Seems to me the Romneys believe Mormonism is a government, not a religion.

[nolabear]

There's an interesting equivalence in their proclaimations about service. Virtually all of Romney's stories about helping people, as an individual and through charity donations, involve fellow Mormons. Ann somehow seems to believe that both Mitt's and the sons' "service" as Mormon missionaries is equal to serving on the battlefield. Now even Newt's spouting the line that Mitt's Mormon mission counts as foreign service.

What about the rest of us? Where is there the slightest sign that we outside of the religious bubble they live in matter to them in the least? Although this is conjecture, even the things that Mitt did in Massachusetts, in light of his flip-flops, seem just like stepping stones that can easily be shifted as he focuses on his run for the White House.

Am I the only one who is shocked that people accept this as social and foreign policies?

[Angry Dragon]

1. It is a cult

[nolabear]

2. But that's not my point. I'm astonished how the equivalence isn't questioned. Even brought up.

[Angry Dragon]

6. The media is afraid to mention it\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\

the new kitten typed the last part

[L0oniX]

17. Google - Romney mental problems ...About 50,400,000 results (0.21 seconds)

[ProudProgressiveNow]

34. Noticed that yesterday. Where are his medical records.

His family has been trying to warn us for weeks...

[davidpdx]

38. + 10,000,000

[riverbendviewgal]

3. it is a cult.

The Romney's are cowards.

[Andy823]

4. Well...

Mormons, like some other religions, believe they are the "ONLY TRUE RELIGION" and that their mission in life is to convert as many people as they can so those people can be saved. They have no real loyalty to the governments of this world, they are only loyal to their religious leaders. For them the "battlefield" is the entire earth and the "service" they do is their version of "warfare". It's their job to convert everyone they can in order to win the "WAR" they believe they are fighting.

What shocks me is that most evangelicals have preached for years that Mormons, Jehovah's Witnesses, and other groups like them are CULTS and are NOT in anyway real Christians. Now all of a sudden because the right wing goons from fox news, Rush Limbaugh, and most of all Glen Beck who is a Mormons himself, tell them they "have" to vote for this "CULT" member instead of the socialist black man, they are turning against everything they have been taught in their religions in order to get the president Obama out of office!

The ironic thing about this is back in 2008 these same people would trashed Romney for his religious beliefs, and swore they would never vote for him! They couldn't because he was a "CULT MEMBER"! I guess for these so called "CHRISTIANS" hate has taken over as their motivator!

[TxBluebonnetDem]

10. I've been taken aback by the same issue you bring up....

I live in a small very red county in Texas. I've been really surprised by how many of the faithful have chosen to vote for Romney, especially when during the primaries they were dead set against anyone of what they call a cult faith becoming the GOP nominee. But on the other hand, there are a number of people who will not vote at all because they can't bring themselves to vote for Obama and they won't abandon their values to vote for Romney. I'm hoping the latter becomes the reality in the long run and more of them decide to stay home. Though I'll be the first to admit that's not likely to happen.

[yardwork]

12. A lot of Christian Protestants feel the same way. You've just described Evangelism.

"...mission in life is to convert as many people as they can so those people can be saved." I know a lot of Protestants who believe exactly that, and they believe that the U.S. government should be helping with that goal.

I see your point that these groups are now seemingly in conflict with one another, but when it comes down to it I'm not sure how deeply held any of these beliefs really are compared to their worship of M O N E Y.

[Politicalboi]

5. They're ALL cults

[WinkyDink]

24. No, in point of fact, "they" are not. Or are you Humpty-Dumpty,

defining words as you want?

[agent46]

7. There are many cults

Last edited Sun Oct 21, 2012, 06:26 PM - Edit history (1)

who derive their imaginary authority from ruling "hierarchies" they are hypnotized to believe go all the way to the top - beyond planetary, galactic and universal rule. These are people who are so removed from reality they believe they are empowered by the controllers of the universe. Not the kind of fevered delusional swallop I'd want anywhere near the oval office. Too bad Americans in particular seem vulnerable to this kind of legitimized religious psychosis.

[nolabear]

8. So do all "cults" believe they are governments? Sorry if I'm being obvious but it's hit home.

[byeya]

14. I lived in rural SW Utah for 2 years and Morms are the government and feel

that they deserve to be the government.

...a mind controlling cult

[aletier_v]

18. ditto in sw idaho.

the mormons are well organized and intent on taking over control of the state and local govt.

[AzDar]

9. K & R

[corneliamcgillicutty]

11. I WOULD STRONGLY RECOMMEND A BOOK

entitled "UNDER THE BANNER OF HEAVEN" by critically acclaimed investigative journalist Jon Krakauer. I am about half way through and find it to be very revealing and frightening. In my opinion, the book lends strong credence to your premise. Scary!!!!

[nolabear]

35. I've been reading it as well. It's shocking.

Blood atonement is one of the most horrifying things I've ever seen. The current LDS would say that's all history.

[tanyev]

13. That may be the goal.

[L0oniX]

15. It is a toxic mentally poisonous cult ...and probably to blame for Rmoney's mental problems.

[siligut]

16. Mormons seem to have the idea that they are huge in the grand scheme of things

Their presence in US politics outweighs their 1-2% in the general population.

http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2012/05/12/hfr-with-or-without-romney-d-c-a-surprising-mormon-stronghold/
---Snip---
“In a Republican administration, there will be even more Mormons here,” whispers the bishop, Lewis Larsen, pointing out prominent Washingtonians around the chapel. “Every Republican administration just loads up with them.”
---Snip---
When Larsen arrived in Washington in the early ’80s, there were a just handful of Mormon meetinghouses in northern Virginia, where he lives. Today, there are more than 25, each housing three separate congregations, or wards, as they’re known in the LDS Church.
---Snip---
Congress now counts 15 Mormon members, including Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, according to the Pew Forum on Religion and Public Life. That means the 2% of the country that’s Mormon is slightly overrepresented on Capitol Hill.

You know about the masonic rites practiced in Mormon temples? You know about our Masonic history? Maybe this is what you are seeing from the Romney's.

[WinkyDink]

25. Triple-"yes" to your last points. Secretive, treasonous, and 100% indifferent to non-Mormons. 100%.

[Eddie Haskell]

19. The Mormons moved to Utah when it was part of Mexico.

Their purpose was to set up a separate government ... a fascist theocracy. The US took Texas (which included part of Utah) in the Mexican-American War.

[FreeState]

26. Yes and No

Utah was part of Mexico for about 6 months after Brigham Young's followers arrived. The Church sent soldiers to the war to make it part of the US (they arrived after the war had ended and never served, they were on their way there when it ended.)

Brigham Young originally set out for Vancouver BC Canada - not Utah or Mexico. Their purpose was not to set up a separate government - their purpose was to settle in an area where they would be left alone (the Church had been pushed out of NY, then Ohio, then Missouri and then Illinois.)

Fascist Theocracy was never part of their plan, nor has it ever been. If one does not understand the basic doctrines of the Church it would be easy to say that, however one of the very basic tenants of the faith is freedom to choose your beliefs. "United Order" or the government that is mentioned in the older texts is socialism at its core. Fascism is based on Nationalism not religious identity.

[Eddie Haskell]

37. You forgot the freedom to commit statutory rape.

Fascism is a state of mind.

[0rganism]

20. RWers don't believe there should be a distinction

to the rabid rightwinger, government exists primarily to promote and uphold the tenets of their One True Faith, especially as expressed by way of international crusades and various symbolic rituals. The One True Faith will provide vetted candidates for governing positions, and voting will occur in venues approved by the Faith, and with voting mechanisms developed by devout adherents to said Faith.

For its part, the One True Faith will establish a very limited set of social support structures intended to replace any and all "safety nets" heretofore provided by federal, state, and local governments. Receipt of benefits will be contingent upon acceptance of instruction from the One True Faith.

The only thing that's allowed secular government to persist so far is a lack of complete agreement by the rightwing on which religion most precisely embodies the One True Faith they'll enforce upon everyone else.

[siligut]

27. Receipt of benefits will be contingent upon acceptance of instruction from the One True Faith.

This is the Mormon way, and those of us who have lived in Utah, we would rather people wake the fuck up. It isn't just benefits, it is only the faithful who deserve to exist.

[DollarBillHines]

21. The Mormon goal is to govern.

Jos Smith's immaculate fantasy was that there would, some day, be a Mormon in the White House.

[Raster]

22. Yes, and in true over-inflated and self-aggrandizing style, Smith predicted that said Mormon...

...would ride in on the proverbial white horse and save the nation.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Horse_Prophecy

The White Horse Prophecy is a statement purported to have been made in 1843 by Joseph Smith, Jr., founder of the Latter Day Saint movement, regarding the future of the Latter Day Saints (Mormons) and the United States of America. The Latter Day Saints, according to the prophecy, would "go to the Rocky Mountains and ... be a great and mighty people", identified figuratively with the White Horse described in the Revelation of John. The prophecy further predicts that the United States Constitution will one day "hang like a thread" and will be saved "by the efforts of the White Horse".

Some have speculated, on the basis of the White Horse Prophecy, that Mormons expect the United States to eventually become a theocracy dominated by The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS Church). The authenticity of the prophecy as a whole, which was not made public until long after Smith's death, is debated, and the leadership of the LDS Church has stated that "the so-called 'White Horse Prophecy' ... is not embraced as Church doctrine."However, the belief that members of the LDS Church will one day need to take action to save the imperiled US Constitution has been attributed to Smith in several sources and has been discussed in an approving fashion by Brigham Young and other LDS leaders.

Several famous Mormons have made statements related to the White Horse Prophecy. For instance, US presidential candidate Mitt Romney has said he considers the White Horse Prophecy to be a matter of "speculation and discussion by [LDS] church members" and "not official [LDS] church doctrine."

<snip, much more>

The Rmonies slept all snug in their beds,
while visions of White Horses danced in their heads.

[DollarBillHines]

29. Thanks, I had forgotten about the White Horse Prophecy.

Damn, those people are crazy.

[rbrnmw]

30. That scares the shit out of me

Maybe other religions are crazy but it looks like the LDS has cornered the market on crazy I lived next door to a
Mormon couple and they were very weird almost the same detachment you see from the Romney's

[WinkyDink]

23. The word you're searching for is THEOCRACY. It's not just for hummus anymore.

[madrchsod]

28. that is the reason they were chased across america in the early 1800`s.

when they settled in nauvoo illinois they decided they did`t have to follow state laws. what really pissed off many people in illinois was they accepted many bandits and murderers into their town and gave them refuge from the local and state authorities. the baptists hated the mormon because of their religious beliefs which to more than a few shootings and death.

the mormons think only the man on the white horse can save american democracy.....

[kurt_cagle]

31. Understanding Romney's view of Mormonism

I've worked with Mormons before at a fairly high level, and I'm beginning to develop a theory that Mitt's ultimate goal is not to be head of the United States, but rather to be head of the Mormon Church.

The Mormon hierarchy is built around the idea of Bishops, Stake Presidents, the Quorum of the Twelve, and the First Presidency. A stake is a region that's usually larger than a county (it may encompass several) but typically smaller than a state. Bishops are in effect roughly analogous to Catholic Priests - they minister to a fairly large congregation. A Stake president is then analogous to a Catholic Bishop. The Quorum of the Twelve is in effect the Archbishops - each Quorum member has typically served as a Stake president, and usually has fairly broad ecclesiastical authority. The first presidency then consists of the First President and his two advisors.

I believe in Romney's mind, what he's hoping to eventually achieve is to become First President. Serving as Gov. of Massachusetts was not enough to make the leap to the quorum (with vacancies that are filled only by retirement or death) but that by become POTUS, it strengthens his case to become a Quorum member, and from there (if the timing is right) to become First President. In that respect, POTUS is a test for Romney - he knows that if he fails, he will not make it to the Quorum. POTUS is simply a stepping stone.

It also puts a lot Romney's giving in perspective. As a Bishop, his role is to act as a spiritual advisor to members in his stake. It's in effect his true vocation - Bain existed primarily as a means to get rich quick. Yet that role also colors his view with respect to others, because the only people in hard straits that he interacts with are Mormons, and his primary role with them is to help them move back to the path of Mormonism in times of crisis. This gives him a very skewed perspective of people in hardship, and it makes it easier for him to dismiss non-Mormons (and most especially non-rich non-Mormons) as "alien". They are not Mormon, so until they accept Mormonism they are not part of the tribe.

If that theory is right, it only strengthens my resolve to vote for Obama. To me POTUS is not a part time job, and by placing his faith above his secular duty, Romney could be very, very dangerous.

[aletier_v]

33. Very interesting theory

It squares with my personal experience with Mormons. Romney's advance would be unstoppable if he were to fulfill the White Horse Prophecy.

[marshall]

32. Harvard Considers Mormons an authentic group

As such, they are in some sense a close system, with their own social rules and identity different from the majority.

[nolabear]

36. It's so hard to feel as if I'm limiting religious freedom but I won't be a pawn.

I respect religious freedom as one of the pillars on which the country was built though I'm an atheist myself. Sort of a spiritual atheist. But I feel like we're being played in a dangerous way, as if we're the means to an end. Else why the shocking changes with every breeze?