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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsJudge Questioned If Capitol Rioters Are Getting Off Too Easy For "Terrorizing Members Of Congress"
Link to tweet
https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/zoetillman/capitol-riot-jan-6-defendants-plea-deals-too-lenient
WASHINGTON A federal judge on Thursday pushed back on the governments decision to ink deals in the Capitol riot cases that involve low-level misdemeanors, questioning whether that was appropriate for people involved in terrorizing members of Congress.
The unusual exchange came during a plea hearing for Jack Jesse Griffith, who was charged solely with misdemeanor crimes for going into the Capitol on Jan. 6; he wasnt accused of violence or property destruction. As Griffith prepared to plead guilty to one count of parading, demonstrating, or picketing in a Capitol building a class B misdemeanor with a maximum sentence of six months in jail US District Chief Judge Beryl Howell asked the prosecutor to explain why Griffiths deal involved a class of crime typically reserved for people who did things like trespass in a national park at night.
I'm just curious does the government have any concern given the factual predicate at issue here, of the defendant joining a mob, breaking into the Capitol building through a broken door, wandering through the Capitol building and stopping a constitutionally mandated duty of the Congress and terrorizing members of Congress, the vice president, who had to be evacuated? Howell asked. Does the government, in agreeing to the petty offense in this case, have any concern about deterrence?
It was the second time this week that a judge questioned whether defendants charged in connection with Jan. 6 are getting off too lightly in plea deals, even if theyre not accused of more serious criminal activity, such as attacking police. On Tuesday, US District Judge Reggie Walton, one of Howells colleagues on the federal bench in Washington, DC, briefly pondered whether he should jail two defendants who signed a deal similar to Griffiths, given their involvement in the atrocious act of storming the Capitol; he ultimately allowed them to go home until theyre sentenced in October.
*snip*
WHITT
(2,868 posts)You go your honor!
SheltieLover
(57,073 posts)SallyHemmings
(1,813 posts)lagomorph777
(30,613 posts)usaf-vet
(6,092 posts)pazzyanne
(6,518 posts)+1000
+1000
calimary
(80,693 posts)Times a million!
happy feet
(856 posts)Roisin Ni Fiachra
(2,574 posts)Thomas Hurt
(13,903 posts)Ferrets are Cool
(21,059 posts)COL Mustard
(5,782 posts)Ferrets are Cool
(21,059 posts)2naSalit
(86,040 posts)bottomofthehill
(8,261 posts)These fucking people attacked the US Capitol and Democracy itself. They belong in jail for a long time
SheltieLover
(57,073 posts)And they all deserve a loooong sentence!
Coddling only serves to embolden.
Prof. Toru Tanaka
(1,921 posts)Spot-on and I agree 100%.
Funny how Mr. "Law and Order" who "loves the police" isn't calling for strict punishment, isn't it? (sarcasm)
SheltieLover
(57,073 posts)I hope they all get perp marched.
Fortinbras Armstrong
(4,473 posts)From what they said about the testimony of the Capitol Policemen that their supposed support for the police is a lie. But then, they support Trump, who is famous for lying about anything and everything. Thus, they have no problem with lying. Of course, any ideology which is based on lying is bogus.
SheltieLover
(57,073 posts)When their lips are moving, they're lying.
wnylib
(21,146 posts)see them in an encore next month, trying to "reinstate" TFG.
SheltieLover
(57,073 posts)OldBaldy1701E
(4,967 posts)DENVERPOPS
(8,677 posts)setting the bar for lower penalties for the worst ones............
I don't think there are "degrees" of insurrection and sedition.........
We have coddled Trumphumpers and Republicans, and it is more than obvious where THAT ended.............
Prof. Toru Tanaka
(1,921 posts)Judge Walton is right, this isn't trespassing in a national park. This is the building where our elected legislators do business that affects our nation and the world. Like the Pentagon, it needs to be secure and protected.
These people breached that security and threatened our legislators and lives were lost. They committed serious federal crimes and should be treated as such.
Ligyron
(7,592 posts)Especially a process as sacred as the one which was interrupted.
fwvinson
(488 posts)The ones inside the Capitol Building should get 25+yrs
The ones outside the Capitol Building should get 10+ yrs
The ones inside the Capitol that disturbed, stole, damaged, or threated with violence should get life
The ones that planned and instigated the insurrection should get hung by the neck till dead.
Fullduplexxx
(7,818 posts)dalton99a
(81,065 posts)live love laugh
(12,995 posts)Baitball Blogger
(46,572 posts)A case for deterrence.
C_U_L8R
(44,891 posts)Gallows too. What is the appropriate penalty for this treason?
MagickMuffin
(15,887 posts)And I have the same exact questions
DFW
(54,050 posts)A felony doesn't become a misdemeanor just because five thousand crazed Republicans committed one. If three people had broken windows at the Capitol and roared in, assaulting police, carrying potential weapons, barging into offices and the chambers of the House and the Senate, calling for the murder of the Vice-President and the House Speaker, what would have been the charges against them? OK, so it's a far lesser offense because they were numerous? I don't know of any law that dilutes the severity of an offense just because the number of perps is above average.
Ferrets are Cool
(21,059 posts)If it had been 10 men of middle eastern descent, they would already be in Gitmo...indefinitely
twodogsbarking
(9,291 posts)COL Mustard
(5,782 posts)They'd have been shot!
Ferrets are Cool
(21,059 posts)Faux pas
(14,582 posts)are getting off too easily! I'm pretty sure this will fuel the "faithful" into doing it more because of that.
world wide wally
(21,718 posts)ffr
(22,644 posts)or Pence, for that matter, wasn't captured, race over to the gallows they'd set up and hanged.
Oh how things could have gone so differently. The punishments should be exceedingly harsh, if it were me.
Silent3
(15,018 posts)More serious charges without plea deals take up a lot of court time. I'd love to see these terrorists slammed down, and slammed down hard, but without plea deals these cases would probably still be working their way through the court system ten years from now.
The best we'll probably be able to manage is randomly going whole hog on a few of them and making examples out of those few.
jaxexpat
(6,701 posts)THAT should be the minimum standard. These Yahoo's lives need to be screwed up for a long time. House arrest, 20 days, deferred for time served does not suit the offense.
Cha
(295,899 posts)Last edited Thu Jul 29, 2021, 02:32 PM - Edit history (1)
Time to fit the Crime.
bucolic_frolic
(42,662 posts)as an example. This leniency means they don't want to be a harsh government, which might create more resentment and outrage, but it's also not something to brush off lightly. I would want to know what they would incur if they did the same in their hometown, or state capitol, neighborhood, or big box store. I suspect a lot of the lesser crimes would get a few months.
PSPS
(13,512 posts)Warpy
(110,900 posts)and facing charges and paying fines and court costs will do nicely for them. They're the most likely to dimly realize they've done something really, really stupid.
The violent ones, the fanatics, and the organizers need to face prison. Brooks, Biggs and Gosar need their phone records gone over with a fine toothed virtual comb since they've been named as Congressional co conspirators
Above all, law enforcement in general needs a strong attitude adjustment. Democracies have been overthrown but only by the far right. There are no historical exceptions in this. They need to stop chasing lefties who want higher wages and fewer billionaires and start chasing right wing extremists who want to use violence to install a dictator.
Let's hope Congress pursues that line of investigation, why there was overwhelming anti riot preparedness for peaceful BLM protests and next to nothing for a mostly white, eight wing mob.
Aviation Pro
(12,052 posts)Because, you know, it essentially was.
BlueJac
(7,838 posts)rickyhall
(4,889 posts)It's like if they ain't aren't non-white or have long hair they can't possibly be terrorists.
Texin
(2,585 posts)and those that organized the insurrection? Just wondering. A lot of these people, while part of the collected mob, seemed to have been following along and were not the ones assaulting Capitol police and causing actual property damage.
orangecrush
(19,236 posts)You know damn well they'd do it for us!
toughtony
(88 posts)They look like a bunch of wild animals....giving them light sentences conveys a sense of support and a sense of weakness on the part of the courts. Maybe they knew they would get no time.
What makes me sad is that, I always believed that as you get older, you get wiser. You don't figure an older person would be stupid enough to fall for such political bulls..t. I was wrong, a lot of these people have grandkids, they're old and they should have known better. They should have known better than to put their personal lives at risk over what they had to know was trump's same ol bulls...t! They had to know, at their age, that trump felt this was all for him, not America, not for patriotism, not for courage, but for him, and only him. And while he failed to make that call, a woman died. A woman who probably wouldn't have died had there been more enforcement. Trump started lying within minutes after everything was over, saying in a speech on national TV that he "immediately" called the national guard. He just lied right in our faces as if we're all fools. We know what happened, we saw it.
Danascot
(4,663 posts)The order calls on the attorney general to prosecute to the fullest extent of the law any person or group that destroys or vandalizes a monument, memorial or statue. I believe the Capitol Building can be considered a monument. Federal law authorizes a penalty of up to 10 years in prison for the willful injury of federal property. The order calls for maximum prosecution for anyone who incites violence and illegal activity.
Sounds good to me.
marble falls
(56,358 posts)... one year federal time.
malaise
(267,798 posts)Rec
Justice matters.
(6,873 posts)NQAS
(10,749 posts)Maybe it's a case of the government bringing charges they know that they can prove.
I don't think there are any specific domestic terrorism statutes, and I'm guessing that prosecutors don't think they can prove insurrection, at least not against the majority of those arrested.
So, maybe, no more plea deals. You plead guilty, you go to jail for the maximum allowed. You plead not guilt and are convicted, you go to jail for the maximum.
And. . . it's time to bring charges for insurrection and related crimes. Though even there the maximum prison sentence is 10 years. Maybe time to change those laws pretty darn quick, hey?
Jakes Progress
(11,121 posts)Never charged for the level of their crimes. So they keep doing what they got away with.
In my old neighborhood, we had a rash of midnight car break-ins. Windows broken, stuff stolen, gas siphoned. Dozens of them reported to police. No one was arrested. No one was ever charged or brought in even though there were door cameras of the guys doing it. It went on and on for months.
Enough of the neighborhood complained to the district's councilman (just before the election) and the police began patrolling and stopping people. Some arrests were made. Some people went to jail.
Bad guys will keep doing what they want as long as they don't fear being caught.
We are telling the mega bigots not to worry. 8 months for destroying federal property and assaulting police. 9 months for selling a joint. We are telling them not to sweat it.
They will do it again and again.
CrispyQ
(36,224 posts)NO.
Also, "...breaking into the Capitol building through a broken door..." There were 8 breaches to the Capitol Building. These people are getting off easy.
BarbD
(1,190 posts)The crime was insurrection and an attempted coup -- an overthrow of the government.
They should be tried for treason.
msfiddlestix
(7,264 posts)rather light prosecution handling of these dangerous treasonous terrorists.
The source of great angst in my mind as to future coup attempts.
olegramps
(8,200 posts)I believe that the officers were being assaulted and the breach of the Capitol by a mob of Trump inspired trash in addition to the fact that elected representatives were in grave danger was justification for use of deadly force. Of course the Republicans would have condemned this, but they believe it just fine for officers to take deadly action against minorities who are not even armed. The hypocrisy of to day's Republican racists makes me want to vomit. The Republicans should have been attending funerals in stead of rallies celebrating their treason and kissing Trump's ass. I can not stand the sight of any Republican and have no desire to have any of them as my friend. It is tantamount to kissing Judas and celebrating Benedict Arnold's betrayal. I have, with full justification, grown to actually despise the bastards.
randr
(12,408 posts)No mercy must be shown to traitorous terrorists.
catrose
(5,047 posts)Poiuyt
(18,087 posts)of the people behind the insurrection. I'm talking about Trump and certain members of Congress.
RainCaster
(10,676 posts)Then DFT should get 25 years min.
MiHale
(9,593 posts)Pas-de-Calais
(9,888 posts)Hulk
(6,699 posts)I certainly hope so!
BradAllison
(1,879 posts)I wonder if some DU posters will be along to say the judge doesn't know what's going on and to pipe down.
LudwigPastorius
(8,943 posts)Jail Trump. Cut off his constant stream of treacherous lies and you cut off the lifeline to the MAGAt insurrectionists.
summer_in_TX
(2,680 posts)He covers the arrests, charges, and court cases of the insurrectionists for the network.
One thing he said stuck out in this morning's discussion of where the House's investigation into the insurrection goes from here. These judges don't hesitate to talk about Trump's role and that he still poses a threat to the nation.
They know who the responsible party is.
PCIntern
(25,342 posts)The right wingers would be clamoring for the death penalty for the entire mob. The only question would be hanging or firing squad.
ShepKat
(376 posts)won't THAT embolden the terrorists. Good thing they weren't selling loose cigarettes
llashram
(6,265 posts)no question about this 'query'...yes!
Progressive Jones
(6,011 posts)why aren't the judges handing out maximum sentences? I'm aware that there are sentencing guidelines, but are those guidelines something that judges are required by law, not policy, to follow?
Also, I'm seeing some really weak sentencing recommendations from prosecutors. Again, I bring up maximum sentences. Pleading guilty, and/or "cooperating" should not lower the consequences for The Terror Trash.
Finally, I'm extremely disappointed we won't see any life sentences or executions. Just my opinion.
malthaussen
(17,065 posts)When the prosecution makes a deal with the defendant, the Judge is bound to honor it. It would defeat the whole purpose of plea bargaining to do otherwise.
-- Mal
LetMyPeopleVote
(143,998 posts)malthaussen
(17,065 posts)And then there's the larger question: "Does the Government have any intention of prosecuting those who incited the insurrection?"
-- Mal