"Conservatism" is still a dangerous ideology

[Cary]

Our war against fascism is not over. We must turn out in force in 2022.

I hope to see less bickering here. I want to see more rallying around shared values.

[Thekaspervote]

1. +1000

[Cary]

3. Thank you.

I would love to participate here more and would do so if I didn't have to fend off nasty nonsense.

[MyOwnPeace]

2. Not around here (western PA).......

Just passed a house today with a banner out: TRUMP - PENCE - MAKE THE LIBS CRY AGAIN!

Damned near ran the car over the sign!

Our battle isn't over, friends!

[42bambi]

14. The LIB'S should stop giving the basement dwellers food stamps, welfare, Medicaid, & any & all

socialist freebies. Well, look who's crying now!

[MyOwnPeace]

17. I titled my own post wrong!

It IS still ugly around here - and (this point I DID get right!) our battle is NOT over!

Sorry 'bout that!

GO, JOE - we're with 'ya!!!!!

[LAS14]

4. Are you equating conservatism with fascism? nt

[ck4829]

7. It has certainly become fascism-friendly.

[Cary]

15. No one seems to argue anything but that "conservatism" shares many traits with fascism

Last edited Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:06 PM - Edit history (1)

Disturbing traits too. David Frum makes a strained distinction in Trumpocalyse.

So finding reasons why "conservatism" is not fascism is a reach. Why would one bend over backward to not identify them as fascists? How have "conservatives" earned the benefit of the doubt?

[Cary]

8. You have a problem with that?

But before you say anything do notice my scare quotes. They are known as "conservatives" but conservatism is careful, incremental, scholarly, historical, traditional.

"Comservatives" are rash, reckless, punitive,.cruel, racist, xenophobic, anti-intellectual, and careless. "Conservatives" are not.conservative, they are to the right of conservatives. Fascists are to the right of conservatives.

Few actual conservatives exist. As Alan Greenspan said "there is a flaw in the ideology."

If you disagree that's fine but do not expect me to accept your argument. This one is not negotiable. "Conservatives" are the 21st Century incarnation of National Socialism. Yes, they are evil and they have no place in polite society.

[MyOwnPeace]

18. Oops! No problem, bro!!!

Got mixed up in responses to too many threads!

You were "spot on" and we ARE on the same team!

[Cary]

19. I suspected some misunderstanding

Thanks for giving me an opportunity to launch into my "conservative" rant.

[LAS14]

24. I think people should be able to have a conservative philosophy without...

.... being lumped in with truth denying misogynists, racists, etc. Just like I think people should be able to profess Christianity without being lumped in with truth denying, narrow minded fundamentalists.

[Cary]

26. There are a few of those

But how did we get from conservatism to "conservatism?"

I will be re-reading Russell Kirk after I finish Reaganland. I am not so sure that they don't deserve to be lumped.

[JI7]

22. United States Conservatism as in Trump's Republican Party , Yes it is .

[Caliman73]

27. Conservatism unrestrained, will eventually turn to fascism.

Conservatism is based on the belief that people are fundamentally unequal and that there is a hierarchy that is the "natural order". The founders of Conservative thought were all supporters of the Monarchy, and while they changed their ideas about "who" should be at the top, the fundamental ideology has not changed from that time period. Wealthy Capitalists were merely substituted for the Monarchy.

[brer cat]

5. We need to focus on what unites us rather than what divides us.

Compromise is required since no one will get everything they want.

[Binkie The Clown]

6. Eisenhower was the last honorable conservative

and an awful lot of his policies would be called "liberal": by today's standards.

[Cary]

10. 100% agreement

[Bettie]

9. Step one: Call Fascism what it is

don't soft-pedal it, say "This is fascism and it goes against our values".

[Cary]

11. 100% agreement

[Cosmocat]

12. This

Nm

[Roisin Ni Fiachra]

23. This

ty

[ooky]

25. Thank you.

The Republican Party has evolved into the American Fascist Party and it's high time everyone recognized it. They might as well all be wearing brown shirts and arm bands. Refusing to recognize our election should be the last straw for anyone who still hasn't seen enough. They are leaving no doubt why they hate democrats - they hate democracy!

[Cosmocat]

13. T H I S

He is a symptom, not the cause

[Cary]

16. Absolutely.

He walked into the role. He is a demagogue.

[lastlib]

20. You are absolutely right!!

It's the ideology that has given rise to "Michigan Militia" and all the other "very fine people."

Want proof? Read the book A Force Upon The Plain by Kenneth Stern. Yes, it's 25 years old, and yes, every word of it is still valid. We ARE in a WAR for the soul of the nation, and it's past time to go nuclear.

[Cary]

28. Thanks for the book suggestion

I recommend Reaganland.

[qdouble]

21. "Conservatism" is just branding.

It's typically just a cover for some mixture of fascism, corporatism, racism, sexism or something else that's vile. Appeals to mythologized tradition simply masks it.

[WyattKansas]

30. The one constant about Republicans for the last half Century is that their ideals & policies...

Are ALL complete failures and they do more harm than good, while also wrecking everything in the process of their race to the bottom experiments they already know won't succeed. Either they are completely evil and selfish or they genuinely don't know how stupid they are. The verdict is now in that the Republican politicians know exactly what they are doing while their followers are just stupid fools.

Most people tend to identify as 'conservative' with the belief that they value and want the America they grew up in and came to know that came to be only because of FDR Progressive Ideals and Policies that became the Law. And they mistakenly choose Republican to bring that back to them and to be the America they want. Republicans have been very good at hijacking and stealing accomplishments of the Democratic Party the last Century to slap their own brand on it. Hell even tRUMP tried to steal FDR name recognition for his own perverted gimmicks. In the end, people end up voting for the complete opposite of what they really want, because the Republicans have tricked them into voting for their own failed ideals and policies thinking that would bring them back to the FDR Progressive Ideals and Policies... Sadly, it only reverses the same FDR Progressive Ideals and Policies they wanted to bring back.

If the Democratic Party wants to win big and reverse the damage done be Republicans the last half Century, they they have to go back to the FDR Progressive Ideals and Policies the rest of the world envied and ushered in the biggest economic boom the world has ever known, which incidentally benefited all of it's people. Either America wants to be the best ever that FDR gave us or they want to be the gimmick myth the Republicans offer.

[Hortensis]

29. It's not an ideology at all, it's varying syndromes of negative reactions.

Conservative intellectuals tried to establish an ideology based on protection of what's established and proven to work in the last century. But that didn't work for the new ultrawealthy classes, and religious right, who harnessed the negative emotions to purge even that from conservative politics and instead turn them against us.

That's the main reason this happened on the right, and could only be done with far fewer on the left also vulnerable to manipulation through negative emotions. We have a very strong liberal ideology, which our nation was founded on and has held steady ever since.