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Sun May 16, 2021, 09:35 PM

Joe Biden's $50 billion semiconductor plan is about to become law - GPUs?

Does this mean I can finally get a %$%#$% graphics card? What is amazing is that despite Trump's so-called America First tendencies, this never came up despite the bipartisan appeal of such a bill even as Trump was happily causing chaos by threatening trade wars.

Yet, it takes Biden's support to get finally begin building semiconductors domestically to not only allow me to finally score an RTX 3080, but to provide needed chips for the U.S. auto industry so that it is not so dependent on Taiwan, whose production is being crippled by a drought.

Still, it will probably not be until 2023 that I can score a GPU for anything resembling MSRP.

https://www.tomshardware.com/news/semiconductor-industry-funding-plans-in-usa-south-korea

According to a Reuters report, a group of four U.S. senators might unveil their $52-billion microelectronics industry backing proposal on Friday or early next week. The chip industry support plan is set to include funding of R&D and production and the establishment of national programs. The $52 billion five-year plan pales in comparison to South Korea's intention to support its semiconductor industry with $450 billion over the next 10 years. Still, the real question is if we can compare the plans directly.

Various companies in the U.S. design the vast majority of chips used globally, yet only 12% of semiconductors are produced on American soil. The microelectronics industry funding bill is designed to at least partially change that and bring more chip production back to the USA.

The U.S. semiconductor industry funding law is developed by senators Mark Kelly, John Cornyn, Mark Warner, and Tom Cotton. According to a draft document seen by Reuters, the plan is expected to include $39 billion in production and R&D incentives and $10.5 billion to implement various national programs over a five-year period. Among the government-supported R&D initiatives are the National Semiconductor Technology Center and National Advanced Packaging Manufacturing Program.

The chip industry supporting bill will be a part of a bigger $110 billion effort to fund U.S. technology research in a bid to better compete with China. The same bill is also set to include semiconductor requirements of this year's National Defense Authorization Act, which will obviously somewhat help the American microelectronics industry, too.

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Reply Joe Biden's $50 billion semiconductor plan is about to become law - GPUs? (Original post)
TomCADem May 16 OP
abqtommy May 16 #1
Walleye May 16 #2
abqtommy May 17 #10
dawg day May 17 #12
JustABozoOnThisBus May 17 #11
abqtommy May 17 #15
Walleye May 17 #16
Deminpenn May 17 #14
NutmegYankee May 18 #20
Deminpenn May 18 #23
Demsrule86 May 18 #26
Demsrule86 May 18 #24
Angleae May 18 #27
csziggy May 16 #3
TomCADem May 17 #4
WarGamer May 17 #6
TomCADem May 17 #7
WarGamer May 18 #19
Demsrule86 May 18 #25
WarGamer May 18 #29
TomCADem May 19 #31
csziggy May 17 #8
Spider Jerusalem May 17 #9
WarGamer May 18 #30
WarGamer May 17 #5
JHB May 18 #28
catsudon May 17 #13
Klaralven May 17 #17
Kid Berwyn May 17 #18
Elessar Zappa May 18 #21
pecosbob May 18 #22
TomCADem May 20 #32

Response to TomCADem (Original post)

Sun May 16, 2021, 10:38 PM

1. I bought my '55 Pontiac for 75 bucks in 1966. It didn't have a chip unless I was

having a snack while I drove, and it got me where I wanted to go.

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Response to abqtommy (Reply #1)

Sun May 16, 2021, 10:51 PM

2. 1956 Buick Century station wagon, I bought in 1966 for $150

The engine was too big because it was way too fast

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Response to Walleye (Reply #2)

Mon May 17, 2021, 05:15 AM

10. Now that my memory has been nudged, here's Kathy Mattea's song "455 Rocket"...

Those were the days!

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Response to Walleye (Reply #2)

Mon May 17, 2021, 05:29 AM

12. My mom had an old station wagon with a 450 engine

Could zoom to 90 just like that. Why on earth did they put that kind of power in a family car? It could have beaten a GTO in a drag race... don't ask me how I know.

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Response to abqtommy (Reply #1)

Mon May 17, 2021, 05:19 AM

11. No chips, but I bet the radio had vacuum tubes, ...

... and when it failed, you had to crawl under the dash, remove the radio, take the tubes to the drugstore testing machine, great fun.

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Response to JustABozoOnThisBus (Reply #11)

Mon May 17, 2021, 05:57 AM

15. That's right. And I didn't have much trouble replacing the bad tube in my car radio so I

could have my tunes back. And I didn't have to remove the radio.

But I admit to having a preference for tubes (or valves, as some in Europe call them) since my favorite guitar amp was 100 watts of all-tube power and tone.

Ah, to be young again!

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Response to JustABozoOnThisBus (Reply #11)

Mon May 17, 2021, 06:04 AM

16. Yes. And you had to wait for it to warm up when you turned it on

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Response to abqtommy (Reply #1)

Mon May 17, 2021, 05:46 AM

14. The auto industry could go back to building cars

that are mostly mechanical, but not sure what the younger generations would do without rearview cameras and other electronics. Can you imagine a younger driver calculatiing the MPG by dividing the miles driven between fill ups by the gallons used? Or backing up using the rear view and side mirrors? Or rolling down the windows with a crank handle?

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Response to Deminpenn (Reply #14)

Tue May 18, 2021, 04:22 AM

20. That's the convenience stuff. The key electronics support fuel injection and engine management

Without computer control engines would not put out as much power as they do today, while using less fuel, and producing minimal toxic emissions. The mechanical distributor, with points, condenser, cap, and rotor is far outdone by modern computer timing controls. The carburetor is wasteful and inefficient compared to fuel injection. Hell, we even have engines that are now gasoline direct injection right into the cylinder head, such as the TSI engines that VW produces.

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Response to NutmegYankee (Reply #20)

Tue May 18, 2021, 08:15 AM

23. Just having some fun

While some electronics improve an engine's performance, there are many electronics that could return to being mechanical and/or hydraulic, like window operation for example. Autos would be cheaper and easier to repair as well.

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Response to Deminpenn (Reply #23)

Tue May 18, 2021, 08:40 AM

26. And we could go back to making buggy whips too. The entire auto industry would need to be

retooled and few young Americans would want such cars.

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Response to Deminpenn (Reply #14)

Tue May 18, 2021, 08:33 AM

24. Today's cars are basically computers. There are cars waiting for chips all over this country.

People are being laid of and hours are being cut.

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Response to Deminpenn (Reply #14)

Tue May 18, 2021, 01:44 PM

27. That would require emission control laws to change.

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Response to TomCADem (Original post)

Sun May 16, 2021, 10:55 PM

3. Yeah - I need to build a new computer but I bet I'll have to wait at least a year.

The original plan was to build it January 2020, but other stuff got in the way. Now that things have settled down and I'm ready to build, I understand computer components are way high and hard to get.

My Win 7 Pro machine is still working fine, but I don't want to upgrade it to Win 10. Usually I go to a new operating system when I build a new system, so that was my plan. This machine should handle Win 10 with no big problems, but I just don't want to deal with it. {SIGH}

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Response to csziggy (Reply #3)

Mon May 17, 2021, 12:29 AM

4. Yup, I Was Able to Buy a 4k Monitor When Prices Went Down on Monitors...

...so it was just a matter of getting a graphics cards that can take advantage of my new monitor. I was hoping that I could get an RTX 3070 or 3080 at something close to MSRP, but that is not going to happen anytime soon.

So, I guess I have to dial back the graphics on most games for the next year or so until GPUs no longer cost more then my entire system.

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Response to TomCADem (Reply #4)

Mon May 17, 2021, 12:33 AM

6. You'll see several new generations of GPU's before you see a US made one in your card.

(Former World Record holding 3d drag racer here... one of the OG LN2 monkeys))

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Response to WarGamer (Reply #6)

Mon May 17, 2021, 01:05 AM

7. Don't Care Where the GPU Is Made. Just Want To Get One

I am starting to think that an RTX 3080 is a myth. I mean have you ever actually seen one in stock?

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Response to TomCADem (Reply #7)

Tue May 18, 2021, 01:18 AM

19. They were released in small numbers, bought up by those with connections

Lots of benchmarking results out there from the overclockers.

But yeah, not really available.

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Response to TomCADem (Reply #7)

Tue May 18, 2021, 08:39 AM

25. Well you should care because plants in this country mean jobs. And unless we make our own,

I guarantee there will be shortages in future years. Right now manufacturing employees are being laid off and/or having their hours cut. I am very worried about my husband's job as his hours have been cut...and "the I don't care where it is made attitude" has caused the loss of good-paying jobs all over this country and the decline of the middle class IMHO.

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Response to Demsrule86 (Reply #25)

Tue May 18, 2021, 05:14 PM

29. That's precisely the argument that made a lot of Obama voters go Trump in '16

Not saying Trump was the solution, he wasn't...

But people have a LEGITIMATE complaint about the direction of blue collar America.

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Response to Demsrule86 (Reply #25)

Wed May 19, 2021, 02:26 PM

31. But When You Are Playing Call of Duty

Will you be willing to sacrifice fps because you insisted on buying a 14 nm card made by a domestic manufacturer or will insist on getting the latest GPU that delivers a smooth 60 fps of 4K sweetness?

This is why it is a good thing that Biden is making the upgrade and expansion of semiconductor fabrication a priority.

It is wishful thinking to count on patriotism in the hopes that gamers will sacrifice performance for a gpu based on outdated tech.

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Response to TomCADem (Reply #4)

Mon May 17, 2021, 01:08 AM

8. I'm not into video games so I can save a lot on the video card

I need something that can do Photoshop (and my basic video software for rendering video to burn to DVD) since that is the most demanding thing I use. Last article I read said I don't even need multi processors (I think that was the term) since PS can only use one at a time. Mostly I need to get back the solid state drive for a dedicated PS scratch disk. That doubled the speed of rendering images, though the 32 GB of RAM I put in this one helped a lot. I had a 128 GB SSID drive, but when I had to add a 6 Tb hard drive, that took my last connector and I used the SS drive as an external. Now I can get thumbdrives larger in capacity so I don't even use that one anymore.

Damn, we've come a long way - I remember saving up to get my first 40 MB hard drive and amazing it was to partition it so DOS could see the entire thing. I've been doing this too long.

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Response to TomCADem (Reply #4)

Mon May 17, 2021, 01:12 AM

9. Sign up for the waitlist on EVGA's website and you'll get one closer to retail price than anywhere

still a bit over the odds compared to what it would be otherwise, but not too bad (GTX 3070 from $599, not the insane scalping prices you'll see on Ebay and Amazon Marketplace).

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Response to Spider Jerusalem (Reply #9)

Tue May 18, 2021, 05:15 PM

30. Problem is, they're in high demand by crypto miners.

Nvidia just recently announced they're "nerfing" the cars so they can't mine Ether.

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Response to TomCADem (Original post)

Mon May 17, 2021, 12:31 AM

5. will be a LONG time before we're competing with Taiwan and China

for production quantities... maybe never.

But I appreciate the effort.

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Response to WarGamer (Reply #5)

Tue May 18, 2021, 01:49 PM

28. Even if it never does, there's value in having a domestic alternative.

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Response to TomCADem (Original post)

Mon May 17, 2021, 05:41 AM

13. well, i for one

am glad tsmc is here and is decoupling from china.

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Response to TomCADem (Original post)

Mon May 17, 2021, 07:46 AM

17. $10 B per year won't change anything

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Response to TomCADem (Original post)

Mon May 17, 2021, 08:00 AM

18. We invented the integrated circuit and a whole lot more.

President Biden understands why we should lead the world in their production, development and application.

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Response to TomCADem (Original post)

Tue May 18, 2021, 04:36 AM

21. It's a start.

We should really be investing ten times that. Itís a national security issue.

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Response to TomCADem (Original post)

Tue May 18, 2021, 04:40 AM

22. Current problem is that we have to import the required resources...rare earth minerals



Perhaps the Moon or Mars?

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Response to pecosbob (Reply #22)

Thu May 20, 2021, 12:42 PM

32. Semiconductor Shortage Explained

I have never heard that a shortage of domestic rare minerals was the reason why there are no semiconductor fabs in the U.S. If that was the case, then Taiwan and South Korea would never have gotten off the ground.

A nice (somewhat boring) explanation can be found on this tech channel:

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