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Tue Sep 14, 2021, 11:45 PM

Something to consider about prosecuting Trump

Last edited Wed Sep 15, 2021, 09:11 AM - Edit history (2)

Many people here and elsewhere are expressing frustration that DOJ hasn't yet charged Trump with any crimes. Some of these folk insist that there is already more than enough evidence just based on the public record that Trump is guilty of some crimes and the lack of indictments by DOJ for those crimes at this point is proof of negligence, malfeasance and worse on DOJ's part.

Setting aside the fact that what may be sufficient to convince dedicated rank-and-file Democrats of Trump's guilt is very different than what prosecutors will have to prove in a court of law to convince 12 jurors of his guilt beyond a reasonable doubt, there is also another very important fact to consider:

In high profile, high stakes, complex cases like this one, prosecutors almost always prefer to pull all of the charges together into one indictment, rather indicting in dribs and drabs, bringing a charge now, and then later adding another charge, and later adding more charges. And while prosecutors may already have enough evidence to support an indictment for some charges that are easier to prove, they are likely to hold off on indicting on those charges until they have wrapped up their investigations of other acts and included those charges in the comprehensive indictment.

In short, prosecutors aren't likely to bring any indictment while the investigations of other crimes are ongoing.

Along those lines, it's also very likely that the more serious charges are dependent upon the lesser charges - the wrongdoing is meshed together and built upon and must be presented together as a big picture made up of a continuous pattern of related activity. This is probably very much like - or is - a RICO case that doesn't simply focus on individual acts of wrongdoing but proves a larger series of interactive, interlocking crimes resulting in a major criminal undertaking.

And when building this kind of case, prosecutors do not publicly discuss their progress - or even disclose whether an investigation is underway. Public disclosure at this stage can land a death blow to a successful investigation and prosecution.

So, while some folks are impatient and feeling as if the lack of indictments at this point is a sign that DOJ is not actively pursuing Trump and/or no indictments will be forthcoming, it is important to understand how these kinds of investigations tend to develop. In this instance, DOJ's silence is NOT any indication of inaction and, in fact, suggests the opposite.

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Arrow 12 replies Author Time Post
Reply Something to consider about prosecuting Trump (Original post)
StarfishSaver Sep 14 OP
PortTack Sep 14 #1
CaliforniaPeggy Sep 15 #2
secondwind Sep 15 #3
ShazzieB Sep 15 #4
brer cat Sep 15 #5
PoindexterOglethorpe Sep 15 #6
StarfishSaver Sep 15 #7
PoindexterOglethorpe Sep 15 #9
StarfishSaver Sep 15 #12
lamp_shade Sep 15 #8
StarfishSaver Sep 15 #10
Elessar Zappa Sep 15 #11

Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Tue Sep 14, 2021, 11:59 PM

1. Thank you! Always good analysis

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Wed Sep 15, 2021, 12:01 AM

2. You have made a very good case for what is undoubtedly happening.

But we're an impatient lot and we want justice, NOW.

I am happy to follow your reasoning. It all makes sense.

Thank you!

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Wed Sep 15, 2021, 12:03 AM

3. Well said, Starfish, that was spot on.


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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Wed Sep 15, 2021, 12:22 AM

4. Thanks for this!

You have really laid it out clearly. Hope you don't mind if I link to this post when the kind of comments you're talking about come up again, as we know they will. *sigh*

That stuff drives me nuts, especially when the Garland bashing. He hardly had time to move into his office st the DOJ before people started in on him.

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Wed Sep 15, 2021, 12:22 AM

5. K&R

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Wed Sep 15, 2021, 01:08 AM

6. I realize your reasoned analysis is good, but how many times have we been

bamboozled by the possibility of politicians being held accountable for their crimes?

Complexity be damned. Bring charges. Make sure they actually pay for what they've done. Otherwise, it's hopeless. We are all helpless and the powerful get to do exactly whatever they like and ride roughshod over all the rest of us.

It goes back to Richard Nixon. That SOB should have died in jail. Instead, he was allowed to resign and eventually become a respected elder statesman, which should never have happened. At the risk of repeating myself, he should have died in jail.

Ronald Reagan and all of his many cronies. None of them really was punished. Why? Meanwhile, some poor bastard who is stopped for a minor traffic crime winds up dead.

If there ever are indictments, I'll owe you an apology. But I am not about to hold my breath. If there ever are indictments, then I might be the Queen of England.

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Response to PoindexterOglethorpe (Reply #6)

Wed Sep 15, 2021, 01:18 AM

7. "Complexity be damned. Bring charges"

Fortunately, the people responsible not only for bringing charges, but also avoiding dismissals and securing convictions - you know, "make sure they actually pay for what they've done" as you demand they do - don't approach the law the way you want them to.

And if there are indictments, you don't have to apologize to me. But I would appreciate it if, using your Queenly powers and prerogatives, you would make me a Dame of the Most Excellent Order of the British Empire ...

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Response to StarfishSaver (Reply #7)

Wed Sep 15, 2021, 02:36 AM

9. LOL! How I wish I could make you

a Dame of the Most Excellent Order of the British Empire. Alas, I'm an ordinary person and have no such powers.

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Response to PoindexterOglethorpe (Reply #9)

Wed Sep 15, 2021, 11:45 AM

12. But you will have the power when Trump is indicted and you become the Queen of England

I'm betting on the former, so the latter should also happen as you promise.

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Wed Sep 15, 2021, 02:33 AM

8. kick for visibility

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Wed Sep 15, 2021, 08:09 AM

10. Morning kick

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Wed Sep 15, 2021, 08:16 AM

11. Good post.

People need to have patience. If a former President is to be charged with a crime, you can bet that the DOJ will dot all theis and cross all the ts before bringing an indictment.

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