General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsIf you're demanding Schumer "better not cave!" or insisting "he needs to grow a spine!" please know
Chuck Schumer - or any Congressional leader, for that matter - doesn't operate in a vacuum. He's not, on his own, figuring out how the Democrats can best position themselves, singlehandedly deciding how to proceed, and then negotiating with McConnell all alone while all of the other Democrats sit in their offices hoping he'll get it right and waiting helplessly to see what he comes out with.
Schumer is working closely with his caucus to determine what they think is best and developing strategies for achieving it. He and the Senate leadership talk to the Democratic Caucus every day, sometimes several times a day. They meet as a group at least once a week, have regular conference calls, and talk one-on-one and in small groups on and off the Senate floor, in the cloakroom, in the hallways, in their "hideaways," and in their offices daily.
When Schumer takes an approach, it's not because he alone decided it. He takes an approach that his Democratic colleagues, as a body, determined is the best plan. He's the Majority Leader, not the Majority Monarch.
So, demanding that Schumer do or not do something is not just pointless (and not just because he's not listening to us raging on an online message board ...), It's anti-factual. Assuming that he's "caving" or letting down other Democrats if he takes an approach that people on DU think is not aggressive enough is not based on reality.
Chuck Schumer isn't weak and he isn't winging it. He's doing exactly what his caucus elected him to do and he's obviously doing it well enough for them to overwhelmingly want him to keep doing it.
SheltieLover
(57,073 posts)Ty!!!
cilla4progress
(24,726 posts)you are!
Hoyt
(54,770 posts)Theyll do their best in a complicated situation.
servermsh
(913 posts)Couldn't Schumer, at any time, exercise the "nuclear option" (calling for a vote to appeal a ruling of the chair and vote to override it using a majority vote)?
I'd assume they could use this technique to break the filibuster on the organizing resolution, but leave the filibuster in place as is for legislation.
Schumer says McConnell will not get what he's asking for, but so far he has not described the strategy.
StarfishSaver
(18,486 posts)servermsh
(913 posts)If the parties were reversed McConnell would have exercised this option at about 5:00 PM on January 20th. And the press would have praised him for being so strong and strategic.
StarfishSaver
(18,486 posts)lamp_shade
(14,827 posts)stopdiggin
(11,296 posts)Salviati
(6,008 posts)He would need the support of all 50 democratic Senators and the VP, which it's understood that he doesn't have at this point. So if you want to be upset at someone for not using that stratagy, then you should probably be upset at Joe Manchin, Dianne Feinstein, and Kyrsten Sinema, amongst likely a few others. Though from what Schumer has said, it would suggest that they may not have ruled it out entirely if the republicans go full obstructionist.
https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/534527-senate-democrats-leery-of-nixing-filibuster
betsuni
(25,464 posts)sheshe2
(83,746 posts)Here: https://www.democraticunderground.com/100214990690#top
This is a response I got. Perfect fit.
You MUST listen to this, must listen. This is not just John's song, it is the dialog.
https://www.democraticunderground.com/100214990690#post7
Hekate
(90,645 posts)KPN
(15,642 posts)Hekate
(90,645 posts)bluestateboomer
(505 posts)One, yes Schumer is a politician and he will be communicating to his caucus about their strengths and weaknesses in each situation, but it is also important for him hear then people's opinion. Much of his strength will derive from popular support. Maybe we don't need to yell about "caving", but we need to keep speaking up.
Two, In comparison, how do you think McConnell would be operating in the same situation?
Hekate
(90,645 posts)...when its time to collect their votes in Kentucky, as he has demonstrated abundantly over the years. He has a plan & the long view, and he does not deviate from it. He musters the votes from his side of the aisle all of them and he gets done what he wants to get done.
We could learn a thing or two from that, and one is to take the long view and the other is to keep all our votes together and back our leaders.
bluestateboomer
(505 posts)N/T
Demsrule86
(68,552 posts)the practice of message voting which destroyed our ability to advance policy and cost us a SCOTUS nominee never happens again. Also, those who voted third party in 16 cost us fecent healthcare, fair taxation our economy and 400,000 + Americans their lives.
StarfishSaver
(18,486 posts)Last edited Sat Jan 23, 2021, 09:42 AM - Edit history (1)
And I don't care what McConnell would do in this situation. He shouldn't be our guide for how to behave.
Too many Democrats spend a lot of time complaining about Republicans' behavior but then get furious when Democrats don't do the same things Turns out they don't really have any problem with those tactics - they just want it to be Democrats engaging in them.
Gore1FL
(21,127 posts)Skittles
(153,147 posts)we always get the three-dimensional chess explanation; in the meantime, repukes seem to have way more power than they should
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)Everything in government starts with and ends with the electorate.
That three-dimensional chess comparison vastly understates reality. Very few know enough to evaluate their performance, even if important information wasn't always necessarily kept secret. Soaking up the interpretations of the influencers who snow us with blizzards of agitprop, disinfo and inevitably partial, simplified truths produces fools. And sharing the product of groupthink ignorance and dishonesty as wisdom amounts to clueless chicanery by fools.
Being smart enough to at least avoid that begins with realizing and respecting one's own ignorance. Humility. It also helps to admit that they're usually working with less than they need, often tragically less, thanks to our failure to do our job better. "I want" is not "I've done my part."
orleans
(34,049 posts)and, for the record, i haven't been "raging"; i haven't said a word about him
however, while i can't remember what he had done (and i mean what he did not do) i do remember that i was furious and terribly disappointed by him and his inaction.
that was my take-away and has been my silent opinion of him ever since.
so now i sit here, watching and waiting to see what he does this time
StarfishSaver
(18,486 posts)a misunderstanding of Senate rules and the options actually available to Democrats, incorrect assumptions and a strange belief that Democrats should telegraph their every plan in advance and constantly and failure to do so means they don't have one and aren't doing anything.
PatrickforO
(14,570 posts)Lots to do, and only 24 hours in a day.
We are seeing plenty of action from them. We need to get Biden's cabinet confirmed, and with the absolute bombshells that came out today, the guy on the phone in the window on Jan. 6 (I'm just sure it was Gosar, the traitor!), and the Trump trying to do a Sunday Night Massacre in the Justice Department - February 9 give everyone plenty of time to assemble more evidence.
I think Biden is doing great, and so are the Democrats in the Senate and House.
Again, lots to do. Let's all back their play. We won't always get our way, but we'll get a heck of a lot further if we stick together.
Thekaspervote
(32,755 posts)dansolo
(5,376 posts)Personally, I think that the "nuclear option" should be used, because the rules should not be subject to the filibuster. The minority should not be allowed to hold up the transfer of power when the majority changes.
Demsrule86
(68,552 posts)But it is what it is, and Mconnell has nothing to lose with his obstruction. And all GOP types are waiting with bated breath for us to turn on our own as we have done before.
DeminPennswoods
(15,278 posts)based on your experience and knowledge.
Maxheader
(4,372 posts)And stuff to throw out from the last 4 years....Givem time,
They'll sort it out....lm still in disbelief we are where we are.....
KayF
(1,345 posts)AOC's defeat of Joe Crowley helps. Schumer thinking this could happen to him might help him show a little more spine in these negotiations.
StarfishSaver
(18,486 posts)Demsrule86
(68,552 posts)LTG
(215 posts)Hes had the impeachment trial to schedule and start prep on. That required some negotiation with Mitch.
They are still negotiating over the terms of the power sharing agreement. Vice President Harriss tie-breaking may make them a majority position the Democrats do not hold the majority of seats. There is fairly solid Senate precedent that includes things like equal membership on committees, which can be a little troublesome.
To some Senators Senate traditions and precedents are very important, like Senator Feinstein. So, keeping the caucus together and not alienating any possible Republican votes if you cant get 50 Democrat Votes.
Once these and other necessary housekeeping chores are done they can get down to more than confirming Presidential appointees.
StarfishSaver
(18,486 posts)Thank you.
MineralMan
(146,286 posts)and destructive. At this point, we should not be "demanding" that our federal leadership do anything specific. Truly, we have only a limited understanding of everything that is involved in how the government functions.
Some of us know more than others, but none of us are actually in office in either house of Congress. Leave the man alone! He will get things done. Don't second guess him. He understands how the Senate functions better than almost anyone in that body.