some point in their lives. It's jaw-droppingly common. Ask any female over the age of 12 for her stories about how males have treated her. I guarantee every single one will have at least one anecdote of being harassed in public, humiliated by males, grabbed, groped, chased, "exposed" or publicly masturbated to, stalked, raped, hit, and on and on. Women aren't paid equally. They're not given sufficient leaves, or any leaves. Most are expected to work a paid job and do the majority of child care and home cleaning and cooking. We can't walk alone anywhere without being fearful of being attacked by males. Even in my "nice" safe neighborhood I think twice before walking through a patch of woods. I'd like to go there to breathe in the rich oxygen get some peace of mind in nature. Instead I have to worry about men lurking behind trees (there have been attacks in similar areas. They're rare but they do happen. I'm not being paranoid). There is a bottomless pit of evidence and examples of how U.S. women are valued like crap and treated like dirt. I could go on and on and on...

One major thing that women can do, besides working for better political outcomes, is stop supporting and attending churches. Religion's primary aim is to perpetuate the patriarchy. So, no more butts in the pews. No help in the basement kitchen. No more casserole contributions. No bake sales. No money in the grifting plate. Just stop buying into the utterly ridiculous mythology of a male omnipotent god and his magical male child. It's all make-believe. And it's been utter poison for women.

[CousinIT]

56. Women in America are breeding apparatus and domestic slaves. . .

. . . controlled by legislative chains tied to their uteruses, paid less if at all (most caretaking is dumped on women in our society and in fact our systems are BUILT around their doing it all for FREE). I once calculated what a woman with 2 kids and who took care of her elderly parents would make if PAID for childcare, elder care, cooking and maid service - it was MILLIONS over a lifetime. Women are just damn slaves. And incubators.

[KT2000]

59. Supreme Court

summed it up for all of America. Women are still property for many and that position has been given legal, political and religious prominence.

When I see the stories of women abused, killed and dumped like trash, I wonder why it is not addressed as a systemic problem rather than just a criminal matter. Shouldn't it alarm us all that families are raising their children to consider women as second class citizens. Such individuals remain protected by those unwilling to face the truth about our society.

[sellitman]

60. Not to mention

We have an ex president who most probably is a rapist.

And he is running again.

[Murphyb849]

62. No.

[Warpy]

63. You can tell how much we're valued by our comparative paychecks

and the way we're treated on and off the job.

[Timeflyer]

64. Women aren't valued as full humans equal to men

LBJ had a quote about how if you convince the lowest white man he's better than the best colored man, you can pick his pocket and he'll even help you pick it. (Sorry about the use of antiquated word for African Americans, and I'm certainly don't think there's a direct comparison to the racist treatment of blacks in US to that of women)--but every woman knows she's a potential target of abuse/assault/ resentment/contempt from some men just because she not swinging a penis and raging testosterone.

[CharleyDog]

65. Women are not valued.

Pregnant women, the most vulnerable time, face many threats; they cannot even count on evidence-based, standard-practice medical care.

Women's pay is less. Everything about their lives are worth less. They don't even get to keep their name.

Many states now feel no shame in wanting to restrict women's travel as if they are escaped slaves; valid and reliable abortion medicine is "illegal" not for medical reasons, but for control.

Already one state, Florida, seems to have mandated that women athletes submit their menstrual cycles to further control them.

there's much more, of course, but lastly, women are murdered/disappeared at an astounding rate, esp women of color and even worse for First Nation women. Rape is ignored by the "police" and women fear reporting their abuse because they are not taken seriously, are mocked, and belittled. Sex workers disappear and the "police" don't investigate, because they themselves, MEN, invented this category of women to be used and discarded.

Because women are viewed (so much is subconscious) as less. We're compared to cows, to animals. We are animals to be USED.
"How can I use her," a common first reaction from many men. This is my experience in life so far.

I've said this before, here, and some people felt offended. Yet, perhaps dig a little into your subconscious now and then, and see what's there.

[TygrBright]

66. Hardly. We might not even be the most highly-valued form of domestic livestock. n/t

[Withywindle]

67. No, I don't

For so many reasons. Our rights to bodily autonomy are being completely ripped away. Virtually every one of these mass shooters who makes the headlines is a man with a history of violence against women close to him, and this violence was reported and known, and nothing was done because the safety of their girlfriends, wives, mothers, sisters, daughters, etc was seen as a personal, private matter and a man can do what he likes with his property. Every day women go missing, and only some types of women even get searched for. #MeToo made a temporary splash with some celebrities, but everyday women facing sexual harassment and violence get no fair hearing and no justice.

We do not have anywhere near equal representation in government to this day and we are a long way from getting it. Young men are being radicalized by fascist incel internet personalities who openly talk about how we are intellectually inferior and need to be trained and controlled. It's not just a matter of waiting for the old male chauvinists to die out, like we've been told. We are moving BACKWARDS, not forwards, and lots of young misogynists are even worse than the old ones.

[housecat]

68. Weak men have always feared strong women. Now they seem to fear all women.

[h2ebits]

71. We have become another target in the wave of hate that is sweeping our country.

I think women all over the country should unite--again--for a new women's movement. The organization already exists--we need to signup and participate in whatever state we live in.

We need to make our voices heard over the constant din of the hate; fueled by social media and expanded upon by what we call our Main Stream Media.

https://now.org/

[niyad]

88. Welcome to our DU family.

[Scrivener7]

78. No, women's lives aren't valued. Never have been, really. We made some progress

under Obama, but that has all fallen off the cliff lately.

[sheshe2]

93. Kick

[applegrove]

94. The Pelosies may be laying low..... trying to reduce their exposure to nuts now that

Nancy Pelosi is no longer speaker. They may have gotten advice on that from the secret service. I know one of their daughters implied the family was done with high profile politics as they visited with Paul Pelosi in the hospital.

[Hope22]

119. This is so very sad.

When the men find out that these attacks get rid women from politics we can expect more violence. Nancy has done more than her share so I have no quibble with her dropping back. My heart goes out to her and the family.

[applegrove]

123. I think Nancy had plans to retire. Who wants to be Minority Leader.

But I'm sure the attack made it more likely.

[Hope22]

132. Agree.

She deserved a happier day!

[herding cats]

95. I got distracted above. I know I'm not valued.

I've lived it.

I'm just fighting for the women following me being valued at this point.

[Trueblue Texan]

96. The only demographic our nation cares less about than women...

...is Black men.

[MissMillie]

99. Well, my answer to that question might break the internet

There's just too much to say about it.

And unfortunately, it's not just women who are under-valued.

Seems to me that unless you are a heterosexual, gun-toting, Christian, white male carnivore, the only value you have in society is when you "stay in your place."

[BlueWaveNeverEnd]

100. they focus on trans-athletes and gender/bathroom issues saying they are protecting women

yet, ignore the gender issues involved in murders/violence by hetero males

[lark]

101. MAGAs think women are only good for making babies and accepting their sperm, otherwise valueless.

Their goal is complete domination, and depersonalization of women. They are the American taliban.

[BlueMTexpat]

102. No, I do NOT!

One first realization of this happened to me as a Peace Corps Volunteer in Morocco in the 1960s.

Morocco, a Muslim country, had - as one result of colonization - adopted a French-style health care system. Any Moroccan women colleagues or other professionals (and despite much of Western propaganda to the contrary there were quite a few of them) who became pregnant were automatically entitled to paid maternity leave of at least two months. Moreover, they were also allowed time to make arrangements for breast-feeding for some time after that leave.

Of course, that was long before the days when pumping breast miilk occurred.

Women professionals were not passed over for promotion, etc. because of this. Most importantly, they were never forced to quit their jobs. It was not true that there was NO discrimination, but it was certainly no worse than in the US system, generally.

When I returned to the US to teach in the 1970s, women teachers in public schools in my state (Montana) were obliged to resign from their teaching jobs once they were five months pregnant. There was no guarantee that they would ever get their jobs or seniority back.

While the situation improved in Montana later in the 1970s so as not to require resignation, it was still a long time before paid maternity leave was introduced. Mothers had to use their regular sick leave or and/or take unpaid leave.

At least teaching was one career that routinely allowed for women to be available for their children during holidays and the summer. But the pay was so low that most of us used much of the summer to work at other jobs and/or to upgrade our teaching qualifications so that our salaries would be higher and go further.

Once my children were old enough, I trained in more profitable professions. I was a single parent for several years in their youth. I was fortunate enough to have had a family to help out though and that the stars aligned in my favor. Too many women have not been so lucky.

And no - despite all the cheesy lip service by hypocrites - women have NEVER been valued in the USA.

[Oneironaut]

108. Nope. Not even a little. Look how popular media talks about female celebrities.

Fat, ugly, old, slut. The subtle messaging in these entertainment pieces is that women are never good enough, should always be ashamed of their bodies. Anything over the age of 25 is over the hill and you should just go die. Any weight over your ribs showing means you should starve yourself until having a heart attack.

Also, allow the plastic surgery industry to hack your face up until you look like a platypus. You’re only as good as the number of men who want to fuck you.

It never ends.

[mnhtnbb]

109. To answer the question

women's lives in the US are NOT valued equally to men's lives, particularly by fundamentalist white Anglo-Saxon men.

Patriarchy is alive and well in this country, as it has been since it was founded. In the patriarchal scheme of things, yes, women have value, but it is not intrinsic. It is not equal to men, and it is the men who determine the value women will have.

In my experience--as an almost 72 year old white woman--although opportunities for women increased during my lifetime, we are now seeing a major backlash to that. The minority has grabbed the reins of power and are using it to deny women decision making control over their own lives. The Dobbs decision made me literally sick.

Misogyny is out of control in this country. But what makes me even more angry, is the number of women who are willing to go along with it, profit from it, and take advantage of it by prostituting themselves to men, whether physically, emotionally, or professionally in order to advance themselves.

Amy Coney Barrett, that's you. She deserves to be shunned by all women for her betrayal.

[Ilsa]

111. Men (and some women) feel compelled to set hemlines for women at

work in the FL lege. It's one thing to request "professional attire," but disrespectful to dictate minimum hemlines.

[hamsterjill]

113. Definitely going backwards in this country.

This probably won’t be popular here, but please hear me out.

I am tired of women’s rights being equated to the rights of the LGBTQ community having rights. In my opinion, they are similar causes but yet still very separate causes. Both completely worthy and should be no brainers in this country.

But every time I see the topic of women’s rights brought up, ultimately, there is something said about LGBTQ rights, and the topic gets muddled.

Again, every person on this planet deserves the right to have control over his/her/their body, their appearance, their life, their conduct, everything. But the right to a safe, legal abortion should not be intermixed with the right for someone to dress a certain way. And I see Republicans using this constantly as a means of muddling the conversation and taking the attention away from abortion rights.

I’m sure I will have offended someone here with this post. I tried to explain this as well as I could. I’ve gotten to where I don’t even post that much on DU any more for that reason. I mean no offense; just stating an opinion.

We need a clear, definitive, aggressive campaign to protect the right to a safe, legal abortion without any other topics clouding that agenda. Other topics deserve their own clear, definitive and aggressive campaigns.

[Wednesdays]

114. It seems the consensus here is that there is definitely misogyny in this country

The big question is, what do we do about it?

[Hope22]

120. National walk out.......n/t

[Hope22]

118. No. I fight the fight in my own home.

The men in my family are educated normal acting and think that they support women. When an important issue comes up I ask then to speak out, write call or visit their representative, simply make their views known. I get crickets, nothing. I text them the link…nothing. I ask them how they would feel if they woke up some day to being half a person in this country. Crickets because they know that will not happen to their white male selves. They act like they care but do nothing. They have no idea how frustrated and uncared for their actions make me feel.

I am so frightened for my son’s fiancé. I’m afraid she will get pregnant with a baby that they want. She has no rights, no personal right to health care, no voice as things stand. And, I’m afraid as hell that she will have a girl. In a million years I could not have imagined myself ever feeling this way!

I think things are pretty hopeless in this country. Even the National Women’s March on the 50th Anniversary of Roe was invisible. I’ve seen them collecting for porta potties this winter. Then I look at the number of people signed up for the action and think…how many potties do 300 people need? We are going to need some mammoth DC actions in order to be seen! The women of Iceland only got their rights after a National walk out. It seems to have held up over time. I can’t imagine how that would fly here. Hang tight and take care. We are in for a wild ride for sure! Love to all💗💗.

[McKim]

124. NO THE USA IS NOT A FRIENDLY PLACE FOR WOMEN

No the USA is not a friendly place for women. In graduate school because I was a part time graduate student, (because I insisted on caring for my baby at least part time). I was refused the opportunity to get the college teaching experience for my resume! In France they have sliding fee government health care, sliding fee scale high quality national government day care for working parents. In the US it is a scramble to get day care and it is expensive.

Also because of trickle down economics and its resulting poverty we have created a drug taking hopeless population of people in my city. It is no longer safe for me to walk around at night downtown alone. I am afraid to go to the bathroom in my local grocery store as it is up a slow elevator and down a lonely corridor. I have run into some very scary men there, even in the womens bathroom.Now I have to carry a whistle.

At 78 I am too old to immigrate to Spain or France but should have done so long ago. I stayed here to improve things and I have not been able to achieve that against the strong forces of dark money. No the USA is not a friendly place for women.

[Bettie]

125. No, our lives aren't valued

we were making some progress, but it's all moving backward now.

[YoshidaYui]

126. Yes and there has been on going attack on

Asian Americans and Pacific islander women as well.

[Jilly_in_VA]

127. I do not

We are second class citizens. We can't even get the ERA passed, FFS. And I cannot believe that at nearly 80 I am still having to protest the shit I am protesting!

[Permanut]

128. K & R..

times 10 thousand from this old white guy.

My gay sister fought for most of her 77 years for equal rights, with special focus on women, and I'm proud to say she was instrumental in moving Oregon an eighth of an inch closer to equality through her efforts.

We lost her two years ago after a valiant but losing fight against cancer. She taught me about all of the issues in this thread, plus the incredible bullshit that happens in churches, and I continue to advocate on her behalf and in her honor.

She was well versed in the hypocrisy and evil that was Phyllis Schafly, and she actually had a dart board with a picture of Anita Bryant in the middle.

[senseandsensibility]

130. Here's to your sister!

May she rest in peace.

[Native]

129. No

[Laura PourMeADrink]

131. So you're saying if it was a famous man whose female wife

Got attacked? Yes, would say it was different. But just how the physical aspect is viewed.

[Tree Lady]

133. No our lives are not

I personally think it's because there are a lot of men who while they say they are all for women and that includes a lot of democrat leaders also love power too much to give it up.

They give us just enough to say, we let you run for office, etc but there are still too many good ole boys determined to keep things the same.

Then there are women who believe honestly that a man is their leader in the house and marriage. Those beliefs put the rest of us backwards because they vote that way for male leaders.

Nothing wrong with many many great male leaders but we are definitely not equal to them.

Hard to be valued in a country where republican women are trying to have us barefoot and pregnant even if it means our death.

[electric_blue68]

135. Yes - In SOME Places, Among Some People. OTOH: NO In Too Many Places & w Too Many People!

My short answer version.