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Wed Sep 1, 2021, 10:02 PM

So how does this work? Who determines the difference between 5 and 6 weeks?

If youíre seeking an abortion do they have monitors standing by to listen for a heartbeat? Do you have to go to a vetted ob/gyn whoíll swear how far along you are? (Mine was a month off with my first, unless you believe he really was six weeks late and perfectly healthy) Once that six weeks decision is made is the info sent to every abortion provider in the state so you canít try elsewhere? Can people put tails on you and follow you around to be sure you donít violate their law?

Is there any possible way this isnít some handmaid shit?

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Arrow 28 replies Author Time Post
Reply So how does this work? Who determines the difference between 5 and 6 weeks? (Original post)
nolabear Sep 1 OP
Scrivener7 Sep 1 #1
Walleye Sep 1 #2
KentuckyWoman Sep 1 #16
Hugh_Lebowski Sep 1 #3
d_r Sep 1 #8
Hugh_Lebowski Sep 1 #10
Hoyt Sep 1 #9
3catwoman3 Sep 1 #4
orleans Sep 1 #17
Walleye Sep 1 #18
underpants Sep 1 #5
Mr.Bill Sep 1 #6
Crunchy Frog Sep 1 #7
Hugh_Lebowski Sep 1 #11
Crunchy Frog Sep 1 #14
milestogo Sep 2 #27
Crunchy Frog Sep 2 #28
LiberalFighter Sep 1 #12
JenniferJuniper Sep 1 #13
stillcool Sep 1 #15
nolabear Sep 2 #19
Ilsa Sep 2 #20
sl8 Sep 2 #21
nolabear Sep 2 #22
muriel_volestrangler Sep 2 #23
CrackityJones75 Sep 2 #24
nolabear Sep 2 #26
peggysue2 Sep 2 #25

Response to nolabear (Original post)

Wed Sep 1, 2021, 10:04 PM

1. The Witchfinder General decides.

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Response to nolabear (Original post)

Wed Sep 1, 2021, 10:06 PM

2. Personally I think they are planning on selective enforcement against the people they don't like

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Response to Walleye (Reply #2)

Wed Sep 1, 2021, 11:10 PM

16. That is a given with every GOP and every law.

The law only applies to the others

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Response to nolabear (Original post)

Wed Sep 1, 2021, 10:06 PM

3. My understanding is it's 'heartbeat detection' ...

Six weeks is the earliest that ever happens, which is why people are talking about that number.

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Response to Hugh_Lebowski (Reply #3)

Wed Sep 1, 2021, 10:12 PM

8. Yes but

Who detects the heart beat?

A person has an abortion.
A person files a report.
Who detected the heart beat?

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Response to d_r (Reply #8)

Wed Sep 1, 2021, 10:13 PM

10. The question of who would be providing this information in such a case is indeed interesting (nt)

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Response to Hugh_Lebowski (Reply #3)

Wed Sep 1, 2021, 10:13 PM

9. Thanks. My understanding too. I can see a case against a doc

who said they didnít hear a heartbeat at 9 weeks. This law is junk.

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Response to nolabear (Original post)

Wed Sep 1, 2021, 10:07 PM

4. Just wait - women will probably have to sign at the pharmacy for tampons...

Öand pads, like you have to for Sudafed, so patterns of use can be monitored. Stray from your usual purchasing pattern and here come the period police.


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Response to 3catwoman3 (Reply #4)

Wed Sep 1, 2021, 11:24 PM

17. perhaps they should start a PFA group like periods for pence!

and, thinking about it--i'm sure mike pence would LOVE to be included on all the period information women can give him--even it it is for the state of texas. you know, it would be a nice reminder of how wonderful his life was when he was dicktating on women's bodies.

"Periods for Pence
The residents of Indiana responded in a campaign that became known as "Periods for Pence".[4] A Facebook page was created anonymously on March 28 urging women from all over the state to send in emails, tweets, and phone calls to the governor's office reporting the progression of their menstrual flow, cramps, birth control, tampon discomfort, bloating, and even menopausal advancements.

The organizer of the Facebook page emphasized a specific aspect of the law, forcing miscarried fetuses and aborted fetuses to be "interred or cremated by a facility having possession of the remains," regardless of the age of the fetus. In response to this, the organizer posted:

Fertilized eggs can be expelled during a woman's period without a woman even knowing that she might have had the potential blastocyst in her. Therefore, any period could potentially be a miscarriage without knowledge. I would certainly hate for any of my fellow Hoosier women to be at risk of penalty if they do not 'properly dispose' of this or report it. Just to cover our bases, perhaps we should make sure to contact Governor Pence's office to report our periods. We wouldn't want him thinking that THOUSANDS OF HOOSIER WOMEN A DAY are trying to hide anything, would we?[5]

Following this first post on Facebook, thousands of women commented about the progression of their menstrual cycles. The page publicly shared the phone number of Governor Pence's office for the usage of any fans of the page. As of November 2016, the page had more than 70,000 likes.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Periods_for_Politicians

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Response to 3catwoman3 (Reply #4)

Wed Sep 1, 2021, 11:39 PM

18. Communist China did that when they had the one child rule. Neighbors reporting on menstrual cycles

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Response to nolabear (Original post)

Wed Sep 1, 2021, 10:08 PM

5. Good question.

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Response to nolabear (Original post)

Wed Sep 1, 2021, 10:08 PM

6. That's why the $10,000 bounty.

They're trying to to turn the whole state into the abortion police. Should be a real clusterfuck that won't work at all.

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Response to nolabear (Original post)

Wed Sep 1, 2021, 10:10 PM

7. It's six weeks since the 1st day of your last menstrual period.

Around four weeks after actual conception.

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Response to Crunchy Frog (Reply #7)

Wed Sep 1, 2021, 10:16 PM

11. My understanding is that it's heartbeat detection, which can be as few as 6 weeks after conception

Which is why people are using the term '6 weeks' all over the internet.

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Response to Hugh_Lebowski (Reply #11)

Wed Sep 1, 2021, 10:38 PM

14. It happens between 6 and 7 weeks.

Usually no later than 2-3 days after the 6 week mark. If it doesn't happen then, then there generally isn't a viable pregnancy.

Of course, with this dating method you can be a few days off on your estimate of when conception occured. It's still the rule of thumb that they use, though.

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Response to Crunchy Frog (Reply #7)

Thu Sep 2, 2021, 01:12 PM

27. And who is going to know what day that was except the patient herself?

If she even remembers.

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Response to milestogo (Reply #27)

Thu Sep 2, 2021, 01:17 PM

28. They also do an ultrasound in Texas prior to an abortion.

If there's a heartbeat, they'll be able to see it.

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Response to nolabear (Original post)

Wed Sep 1, 2021, 10:17 PM

12. Use the law against the instigators.

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Response to nolabear (Original post)

Wed Sep 1, 2021, 10:36 PM

13. The government makes that call.

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Response to nolabear (Original post)

Wed Sep 1, 2021, 10:52 PM

15. I've read several articles that say "about" 6 weeks

The Texas law, passed in May, bans all abortions in the state after about six weeks of pregnancy ó well before many women even know they are pregnant. The policy conflicts with the Supreme Court's precedents, which prohibit states from banning abortion before fetal viability, usually between 22 and 24 weeks of pregnancy.
https://www.npr.org/2021/09/01/1033171800/texas-abortion-ban-supreme-court-

this was helpful..
1. What does the law allow and not allow on abortions?
The law, Senate Bill 8, bans abortion once the rhythmic contracting of fetal cardiac tissue can be detected. That's usually around six weeks, before some women may even know they're pregnant. Most of the abortions performed nationwide are after six weeks of pregnancy.

There is an exception in the Texas law for abortions in cases of medical emergencies. The law does not make exceptions for pregnancies resulting from incest or rape.

A fetal heartbeat is typically first detected five to six weeks after gestation.
https://www.goodmorningamerica.com/wellness/story/questions-answered-texas-law-banning-abortion-weeks-79767379

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Response to stillcool (Reply #15)

Thu Sep 2, 2021, 12:38 AM

19. But by whom? An abortion provider? "Why no, no heartbeat." A monitor?

You get the idea. How will real people deal with this?

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Response to nolabear (Original post)

Thu Sep 2, 2021, 07:08 AM

20. Multiple visits requiring ultrasound.

There was a story yesterday where a woman seeking abortion had her first clinic visit and no "heartbeat" was detected. She returned for the procedure the next day, but before the abortion is another required ultrasound. Only a day later a "heartbeat " was detected and the procedure had to be canceled. She left crying, uncertain what she would do next.

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Response to nolabear (Original post)

Thu Sep 2, 2021, 07:31 AM

21. "DETERMINATION OF PRESENCE OF FETAL HEARTBEAT"

https://legiscan.com/TX/text/SB8/id/2395961

[...]

Sec. 171.203. DETERMINATION OF PRESENCE OF FETAL HEARTBEAT
REQUIRED; RECORD. (a) For the purposes of determining the
presence of a fetal heartbeat under this section, "standard medical
practice" includes employing the appropriate means of detecting the
heartbeat based on the estimated gestational age of the unborn
child and the condition of the woman and her pregnancy.
(b) Except as provided by Section 171.205, a physician may
not knowingly perform or induce an abortion on a pregnant woman
unless the physician has determined, in accordance with this
section, whether the woman's unborn child has a detectable fetal
heartbeat.
(c) In making a determination under Subsection (b), the
physician must use a test that is:
(1) consistent with the physician's good faith and
reasonable understanding of standard medical practice; and
(2) appropriate for the estimated gestational age of
the unborn child and the condition of the pregnant woman and her
pregnancy.
(d) A physician making a determination under Subsection (b)
shall record in the pregnant woman's medical record:
(1) the estimated gestational age of the unborn child;
(2) the method used to estimate the gestational age;
and
(3) the test used for detecting a fetal heartbeat,
including the date, time, and results of the test.
Sec. 171.204. PROHIBITED ABORTION OF UNBORN CHILD WITH
DETECTABLE FETAL HEARTBEAT; EFFECT. (a) Except as provided by
Section 171.205, a physician may not knowingly perform or induce an
abortion on a pregnant woman if the physician detected a fetal
heartbeat for the unborn child as required by Section 171.203 or
failed to perform a test to detect a fetal heartbeat.
(b) A physician does not violate this section if the
physician performed a test for a fetal heartbeat as required by
Section 171.203 and did not detect a fetal heartbeat.
(c) This section does not affect:
(1) the provisions of this chapter that restrict or
regulate an abortion by a particular method or during a particular
stage of pregnancy; or
(2) any other provision of state law that regulates or
prohibits abortion.

[...]

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Response to sl8 (Reply #21)

Thu Sep 2, 2021, 07:44 AM

22. That wasn't the question. What prevents cheating that?

How do the new overlords determine an abortion isnít being performed outside the (insane) window of opportunity? At eight weeks? Are they going to put monitors in every office?

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Response to nolabear (Original post)

Thu Sep 2, 2021, 08:27 AM

23. Since the defendants can't recoup their lawyers' costs, it hardly matters

The idea is to make it so potentially expensive to even think about providing an abortion that no-one will try, until the law is finally struck down. Some rich motherfucker will bankroll the litigation fees for anti-choice charities or individuals who bring any court cases, and may well use cheap, careless lawyers, because the idea is to make the organisations pay any way they can, rather than to win lots of cases.

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Response to nolabear (Original post)

Thu Sep 2, 2021, 09:01 AM

24. I wonder

I wonder how many women will simply make the decision that they do not want to have children at a much earlier age and opt for a more permanent solution. This of course wouldnít be an option for people that cannot afford it but I do think if I was a woman I might consider it. On top of everything else that is completely fucked up in this country and world and the moral dilemma of bringing a child into this world, why would I risk getting pregnant with a bounty on my head if I werenít ready to have a child at that point in time? I might think about just opting out of having children entirely. I know that (for now) there is birth control, but that isnít fool proof by any means and as a woman with a potential bounty on their head I donít know that I would trust it.

Then there is the possibility of IVF pregnancy and Tubal reversal surgery as well should the woman decide they then want to have a child. I didnít even know that tubal reversal surgery was possible. Perhaps that is where resources will go. Still another i sane amount of responsibility put on women, but allowing them to decide when and if they get pregnant. If Roe is dead, I suspect that there will be an entirely new way women fight the subjugation of their gender.

I donít know maybe I am way off base and this is all stupid thinking but I am tired of women having to put up with this bullshit.

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Response to CrackityJones75 (Reply #24)

Thu Sep 2, 2021, 01:08 PM

26. No, I think you're reflecting what many are thinking.

If I was young Iíd be scouting out every possible way out. If this thing holds, thereís going to be an underground like you wouldnít believe, and sadly far more who will just cower and let it happen.

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Response to nolabear (Original post)

Thu Sep 2, 2021, 10:55 AM

25. I'm sure there will be a 'laying on of hands'

By the most faithful, of course. Because we wouldn't want a bunch of ignoramuses to make the determination.

It will follow the same course of neighborly spies suspecting a woman is pregnant and then noticing that she's not. Call the Birther Patrol immediately, find out who the woman's doctor and friends are, make them all pay a heavy cost.

Because only the faithful are protecting the babies, the future.

Welcome to Gilead!

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