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Mon May 9, 2022, 09:15 PM

States hitting hybrid and electric car owners with new taxes

https://www.khou.com/amp/article/money/states-adding-taxes-to-hybrid-and-electric-cars/285-6224d1d5-6bd3-4422-a66b-0df9d53ba65a

“ 30 states are hitting hybrid and electric car owners with additional taxes to pay for highway maintenance, and a dozen more have proposals in their legislature.”

EXAS, USA — State governments everywhere are starting to tax owners of hybrid and electric cars because they claim their drivers don’t pay enough in gasoline taxes.

With gas prices so high, more and more drivers have been looking at buying a hybrid or electric cars.

But you might want to be aware of some fees that owners say are unfair.

……….

"As I read this, I found they are going to in essence double the registration fee on my 12-year-old Toyota hybrid," Gilbert said.

At least he's not driving a Tesla, whose owners are facing a $150 annual fee.

Thirty states are now hitting hybrid and electric owners with annual fees, according to the National Conference of State Legislatures.

Another dozen states are considering adding these fees to make up for the money they say they are losing from gasoline taxes.

Some states are adding more than just an extra fee at renewal time, but they're also adding a small tax to the electricity fee at public charging stations




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Arrow 33 replies Author Time Post
Reply States hitting hybrid and electric car owners with new taxes (Original post)
JohnSJ May 9 OP
WarGamer May 9 #1
underpants May 9 #2
Scrivener7 May 9 #4
DetroitLegalBeagle May 9 #7
LiberatedUSA May 9 #9
Scrivener7 May 9 #10
underpants May 9 #12
USALiberal May 9 #15
Scrivener7 May 10 #31
rockfordfile May 10 #25
Groundhawg May 9 #11
rockfordfile May 10 #26
Groundhawg May 14 #32
jimfields33 May 9 #3
dsp3000 May 9 #5
former9thward May 9 #6
dsp3000 May 9 #14
USALiberal May 9 #17
dsp3000 May 9 #19
TheBlackAdder May 10 #29
MichMan May 9 #8
NickB79 May 9 #13
dsp3000 May 9 #16
USALiberal May 9 #18
NickB79 May 9 #21
dsp3000 May 9 #23
moonshinegnomie May 9 #20
NickB79 May 9 #22
MissB May 9 #24
Emile May 10 #27
JustABozoOnThisBus May 10 #28
Buckeyeblue May 10 #30
Patton French May 14 #33

Response to JohnSJ (Original post)

Mon May 9, 2022, 09:18 PM

1. understandable... but still pretty rotten.

It's ALWAYS been my opinion...

Make the largest share of highway maintenance burden fall on COMMERCIAL entities that MAKE MONEY from the highway systems...

Why tax the dude trying to get to his $10/hr job??

Maybe tax every damn Amazon van and such things??

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Response to JohnSJ (Original post)

Mon May 9, 2022, 09:23 PM

2. Well money is needed for roads.

I drive an older hybrid and get 40-45 MPG regularly. I’ve had trips register up to 60 MPG.

This is the big fight right now innhe Virginia General Assembly. Tax cuts in general but also the Repub are proposing a 90 day gas tax holiday. The Dems are fighting it because, as far as I know, know that that blip in revenue could really hurt the roads. Virginia roads used to be great but George Allen’s administration was horrible (he fired engineers on an almost weekly basis) and our roads never really got back to where they were.

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Response to underpants (Reply #2)

Mon May 9, 2022, 09:25 PM

4. But this isn't about that. This is about making cars that use less or no

gas less attractive compared to cars that use gas.

The oil companies are behind this.

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Response to Scrivener7 (Reply #4)

Mon May 9, 2022, 09:36 PM

7. Hybrids and electric cars still cause wear and tear on the roads

Which is what the gas taxes are supposed to go towards fixing. Why should'nt they pay their fair share towards road maintenance costs?

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Response to DetroitLegalBeagle (Reply #7)

Mon May 9, 2022, 09:40 PM

9. Invalidating the reason for getting the hybrid.

Get a hybrid to pay less gas.

Get increased costs (fines) to make up for using less gas, thereby counteracting your savings.

Just get a cool gas guzzler next time since it all evens out in expenses in the end.

Lesson learned.

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Response to DetroitLegalBeagle (Reply #7)

Mon May 9, 2022, 09:45 PM

10. Sure. But that's not what this is about.

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Response to Scrivener7 (Reply #4)

Mon May 9, 2022, 09:55 PM

12. I can't imagine ever owning anything but at this point

I just hate buying gas and it’s not just because oil companies suck. I have a battery powered lawn mower because I don’t like having gas around the house let alone having to go get it.

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Response to Scrivener7 (Reply #4)

Mon May 9, 2022, 10:54 PM

15. It is absolutely about that. That's how roads are fixed!!! Nt

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Response to USALiberal (Reply #15)

Tue May 10, 2022, 07:55 AM

31. Sure. It's the sad roads and not the oil companies that are convincing politicians

to pass these measures.

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Response to Scrivener7 (Reply #4)

Tue May 10, 2022, 05:25 AM

25. I agree. Corrupt oil companies

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Response to underpants (Reply #2)

Mon May 9, 2022, 09:48 PM

11. ev are much heavier and harder on the roads.

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Response to Groundhawg (Reply #11)

Tue May 10, 2022, 05:32 AM

26. What's the % between fossil fuel and electric car owners?

18 wheelers are fossil fuel? they do the most damage. These 4x4 truck do a lot damage to the roads.

What's the % of car owners between electric and fossil fuel? I bet more are fossil fuel. So that would tell me the oil companies are behind the bs in discriminating against electric or hybrid car owners.

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Response to rockfordfile (Reply #26)

Sat May 14, 2022, 05:41 PM

32. You can't really compare a semi to a car, but tesla's heavy semi is going to

be more wear and tear on roads and tires as well.

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Response to JohnSJ (Original post)

Mon May 9, 2022, 09:24 PM

3. Gas tax is around 50 cents a gallon so somehow they need to figure

out a way to charge owners that amount.

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Response to JohnSJ (Original post)

Mon May 9, 2022, 09:26 PM

5. This seems counter productive and unfair

Penalizing people for choosing more environmentally friendly vehicle choices. As a current hybrid owner, maybe i'll get a V8 Lexus as my next car purchase after all to spite this BS.

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Response to dsp3000 (Reply #5)

Mon May 9, 2022, 09:33 PM

6. Are these flying cars?

If not they need to pay for the highways just like everyone else using them.

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Response to former9thward (Reply #6)

Mon May 9, 2022, 10:51 PM

14. This seems ham fisted to me. Literally punishing people for making an environmental choice.

I can see some kind of "alternative" tax for EV users but for hybrid owners, they still have to purchase fuel. what's the difference if they need to purchase 10 gallons of gas vs 20 gallons of gas? Why not just tax toyota corollas, chevy cruzes more because they get over 30MPG? It's dis incentivizing the "green" choice, and we need to be green more than ever. and if the tax is high enough to outweigh me driving an efficient vehicle then fuck it, i'm buying a V8 with 500 horsepower that gets less than 20 mpg and i'll get my "smiles" per gallon

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Response to dsp3000 (Reply #14)

Mon May 9, 2022, 10:56 PM

17. It's not punishing anyone anymore than gas tax does!!! Nt

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Response to USALiberal (Reply #17)

Mon May 9, 2022, 10:58 PM

19. it punishes people more for driving a hybrid. who still has to pay gas taxes!

What's the difference between a hybrid SUV that gets 25 MPG vs a non hybrid corolla that gets 35 MPG? what about a V8 Land Cruiser that gets 13 MPG? they all pay gas taxes!

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Response to dsp3000 (Reply #19)

Tue May 10, 2022, 06:39 AM

29. Typically, the vehicle that gets less MPG has a higher GVW and that affects road surfaces more.

.

For sports cars, they are often drive harder. Not many asphalt tearing launches in a Prius.

Now, Tesla launch, but they have a better way to record mileage, making it harder for
owners to bypass the odometer & transmission like on most other cars. Those vehicles
could have reports sent by the manufacturer to the state, or a Tax Form supplied to the
owners to file with their state tax returns, either quarterly or yearly based on vehicle use.


This is one such product that bypasses both the odometer and transmission data.



&t=818s


Vehicles that scam future owners, will still be on the hook for gas taxes.


We are now starting to reach a point where electric and hybrid vehicles will start outselling
gasoline vehicles. As MPG improves or is completely converted to eMPG the roadway taxes
start to disappear--something that most states use to charge road usage. The odometer is
unreliable in most vehicles.


I see the anticipated, "I'll buy a V8" posts. Well, then they'll pay more in gas taxes.

Now, a hybrid should have a lesser fee as they are not 100% electric.

.

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Response to JohnSJ (Original post)

Mon May 9, 2022, 09:36 PM

8. Seems reasonable.

Why should they use the same roads as everyone else and freeload by not paying anything towards maintenance and repair?

Also, isn't some gas tax revenue directed towards public transportation?

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Response to JohnSJ (Original post)

Mon May 9, 2022, 10:17 PM

13. Someone has to pay for road repairs

And gas taxes have historically been a key part of that. Not all of it, but a significant part.

Has anyone proposed a serious replacement for gas taxes when the day comes that hybrids and EV's are the predominant vehicles on the road? Because we will need to figure it out sooner or later.

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Response to NickB79 (Reply #13)

Mon May 9, 2022, 10:55 PM

16. what about SEMIS? COMMERCIAL TRUCKS?

these companies make money driving on these roads, AND they do the most damage due to their weight. why punish the average environmentally conscious consumer??

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Response to dsp3000 (Reply #16)

Mon May 9, 2022, 10:57 PM

18. And the trucks pay for their share of road repair more than anybody. Lots of gas used! Nt

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Response to dsp3000 (Reply #16)

Mon May 9, 2022, 11:06 PM

21. Because they'll all be EV's and hybrids in a decade as well

Same problem. All the taxes from the diesel they burn will disappear.

What do we do when we reach our goal of eliminating ICE vehicles?

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Response to NickB79 (Reply #21)

Mon May 9, 2022, 11:34 PM

23. I guess my gut feeling is we're not there yet. This will push people to not purchase hybrids

how about we all agree to just tax churches to make up the difference and thensome??

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Response to JohnSJ (Original post)

Mon May 9, 2022, 11:02 PM

20. a little math

the average car is driven 15k miles per year
the average car gets 25mpg. that means 600 gallons of gas per year.
gas taxes range from roughly 20 cents to 60 cents per gallon. lets take 35c as an average tax. that means the average car owner pays 210/yr in gas taxes.

now lets compare that to an electric or hybrid getting for example 50mpg. that car will use 300 gallons/year and pay 105/yr in taxes.

also a 150/yr tax only comes to 1c/gallon


considering gas taxes are used for road maintenance and a hybrid or electric will cause as much wear and tear on the road as a gas vehicle i dont think a 150/yr fee is really unreasonable

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Response to JohnSJ (Original post)

Mon May 9, 2022, 11:25 PM

22. We could do a mileage tax instead

But we'd all have to consent to odometer inspections or GPS units for accurate tracking 😬

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Response to JohnSJ (Original post)

Mon May 9, 2022, 11:49 PM

24. EV owners do pay to fuel their cars

I get that the cost to fuel the EVs does not pay for road repairs.

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Response to JohnSJ (Original post)

Tue May 10, 2022, 05:36 AM

27. Time to make solar powered flying cars.

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Response to Emile (Reply #27)

Tue May 10, 2022, 06:08 AM

28. That's what I want: a Chevy Icarus.

Fly safely.

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Response to JohnSJ (Original post)

Tue May 10, 2022, 06:50 AM

30. Around here it's the farmers who damage the roads the most

They pay next to no taxes. I'm fine with figuring out a way that everyone with a car pays their fair share for roads. But maybe instead of a tax on gasoline, it should be a flat fee on auto registrations.

It's interesting, on I-80, you not only pay for a toll, presumably to maintain the roads, but you also pay tax on the gas you buy at the service stations along the way.

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Response to JohnSJ (Original post)

Sat May 14, 2022, 07:40 PM

33. It's complete BS

Sure, we’re using the roads, but we’re also trying to be more environmentally conscientious. That should be rewarded, not penalized.

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